Can Scotland qualify for Euro 08?

[Bulldog Revolution]

Can the Scots pull off a win over Italy at Hampden Park to see them qualify?

Does it all come down to Ferguson patrolling the midfield and McFadden having to score an incredible goal?

[Chops]

No chance I'd say. Italians only need a draw and are masters of shutting down the game and controlling the tempo. Won't be surprise if they score on a counter attack.

[The Coon Dog]

It didn't help their cause when they lost 2-0 in Georgia.

Now, firstly let's set the scene. The top 2 qualify & there's 3 countries battling it out, they being Italy, Scotland & France.

Table:

France - 25 points - F 23 - A3
Scotland - 24 points - F20 - A10
Italy - 23 points - F17 - A7

Fixtures Remaining:

Scotland v Italy
Italy v Faroe Islands
Ukraine v France

You would think Italy would win their game in hand over the Faroe Islands & go to 26 points.

I'd say italy are certanties, but it gets interesting if France & Scotland finish equal.

Here's how they seperate teams with equal points, courtesy of Sporting Life.http://www.sportinglife.com/football/euro2008/standings/

#

If two or more teams are equal on points, the following criteria are applied to determine the standings:

# a) Higher number of points obtained in the group matches played among the teams in question.

# b) Superior goal difference from the group matches played among the teams in question.

# c) Higher number of goals scored in the group matches played among the teams in question.

# d) Higher number of goals scored away from home in the group matches played among the teams in question.

# e) If, after applying criteria a) to d) to several teams, two or more teams still have an equal standing, the criteria a) to d) will be reapplied to these two to determine the standing of these teams. If this procedure does not lead to a decision, criteria f) and g) will apply.

# f) Results of all group matches: 1. Superior goal difference 2. Higher number of goals scored 3. Higher number of goals scored away from home 4. Fair play conduct.

# g) Drawing of lots.

[Sockeye Salmon]

It didn't help their cause when they lost 2-0 in Georgia.

Now, firstly let's set the scene. The top 2 qualify & there's 3 countries battling it out, they being Italy, Scotland & France.

Table:

France - 25 points - F 23 - A3
Scotland - 24 points - F20 - A10
Italy - 23 points - F17 - A7

Fixtures Remaining:

Scotland v Italy
Italy v Faroe Islands
Ukraine v France

You would think Italy would win their game in hand over the Faroe Islands & go to 26 points.

I'd say italy are certanties, but it gets interesting if France & Scotland finish equal.

Here's how they seperate teams with equal points, courtesy of Sporting Life.http://www.sportinglife.com/football/euro2008/standings/

#

If two or more teams are equal on points, the following criteria are applied to determine the standings:

# a) Higher number of points obtained in the group matches played among the teams in question.

# b) Superior goal difference from the group matches played among the teams in question.

# c) Higher number of goals scored in the group matches played among the teams in question.

# d) Higher number of goals scored away from home in the group matches played among the teams in question.

# e) If, after applying criteria a) to d) to several teams, two or more teams still have an equal standing, the criteria a) to d) will be reapplied to these two to determine the standing of these teams. If this procedure does not lead to a decision, criteria f) and g) will apply.

# f) Results of all group matches: 1. Superior goal difference 2. Higher number of goals scored 3. Higher number of goals scored away from home 4. Fair play conduct.

# g) Drawing of lots.

All very interesting, Baz.

Of course it would actually mean something if we knew what the score was when France played Scotland.

[The Coon Dog]

All very interesting, Baz.

Of course it would actually mean something if we knew what the score was when France played Scotland.

Oops!

Scotland won BOTH games 1-0.

Imagine if it ever got to drawing of lots!

[Sockeye Salmon]

In that case, to get through Scotland must either

a) Beat Italy

or

b) Draw with Italy and hope the Ukraine beat France.

[The Coon Dog]

In that case, to get through Scotland must either

a) Beat Italy

or

b) Draw with Italy and hope the Ukraine beat France.

Yeah!

If Scotland:

a) beat Italy they'll qualify.
b) draw with Italy they'll qualify if France lose to the Ukraine.
c) Lose to Italy they can't qualify.

Imagine this scenario:

a) Scotland beat Italy
b) Italy beat Fairo Islands
c) France draw with Ukraine

Scotland would have 27 points & Italy & France would have 26.

Italy & France drew 0-0 in Italy & France won 3-1 in France.

[Chops]

If Italy lose to Scotland I will eat my hat. Italy have an uncanny ability to get the job done when required. Watch out for the centre forward Toni, he is class. If he plays, Scotland no chance as they will need 2 blokes to mark him.

[The Coon Dog]

If Italy lose to Scotland I will eat my hat. Italy have an uncanny ability to get the job done when required. Watch out for the centre forward Toni, he is class. If he plays, Scotland no chance as they will need 2 blokes to mark him.

Didn't Luca Toni score both goals against Scotland last time they played?

Funny, I wouldn't have thought Scotland would have drawn with France, let alone win, both home & away. Funnier things have happened.

[Chops]

Didn't Luca Toni score both goals against Scotland last time they played?

Yep
About 70 goals just in the domestic comp in the past 3 years including 31 2 seasons back. Was a Fiorentina and Palermo player, now at Bayern Munich and killing them there.
Injured a few times in the past year meaning he missed a few games include the France 1-3 game (Italy hung over game) right after the WC.
Had a legit goal disallowed in the WC final.

Lucarelli might play as he scored twice vs Georgia and isn't bad either.

[Bulldog Revolution]

It seems a big ask - basically they have to beat Italy - France have been in pretty good touch and should be too strong for the Ukraine.

Scotland majorly stuffed up when they lost 2-0 to Georgia

On a trip to Scotland in 2002 I watched the Scottish National team on the TV with a mate on one of the wettest days Glasgow has ever seen.

The Scots were down 2-0 at half time of a game to the Faroe Islands

Now if you think Dogs supporters were unhappy with Season 2007, the Scots were absolutely livid at half time, the former players on the TV were going crazy it was actually very funny - my scottish mate was basically hysterical with how crazy the commentators were going. The commentators had a reasonable point though as the Faroese contained a number of amateur players including PE teachers, tradesmen etc

They ended up drawing but the coach got the sack not long after

[The Coon Dog]

I love the chant the Scots sing to the Italians, "We deep fried ya pizza's!"

[Bulldog Revolution]

I love the chant the Scots sing to the Italians, "We deep fried ya pizza's!"

its definitely a classic

[The Coon Dog]

The Scotland v Italy clash is being televised live on ESPN on Sunday morning (3.55am) for those with Foxtel.

[The Coon Dog]

An omen, perhaps?

In Italy, the number 17 is considered unlucky. Some Alitalia planes have no row 17, some Italian hotels have no room 17 and in Roman numerals XVII is an anagram of VIXI which translates into "I have lived" with the implication "my life is over" or "I am dead".

Italy play Scotland in a crucial Euro 2008 qualifier at Hampden Park on Saturday, 17 November with kick-off at 1700 GMT - for the record, Italy have won four of their 11 matches played on the 17th of a month in the last 30 years.

[Mantis]

An omen, perhaps?

In Italy, the number 17 is considered unlucky. Some Alitalia planes have no row 17, some Italian hotels have no room 17 and in Roman numerals XVII is an anagram of VIXI which translates into "I have lived" with the implication "my life is over" or "I am dead".

Italy play Scotland in a crucial Euro 2008 qualifier at Hampden Park on Saturday, 17 November with kick-off at 1700 GMT - for the record, Italy have won four of their 11 matches played on the 17th of a month in the last 30 years.

Where the bloody hell do you get this information??

[The Coon Dog]

Where the bloody hell do you get this information??

Would you believe me if I said I went back through the history books?

Didn't think so, I found it on the BBC website.

[Mantis]

Would you believe me if I said I went back through the history books?

Nothing would surprise me.

Didn't think so, I found it on the BBC website.

You have way to much time on your hands.

The off season must kill you.

[Chops]

The answer is no.

Scotland 1 Italy 2

[The Coon Dog]

It was a strange game in a sense.

If you watched it thinking it was a 'one off' you would say Scotland shaded it, but with Italy scoring in the first minute (the defending for that goal was like watching the Bulldogs in the last 7 games) the onus was on Scotland to attack as they had to score. A 1-0 win to Italy was enough for them.

Italy were desperately unlucky on two counts & Scotland one.

Firstly Utaly scored midway through the first half but the goal was disallowed for offside. It was never offside.

In the second half Scotland's persistance was rewarded when they scored through a goal mouth scramble, though Barry Ferguson was clearly offside.

Italy were quite comfortable at 1-1 as they knew a point would be enough for them to qualify. As I said the onus was on Scotland & they should have gone ahead near full time, McFadden missing the target from close range.

In injury time Italy were inexplicably awarded a free kick, which should have been awarded to Scotland, which they duly converted from via a terrific header.

Whilst Scotland will feel aggrieved at the death knoll, they should a) have been 2-0 down, b) had their goal disallowed & c) McFadden should have scored, therefore they have no real complaints.

Viva Le France & Forza Azzuri qualify!!

[Chops]

In injury time Italy were inexplicably awarded a free kick, which should have been awarded to Scotland, which they duly converted from via a terrific header.

Was told it was reversed free after the Scotish guy retaliated

[The Coon Dog]

Was told it was reversed free after the Scotish guy retaliated

According to Sporting Life & the BBC, the linesman awarded the free kick to Italy.

Interestingly Scotland's Manager Alex McLeish as well as James McFadden & Lee McCulloch are absolutely scathing about the refereeing decision that they claim cost them. Whilst they may have a point about that particular decision, it's stretching a long bow to say they were robbed, afterall the officials got it wrong twice, both times to the benefit of Scotland which saw an Italian goal disallowed that should have stood & the Scot's goal stand when it should have been disallowed for offside.

[Sockeye Salmon]

Was told it was reversed free after the Scotish guy retaliated

Ernie, your credibility regarding the Italian team is zero. You still refuse to admit they cheated at the world cup!

[Chops]

Ernie, your credibility regarding the Italian team is zero. You still refuse to admit they cheated at the world cup!

How did they cheat? They ref gave them a penalty, any Australian in same situation would have done the same. Bresciano must of cheated too as he dove theratrically and Italian got a very harsh red.

Besides I went for Australia.

For stirring me up, I hope you are still feeling sore from your cricket.

[Topdog]

The linesman awarded it directly to Italy. Didnt make a difference anyway Scotland needed to win not draw.

[The Coon Dog]

Didnt make a difference anyway Scotland needed to win not draw.

Not necessarily. A point would have been good enough IF Ukraine then defeated France. That becomes irrelevant now as France HAVE qualified & won't be under the same pressure when the play Ukraine.