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Re: Is Western Bulldogs star Tom Boyd suffering from a premiership hangover?
Originally Posted by
bulldogtragic
Wow. Six games after his GF, two where he rucked solo on very good ruckmen, and Comrade has called it.
Expect Damien Barrett & Leigh Matthews to be using 'sources close to the club' (above) saying 'they've given up on Tom Boyd being the player they hoped for when traded for'.
I'm more than happy for this to blow up in my face when he becomes an 80 goal a year forward. Nothing would make me happier.
But there's a reason I didn't gush about Liam Jones in that infamous WOOF thread. As a counterpoint, Jones' career stats compared to Boyd are better at the same age. More marks on average, more goals on average and the same disposals despite being a focal point inside the forward 50. Yes, Jones didn't have the ruck to worry about but it's not as if Boyd has rucked 1 out for every single one of his matches.
Our 1954 premiership players are our heroes, and it has to be said that Charlie was their hero.
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Re: Is Western Bulldogs star Tom Boyd suffering from a premiership hangover?
Originally Posted by
comrade
I'm assuming he's been playing footy since he was 5 years old like most top level footballers.
I heard Tom, the dirty bludger, at kindergarten would leave on his finger paint before kick to kick to make the footy stick in his hands. If we did our due diligence as a club, recruiting someone who can't legally mark a footy never would've happened.
Rocket Science: the epitaph for the Beveridge era - whenever it ends - reading 'Here lies a team that could beat anyone on its day, but seldom did when it mattered most'. 15/7/2023
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Re: Is Western Bulldogs star Tom Boyd suffering from a premiership hangover?
Originally Posted by
bulldogtragic
I heard Tom, the dirty bludger, at kindergarten would leave on his finger paint before kick to kick to make the footy stick in his hands. If we did our due diligence as a club, recruiting someone who can't legally mark a footy never would've happened.
Wish he'd do it now. He'd average more than 2.3 marks a game.
Our 1954 premiership players are our heroes, and it has to be said that Charlie was their hero.
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Re: Is Western Bulldogs star Tom Boyd suffering from a premiership hangover?
Originally Posted by
comrade
I'm more than happy for this to blow up in my face when he becomes an 80 goal a year forward. Nothing would make me happier.
But there's a reason I didn't gush about Liam Jones in that infamous WOOF thread. As a counterpoint, Jones' career stats compared to Boyd are better at the same age. More marks on average, more goals on average and the same disposals despite being a focal point inside the forward 50. Yes, Jones didn't have the ruck to worry about but it's not as if Boyd has rucked 1 out for every single one of his matches.
Now you compare a contested beast, to an actual contested beast. How much is Liam paying you to be mentioned on the same Internet as Tom? All the best on this one.
Rocket Science: the epitaph for the Beveridge era - whenever it ends - reading 'Here lies a team that could beat anyone on its day, but seldom did when it mattered most'. 15/7/2023
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Re: Is Western Bulldogs star Tom Boyd suffering from a premiership hangover?
Jones' issues are pretty much between the ears. He has talent he can't capitalise upon. He has his weaknesses of course, but nothing that couldn't have been worked around.
Boyd doesn't bare a resemblance to Jones on this front as far as I can tell. He may not turn out to be the perfect key forward but I'm sure with further practice and support he can be a really good one.
Nobody's looking for a puppeteer in today's wintry economic climate.
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Re: Is Western Bulldogs star Tom Boyd suffering from a premiership hangover?
Originally Posted by
comrade
To use your analogy, Boyd started swinging a hammer 15 years ago. If he doesn't know how to build a pencil box by now (ie. take stock standard marks consistently), I doubt he ever will.
He takes those marks around the ground fairly consistently. Its usually when he is in the F50 that he fails
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Re: Is Western Bulldogs star Tom Boyd suffering from a premiership hangover?
Originally Posted by
GVGjr
Yes and no. Why does it have to be as a ruckman when as you say we are also missing two key forward targets?
We either planned poorly by not replacing Minson with someone with a mature body who could fill in for a few games or we gambled on the fitness of two ruckman who haven't really proved they're that durable?
Which mature ruckmen were available?
Only a few changed clubs and they were guys like Vardy and Witts who had a legitimate chance of being their club's no 1 ruckmen when they arrive (and Vardy is more injury prone than virtually anyone else in the competition).
Whoever came to us would know they are depth and would need to rely on multiple injuries to get senior gametime.
I'm sure we asked the question, there was just nobody good enough who was available.
Western Bulldogs: 2016 Premiers
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Re: Is Western Bulldogs star Tom Boyd suffering from a premiership hangover?
We went after Nankervis but he chose Richmond. Not sure they was to much else around of value.
The curse is dead.
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Re: Is Western Bulldogs star Tom Boyd suffering from a premiership hangover?
I just don't see it with Boyd as a KPF at this level, his hands are Minson like at times and he just doesn't look a 'natural forward' like others his age eg Daniher, Moore, Hogan etc.
More than happy with his ruck/forward progression though and he and Roughie are going to be formidable once Jordan is fit again.
The curse is dead.
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Re: Is Western Bulldogs star Tom Boyd suffering from a premiership hangover?
Originally Posted by
Mofra
Which mature ruckmen were available?
Only a few changed clubs and they were guys like Vardy and Witts who had a legitimate chance of being their club's no 1 ruckmen when they arrive (and Vardy is more injury prone than virtually anyone else in the competition).
Whoever came to us would know they are depth and would need to rely on multiple injuries to get senior gametime.
I'm sure we asked the question, there was just nobody good enough who was available.
Yep, it's fine to say we should have prepared better/had more foresight but its not easy to just conjure up a quality depth ruckman that is happy to play 3rd fiddle on what's likely a below average contract ($$ wise).
And shock horror: perhaps Bevo sees Boyd more as a ruck/forward rather than a pure KPF (especially considering we brought in Cloke to fill that role) and considers him as part of our overall ruck depth.
Our 1954 premiership players are our heroes, and it has to be said that Charlie was their hero.
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Re: Is Western Bulldogs star Tom Boyd suffering from a premiership hangover?
Originally Posted by
chef
I just don't see it with Boyd as a KPF at this level, his hands are Minson like at times and he just doesn't look a 'natural forward' like others his age eg Daniher, Moore, Hogan etc.
More than happy with his ruck/forward progression though and he and Roughie are going to be formidable once Jordan is fit again.
Boyd gets to the right positions though, far more than Minson would/could.
I think we are developing in the 2nd ruck role as it's so difficult to fill... but in 2 years with Roughy and English in the side I'd expect Roughy to play 2nd ruck, English to play no 1 ruck and Boyd to play full time forward.
Western Bulldogs: 2016 Premiers
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Re: Is Western Bulldogs star Tom Boyd suffering from a premiership hangover?
Originally Posted by
Mofra
Boyd gets to the right positions though, far more than Minson would/could.
I think we are developing in the 2nd ruck role as it's so difficult to fill... but in 2 years with Roughy and English in the side I'd expect Roughy to play 2nd ruck, English to play no 1 ruck and Boyd to play full time forward.
Then should we be playing him forward more now to learn his craft better? So his concrete hands become a bit softer and the ball sinks into them rather than bounces off.
They say Burt Lancaster has one, but I don't believe them.
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Re: Is Western Bulldogs star Tom Boyd suffering from a premiership hangover?
Originally Posted by
Mofra
Boyd gets to the right positions though, far more than Minson would/could.
I think we are developing in the 2nd ruck role as it's so difficult to fill... but in 2 years with Roughy and English in the side I'd expect Roughy to play 2nd ruck, English to play no 1 ruck and Boyd to play full time forward.
As a 2nd ruck, are you suggesting that Roughy spends the bulk of his time forward...with Tom Boyd also playing forward? I'd love to be a running defender against the Bulldogs in a few years in that case.
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Re: Is Western Bulldogs star Tom Boyd suffering from a premiership hangover?
Originally Posted by
comrade
And shock horror: perhaps Bevo sees Boyd more as a ruck/forward rather than a pure KPF (especially considering we brought in Cloke to fill that role) and considers him as part of our overall ruck depth.
I wouldn't think it would be very on-brand of Bevo to pigeon-hole someone so young with so much upside into a role that they've never really played previously; seems far more of a McCartney-type move.
- I'm a visionary - Only here to confirm my biases -
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Re: Is Western Bulldogs star Tom Boyd suffering from a premiership hangover?
Originally Posted by
Ozza
As a 2nd ruck, are you suggesting that Roughy spends the bulk of his time forward...with Tom Boyd also playing forward? I'd love to be a running defender against the Bulldogs in a few years in that case.
Do you think Roughy as a 60-70% forward is much different to Cloke in terms of defensive pressure?
Originally Posted by
Twodogs
Then should we be playing him forward more now to learn his craft better? So his concrete hands become a bit softer and the ball sinks into them rather than bounces off.
Necessity more than development right now - our ruck cupboard is bare and having the ability to chop out in the ruck makes him much more valuable to the team long term.
We never know what lies around the corner and virtually nobody in our line up plays 100% of game-time in one position game in, game out.
Western Bulldogs: 2016 Premiers