How do you rate the Dogs' attacking firepower?

[jeemak]

They ae either not being told or don't comply. Plonk me on the big salary and I'll tell you, but almost certainly get it wrong - like all the others.

We play shallow, force a crowd. From everything I've seen they do that, if you can tell me they're instructed not to do that go ahead.

I'm not saying I like how we/ they play. I just can't say the forwards aren't doing what they're told.

[Bulldog Joe]

Just to take one issue (without being privy to your entire IP), what would a coach tell his forwards to stop them getting pushed under the ball?

A simple premise of life.
If you keep doing the same thing with the expectation of a different result you are insane.

If they are getting continually pushed under the ball they need to stop engaging the physical push and shove or have someone else coming over the top of the contest.

[D Mitchell]

Just to take one issue (without being privy to your entire IP), what would a coach tell his forwards to stop them getting pushed under the ball?

That, along with being nudged off balance, even getting back into position quickly, aren't really coaching issues, they occur all over the ground. Just to contradict myself, I recall reading an account of one of Chris Grant's coaches, probably Plough, having it drawn to his attention by a radio commentator that Grant was being forced under the ball by a particular defender during a game so instructed Grant to play the defender from behind. I can't be more explicit than that, it's one of the multitude of titbits still in the huge pile of the unsorted, uncatalogued and to be filed of my entire IP

[D Mitchell]

We play shallow, force a crowd. From everything I've seen they do that, if you can tell me they're instructed not to do that go ahead.

I'm not saying I like how we/ they play. I just can't say the forwards aren't doing what they're told.

Fair point if by "shallow" you are referring to the forward press tactic, that might account for 2-3 forwards flying for the high ball in front of goal, one of my criticisms. A forward press works well with players like Clay Smith, Picken, a young McLean, Dunkley, Dickson, even Zaine Cordy in the forward line. The current forward line lacks those sorts. If I've misread you, I'd be interested in what you mean by "shallow".

PS MJP uses the phrase "wide and shallow" It looks like a reference to he forward pockets.

[mjp]

Forwards run either where they're told to or where they think the ball is going to go.

Forwards (mostly) run to space.

Good forwards run to where their team-mates can kick-it AND where they can score from whether there is space in that area or not. It's hard to teach and it's why players like Lynch and Hogan tend to get shots on goal whether they are in form or out of form. And it's why players like the recent revolving door at Melbourne (Henneman, Schache) will be feast or famine.

If you run to space it is generally available wide and shallow...hard to hit those targets and hard to kick goals from there.

[Uninformed]

That, along with being nudged off balance, even getting back into position quickly, aren't really coaching issues, they occur all over the ground. Just to contradict myself, I recall reading an account of one of Chris Grant's coaches, probably Plough, having it drawn to his attention by a radio commentator that Grant was being forced under the ball by a particular defender during a game so instructed Grant to play the defender from behind. I can't be more explicit than that, it's one of the multitude of titbits still in the huge pile of the unsorted, uncatalogued and to be filed of my entire IP

If you don't get the top job, you can always publish the IP! Big sales numbers.

[Uninformed]

A simple premise of life.
If you keep doing the same thing with the expectation of a different result you are insane.

If they are getting continually pushed under the ball they need to stop engaging the physical push and shove or have someone else coming over the top of the contest.

To me it appears they are moving quickly to the fall of the ball, but need to stop and prop with enough power to knock the defender off balance. Probably give up a free for blocking though?

[D Mitchell]

...or maybe they aren't as good as we think they are. In 2016, there was 1 specialist forward, Dickson, hardly a tall marking/monster, in the Grand Final team. The obsession with filling the forward line with with tall, marking forwards is counter productive, arguably a major contribution to the reasons we don't get past the first week of the Finals. What wins now is a team of goers who excel both defensively and offensively, no matter where they play.

[Uninformed]

...or maybe they aren't as good as we think they are. In 2016, there was 1 specialist forward, Dickson, hardly a tall marking/monster, in the Grand Final team. The obsession with filling the forward line with with tall, marking forwards is counter productive, arguably a major contribution to the reasons we don't get past the first week of the Finals. What wins now is a team of goers who excel both defensively and offensively, no matter where they play.

I am hoping super mobile talls with good ground game like Marra and Naughton can do the job.

[D Mitchell]

I am hoping super mobile talls with good ground game like Marra and Naughton can do the job.

Naughton's a couple of years longer in the system than Ugle-Hagan. He shows aggression when the ball is in dispute, neither do nearly enough work when the opposition has control of the ball. I join you in your hope but it hasn't happened yet.

[mjp]

Naughton's a couple of years longer in the system than Ugle-Hagan. He shows aggression when the ball is in dispute, neither do nearly enough work when the opposition has control of the ball. I join you in your hope but it hasn't happened yet.

Naughton is elite when the oppo have the ball. Strongly disagree.

[Grantysghost]

Naughton is elite when the oppo have the ball. Strongly disagree.

Great DEFENSIVE skills hey MJP

[D Mitchell]

Naughton is elite when the oppo have the ball. Strongly disagree.

Even more strongly re state my case. When the balls to be won, Naughton's right up there but doesn't apply pressure when it's gone. I recall James Cook, your classic forward who considered his job done once the ball had gone, unusually chasing a defender out, metres back, the defender bounced the ball, it went off at an angle and by the time the defender regathered it, Cook caught up, tackled, goaled from the free. That's what Naughton doesn't do. That said, he's the best of the tall forwards by a mile. What's "shallow" ?

[bornadog]

Naughton's a couple of years longer in the system than Ugle-Hagan. He shows aggression when the ball is in dispute, neither do nearly enough work when the opposition has control of the ball. I join you in your hope but it hasn't happened yet.

Naughton is elite when the oppo have the ball. Strongly disagree.

To back that up, Naughton sits top 12 in AFL for tackles inside 50 - all the players above him are below 190cm tall.

[D Mitchell]

To back that up, Naughton sits top 12 in AFL for tackles inside 50 - all the players above him are below 190cm tall.

Thanks, BAD. That stat validates Naughton's work when the ball is in dispute. When the ball's clear i e when the opposition have it under control and on the way out is where lies his Achilles heel.