Richmond - The big improvers?

[GVGjr]

Lets lose any personal vendettas with the Tigers but I'd like to hear if people think they are likely to step up a few positions on the ladder in 2013?

They have a very good midfield with the likes of Deledio, Cotchin, Martin, Foley, Tuck and Conca. A nice back line with Rance, Chaplin, Griffiths, Ellis, Morris and Newman and they have a dangerous forward line with Riewoldt, Vickery, King, Nahas and Knights.

Can anyone else see them making a big improvement next season?

[Eastdog]

Some are saying that Hardwick's job is in trouble if Richmond don't make the 8 in 2013.

[dog town]

Tried to address the right areas but I think they lack real depth much like Carlton. I think they will improve and push hard for the 8 but thats about it. Too many of them go missing when the heat really gets turned up. It is a massive step up for them.

[Greystache]

I'm on the fence about Richmond. They have some developing talent but they haven't been able to play together consistently both from week to week and within games themselves. I think the culture within the club celebrates mediocrity and I think that will play a role in limiting how much they progress.

I have concerns about the off field habits and dedication of some of the younger players they are relying on to take them forward. Martin and Conca for example have a lot of maturing to do before they can be considered certainties to take the Tigers forward.

I think they'll finish between 7-11 depending on luck with injuries.

[Maddog37]

I can't see them being top four, which in essence means they have bugger all chance of winning anything.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Agree that their depth isn't great and this will be their downfall.

They need to make the 8 though. They've made solid progress since Hardwick came on board, but if they fail again next season to play finals, it would be a big step backwards.

[bornadog]

Their biggest issue is the backline. Rance isnot a KPP, he is just not tall enough and they don't really have a centre half back. If they are going to make finals then I think 2013 is their best chance, but they won't be top four.

[Remi Moses]

Their biggest issue is the backline. Rance isnot a KPP, he is just not tall enough and they don't really have a centre half back. If they are going to make finals then I think 2013 is their best chance, but they won't be top four.

That's what I reckon as well. They're to Riewoldt centric as well.
Chance for the eight yes, but not top 4 for mine.

[boydogs]

Don't get sucked in to the hype, every year they are top 4 material then it falls in a screaming heap after round 1.

In the running for the 8, but nothing more.

[chef]

They've topped up with a lot of average players too.

Bottom half of the top 8 for me as long as they have a good run with injuries.

[AndrewP6]

Might squeeze into top eight, then will crash and burn. They're not as good as the hype.

[LostDoggy]

I predict they will finish ninth

[Ghost Dog]

I think they will do well next season. Their midfield will get them pretty far, but doubt they have the icing to finish the job in finals.

[Murphy'sLore]

I'm on the fence about Richmond. They have some developing talent but they haven't been able to play together consistently both from week to week and within games themselves. I think the culture within the club celebrates mediocrity and I think that will play a role in limiting how much they progress.

I have concerns about the off field habits and dedication of some of the younger players they are relying on to take them forward. Martin and Conca for example have a lot of maturing to do before they can be considered certainties to take the Tigers forward.

I think they'll finish between 7-11 depending on luck with injuries.

Stache, what exactly do you mean by that? How does it manifest?

[Ghost Dog]

Not sure how they celebrate mediocrity. They are still paying for their time with Terry Wallace but less so over time. Once they get over that hangover, will be a force to be reckoned with.

[Ozza]

I really enjoy watching Richmond play - great team to watch, and plenty of exciting players. But I think they are still at least another year off being a really good side.

They would need to defend better - across the whole ground, to be a top 4 or top 6 team. They are always heavily scored against. Even when they win - it tends to be 130-110.

A great free flowing game style to watch - but they aren't tough enough or stingy enough yet.

[G-Mo77]

I think they'll squeeze into the 8 next season.

I think they've done really well in the off season. I really like the addition of Chaplin in the backline, it was an area that needed work and they got a really good defender for virtually nothing. Knights is also a decent addition to the squad and cost them nothing. They added some experienced recycled players on the rookie list who extend their depth a little and kept their 3 top picks in this years draft in the process. I can't fault them in the off-season at all.

Anywhere from 6th - 9th is my prediction.

[Mofra]

Strange team - their midfield looks fantastic on paper, but is less effective than they shoudl be on match day. I still think their backline looks a little suspect

[G-Mo77]

Strange team - their midfield looks fantastic on paper, but is less effective than they shoudl be on match day. I still think their backline looks a little suspect

They're still thin there even with Chaplin. One of the key players go down and they'll find themselves in a spot of bother.

[DragzLS1]

Midfield is great its the backline and forward line that are just not good enough. Just do not have enough depth and will crash and burn come finals.. Same as Carlton and Essendon imo.

[Happy Days]

Of all the recycled players (i.e: the ones that you would expect to contribute immediately) that they have picked up, only Chaplin is worthwhile. Any improvement that they are to see is directly linked to how much improvement they can get out of their young midfield, which has to have some serious maturity issues to it.

[LostDoggy]

I'm changing to Richmond because i want to watch finals football

[Eastdog]

I'm changing to Richmond because i want to watch finals football

Don't worry M.R.M will be playing finals again soon. Richmond in the past 30 years haven't played in that many final series.

[EasternWest]

Don't worry M.R.M will be playing finals again soon. Richmond in the past 30 years haven't played in that many final series.

I think that was a play on words of the infamous Judas quote.

But I'd like to think you're right ED. Finals again sooner rather than later.

[Greystache]

Stache, what exactly do you mean by that? How does it manifest?

When you've had very little success such as they have you can develop a culture of celebrating small short term wins rather than considering where that victory sits in the greater scheme of things. In the Richmond example, if they were to beat Carlton in round 1 rather than using it as an affirmation they're on the right track and building on it, they're inclined to get so caught up in the celebration that they'll go out and lose the next 2 games to cellar dwellers and kill the moment they'd built.

[bulldogtragic]

Ninth would fill me with joy.

[Bulldog Revolution]

Their backline is pretty dependent on Chaplin - Im unsure Griffiths ever emerge as a real player

They have been developing nicely but need a few more to step up. Cotchin is an exquisite footballing talent, dynamic, line breaking, penetrating by foot. Martin when going is an explosive game breaker but lacks consistency.

Its a big year for them no doubt about it

Is Williams a good get for them as an assistant?

[Topdog]

Certainty to make the 8, piss easy draw. Wont do anything in the finals.

Carlton of 2010

[Remi Moses]

Gee the fans are talking it up.
But then again they get chatty often this time of year.

[always right]

Ninth would fill me with joy.

I'm with you but I have to concede they've developed a nice list with a midfield that threatens to become the best in the AFL. Their depth is improving each year and I think Chaplin is a huge get for them. I expect them to finish in the bottom four of the eight.

I hope I'm wrong. I envisage a sea of duffle coats (with Woosha Welsh on the back) being brought out of mothballs as the tiger faithful find their voice again.

[boydogs]

I'm with you but I have to concede they've developed a nice list with a midfield that threatens to become the best in the AFL.

Really? Cotchin is a top 10 player, Deledio is up there if you're counting him, but Foley, Tuck, Conca & Martin don't strike me as elite.

[chef]

Really? Cotchin is a top 10 player, Deledio is up there if you're counting him, but Foley, Tuck, Conca & Martin don't strike me as elite.

I would have Martin as elite.

[Ghost Dog]

What do you make of the coach? Hardwick seems like a nice enough guy but doesn't strike me as being a master tactician. I've been to a few Richmond smashings in my time.

[LostDoggy]

Really? Cotchin is a top 10 player, Deledio is up there if you're counting him, but Foley, Tuck, Conca & Martin don't strike me as elite.

Martin is a deadset star, just a shame he's also a knob, it seems.

[boydogs]

I would have Martin as elite.

Still a couple of years away IMO, and his commitment to his footy to get there is in doubt.

[Remi Moses]

Had a poor year last year. Not elite for mine, hanging out with Connors isn't going to help.

[azabob]

Had a poor year last year. Not elite for mine, hanging out with Connors isn't going to help.

Hasn't there been speculation that Martin is just as bad an influence on Connors?

[Topdog]

Martin had a good year interrupted by injury and stupidity.

He isn't elite at the moment but he isn't far off either. He is already a game changer.

[LostDoggy]

I think they will be the North of 2012. Easy draw, good run at some point, scrape into the 8 then get absolutely flogged in the finals. Watching North do that was pleasure.

[DragzLS1]

I think they will be the North of 2012. Easy draw, good run at some point, scrape into the 8 then get absolutely flogged in the finals. Watching North do that was pleasure.


I could not have said it better myself. Loved watching them talk up how good they were going only to get put back in there place by West Coast. God that was good!

I'm still not set on tigers I think Carlton will be the big improvers

[Remi Moses]

Gee their supporters need to find that elusive lid that comes off at this time of the year.
I think they're a chance for the eight but to say they 're going past the likes of Freo, Geelong and even Norf is a bit of a stretch.I think Carlton and even The Bombres will be thereabouts for the eight .

[LostDoggy]

I could not have said it better myself. Loved watching them talk up how good they were going only to get put back in there place by West Coast. God that was good!

I'm still not set on tigers I think Carlton will be the big improvers

I just don't see where they can improve? They didn't bring in anymore talent, Judd is a year older and slower and Eddie Betts is their forward line for another year. Possibly they get more out of Gibbs but I don't see much else on the horizon. At least Norf have young improvers taking them up the list and the tigers seem to have added some of what they need.

Tigers, North, Lions and Freo improvers for mine
Saints, Blues to continue to stagnate

[lemmon]

All about injures for mine, if they keep their important players fit, 6th or 7th isn't out of the question. Cotchin, Deledio, Martin, Riewoldt, Maric etc is a lot of top end talent

[DragzLS1]

I just don't see where they can improve? They didn't bring in anymore talent, Judd is a year older and slower and Eddie Betts is their forward line for another year. Possibly they get more out of Gibbs but I don't see much else on the horizon. At least Norf have young improvers taking them up the list and the tigers seem to have added some of what they need.

Tigers, North, Lions and Freo improvers for mine
Saints, Blues to continue to stagnate

Carlton had an excessive amount of injuries but think will rise bar injuries again. Even though I hate to say it! Lol

Tigers are a maybe and may just scrape in.

Not sold on lions or north as of yet but north will be a very unpredictable side next year

[KT31]

Tigers ninth for me.:D

[LostDoggy]

The one thing I love about Richmond, is how they get a standing ovation at half time when they are dominating....then it all falls apart and they lose hehe. If Jack goes down they are bottom 4 if he stays up we will still finish above them and that's all that matters. Hardwick won't coach the Season out.

[Bulldog Joe]

A few comments about them having an easy draw.

Carlton in round 1 is a game they MUST win
St Kilda round 2 after the Saints are primed with a clash against Gold Coast
Bulldogs round 3 is there best chance and if we get over them and they also lose the first 2 they will be ready to self destruct.
Follow up games
Collingwood - Round 4
Fremantle - (Perth) Round 5 on successive 6 day breaks
Geelong - Round 6

If they win 4 of 6 they will certainly be on their way, but anything less than 2 could have them in big trouble. 0 and 6 is not impossible.

I see them at 3 and 7 after 10 rounds and its pretty hard to make finals from there. It will take at least 12 wins to make finals.

[Remi Moses]

A few comments about them having an easy draw.

Carlton in round 1 is a game they MUST win
St Kilda round 2 after the Saints are primed with a clash against Gold Coast
Bulldogs round 3 is there best chance and if we get over them and they also lose the first 2 they will be ready to self destruct.
Follow up games
Collingwood - Round 4
Fremantle - (Perth) Round 5 on successive 6 day breaks
Geelong - Round 6

If they win 4 of 6 they will certainly be on their way, but anything less than 2 could have them in big trouble. 0 and 6 is not impossible.

I see them at 3 and 7 after 10 rounds and its pretty hard to make finals from there.
It will take at least 12 wins to make finals.

Hardwick will by unemployed if they don't improve

[Ghost Dog]

A few comments about them having an easy draw.

Carlton in round 1 is a game they MUST win

.

A hard game to win. On paper, Carlton are a bit ahead in terms of backline, ruck, but midfield is pretty even (maybe Carlton, just ) and the Tiger's forward line seems more potent.
Mick will throw everything he has at the Tigers. Even if they lose, I think Tigers fans will live with it ( used to it ) and the team won't drop its head like years gone by.

[GVGjr]

Hardwick will by unemployed if they don't improve

I think he has done a good job with them but they have taken to topping up the list like Voss did with the Lions which didn't work. I do think they will improve due to their good recruitment in recent years.