Want back-to-back flags? Then what do we to need change or improve in 2017?

[Dry Rot]

A premiership win is damned good fun, isn't it, and I'm recommending that the Saints and Tigers fans I know try it some time this century.

Two in row can only be twice the fun, but the stats suggest twice as hard.

Sure we have a host of players rejoining or joining us in 2017 like Murphy, Suckling, Wallis, Crameri, Adams and Cloke. Now just pause, and think if you were say a Pies or Tigers fan and you'd been able to trade that lot in. You'd be over the moon.

But is it enough?

The AFL decided it needed to act against Jong and our third man up prowess, and changed the rules.

Meanwhile, the mouthy, entitled, arrogant Giants scum are making dark plans against us at Breakfast Point* as I type this.

*Being on the water doesn't make their evil enclave any less of a shit hole.

Seasoned sides with strong home ground advantages like the Eagles and Swans will be chasing us, if they can find their players who went AWOL in the finals. Apparently Rohan and Tippett are still lost somewhere on the Hume Highway, trying to find their way home.

Young punk sides like the Saints and Demons will be coming at us, and the "young" Kangaroos if you can believe what Higgins said today.

The Hawks have had to resort to getting in the best mid to play in the history of game with only one knee and the great Ty Vickery, while the Cats are working on dark plans to make their 2 man team win against 22 players. And who knows what the **** is happening with two Adelaide teams?

In short, now we are the hunted, not the hunter. So what needs to change or improve in 2017 to get that second flag?

First thing I'd nominate is our kicking, both for goal and with our forward entries.

What do you think?

[boydogs]

Not a lot really. Injuries, goal kicking and forward line targets were issues in 2016, but we won anyway. Adjust to the loss of Hamling and the rule changes and we will be in the mix again

[Twodogs]

Agree with most of watch you say but I can't agree with St Kilda or Richmond winning a flag this century. *!*!*!*! 'em! I want their flags.

[Twodogs]

Our kicking really needs to improve. It's the next logical place for improvement in the AFL. Especially goalkicking. People will start saying, and they'd be right, we must focus more on players' goalkicking. They should be much better kicks at goal than this.

[Bulldog Joe]

I am expecting us to be very harshly umpired in the year ahead.

The rule changes and supposed harder interpretations on disposal by hand are clearly aimed at curbing our game.

Amazing that the AFL keep saying they want the game to open up and then react to the bleating of coaches who can't compete with how we open the game up.

Bevo will need strategies to keep the ball moving if the handball club is unduly penalised.

We need to maintain the manic pressure and run from behind. Improved delivery skills will also help and I see Bailey Williams as the player to add to what we have.

A better run with injury probably wouldn't go astray either.

[bornadog]

Good thread DR.

Back to back is not an easy task, however, we have a young hungry team that can do it. One of the areas that other teams would have studied closely is the midfield. Most teams go in with 2 or 3 midfielders and rely on them for the entire game. We have been rotating around 8 players, with the advantage that they can keep up the intensity for the entire game. Other teams may start to employ the same tactics and our advantage may be whittled down. Therefore, our midfield will be challenged.

Another area other teams would have looked at is our defensive structure. When you look at who is in defense, we are very inexperienced with the exception of Morris, yet we didn't allow big scores throughout the year. Bevo needs to ensure our forwards kick lots of goals, as other teams will employ similar structures to ours. The challenge will be the delivery to the forward line, the forward line setup and the ability to hit the scoreboard with accuracy.

Certainly the rule changes like 3rd man up will impact, but I am sure Bevo will counter that with other tactics.

In essence, we need to have new tactics to counter teams that will have copied our 2016 game plan and we need the forward line to be super efficient.

I am confident we can go back to back, as we have depth, class and the hunger to win.

[Mantis]

Good thread DR.

Back to back is not an easy task, however, we have a young hungry team that can do it. One of the areas that other teams would have studied closely is the midfield. Most teams go in with 2 or 3 midfielders and rely on them for the entire game. We have been rotating around 8 players, with the advantage that they can keep up the intensity for the entire game. Other teams may start to employ the same tactics and our advantage may be whittled down. Therefore, our midfield will be challenged.



Do other teams have the depth of quality in the midfield? I guess other teams won't know until they try, but there is a reason why most clubs limit the numbers who go through this area.. No such problems for us as we bat very deep.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

On paper we're going to be much stronger next year.

Crameri is a huge inclusion for our forward half, Cloke is a wildcard who if he fires probably makes us the most potent forward line in the competition. Dickson and Stringer are the obvious two who will benefit from Crameri/Cloke and we haven't spoken about Boyd's natural improvement, although he will spend time as a ruck.

Murphy is a big in along with a fit Suckling. Adams is better than Hamling when fit.

We would expect improvement from our young players, and I am bullish about the likes of Dale, Williams, Webb etc.

I think the question marks may revolve around our older players (Boyd, Morris, Murphy, Picken) playing as well as they have previously. Injuries will always have some sort of impact too. Other than that, we should be a much better side in 2017 than we were in 2016 which is scary.

[LostDoggy]

We should improve across most of the playing list, we have considerable depth, our players at 22-30 on the list are very capable and we were absolutely ravaged by injury last year.

We have great people at the club, the coach is a special unit and I can see him still surprising a few teams with bulldog strategy v2017.

Bontempelli.

So yes, yes yes, it can happen but a lot has to go right.

The greatest concern for me is the giants, I hope we can continue to get in their heads, they have an unreasonably talented team.

[Eastdog]

It is always tough defending a title but I believe we are every chance to do it again and experience that great moment we all did on October 1, 2016.

We have Bob Murphy our captain coming back which will be great and from training so far from what I've read he is super keen to get in it. Stewart Crameri as well will be a significant inclusion and will see how Jake Stringer goes and of course Travis.

Our midfield will scare many opposition sides: the likes of Libba, Macrae, Hunter, Bonti, Dahlhaus, McLean etc all at the top of their games will do a lot of damage.

Our defence despite all the battering it took in 2016 it was excellent and it is great to have experienced guys like Morris, M Boyd and Bob down there. Will be good to get Suckling back as well abd hopefully he is more consistent. I look forward to seeing more of Fletcher Roberts and how he goes and Kieran Collins will get more of a chance I would say particularly with Joel Hamling departing.

[Eastdog]

Our forward line in 2017 has the potential to scare a lot of opposition sides.

[1eyedog]

Do other teams have the depth of quality in the midfield? I guess other teams won't know until they try, but there is a reason why most clubs limit the numbers who go through this area.. No such problems for us as we bat very deep.

This is the nuts and bolts of it.

[Twodogs]

Do other teams have the depth of quality in the midfield? I guess other teams won't know until they try, but there is a reason why most clubs limit the numbers who go through this area.. No such problems for us as we bat very deep.


This is the nuts and bolts of it.

And all our mids can rest forward or back and still contribute. Bont did some of his best work roaming deep in attack in red time in quarters in the finals while he was resting forward. He took that hanger over Hodge while resting forward but that was earlier in the second quarter I think.

But Hunter, Daniel, Wallis, Tom Libba, Dahlhaus, Smith, Jong, McLean, Dunkley, Picken can all go forward and play well down there while Webb, R. Smith, Prudden, Suckling, Boyd, JJ, Biggs, Macrae can all rotate through the half back flanks and through the midfield.

That's why we have a magic pudding of midfield rotations-we pride ourselves on having a set of three different mids at each centre bounce and still scare the bejesus out of the opposition with the quality of the three we've sent into the middle. This is because Bevo and the coaching and development staff have challenged the players to add another bow to their armoury. Mids develop defense or attack roles and forwards and defenders can learn to take a turn through the midfield. We don't have to have our best players sitting on the bench because there isn't a spot in the midfield rotation for them. They can go forward or back and still contribute.


Our forward line in 2017 has the potential to scare a lot of opposition sides.

As opposed to the way our forward line have been scaring us over the last couple of years with their shooting at goal.:cool:

[jeemak]

It is always tough defending a title but I believe we are every chance to do it again and experience that great moment we all did on October 1, 2016.

We have Bob Murphy our captain coming back which will be great and from training so far from what I've read he is super keen to get in it. Stewart Crameri as well will be a significant inclusion and will see how Jake Stringer goes and of course Travis.

Our midfield will scare many opposition sides: the likes of Libba, Macrae, Hunter, Bonti, Dahlhaus, McLean etc all at the top of their games will do a lot of damage.

Our defence despite all the battering it took in 2016 it was excellent and it is great to have experienced guys like Morris, M Boyd and Bob down there. Will be good to get Suckling back as well abd hopefully he is more consistent. I look forward to seeing more of Fletcher Roberts and how he goes and Kieran Collins will get more of a chance I would say particularly with Joel Hamling departing.

Good post mate.

I appreciate you think cattle are going to play a significant part in our title defence, how do you feel strategy and selection pressure (providing we stay healthy) will play a part given it's getting harder and harder for all of us to select a best 22 players? This year we cobbled competitiveness together week in and week out due to injuries, what do we look like and what do we do with a healthy list to impreove?

Which players miss out on first cut selection and which ones play a big part in getting us up and running?

[jeemak]

I've said this in the rule changes thread, I think the key to our success in 2017 is being more direct with our usage and transitioning away from a huge reliance on handball to kicking more.

As others have said, we need to improve our kicking on all levels, as the cat is well and truly out of the bag on our handball effectiveness (to the extent the AFL is legislating against us).

For me, it starts from the back half. Without JJ and Murphy for a significant chunk and the whole season respectively our kicking game suffered. Biggs is a trier in this area, but he's not as proficient with either pace or skill execution to be a decisive kicker compared to each. If Murphy and JJ stay fit we are a significant step forward from where we were for much of the season, and the game will naturally open up.

The difference in these two using elite run and kick work in the home and away season can be the difference between us winning 15 games and 17 games - getting us close to top four (the obscurities of this most recent home and away season aside).

Importantly we'll be able to get the footy forward more decisively than we did this year on the back of better kicking out of defence, meaning we won't have to rely on the grind as much as we did in 2016. That effectively sees us playing intensely in the middle without having to hold onto the footy with ridiculously quick hands until a useful option short or medium distance presents itself. With Cloke, Boyd, Crameri and Stringer we'll be able to rush it long and get it out the back more than we did from the midfield this year, and or rely on our good kickers from defence opening up another side of the ground to transition the ball more easily.

I should note I don't want to see us become an Adelaide who relies on getting it out the back to score a huge chunk of goals, it's acknowledged that a grinding premiership win should be respected and much of that plan should still carry through given teams are going to be fooled into thinking that's our major play of 2016/2017.

But, we didn't win the premiership playing as we did in the first couple of rounds in 2016 when we were glittering. Things can change and you need to adjust as a team to the circumstances presented.

[Bulldog Revolution]

Super thread - lots of important issues to consider, but then IMO there is hardly a more important issue in life than to consider how the dogs might do it all again

We still have a lot of young guys with upside

Backline: Adams and Cordy get their chances to replace Hamling - Suckling, Murphy both missed the prelim and GF and would - Williams may spend more time being groomed. The impressive and likely rookie Lynch might also get a chance, as might Roarke Smith. Can Morris and Matt Boyd reproduce golden seasons?? I don't know, but its worth taking a moment just to appreciate how sensational these two have been for the club. Dale Morris embodies everything we want the modern bulldog player to be, fiercely determined, more skilled than is generally appreciated, incredibly giving of his time with fans, from all reports a great person, clubman, teammate, mentor, dad etc. Matt Boyd has unfairly had his detractors. Yes he ran himself ragged in the midfield and missed the odd target, but he did this whilst covering more ground than anyone in the competition, smashing his body physically to gain more of the ball than anyone in the game at least in one season. But, what we need to appreciate is his single minded determination that has willed himself, and our club, to a premiership. In the process he has overcome many scars of prelims past, has moved positions on the ground and been named all australian, and in his latter years has become a better leader of the gen y, millenials than seemed likely. Ok, premiership bulldog reminiscing momentarily done.

Midfield: Stevens and Hrovat's losses can be covered mostly from within. The major loss is Wallis who may reappear late in the season but whose an underrated, and incredibly consistent performer - Jong is the many most likely to be beneficiary and still has the athleticism and scope to become an A grader if his game sense can improve again, i have been bullish about Webb for a while and more work on his tank and off the ball work could see him in the mix, perhaps even Honeychurch and Dale shape as options in this area of the ground, but also for that high half forward role. Maybe Lipinski is the Stevens big bodied mid replacement, but then he may take some time.

Forwardline: Crameri is a huge addition - such a workhorse in terms of the ground he covers, his ability to get one out the back. His addition makes life easier for Stringer and Dickson. Cloke - will get every chance to replace injured Redpath - needs to cover ground, compete and take his chances - I remain quite hopeful he could be a big part of the equation. Tom Boyd - i watched Dunstall say after the grand final that players take a lot of confidence from performing so well in a grand final - and if his form continues on that trajectory then lookout. Bailey Dale may also be in the mix for a high half forward role and its not beyond his grasp to become a good option there, whilst Mitch Honeychurch is on our list because he has spent his whole life performing above the expectations of him, so I don't discount him either. Lipinski may also get a taste at some stage in a half forward role

[Eastdog]

Good post mate.

I appreciate you think cattle are going to play a significant part in our title defence, how do you feel strategy and selection pressure (providing we stay healthy) will play a part given it's getting harder and harder for all of us to select a best 22 players? This year we cobbled competitiveness together week in and week out due to injuries, what do we look like and what do we do with a healthy list to impreove?

Which players miss out on first cut selection and which ones play a big part in getting us up and running?

We also can't forget Redpath and Wallis who are expected to return later in the season. I would say Wally would slot back in much like Libba did. Redpath is another forward and will have quite a lot of competition now.

[Twodogs]

We also can't forget Redpath and Wallis who are expected to return later in the season. I would say Wally would slot back in much like Libba did. Redpath is another forward and will have quite a lot of competition now.

This is the most competition for tall forward spots I've seen at the bulldogs. Back in the mid '70s I can recall having a choice between Quinlan, Templeton, Sandilands and Welsh were all on the list at the same time.

[Eastdog]

This is the most competition for tall forward spots I've seen at the bulldogs. Back in the mid '70s I can recall having a choice between Quinlan, Templeton, Sandilands and Welsh were all on the list at the same time.

It is a good problem to have. How do you see Campbell going next year? Will he compliment Roughead in our side.

[Eastdog]

This is the most competition for tall forward spots I've seen at the bulldogs. Back in the mid '70s I can recall having a choice between Quinlan, Templeton, Sandilands and Welsh were all on the list at the same time.

Would have been cool to have been around then and watch some of these guys play.

[Bulldog4life]

This is the most competition for tall forward spots I've seen at the bulldogs. Back in the mid '70s I can recall having a choice between Quinlan, Templeton, Sandilands and Welsh were all on the list at the same time.

Plus Sockeye Salmon was on the list at that time too.

[1eyedog]

Ok I need help. Can someone please explain to me why GWS will beat us in the 2017 Grand Final? Most pundits have us as runner ups for 2017, actually every pundit does. So a 30 year old Brett Deliedio and a 34 year old Stevie J go into the side that LOST to us on their home ground 4 months ago. While Cloke, Crameri and Murphy (and Wally and Adams) come into ours. How are they more likely to beat us in Melbourne with Deliedio exactly?

Please enlighten me?

[Remi Moses]

I feel confident when the media are on another horse

[Bulldog Joe]

Ok I need help. Can someone please explain to me why GWS will beat us in the 2017 Grand Final? Most pundits have us as runner ups for 2017, actually every pundit does. So a 30 year old Brett Deliedio and a 34 year old Stevie J go into the side that LOST to us on their home ground 4 months ago. While Cloke, Crameri and Murphy (and Wally and Adams) come into ours. How are they more likely to beat us in Melbourne with Deliedio exactly?

Please enlighten me?

I believe that "the pundits" are assuming that GWS are still a young and developing list with oodles of talent. They see them as having topped up with experienced heads - Mumford, Shaw, StevieJ, Griffen and now Deledio, so success is assured.

What they have done is weaken their depth for mature talent and turned their list into the second oldest on average age. They have plenty of experience across their list.

Nobody seems to factor that the automatic improvement from age/experience is just as likely to occur with our side. Instead it seems popular belief, that a premiership hangover of some sort will make us a lesser team, despite the influx of players who missed the final series.

Happy for us to be again undervalued and can't wait to see us pull the Teddy Whitten.

STICK IT UP 'EM

[merantau]

Spoke with an ex-AFL player yesterday. Said he wasn't a romantic. Happy that Dogs won but "they weren't the best side in the competition. Sydney and GWS were better."
I was happy to hear that but pointed out to him that you only have to be "the best side on the day."
I'm really pleased that we're headed south
It will make proving all the doubters wrong even sweeter come Sept.

[GVGjr]

Spoke with an ex-AFL player yesterday. Said he wasn't a romantic. Happy that Dogs won but "they weren't the best side in the competition. Sydney and GWS were better."
I was happy to hear that but pointed out to him that you only have to be "the best side on the day."
I'm really pleased that we're headed south
It will make proving all the doubters wrong even sweeter come Sept.

I think if you honestly look at the home and away season he has a fair point. Sydney, GWS and maybe Geelong and Adelaide were impressive and yet Hawthorn who finished high on the ladder weren't. Once it came to the finals though it was a different story with our performances.

I think the fact that GWS are the current favourites for this helps us with motivation but there is a lot of work to do given every team will analyse our performances and copy what they can.

[merantau]

I haven't analysed the other teams wins but one thing I know is this: we won quite a few close games, when we weren't playing well, often coming from behind. What this shows is a very strong sense of self-belief, an ability to cope with and execute under extreme pressure. Too much downhill skiing is not good prepararion for a finals campaign. I suspect GWS expected us just to go away after they opened up a fourteen point lead early in the last.

[Mofra]

I haven't analysed the other teams wins but one thing I know is this: we won quite a few close games, when we weren't playing well, often coming from behind. What this shows is a very strong sense of self-belief, an ability to cope with and execute under extreme pressure. Too much downhill skiing is not good prepararion for a finals campaign. I suspect GWS expected us just to go away after they opened up a fourteen point lead early in the last.
Yeah we went 6-1 for close games in 2016 didn't we?
The only one we lost was the hawks game in round 3 where the footy gods decided to screw us, sans lube.

We may not have been the best team in 2016 but without doubt we were the mentally toughest and that got us over the line when it mattered.

[The Pie Man]

I still have some concerns over our key defensive stocks - Adams staying fit will be important. Ideally, Cordy & Collins will start to come on...(Zaine's ability to pinch hit forward a massive bonus)

We had some flat spots through last year, which injuries can partly explain. Consistency, while playing in new territory as the hunted will also be important.

Would like to beat Geelong at some point. Was relieved to see them knocked out on the Friday night last year.

Third man up will be interesting - Stringer's goal in the last qtr of the GF doesn't happen with the new rule in place.

Other than that, I'm reallllly looking forward to this year. Reckon Tom Boyd could be monstrous as the 2nd ruck/forward.

[westdog54]

I think if you honestly look at the home and away season he has a fair point. Sydney, GWS and maybe Geelong and Adelaide were impressive and yet Hawthorn who finished high on the ladder weren't. Once it came to the finals though it was a different story with our performances.


You are only as good as your last game. We turned it on when it mattered.

The finals are a season unto themselves. Once the H&A finishes everything effectively starts again.

Its ironic, isn't it. For a team that had a reputation for being poor performers in finals, we turned it on bigtime.

[GVGjr]

You are only as good as your last game. We turned it on when it mattered.

The finals are a season unto themselves. Once the H&A finishes everything effectively starts again.

Its ironic, isn't it. For a team that had a reputation for being poor performers in finals, we turned it on bigtime.

I wasn't dismissing our performances but we did finish 7th on the H&A ladder before turning it up a notch in the finals.
That gives us an incredible amount of confidence for this season but there are still some very good teams to beat to even make the top 4.

[ratsmac]

Ok I need help. Can someone please explain to me why GWS will beat us in the 2017 Grand Final? Most pundits have us as runner ups for 2017, actually every pundit does. So a 30 year old Brett Deliedio and a 34 year old Stevie J go into the side that LOST to us on their home ground 4 months ago. While Cloke, Crameri and Murphy (and Wally and Adams) come into ours. How are they more likely to beat us in Melbourne with Deliedio exactly?

Please enlighten me?

It must be Delidio's finals experience that has the pundits excited, all that winning finals experience.

[GVGjr]

Ok I need help. Can someone please explain to me why GWS will beat us in the 2017 Grand Final? Most pundits have us as runner ups for 2017, actually every pundit does. So a 30 year old Brett Deliedio and a 34 year old Stevie J go into the side that LOST to us on their home ground 4 months ago. While Cloke, Crameri and Murphy (and Wally and Adams) come into ours. How are they more likely to beat us in Melbourne with Deliedio exactly?

Please enlighten me?

As a long time Bulldog supporter I wouldn't bet against us.

The way it's been explained to me is a lot of the high end talent they have drafted over the past few years are now hitting their peak and the games experiences a lot of their players now have is right in the ideal premiership model most clubs would look towards acquiring. Adding the likes of Deledio isn't a game changer for them but if fit he is certainly a best 22 player. It's probably the reason why we were so interested in getting him.

I get the sentiment towards our upside as well but the bookies tend to make their decisions on facts not emotion and right now on what we know GWS are a top side and the team that beats them in the finals will probably win the GF.

[jeemak]

We did finish seventh, but only two games short of the minor premiers - with by far the worst injuries to deal with of all finalists.

When the finals rolled around we played the best football, and were the toughest side physically and between the ears. Funny this aligned with becoming healthier with good players playing together.

Sure, we weren't the best side through the home and away season, but our finals performance suggests if we weren't ravaged by injuries through the year we probably would have been.

[GVGjr]

Sure, we weren't the best side through the home and away season, but our finals performance suggests if we weren't ravaged by injuries through the year we probably would have been.

With a decent run with injuries there is no reason why we can't be a top 4 side.

[1eyedog]

As a long time Bulldog supporter I wouldn't bet against us.

The way it's been explained to me is a lot of the high end talent they have drafted over the past few years are now hitting their peak and the games experiences a lot of their players now have is right in the ideal premiership model most clubs would look towards acquiring. Adding the likes of Deledio isn't a game changer for them but if fit he is certainly a best 22 player. It's probably the reason why we were so interested in getting him.

I get the sentiment towards our upside as well but the bookies tend to make their decisions on facts not emotion and right now on what we know GWS are a top side and the team that beats them in the finals will probably win the GF.

I suppose it is difficult for bookies to quantify mental toughness and psychological edges as they do not translate into crunchable numbers.

I still believe GWS' greatest challenge will be having to win a final against a good team in Melbourne and I think that may very well be their downfall.

[Twodogs]

I wasn't dismissing our performances but we did finish 7th on the H&A ladder before turning it up a notch in the finals.
That gives us an incredible amount of confidence for this season but there are still some very good teams to beat to even make the top 4.


We've proved we can beat the best sides in the competition in the highest pressure games.

[GVGjr]

We've proved we can beat the best sides in the competition in the highest pressure games.

I can't simply dismiss the quality of the opposition like you can. There is a heap of work to do to go close to replicating last years effort. We should certainly be confident but I don't think I'm as confident as you are.

[The Doctor]

We've proved we can beat the best sides in the competition in the highest pressure games.

and anywhere!

[1eyedog]

I can't simply dismiss the quality of the opposition like you can. There is a heap of work to do to go close to replicating last years effort. We should certainly be confident but I don't think I'm as confident as you are.

It will take a bit of time for you to get used to our dominance but after this year I'm sure your confidence will grow.

[MrMahatma]

If you think about it statistically, outside of what we did last year, you have to finish top 4 to win the flag. Maybe what we did is the beginning of breaking the mold, maybe it was a once off.

Most people look at it and say that GWS finished top 4. They'll improve a bit, so should finish top 4 again. We finished 7, we'll improve a bit (potentially a lot...) but we need to go up from 7th... will we make top 4?

I think so. But I can see why others don't. Sydney will still be tough. Adelaide, Geelong, GWS, Hawks. These teams are hard to beat, and it's a long season (as we know).

I reckon we'll finish top 4 but I'm somewhat one eyed.

[bornadog]

If you think about it statistically, outside of what we did last year, you have to finish top 4 to win the flag. Maybe what we did is the beginning of breaking the mold, maybe it was a once off.

Most people look at it and say that GWS finished top 4. They'll improve a bit, so should finish top 4 again. We finished 7, we'll improve a bit (potentially a lot...) but we need to go up from 7th... will we make top 4?

I think so. But I can see why others don't. Sydney will still be tough. Adelaide, Geelong, GWS, Hawks. These teams are hard to beat, and it's a long season (as we know).

I reckon we'll finish top 4 but I'm somewhat one eyed.

My gut feeling is Geelong and Hawks won't make top 4. Stop Dangerfield and Geelong are in trouble. They only really have Danger and Selwood that are any good in the midfield.

Hawks were lucky to make top 4 and losing a couple of hard nuts in the midfield will struggle.

We will be top four and hard to beat again.

[Bulldog Joe]

My gut feeling is Geelong and Hawks won't make top 4. Stop Dangerfield and Geelong are in trouble. They only really have Danger and Selwood that are any good in the midfield.

Hawks were lucky to make top 4 and losing a couple of hard nuts in the midfield will struggle.

We will be top four and hard to beat again.

I am actually tipping Geelong (especially) and Hawthorn to miss the 8.

Geelong with North Melbourne have the highest number of untried players of any list. Geelong only have 27 players who played a senior game in 2016, they are seriously ready to be closer to the bottom 4 than top 4.

Hawthorn also have plenty of inexperienced players and are relying on the quality like Billy Hartung, Ricky Henderson and Jake Fitzpatrick in their top 25.

[LostDoggy]

I am actually tipping Geelong (especially) and Hawthorn to miss the 8.

Geelong with North Melbourne have the highest number of untried players of any list. Geelong only have 27 players who played a senior game in 2016, they are seriously ready to be closer to the bottom 4 than top 4.

Hawthorn also have plenty of inexperienced players and are relying on the quality like Billy Hartung, Ricky Henderson and Jake Fitzpatrick in their top 25.

Agree 100% BJ.

[Twodogs]

It will take a bit of time for you to get used to our dominance but after this year I'm sure your confidence will grow.

That's the premiership cup talking, that is. It has an energy of its own. I used to read all that stuff in the sagas about Viking swords and how each sword had a personality of its own and think "oh yeah, it's just a bunch of metal" but having held the cup, our cup in my arms, I think I know what they are on about. It's everything, that cup.

[Twodogs]

I am actually tipping Geelong (especially) and Hawthorn to miss the 8.

Geelong with North Melbourne have the highest number of untried players of any list. Geelong only have 27 players who played a senior game in 2016, they are seriously ready to be closer to the bottom 4 than top 4.

Hawthorn also have plenty of inexperienced players and are relying on the quality like Billy Hartung, Ricky Henderson and Jake Fitzpatrick in their top 25.

I reckon two out of North, Geelong or Hawthorn will miss the eight. Hawthorn might have added enough with their high priced recruits and Roughy coming back to eke out another year but it will be bottom part of the eight and out in the first week of the finals. None of those three clubs will have a significant impact in the overall scheme of things. Trading out Mitchell and Lewis was crazy brave, don't know what to make of that, it could be genius or it could be a disaster. They will miss Hill too, he's a big loss to a team that wasn't exactly quick over the ground as it was.

About Geelong, like others have said if you stop Dangerfield, you stop Geelong. If Libba hadn't limped off when we played them I think we would have taken them. He was getting Dangerfield well in hand but after Libba went off Dangerfield got on top again. And when Dangerfield goes then so does Selwood and when Selwood goes Duncan goes and so on down the line. No other team relies on one player to start up the band the way that Geelong relies on Dangerfield to get them going.

Dunno about Sydney. Looking back at the Grand Final they did well to only get beaten by 4 goals because we were up for anything that day. We could have beaten Man U in a FA cup final or the Dallas Cowboys at NFL that day. They have a bit of real talent to come back in too, Heany, Alir (I'm a huge Alir Alir fan-he could be great for us) and a few more. Hard to pick their form and finishing place this year, but I'm not brave or silly enough to go down the "Sydney in decline" road that we all seem to start the season with. They may win the premiership or they could win the wooden spoon-neither would suprise me overly.

[Topdog]

I reckon two out of North, Geelong or Hawthorn will miss the eight..

So you think one of Geelong or Hawks will miss the 8?

North will win the spoon this year.

[Topdog]

If you think about it statistically, outside of what we did last year, you have to finish top 4 to win the flag. Maybe what we did is the beginning of breaking the mold, maybe it was a once off.

Most people look at it and say that GWS finished top 4. They'll improve a bit, so should finish top 4 again. We finished 7, we'll improve a bit (potentially a lot...) but we need to go up from 7th... will we make top 4?

But people that look at things statistically will look at it a heck of lot more closely than that. They will notice that in 2016 7th was 1 win out of top 4 and 2 wins off 1st.

7th place in the last 10 years has not been that close to both spots.

2015: 3, 4
2014: 4, 5
2013: 1, 5 (4 to 2nd)
2012: 2, 3
2011: 5, 8
2010: 2, 5
2009: 2, 7
2008: 1, 9
2007: 2, 6
2006: 1, 4

[Twodogs]

So you think one of Geelong or Hawks will miss the 8?

North will win the spoon this year.


Yep, one of Hawthorn or Geelong to miss. I reckon probably Geelong. Both missing wouldn't surprise me but I just reckon Hawthorn to eke out one more year as finalists but not enough quality to actually go anywhere. They have Clarkson too. Clarkson is the second best coach in the caper

[1eyedog]

That's the premiership cup talking, that is. It has an energy of its own. I used to read all that stuff in the sagas about Viking swords and how each sword had a personality of its own and think "oh yeah, it's just a bunch of metal" but having held the cup, our cup in my arms, I think I know what they are on about. It's everything, that cup.

Yep and those Viking swords were everything to those Vikings.

In terms of the above my feeling is both Geelong and Hawthorn will be playing for a position between 6-8 as will half a dozen other teams. Geelong will probably beat us again...

[Bulldog Joe]

Yep and those Viking swords were everything to those Vikings.

In terms of the above my feeling is both Geelong and Hawthorn will be playing for a position between 6-8 as will half a dozen other teams. Geelong will probably beat us again...

The fixture has again been set up to suit them with a Friday night down there on the back of us playing West Coast in Perth.

[Twodogs]

Depends on what sort of night Dangefield is having I guess.

Seriously I think beating Geelong would be pretty high on this groups list. The fact we haven't beaten them in so long (was it 3 coaches ago?) must grate on them a bit. It grates on me a lot.

[Eastdog]

Depends on what sort of night Dangefield is having I guess.

Seriously I think beating Geelong would be pretty high on this groups list. The fact we haven't beaten them in so long (was it 3 coaches ago?) must grate on them a bit. It grates on me a lot.

We are due for a win against them. It has been a while. Very disappointing the way we played first up against them last season at Etihad and the 2nd time we played them at Kardina Park we played better but still lost and was disappointing. So frustrating in that first game that they didn't miss a beat and we scored only 5 goals that night but anyway who cares cause in 2016 we got them all and became premiers :)

[Twodogs]

We are due for a win against them. It has been a while. Very disappointing the way we played first up against them last season at Etihad and the 2nd time we played them at Kardina Park we played better but still lost and was disappointing. So frustrating in that first game that they didn't miss a beat and we scored only 5 goals that night but anyway who cares cause in 2016 we got them all and became premiers :)


Two such wonderful words to put together and then apply to us.

[Eastdog]

Two such wonderful words to put together and then apply to us.

At the time during H&A season of 2016 we wouldn't have thought with all our injuries that will going to lift the cup but it happened and it was unbelievable.

[Twodogs]

At the time during H&A season of 2016 we wouldn't have thought with all our injuries that will going to lift the cup but it happened and it was unbelievable.

Miraculous is what it was.

[bornadog]

Dogs 'have to change' to survive at the top: Hunter (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-02-20/dogs-have-to-change-to-survive-at-the-top-hunter)



http://s.afl.com.au/staticfile/Samples/487698-tlsnewsportrait.jpg



THE WESTERN Bulldogs are embracing the tag of being "the ones to beat" as the reigning premiers look to go back-to-back, according midfielder Lachie Hunter.

The Bulldogs are enjoying the pride that comes with winning a flag, but Hunter says the players are well aware they need to evolve and improve if they're to lift the cup again this season.
"It's a bit of different feeling (to be premiers), but it's a good one to have though," Hunter said at the club's community camp in Ballarat.

"We're coming off a great season and we're the ones to beat."
"You have to change or else you won't survive at the top and we've done that."

Coach Luke Beveridge commended his players for the condition in which they came back from the off-season break, but Hunter was always confident of the professionalism of the group.

He believes that attitude is testament to the ambition of the team.
"(Beveridge) was really happy with how everyone came back (in good condition), Hunter said.

"Everyone drove each other in the pre-season and we knew (what shape) we had to come back.
"In terms of the pre season, you obviously start four weeks later (after playing in the Grand Final), so the fitness has taken a little bit longer to get there.

"Hopefully by round one we'll be right to go."
And when quizzed on his own game, the prolific ball-winner says he aspires to become a more complete footballer in 2017.

Hunter's name was in the conversation for All Australian honours last season after collecting the most uncontested possessions (514), finishing fourth in total kicks (391) and sixth in total possessions (719).

"I'd love to work on my defensive side a bit more," Hunter said.
"I think I've got fair bit left (to get to my best)."

[dukedog]

^^^^
I expect nothing less than coach of the year / Jock Mchale medalist, to have the boys pumped for 2017. Beveridge is all class. He has a very . Very bright future ahead.

[Twodogs]

^^^^
I expect nothing less than coach of the year / Jock Mchale medalist, to have the boys pumped for 2017. Beveridge is all class. He has a very . Very bright future ahead.

If there was a European Chamionship like comp involving all the clubs around Australia and the interstate clubs had become dominant at the game the Victorians had first developed and Australia had a population of 800 million then Bevo would lead us to the AFeL European cup at his first try