The Chad Thread

[bulldogtragic]

I'm finding as the media ramps us between word of our club and The Chad maybe hooking up, there's a fair bit to follow over several threads, and it's drowning out the general other trading topics inwards or outgoing. So if it's alright with everyone, perhaps he's a serious enough topic (& a big enough topic) to dedicate a thread to. Leaving the others general.

If so, my thoughts today have changed a little bit. With outlets reporting that (essentially) Port have said he's not worth what we would offer, so explore the market... Now it's a big 'if'... If Wingard picks us then I think the trade worth is brought into question, which is where my thinking has changed.

Wingard to me was worth pick 6, and maybe some steak knives, nothing coming back. But if it's the case that Port won't match any free agency offers next year at our alleged dollars, then Port's hand is a little weakened. He can go this year for a fair trade, or next year for whatever the AFEL determine the compo at and where they finish. Much like how Tom Boyd under contract said he was leaving GWS in 2014 under contract to the dogs, or in 2015 to the dogs for nothing (owing to the money, via PSD). If we know Port Adelaide won't pay $800,000 this year or next, and he determines he wants to come to Whitten Oval, then maybe we can drop the steak knives off the trade and/or maybe ask for a fourth to fifth rounder swap to get us draft points back. There's no point in overly low balling them, if he picks us, but knowing they won't pay him this year or next to the level we will, that puts a realistic veil over any talks. He's all but assured not to be there between now and 12 months, the media have made sure the Dogs & Hawks know it too. Maybe we could get a really good trade out of it. If this media reporting is correct, I think the trade capital we need to put up is just that bit lesser.

But first things first, get Jackson to get The Chad to make a public announcement picking us and hope the former top tier law firm lawyer, Sam Power, with the insight of a former very good traded, Ameet Bains, can get us a good deal.

[Twodogs]

All aboard the Chadwagon.

[ratsmac]

About time Chad got his thread!

Pick 6 is a good trade for Wingard seeing that Port would have to be interested in some of the SA talent early in this years draft. But what if we want to keep pick 6. Could we throw up a player like Williams (South Australian) and a future pick. I rate Williams, I think he'll blossom next season and could be temping for Port. I'm just spit balling here, I'd hate to lose Williams.

[comrade]

917

Chad liked Mitch’s new contract.

[bulldogtragic]

917

Chad liked Mitch’s new contract.

... Is it the actual Chad Wingard?

[Twodogs]

... Is it the actual Chad Wingard?


Let's just say that it's 'a' Chad Wingard.

[Twodogs]

So given Bevo's love of playing the new guys in suprise positions in their first few games I wonder how the Chad will enjoy playing in the back pocket for the first half of next season?

[EasternWest]

So given Bevo's love of playing the new guys in suprise positions in their first few games I wonder how the Chad will enjoy playing in the back pocket for the first half of next season?

He'll have a hard time getting to the back pocket after taking the centre bounce.

[Greystache]

So given Bevo's love of playing the new guys in suprise positions in their first few games I wonder how the Chad will enjoy playing in the back pocket for the first half of next season?

I bet he never saw himself as a tagger previously!

[bulldogsthru&thru]

917

Chad liked Mitch’s new contract.

Also liked Reds retirement video. I mean footy players like all players content but we can hope

[chef]

Maybe we should wait before getting excited.

[The Doctor]

Maybe we should wait before getting excited.

I agree. I think we should all chill out a bit.

[GVGjr]

There are some warning bells ringing for me with this focus on Wingard.
Based on his form over the last two years though is he really worth 800K plus over a 5 or 6 year deal and pick 6 or 7 in the draft?
If money is his primary focus then that concerns me.

FWIW, I'd want something else back for Wingard than what is being proposed

[EasternWest]

There are some warning bells ringing for me with this focus on Wingard.
Based on his form over the last two years though is he really worth 800K plus over a 5 or 6 year deal and pick 6 or 7 in the draft?
If money is his primary focus then that concerns me.

FWIW, I'd want something else back for Wingard than what is being proposed

I'm a bit with you. I'd welcome him at the club, but with those kind of dollars I'd rather try to get Shiel.

[The Doctor]

There are some warning bells ringing for me with this focus on Wingard.
Based on his form over the last two years though is he really worth 800K plus over a 5 or 6 year deal and pick 6 or 7 in the draft?
If money is his primary focus then that concerns me.

FWIW, I'd want something else back for Wingard than what is being proposed

I think he's worth every penny but that's not my concern. There is a lot of hysteria going on at the moment and I think a few supporters are getting a bit carried away. We face opposition from the Hawks & Saints and of course Port don't have to trade him at all. So it's a long way from being done and I can't hear a fat lady singing, yet.

[GVGjr]

I think he's worth every penny but that's not my concern. There is a lot of hysteria going on at the moment and I think a few supporters are getting a bit carried away. We face opposition from the Hawks & Saints and of course Port don't have to trade him at all. So it's a long way from being done and I can't hear a fat lady singing, yet.

Based on his form over the last two years? He's been an average performed player during that period and a 5 year deal at 800K plus seems on the high side to me. Based on potential it's around the or at least closer to the mark.

In the last two weeks there has certainly been a rise in the number of "Chadpoles" in our supporter base.

[Dancin' Douggy]

The way I see it is we’re in a win/win situation. If we get Chad great. If not pick 6/7 will get us a gem of a player with no salary pressure.

[Twodogs]

He'll have a hard time getting to the back pocket after taking the centre bounce.

Especially with the 3/3/3 rule.


I bet he never saw himself as a tagger previously!

Just let the good players take him to the contest! The Chad can take over from there.

[Sedat]

I'm a bit with you. I'd welcome him at the club, but with those kind of dollars I'd rather try to get Shiel.
I actually think Shiel is a touch overrated - very good player but lacks the hurt factor of some of his teammates. Doesn't hit the scoreboard and can turn it over a bit as well. Josh Kelly on the other hand....

Wingard is an elite footballer with serious hurt factor. He can play midfield, win his own ball and of course is very dangerous in F50 and can win contests one-out. I don't see his plateau over the last couple of years as a negative, rather a positive in that he will never be as gettable as he is right here and now.

If he is committed to a move to help his career I have no problem pulling the trigger on him. I doubt money is the sole motivator - an interstate move and increased tax will wipe most of the difference between his current contract and what is proposed. He is absolutely the right age profile as well.

[Sedat]

Based on his form over the last two years?
His 2nd half of the season playing midfield was as good as any of his teammates. He's a jet IMO and that level of talent is always welcome at the kennel.

Let's see how it all plays out but I'm glad we are courting him. Hopefully we can land The Chad.

[bulldogtragic]

His 2nd half of the season playing midfield was as good as any of his teammates. He's a jet IMO and that level of talent is always welcome at the kennel.

Let's see how it all plays out but I'm glad we are courting him. Hopefully we can land The Chad.

Exactly, it’s a long way from a done deal. But more broadly speaking about being a destination club. Of recent times Tom Boyd threatened to walk out to come to us, Suckling turned his back on the chance at another Hawks flag, Crozier & Trengove were courted by other clubs, Trav Cloke ripped up a big contract to play with us, Schache (pick 2) came to us, Hurley was across the line until Essendon do their thing without any consequence... ‘If’ we can land Wingard, I say we are starting to put together a body of work that says we are becoming a destination club. Get back to winning and it only gets better.

[EasternWest]

I actually think Shiel is a touch overrated - very good player but lacks the hurt factor of some of his teammates. Doesn't hit the scoreboard and can turn it over a bit as well. Josh Kelly on the other hand....

Well yeah, I'm on record as to wanting Kelly more than any other player. I even offered bornadog as steak knives in said trade. But he's not in the discussion, sadly.

I take your point re Shiel and like I said I'm perfectly comfortable/happy to go after Wingard. But if I could choose only one it would be Shiel. Just my take.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

I actually think Shiel is a touch overrated - very good player but lacks the hurt factor of some of his teammates. Doesn't hit the scoreboard and can turn it over a bit as well. Josh Kelly on the other hand....

Wingard is an elite footballer with serious hurt factor. He can play midfield, win his own ball and of course is very dangerous in F50 and can win contests one-out. I don't see his plateau over the last couple of years as a negative, rather a positive in that he will never be as gettable as he is right here and now.

If he is committed to a move to help his career I have no problem pulling the trigger on him. I doubt money is the sole motivator - an interstate move and increased tax will wipe most of the difference between his current contract and what is proposed. He is absolutely the right age profile as well.

Yep - said it a few times but Shiel is very overrated. He has little hurt factor and his skills are not great. Not really a run and carry type of player either.

He's a good 3rd or 4th mid but no more than that.

[Axe Man]

https://i.postimg.cc/0jHFBX63/Capture.png (https://postimages.org/)

[bulldogtragic]

https://i.postimg.cc/0jHFBX63/Capture.png (https://postimages.org/)

But a part from winning the football, winning the contested footy, kicking goals, gerating goal assists, kicking it most inside 50, getting clearances and laying tackles, what has The Chad ever done in 2018?

[Mofra]

There are some warning bells ringing for me with this focus on Wingard.
Based on his form over the last two years though is he really worth 800K plus over a 5 or 6 year deal and pick 6 or 7 in the draft?
If money is his primary focus then that concerns me.

FWIW, I'd want something else back for Wingard than what is being proposed
If he plays like the second half of this year, than yes.
20+ touches and a goal per game. Polec is on $700k, a cooked Hannerbery on $800k pa.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

But a part from winning the football, winning the contested footy, kicking goals, gerating goal assists, kicking it most inside 50, getting clearances and laying tackles, what has The Chad ever done in 2018?

I think a lot of it comes from simply looking at his goals which dropped, even though that was a result of him moving to the midfield.

There's no doubt he has stagnated a bit, but nowhere near as bad as some are making out.

[GVGjr]

His 2nd half of the season playing midfield was as good as any of his teammates. He's a jet IMO and that level of talent is always welcome at the kennel.

Let's see how it all plays out but I'm glad we are courting him. Hopefully we can land The Chad.

He was one of the most exciting players in his early years but I watch Port a little bit and I'm surprised that his drop in form isn't at least a pause for consideration for most people.

As a club if we are convinced he's looking at a move to us because he can play his best football then great, lets go all-in but he's at a strong club now and I think we should at least be wary that money might be his primary focus.

There is no doubt that the upside is huge if he has the hunger to succeed.

Is someone going to start a "I'm a Chadpole" membership option?

[Ozza]

Drop in form over the last two years = fake news.

[The Doctor]

Wingard would be top 5 on our list if not top 3.

Who else on our list has the same hurt factor capability besides Bont?

Anyway as I said earlier I think it's a long way from being done so I'm not getting my hopes up just yet

[EasternWest]

but a part from winning the football, winning the contested footy, kicking goals, gerating goal assists, kicking it most inside 50, getting clearances and laying tackles, what has the chad ever done in 2018?

lol.

[Mantis]

Drop in form over the last two years = fake news.

My form would drop too playing the shit style that Hinkley has implemented.

He's still been more than handy by averaging 20 + 1 a game, but he is capable of more... as seen by his performances when Port were playing an uptempo game.

[Sedat]

Well yeah, I'm on record as to wanting Kelly more than any other player. I even offered bornadog as steak knives in said trade. But he's not in the discussion, sadly.

I take your point re Shiel and like I said I'm perfectly comfortable/happy to go after Wingard. But if I could choose only one it would be Shiel. Just my take.
He's so neat, his socks are always pulled up and he has immaculate hair. Plus he's dating Choco's daughter. He just looks and acts like a serious footballer, and he is very good. Just not quite at the level some scribes are suggesting he is.

[bornadog]

He's so neat, his socks are always pulled up and he has immaculate hair. Plus he's dating Choco's daughter. He just looks and acts like a serious footballer, and he is very good. Just not quite at the level some scribes are suggesting he is.

BTW: Choco taking up a role as coach of Werribee

[Axe Man]

He's so neat, his socks are always pulled up and he has immaculate hair. Plus he's dating Choco's daughter. He just looks and acts like a serious footballer, and he is very good. Just not quite at the level some scribes are suggesting he is.

BAD is dating Choco's daughter?

[KT31]

Mark Stevens
‏

@Stevo7AFL
Follow Follow @Stevo7AFL
More
Chad Wingard in Melbourne today, I’m told, for talks with his management. His manager Tom Petroro later spotted meeting Hawks list manager Graham Wright. Make of that what you will, Hawks have been linked ... Dogs also keen @7NewsMelbourne

[EasternWest]

He's so neat, his socks are always pulled up and he has immaculate hair. Plus he's dating Choco's daughter. He just looks and acts like a serious footballer, and he is very good. Just not quite at the level some scribes are suggesting he is.

Fair enough. Being neat is a weird criticism :).

BAD is dating Choco's daughter?

He's making the most of his steak knives trade.

[Sedat]

Fair enough. Being neat is a weird criticism :)
Not criticising it EW. It just makes him look like the dedicated professional footballer and solid citizen that he is. And because he looks so sharp and professional, I reckon that masks some of his shortcomings with the media.

[bornadog]

Mark Stevens
‏

@Stevo7AFL
Follow Follow @Stevo7AFL
More
Chad Wingard in Melbourne today, I’m told, for talks with his management. His manager Tom Petroro later spotted meeting Hawks list manager Graham Wright. Make of that what you will, Hawks have been linked ... Dogs also keen @7NewsMelbourne

That was yesterday BTW

[Twodogs]

I see what you mean Sedat. Shiel doesn't work at being a bit of a suck but he comes across as one sometimes. He's like that kid who's a mate of your son that always makes a point of saying hello to everyone's mum and dad and is just a bit too nice. I always like to know whose room that kid is in.

[The Pie Man]

How do our facilities stack up these days? If Nixon is to be believed, The Chad is keen on touring both Dogs & Hawks before making a call.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

How do our facilities stack up these days? If Nixon is to be believed, The Chad is keen on touring both Dogs & Hawks before making a call.

Nixon is not to be believed

[mjp]

I keep logging back on just to check this thread...

[comrade]

I keep logging back on just to check this thread...

All aboard the Chadwagon.

[Testekill]

Maybe we should wait before getting excited.

Never

[1eyedog]

Never

Agreed. Boring!
p.s Shiel is an explosive animal.
I'll settle for Wingard. Not worth that dosh but gotta pay overs. He'll sell 800k in short sleeve and long sleeve jumpers.

[Doc26]

How do our facilities stack up these days? If Nixon is to be believed, The Chad is keen on touring both Dogs & Hawks before making a call.

The Hawks new home is being built on a swamp.

And he’d be moving from Kochie to Jeffrey.

[dog town]

Bit frustrating that last year trade radio kicked off with a staged media performance from Stringers manager to help his cause. This year they haven’t spoken to Wingard, his manager, Port or even us about this.

[mjp]

Bit frustrating that last year trade radio kicked off with a staged media performance from Stringers manager to help his cause. This year they haven’t spoken to Wingard, his manager, Port or even us about this.

Blame Jake's manager for last year...and Jake's rambling performance for Wingard not being on this year...

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Blame Jake's manager for last year...and Jake's rambling performance for Wingard not being on this year...

They had Tom Lynch this year. Who said nothing.

[comrade]

Jake's manager, Jake's dad, Dodoro...all played their part in that premeditated, classless ****show.

I'd prefer the Wingard deal to just get done quietly and professionally, rather than play it out publicly.

[bornadog]

Barrett:



If
Wingard joins (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2018-09-18/dogs-secret-weapon-in-the-chase-for-chad) ...



then
the finals will be back on the cards for 2019.

[bulldogtragic]

Barrett:



If
Wingard joins (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2018-09-18/dogs-secret-weapon-in-the-chase-for-chad) ...



then
the finals will be back on the cards for 2019.




I've said for years, this bloke is the most astute footy writer. Really knows his stuff and supports the success of our club.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

I've said for years, this bloke is the most astute footy writer. Really knows his stuff and supports the success of our club.

I'm just genuinely shocked he put aside his beef with Bevo and could actually write something positive about us....or was it a backhanded compliment?

[bulldogtragic]

I'm just genuinely shocked he put aside his beef with Bevo and could actually write something positive about us....or was it a backhanded compliment?

I think just stating the obvious. We bring in a guy whose in our top 5 players, with a re-focused team and development of our kids. Of course finals are on the cards. Not a lot of substance to this pulp fiction. But he's right. The Bevo sledge is for next week.

[jeemak]

Jake's manager, Jake's dad, Dodoro...all played their part in that premeditated, classless ****show.

I'd prefer the Wingard deal to just get done quietly and professionally, rather than play it out publicly.

It was a completely unedifying display put on by the Stringer camp. The efforts to make out the club to be at fault for his ousting, and Dodo's attempts at diminishing his trade value were so obvious it was pathetic.

[The Pie Man]

Jay Clark reckons he ends up at Hawthorn despite us probably offering more coin

Sigh

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Jay Clark reckons he ends up at Hawthorn despite us probably offering more coin

Sigh

Yeah heard that. Although there was very little substance to his reasoning. It was basically just him ogling hawthorn. Pretty much insinuating that Chad would play for the hawks for basically what he’s on now....

[bulldogtragic]

Jay Clark reckons he ends up at Hawthorn despite us probably offering more coin

Sigh

That’s a very strange reckoning. Contracting into same money to turn his back on this contract, which is his big one. Reckons? Or has sources confirming? And Hawthorn have to beat our pick 6 offer to Port. That reckon defies a bit of logic.

[FrediKanoute]

Strange decision to join he Hawks. Yes top 4 in 2018, but seriously their list is a mess and they will crash over the next years to rebuild. Topping up with players like Wingard will see them avoid a complete bottom out, but they are not going to win a flag in the next 5 years. Why as a player would you waste your time?

[Greystache]

That’s a very strange reckoning. Contracting into same money to turn his back on this contract, which is his big one. Reckons? Or has sources confirming? And Hawthorn have to beat our pick 6 offer to Port. That reckon defies a bit of logic.

Yeah not sure I'd take anything Jay Clarke says too seriously. He seems like a Bigfooty poster with a media accreditation.

[Bulldog Joe]

Strange decision to join he Hawks. Yes top 4 in 2018, but seriously their list is a mess and they will crash over the next years to rebuild. Topping up with players like Wingard will see them avoid a complete bottom out, but they are not going to win a flag in the next 5 years. Why as a player would you waste your time?

I think we need to understand that players are not really equipped for list analysis.

If Clark sells the dream, he won't care what anyone thinks.
We need to convince him that we can provide the success.

[bulldogtragic]

Yeah not sure I'd take anything Jay Clarke says too seriously. He seems like a Bigfooty poster with a media accreditation.

He's just missing mentioned Schoenmakers as the fair trade...

[divvydan]

If Wingard wants to be a permanent midfielder then Hawthorn makes sense as their midfield depth is close to non-existant.

[chef]

Clarkson has a lot of pull

[hujsh]

Big club, play big matches on the MCG, get set with better chances for media career post footy if he wants, better support for indigenous players, lots of reasons he could pick.

[bornadog]

Yeah not sure I'd take anything Jay Clarke says too seriously. He seems like a Bigfooty poster with a media accreditation.

He said Wallis was going to Brisbane - gets a lot wrong

[Throughandthrough]

Jay Clarke is a flog

[azabob]

Jay Clarke is a flog

What are you hearing? Is he staying? Going?

[bulldogtragic]

What are you hearing? Is he staying? Going?

Jay Clarke to Breitbart Sport on a three year deal, for small McCafe coffee.

[jeemak]

Jay Clarke to Breitbart Sport on a three year deal, for small McCafe coffee.

They’re overpaying with that offer, desperados.

[GVGjr]

If Wingard is our focus and we are confident he wants to come to us then given we are trading pick 6 we should ask for their pick 45 as a sweetener in the deal. An extra pick could be handy for us with Khamis

If Port weren't keen to add that to the trade then perhaps we could look at a deal with the Crows swapping our pick 6 for their pick 9 and something else.

Port still get a top 10 pick for Wingard from us but they are now picking behind their arch enemy in a strong SA draft. I think Port would comfortably hand us their pick 45 in a deal for Wingard

[Sedat]

If Wingard is our focus and we are confident he wants to come to us then given we are trading pick 6 we should ask for their pick 45 as a sweetener in the deal. An extra pick could be handy for us with Khamis
Agree 100%. Port will get pick 6 off us and another good pick for Polec - they may not even want to use pick 45 if they can snag 4 picks in the top 30.

[bulldogtragic]

If Wingard is our focus and we are confident he wants to come to us then given we are trading pick 6 we should ask for their pick 45 as a sweetener in the deal. An extra pick could be handy for us with Khamis

If Port weren't keen to add that to the trade then perhaps we could look at a deal with the Crows swapping our pick 6 for their pick 9 and something else.

Port still get a top 10 pick for Wingard from us but they are now picking behind their arch enemy in a strong SA draft. I think Port would comfortably hand us their pick 45 in a deal for Wingard

Completely agree. After shuffling that's pick 50 or so. Even if we hand back 66 if push came to shove. That's about 200 extra points.

I've been playing with a complex trade, but haven't finished the fine details but I've got this far:

Port get pick 10 for Polac
Dogs trade Port pick 6 for pick 10

Port take Rozee & Hately at the draft
Dogs use pick 10 before West

Dogs hand over 2019 1st rounder
Dogs swap Port 3rd for 4th rounder this year (45 for 60, about 200 extra points)
Port swap Dogs 3rd for 4th rounder next year (Port stocking up next year, see below)

Wash up:

Port: Upgrade pick 10 into pick 6 to get a gun local kid, also take another first rounder into next year (maybe 8-12), salary cap free for Lycett, equal later swaps over both years - Wingard
Dogs: Wingard - Downgrade pick 6 down to pick 10, for West or before ideally, give 2019 first rounder, equal later swaps over both years

Port would have picks 6, 9, 21, 27 & 46 plus Lycett. So bringing in 6 players at least. A swap of 45 to 60 works for us, and works for them in that they might not use 46. So they get an extra good third rounder next year, a good balance for them having two first rounders, a second rounder, and two third rounders.

Taking out reciprocal later swaps, we give them an upgrade of pick 10 into pick 6 this year for a gun SA kid, plus likely pick 8-12 next year. So a first rounder next year plus a significant first round upgrade into the top 10 this year.

Still working on it. Happy for feedback.

[Happy Days]

To be fair to Clark, if he's just offering his opinion, then given the ability of the respective clubs to attract players and make big trades actually happen, he's entitled to think that Hawthorn would beat us out.

But he's still a dickhead.

[GVGjr]

Completely agree. After shuffling that's pick 50 or so. Even if we hand back 66 if push came to shove. That's about 200 extra points.

I've been playing with a complex trade, but haven't finished the fine details but I've got this far:

Port get pick 10 for Polac
Dogs trade Port pick 6 for pick 10

Port take Rozee & Hately at the draft
Dogs use pick 10 before West

Dogs hand over 2019 1st rounder
Dogs swap Port 3rd for 4th rounder this year (45 for 60, about 200 extra points)
Port swap Dogs 3rd for 4th rounder next year (Port stocking up next year, see below)

.

I believe North are holding firm that they want one of Port's 2nd rounders in return for their 1st pick for Polec.

I'm not sure if that complicates things but it might open up some opportunities for us with the Dahlhaus pick.

Also if Wingard picks the Hawks as his destination there might be an opportunity to get involved in that because on face value Port would want more than pick 14 from the Hawks

I tend to this we have to go hard at either getting Wingard or selecting the best player with our pick 6 or 7 but there could be other scenario's that give us some more selections or points we might have to consider.

[DOG GOD]

Regarding port, obviously they won’t get luko, but I wonder how they rate the other SA kids...
Would they be hopeful of Rozee for instance making it to 9?

I think they will be desperate to get a pick before the crows.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

McLure on SEN saying Hawks are close to getting his nomination.

Sounds like for a 3rd year we've been used to bargain a better deal elsewhere.

[bulldogtragic]

McLure on SEN saying Hawks are close to getting his nomination.

Sounds like for a 3rd year we've been used to bargain a better deal elsewhere.

He's no good anyway*



* unless he nominates us

[Grantysghost]

We can't land a big free agent it seems if this is true (Hawks). Not sure why.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

just to add after reading the actual article, it seems its more guess work from journos. It was Sam Edmund (?) who basically clarified to say he has no idea but believes hawks are seriously going hard.

[bulldogtragic]

just to add after reading the actual article, it seems its more guess work from journos. It was Sam Edmund (?) who basically clarified to say he has no idea but believes hawks are seriously going hard.

Dogs just going moderately hard??? .... Love the news now, just be first, not right, not informed, not have actual insight, provide facts not opinions, but just be first with something.

[Twodogs]

Since when have we rated anything that Sam MacLure says?

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Dogs just going moderately hard??? .... Love the news now, just be first, not right, not informed, not have actual insight, provide facts not opinions, but just be first with something.

Pretty much the exact same from Jay Clarke last week. So no-one has any idea at the moment. This may well be just a bargaining stunt from Chad to get more money on his next deal.

[Twodogs]

Pretty much the exact same from Jay Clarke last week. So no-one has any idea at the moment. This may well be just a bargaining stunt from Chad to get more money on his next deal.


I read about players and their managers doing this and that to try and get more money from the club they are dealing with.

Is it just me or is gouging a prospective employer for as much as you can exactly the wrong thing to be doing as you walk through the door? Serious question because it's the last thing I would be doing.

[EasternWest]

I read about players and their managers doing this and that to try and get more money from the club they are dealing with.

Is it just me or is gouging a prospective employer for as much as you can exactly the wrong thing to be doing as you walk through the door? Serious question because it's the last thing I would be doing.

No.

Once you're in the door I doubt the coaches etc give a crap about whether you scraped out an extra 25k from the board on the way in.

And I know I harp on this point, but if you blow your knee and aren't employable as a footballer next year the club would be quick to shake your hand and say see you later.

If I were a player and my manager wasn't doing their utmost to get me every dollar they could, I'd be getting a new manager.

[Twodogs]

No.

Once you're in the door I doubt the coaches etc give a crap about whether you scraped out an extra 25k from the board on the way in.

And I know I harp on this point, but if you blow your knee and aren't employable as a footballer next year the club would be quick to shake your hand and say see you later.

If I were a player and my manager wasn't doing their utmost to get me every dollar they could, I'd be getting a new manager.

Yeah I can see that. But couldn't you also say that if you were a long term, one club player that you would get better looked after? Doug Hawkins always says that he regrets having one more year at Fitzroy and not being remembered as a one club player. I guess it's a case of not that many players getting the chance to do the romantic thing. Because you are right if it comes to a choice between the welfare of the club and the welfare of a single player it's going to be the club everytime.

A bit like Vinnie says at the end of 'Lock, Stock'

"Lads, it's been emotional"

[EasternWest]

Yeah I can see that. But couldn't you also say that if you were a long term, one club player that you would get better looked after? Doug Hawkins always says that he regrets having one more year at Fitzroy and not being remembered as a one club player. I guess it's a case of not that many players getting the chance to do the romantic thing. Because you are right if it comes to a choice between the welfare of the club and the welfare of a single player it's going to be the club everytime.

A bit like Vinnie says at the end of 'Lock, Stock'

"Lads, it's been emotional"

I think largely the romantic notion of being a one club player is just that. I don't doubt that a lot of players would like that to be the case, but when push comes to shove it's the money that buys you your second home that you don't need :). Loyalty and love of the club only goes so far.

I love my job. I've wanted to work for this organisation since I was a little boy going ee ore ee ore in the backyard. But you better believe I'd walk away if another organisation offered me double the pay.

[Testekill]

Just remember that it's better for journalists that players nominate bigger clubs as there's more of a story there. It's in their best interest to build up Wingard to Hawks as much as possible

[ratsmac]

Everyone said Buddy was going to GWS once upon a time.

[bulldogtragic]

Everyone said Buddy was going to GWS once upon a time.

They all reported Hodge retiring too. Wallis left us last week for Brisbane. Caddy wanted to stay at Geelong. No way Gibbs would ever be traded to Adelaide. Dogs stupid to demand Tom Boyd, GWS would never do it.

Wingard may or may not end up with us, but you'd hope well paid sports journalists would have news to report, not a gut feel. The occasional source or a quote might actually represent reporting of news.

[bulldogtragic]

I just read the article. After saying its Hawthorn and they're front runners for a while, Edmund goes onto say Wingard could actually end up at either club. And that he won't lie and say he's absolutely going to Hawthorn, because that's not the situation, but Hawthorn want him...

[Rocket Science]

My spidey sense is telling me Wingard's going nowhere.

[Murphy'sLore]

We put the mock on the minute this thread was opened...

[Bulldog Joe]

I just read the article. After saying its Hawthorn and they're front runners for a while, Edmund goes onto say Wingard could actually end up at either club. And that he won't lie and say he's absolutely going to Hawthorn, because that's not the situation, but Hawthorn want him...

Could the reporter put some meat to it, by offering any option that Hawthorn could possibly have to trade with Port Adelaide.

To me Port are seriously looking at the draftable talent available from South Australia this year and anyway they could maximise their draft picks for a generational talent.

Hawthorn's pick 14 does not do that.

Their first rounder next year does not do that.

What can they offer?

[bulldogtragic]

Could the reporter put some meat to it, by offering any option that Hawthorn could possibly have to trade with Port Adelaide.

To me Port are seriously looking at the draftable talent available from South Australia this year and anyway they could maximise their draft picks for a generational talent.

Hawthorn's pick 14 does not do that.

Their first rounder next year does not do that.

What can they offer?

Thank God you're also seeing it an obvious side to the story. It's as if Wingard can pick anyone this year and leave. Port need to clear him, and open to keeping him and doing this dance next year. We have pick 6. They have pick 14. That's not even the same ball park as far as a trade goes. Someone who gets paid to write about football trades might like to maybe write about the other side of the trade, not just the nominating. Especially when Hawthorn are not choc full of trade currency.

* Yes I know players just pick a team and it gets done most of the time, but Port have him under contract and no doubt an offer of pick 6 in the mix of a trade. Plus they jump Adelaide in the draft order, and they get a gun local kid. Hawthorn have to come up with something like this, because unlike many other signings of theirs, Wingard is contracted.

[GVGjr]

Could the reporter put some meat to it, by offering any option that Hawthorn could possibly have to trade with Port Adelaide.

To me Port are seriously looking at the draftable talent available from South Australia this year and anyway they could maximise their draft picks for a generational talent.

Hawthorn's pick 14 does not do that.

Their first rounder next year does not do that.

What can they offer?


Even if Wingard chooses the Hawks we might be able to get involved in some manner that benefits us

I also think a bluff of saying we will swap picks with Adelaide won't sit well with Port. Our pick would be very appealing to them

[Bulldog Joe]

Even if Wingard chooses the Hawks we might be able to get involved in some manner that benefits us

I also think a bluff of saying we will swap picks with Adelaide won't sit well with Port. Our pick would be very appealing to them

Surely we don't do anything to facilitate a player we would want going to an opposition player.

Perhaps they will give us Jack Gunston and Tom Mitchell for pick 6.
I just don't see what they could realistically offer that would justify us donating pick 6 to them.

[GVGjr]

Surely we don't do anything to facilitate a player we would want going to an opposition player.

Perhaps they will give us Jack Gunston and Tom Mitchell for pick 6.
I just don't see what they could realistically offer that would justify us donating pick 6 to them.

Yes it's unlikely however, if a club gets desperate they might overpay for our prized pick.

It really depends on who our targets might be.

I've mentioned before but I think if we were prepared to trade pick 6 for Wingard I think we could get something back from Port. They have a couple of selections in the 3rd round they might not really need

[Bulldog Joe]

Yes it's unlikely however, if a club gets desperate they might overpay for our prized pick.

It really depends on who our targets might be.

I've mentioned before but I think if we were prepared to trade pick 6 for Wingard I think we could get something back from Port. They have a couple of selections in the 3rd round they might not really need

I see the sense of the Wingard trade for pick 6 and yes would agree a late pick or 2 back would help our cause.

i just don't see any other reason to trade pick 6, unless we are getting an AA standard player.

Hawthorn only have Mitchell or Gunston that would spark my interest.

[bulldogtragic]

I see the sense of the Wingard trade for pick 6 and yes would agree a late pick or 2 back would help our cause.

i just don't see any other reason to trade pick 6, unless we are getting an AA standard player.

Hawthorn only have Mitchell or Gunston that would spark my interest.

I'm with you on this Joe. If Wingard picks Hawks, and we don't give Hawthorn the pick, and we do promise pick 6 to Port and ask them to block Hawthorn unless they do better than our trade offer while Trengove & Bevo try harder again, we still might land him. Port have leverage by virtue of contract, we have more trade currency leverage and we know Wingard is at worst seriously making our club home. That's just the lay of the land. I'd rather block Hawthorn by holding onto the trade high ground at pick 6 and spending the trade period working him and his manager. If it fails do be it. Our position is taking say Rozee. Standing aside to Hawthorn, to lose Rozee, to lose any chance of Wingard, isn't ideal. Gunston isn't gettable, and 14 and a fringe player does nothing for me. Back the play to the very end, Wingard or Rozee both make me happy.

[FrediKanoute]

Do Adelaide have anyone we would be interested in?

[Mofra]

Do Adelaide have anyone we would be interested in?
I actually like Mitch McGovern even though we haven't been linked to him.

[The Doctor]

Greg Denham in the Australian today says the Bulldogs leading the chase for Wingard.

[bulldogtragic]

Greg Denham in the Australian today says the Bulldogs leading the chase for Wingard.

I hope he's right!!

What is he basing his views on?

[hujsh]

I hope he's right!!

What is he basing his views on?

Everyone else is guessing Hawks so if I guess Dogs I look real smart?

[bulldogtragic]

Everyone else is guessing Hawks so if I guess Dogs I look real smart?

Makes sense to me.

[Happy Days]

Think we're clutching at straws if we're relying on Greg Denham.

[Greystache]

I had some confidence Wingard might be coming to us, but that's now taken a hit if Greg Denham is calling it. The man is an oracle on all things that won't happen. His ability to be consistently wrong even on the simplest subjects is legendary.

[The Pie Man]

I read the article - it’s about Jesse Hogan moving to Freo, with the reference to Wingard moving to Victoria being ‘headed by the Western Bulldogs’

He mentioned 5 days ago we met with him before announcing Wallis. No new detail following that.

Based on that, I’ll remain safely pessimistic.

[Rocket Science]

Is there a bigger wheezing bag of piss and wind covering the game than Denham?

Fare thee well Chad, we barely knew ye.

[jeemak]

Think we're clutching at straws if we're relying on Greg Denham.


I had some confidence Wingard might be coming to us, but that's now taken a hit if Greg Denham is calling it. The man is an oracle on all things that won't happen. His ability to be consistently wrong even on the simplest subjects is legendary.


Is there a bigger wheezing bag of piss and wind covering the game than Denham?

Fare thee well Chad, we barely knew ye.

It's funny, we only ever seem to hear about him when he, like birds flying south, without fail once a year shows everyone just how full of bullshit he is.


I won't hold my breath...…..

[bulldogtragic]

Terry Wallace the other day said Essendon should chase Wingard, assuming in competition to the dogs. Today, Wingard is worth two first rounders.

[ratsmac]

Terry Wallace the other day said Essendon should chase Wingard, assuming in competition to the dogs. Today, Wingard is worth two first rounders.

What's Wallace's problem. Is he still harboring unforgiveness. Remember Terry you left us!;)

[ledge]

Why would the bombers want Wingard when they got the best opportunist goal kicker and future Brownlow medallist in Stringer last year ?

[GVGjr]

Terry Wallace the other day said Essendon should chase Wingard, assuming in competition to the dogs. Today, Wingard is worth two first rounders.

Do you think we would still be interested if it was a first and a second round pick or two first round picks?

I tend to think pick 6 should be enough but I get where Plough is coming from

[bulldogtragic]

Do you think we would still be interested if it was a first and a second round pick or two first round picks?

I tend to think pick 6 should be enough but I get where Plough is coming from

No. Pick 6 is a very, very good pick to give up. Especially in this draft if I believe you! :D Which I do of course. If they demanded our first next year, I'd demand SPP to be added with a third rounder this year second rounder next year. Pick 6 & 2019 1st is overs, and I wouldn't be rushing since Hawthorn can't compete with a prized pick like 6.

The only way in which Wingard is worth two first rounders, is very low ones, like Hawks pick 14 this year and Hawks pick 12-14 next year. He's not in the Treloar 2 X pick 7's first rounders.

All that said, if the equation was one of our players, say Jackson Macrae, taken a year later than Wingard at the near identical pick. Both huge talents. Would we want pick 6 this year, or a pick 14's over two years? I'd take the single digit pick, especially 6. Port would want more as an ambit claim, but if Wingard did the admirable thing and said either club to go to so Port gets the best trade, I couldn't see Hawthorn dislodging our hand and I think Port would take Pick 6. Mind you if he picked us for any reason, I'd like pick 46 back (which they might not use). But I don't see Wingard as a straight out two first rounders. He's a one exceptional first rounder in a strong pointy ended draft, for a local kid ahead of tour cross town rival to me.

[Go_Dogs]

I wouldn't give up 2 first rounders based on form and also on the assumption Port aren't rushing to extend him, again, based on his performance over the past 2 years. It has to cut both ways.

[GVGjr]

I wouldn't give up 2 first rounders based on form and also on the assumption Port aren't rushing to extend him, again, based on his performance over the past 2 years. It has to cut both ways.

I don't think many are acknowledging his form line isn't as strong as what it was 2 or 3 years earlier.
Port don't seem willing to offer a long term deal at 800K plus whereas we might have that ability.

Would you consider a first and a second round pick for Wingard?

[bornadog]

Port Adelaide can’t justify paying Chad Wingard more than $800,000 a season, writes Jon Ralph (https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/expert-opinion/jon-ralph/port-adelaide-cant-justify-paying-chad-wingard-more-than-800000-a-season-writes-jon-ralph/news-story/5c922a91b17cab88cf8f0533b671a3d1)

PORT Adelaide would be negligent to pay Chad Wingard $800,000-$1 million a season based on his output on the past three seasons.

The Western Bulldogs should seriously consider handing over pick six and paying him a salary somewhere in that ballpark.

If those two sentences seem to be wildly conflicting, welcome to football 2018-style.

Where often the price to stay at a club desperate to shake itself up after a 10th-placed finish is very different to one desperate for an ounce of class and goalkicking power.

On face value, Chad Wingard’s likely departure from Port Adelaide (https://www.adelaidenow.com.au/sport/afl/resign-him-now-or-cash-in-says-port-great-gavin-wanganeen/news-story/b8905fbed01b469df1afd59164424fad) is the ultimate head scratcher.

Why would Port Adelaide allow him to assess his Melbourne options when he is a 25-year-old matchwinner who would surely be in the Power’s next premiership team?

Boil it down to one sentence — Port Adelaide isn’t prepared to pay extraordinary money for what they see as three seasons of average performances.

In seven completed seasons Wingard’s best is phenomenal, highlighted by two absolutely outstanding years.

He kicked 43.20 to go with 500 possessions in 2013 to win the best-and-fairest and win an All-Australian blazer, backing it up in 2015 with 53.27 and 422 possessions in another All-Australian year.

In between he kicked 43.31 in 2014, but his returns have diminished in the past three years.
His 2016 season was still solid — 38 goals, but last year he kicked 24.25 and this year 22.21.

https://cdn.newsapi.com.au/image/v1/b798ef51432e018f522e54afb6a24e23?width=650

Chad Wingard has had three below-average seasons after winning All-Australian honours in 2015

In 21 games he was eight times in the AFL coaches votes but only once in the top three in the ground, as voted by coach Ken Hinkley and the opposing coach.

Port Adelaide’s issue isn’t salary cap related — Ken Wood rated its wage bill this year as the second smallest in the competition.

It just can’t justify vast sums for a player who finished outside the top 10 in the 2016 best-and-fairest, eighth last year and is likely to finish outside the top 10 again this year.


Not when it has done that kind of thing with Hamish Hartlett and Matthew Lobbe before and seen it backfire.

The issue is whether Port Adelaide has tried to turn Wingard into something he is not.

In 2015 in that 53 goal season he played 74 per cent forward, averaging 98 rankings points for the season.
Last year he played 47 per cent midfield and this year 45 per cent in that role, becoming a jack of all trades and master of none.

Luke Beveridge is desperately in need of goal power and having drafted Aaron Naughton, Tim English, Ed Richards and traded for young tall Josh Schache they can this year justify trading an early pick.

https://cdn.newsapi.com.au/image/v1/e8e5f83c027879e71afd66225f409392?width=650

Only Fremantle, Gold Coast and Carlton kicked less goals than the Dogs this year, with the Dogs looking to replace the goal power of Luke Dahlhaus (which evaporated this year) and Jake Stringer.

Take Wingard as a small forward — effectively for a comparable wage to Dahlhaus and Jordan Roughead — then draft inside-midfielder Rhylee West as a father-son and your list is going somewhere.

Hawthorn is in a similar boat, pushing hard for Wingard and suddenly with the desire to replace Cyril Rioli plus the cap space from his retirement to afford him.

So is he worth the money?

Dan Hannebery, a player with a similar pedigree by dint of three All-Australian blazers — is going to be paid $800,000 a year for five years when there is clear uncertainty about whether his best is behind him at 27.

Based on Champion Data’s official player ratings Wingard is the 68th best player in the competition.
So if you rank him the 68th best player two years and he is paid $800,000 he’s only just getting overs.

Back in Round 12, 2016 he was the 10th ranked player in the competition, so you only need to believe he can recapture that form to pay him what he is asking.

Melbourne clubs will pay him on talent and potential and the Dogs on output, and in a market where plenty of clubs have cash to burn that means he is like

[hujsh]

It's kind of poor journalism/basic analytical skills to judge his performance based on goals then state he played more time in the midfield in the last two years. Shouldn't there be some sort of assessment of his midfield impact?

[GVGjr]

It's kind of poor journalism/basic analytical skills to judge his performance based on goals then state he played more time in the midfield in the last two years. Shouldn't there be some sort of assessment of his midfield impact?

Spot on, there has to be a drop off on the scoreboard when you are playing substantially more time in the middle

[GVGjr]

Port's position with the salary cap could be very different to ours. I can understand why they might think 800K is a lot but I don't quite get why they would consider trading him.

[bulldogtragic]

Interesting the tinge of it has our club as the background for the narrative in the article, and a subtle pointing out we have the strongest trade hand with pick 6. Leaving aside the points well made above.

[The Doctor]

Port's position with the salary cap could be very different to ours. I can understand why they might think 800K is a lot but I don't quite get why they would consider trading him.

Because they don't think he's worth the money he might get elsewhere. So they can't also expect more than a pick 6/7 type deal either. Certainly not 2 1st round pick as the List Manager suggests.

[Webby]

What the numbers tell us is that he’s a better small forward than he is a midfielder. (As per Toby Greene, Cyril Rioli, Robbie Grey.)

Being in a club with Robbie Grey, he’s been squeezed more into the midfield than he should be. Solution for all is for him to go to a club that desperately needs a medium-small forward. He’s more value outside or Port than he is inside Port. Dogs or Hawks are the right fit. We have the superior trade chips, so we’re the right fit.

Hawthorn are also drifting into Cats & Swans territory. A slow, albeit credible, decline into no mans land.

[ledge]

What the numbers tell us is that he’s a better small forward than he is a midfielder. (As per Toby Greene, Cyril Rioli, Robbie Grey.)

Being in a club with Robbie Grey, he’s been squeezed more into the midfield than he should be. Solution for all is for him to go to a club that desperately needs a medium-small forward. He’s more value outside or Port than he is inside Port. Dogs or Hawks are the right fit. We have the superior trade chips, so we’re the right fit.

Hawthorn are also drifting into Cats & Swans territory. A slow, albeit credible, decline into no mans land.

Good point I agree with the summation of those three teams and compared to us it’s a completely different demographic. Old and slowing or young and upcoming?
Although Box Hill did win the VFL flag this year and that’s usually a good sign of things to come.

[GVGjr]

Because they don't think he's worth the money he might get elsewhere. So they can't also expect more than a pick 6/7 type deal either. Certainly not 2 1st round pick as the List Manager suggests.

I agree, would a 1st and 2nd rounder be too much for him?

[The Doctor]

I agree, would a 1st and 2nd rounder be too much for him?

i think so

[whythelongface]

I agree, would a 1st and 2nd rounder be too much for him?

Probably but i can see him attracting that type of currency. Port are in a decent position where they can extract overs for Chad.

[lemmon]

Probably but i can see him attracting that type of currency. Port are in a decent position where they can extract overs for Chad.

Unless he nominates a destination. Chad holds the power.

[Mofra]

It's kind of poor journalism/basic analytical skills to judge his performance based on goals then state he played more time in the midfield in the last two years. Shouldn't there be some sort of assessment of his midfield impact?
I know he was quiet in the first half of the year and in the second half was a 20+ possession, goal per game midfielder.

If he's willing to play forward more he instantly becomes our best forward. If that allows Gowers to get off the leash a little, Schache to keep roaming etc. we might just cobble together something resembling a functioning forwardline.
He can also run through the middle if he's struggling up forward which gives our mids a chop-out.

[Go_Dogs]

I don't think many are acknowledging his form line isn't as strong as what it was 2 or 3 years earlier.
Port don't seem willing to offer a long term deal at 800K plus whereas we might have that ability.

Would you consider a first and a second round pick for Wingard?

At the moment, I'm comfortable with offering pick 6 and getting a third round back. If Port want more I'd listen, but I'm keen to get a second pick inside the first 30 odd this year so it might mean we have to add a future pick to the equation.

[bulldogtragic]

Foxsports seemingly making news off listening to other journo's and 'figures', but anyhoo:

" THREE-TIME premiership Hawk Terry Wallace believes star forward Chad Wingard is worth two first-round picks, should he wish to leave Port Adelaide.

Wingard could leave the Power at season’s end, despite having one year left on his contract.

The 25-year-old has been heavily linked to the Western Bulldogs — with his relationship with former Port teammate turned Bulldog Jackson Trengove a key sticking point — but Hawthorn is “definitely having a look as well”, according to Damian Barrett.

Wallace said Wingard, a two-time All-Australian, had “enormous” value, considering his age and talent."

[Rocket Science]

Good lord, Trengove's relationship with Wingard is the precise polar opposite of a "sticking point" you colossal morons.

[Happy Days]

I've long thought that all AFL journalists are actually wards of the state who have no job or life skills or interests apart from footy, and get given their positions out of pity and obligation.

[Twodogs]

Good lord, Trengove's relationship with Wingard is the precise polar opposite of a "sticking point" you colossal morons.


English mother *!*!*!*!er. Do. You. Speak. it?

Say 'what' again. I dare you.

One of my favourite scenes of all time, given that it combines correct grammar and extreme violence. And grammar and violence are two of my favourite things...

[bornadog]

Ken Hinkley on SEN, says Chad a top 10 player of AFL and therefore expects picks to reflect that, either 2 first or 1st and 2nd rounders. I think he was just pumping him up to get the best offer for Port.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Ken Hinkley on SEN, says Chad a top 10 player of AFL and therefore expects picks to reflect that, either 2 first or 1st and 2nd rounders. I think he was just pumping him up to get the best offer for Port.

Ken has gone mad. Ken has gone mad. Ken has gone completely mad!

Sorry Ken but he's not a top 10 player of the AFL.

What was the context of the discussion? Interesting that he didn't deny a trade?

[Axe Man]

Ken Hinkley on SEN, says Chad a top 10 player of AFL and therefore expects picks to reflect that, either 2 first or 1st and 2nd rounders. I think he was just pumping him up to get the best offer for Port.

We think you are a top 10 player Chad but we aren't willing to pay you like a top 10 player. Which one is it Ken?

[Axe Man]

Old Kenny has lost the plot

Port coach says Wingard is a top-10 player (https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/super-rankings/afl-daily-live-rolling-footy-news-from-around-australia-for-thursday-september-27-2018/live-coverage/f7a4b672fa8232a310463fa89ab7344f)

PORT Adelaide coach Ken Hinkley says Chad Wingard is a top-10 player in the AFL at his best and such talents are not ones “you let go out of your footy club very easily”.

Wingard has been linked to the Western Bulldogs and Hawthorn on a salary of more than $800,000 a season, seen as likely to depart the Power.

Wingard averaged 20.8 disposals and kicked 22 goals from 21 games this season.

“Chad’s an enormous talent. He’s a really good player,” Hinkley said on SEN radio.

“I think his best football, and it’s not that far away, even this year he played some really big games of football for us, he’s not the type of player that you let go out of your footy club very easily. Whether that’s one of our players or one of the opposition players, top-10 players in the competition are top-10 players.”

Asked of Wingard’s worth at the trade table, Hinkley said that was not his job but such previous deals for quality players gave an indication.

“I just said he’s a top-10 player so he’s pretty valuable,” Hinkley said.

“If I dealt what we’ve been through in the past, we’ve dealt with Paddy Ryder, we’ve dealt with Charlie Dixon and we’ve given up first-round pick and second-round pick, two first-round picks, they’re the sort of numbers but they’re not my decisions, they’re decisions made by list management.”

[chef]

I'd do our first pick and the Dahlhaus compo for him. I agree with Kenny that he's a top 10 player 'at his best'.

[Happy Days]

1st and Young.

I don't rate Young but if Hinkley thinks Wingard is currently a top-10 player in the AFL maybe he does.

[GVGjr]

I'd ask Hinkley if Wingard is a top 10 player in the competition, why aren't Port paying him like one or indicating that they will after his contract expires?

I think it's more likely now that Port have to pony up a great deal for him to stay. They rate him and he now clearly needs to be paid well in excess on a million
800K isn't getting this done

Surely the coach would say we are holding him to his contract and we will make enough room in our cap to keep him

[hujsh]

He did also add the condition 'at his best'. But that very condition is why Port aren't paying him what he wants and why he's not worth what Port are positioning themselves for in a trade.

[Bulldog Revolution]

I'd ask Hinkley if Wingard is a top 10 player in the competition, why aren't Port paying him like one or indicating that they will after his contract expires?

I think it's more likely now that Port have to pony up a great deal for him to stay. They rate him and he now clearly needs to be paid well in excess on a million
800K isn't getting this done

Surely the coach would say we are holding him to his contract and we will make enough room in our cap to keep him

My view is that hes worth pick 6 and nothing more

Hes been all australian twice but on the past 3 years form is only on the fringes of the best 50 players in the league

They don't want him enough or trust him to sign him to a big deal - I wouldn't offer a second or the Dahlhaus compo pick

They wont find a better offer than pick 6 in terms of the ability to have a swing at a star player - their call, but I dont see him returning after they initiated a fire sale

[Mantis]

1st and Young.

I don't rate Young but if Hinkley thinks Wingard is currently a top-10 player in the AFL maybe he does.

If Young departs our key defender stocks are extremely thin.. I think we keep him or at least one more year.

[Axe Man]

If Young departs our key defender stocks are extremely thin.. I think we keep him or at least one more year.

Cordy, Naughton, Adams, Roberts, Morris (maybe not a true key defender now but still regularly plays as one) and Trengove if necessary. Even Wood in an emergency.

How many do we need? I thought we had too many this year and have only lost Collins so far. Couldn't afford to lose both Adams and Young but if one left I wouldn't be overly concerned.

[MrMahatma]

I'd do our first pick and the Dahlhaus compo for him. I agree with Kenny that he's a top 10 player 'at his best'.

Top 10 in the league? I’d say that’s a stretch, even at his best.

[Mantis]

Cordy, Naughton, Adams, Roberts, Morris (maybe not a true key defender now but still regularly plays as one) and Trengove if necessary. Even Wood in an emergency.

How many do we need? I thought we had too many this year and have only lost Collins so far. Couldn't afford to lose both Adams and Young but if one left I wouldn't be overly concerned.

Adams can't get on the park and from rumours might want out.

Roberts clearly isn't in our plans given he has hardly played since early 2017... If he wasn't contracted he would've been delisted and probably is exploring his options.

Morris is about to enter his final year.

Trengove was only passable in defence and is clearly more suited in the ruck or ruck/forward.

I think Young should be still very much in our plans.

[Axe Man]

Adams can't get on the park and from rumours might want out.

Roberts clearly isn't in our plans given he has hardly played since early 2017... If he wasn't contracted he would've been delisted and probably is exploring his options.

Morris is about to enter his final year.

Trengove was only passable in defence and is clearly more suited in the ruck or ruck/forward.

I think Young should be still very much in our plans.

I understand all their limitations and caveats. You said our KPD stocks are extremely thin if Young leaves - I'm wondering how many we need as part of the overall list balance. At present our KPD stocks are far deeper than our KPFs and this season I thought our lack of midfield depth was our greatest concern. I don't think we can afford to carry as many KPDs as we did this year as it leaves other areas too thin.

I would like to keep Young too but he isn't untouchable if it helps gain someone like Wingard.

[mjp]

1/. I love logging on and seeing that there are updates on this thread.

2/. I don't know what defines the 'top 10 players in the AFL' BUT.

If 'Top 10' means the 10 guys who you are actually capable of winning a game off their own boot - whether as a mid or a forward - then Wingard is 'Top 10'. He is top 10 in my 'man, I wouldn't want to have to play on HIM!' list (which mostly consists of guys who can take freakish marks despite being outpositioned and kick 5-goals in a quarter even if beaten comprehensively in the other 3) AND he is top 10 in the 'I wish he was on a team I liked 'cos I love watching him play.'

Get it DONE. Chad to the DOGS!

[EasternWest]

1/. I love logging on and seeing that there are updates on this thread.

2/. I don't know what defines the 'top 10 players in the AFL' BUT.

If 'Top 10' means the 10 guys who you are actually capable of winning a game off their own boot - whether as a mid or a forward - then Wingard is 'Top 10'. He is top 10 in my 'man, I wouldn't want to have to play on HIM!' list (which mostly consists of guys who can take freakish marks despite being outpositioned and kick 5-goals in a quarter even if beaten comprehensively in the other 3) AND he is top 10 in the 'I wish he was on a team I liked 'cos I love watching him play.'

Get it DONE. Chad to the DOGS!

Cyril Rioli was like that and he was a subject of constant ridicule on this board.

[chef]

Top 10 in the league? I’d say that’s a stretch, even at his best.

Not for me, I'd have him in the top 10 when he's on song. He can win games off his own boot 'at his best'..

[GVGjr]

1/. I love logging on and seeing that there are updates on this thread.

2/. I don't know what defines the 'top 10 players in the AFL' BUT.

If 'Top 10' means the 10 guys who you are actually capable of winning a game off their own boot - whether as a mid or a forward - then Wingard is 'Top 10'. He is top 10 in my 'man, I wouldn't want to have to play on HIM!' list (which mostly consists of guys who can take freakish marks despite being outpositioned and kick 5-goals in a quarter even if beaten comprehensively in the other 3) AND he is top 10 in the 'I wish he was on a team I liked 'cos I love watching him play.'

Get it DONE. Chad to the DOGS!

I think there is a massive difference between how you are seeing him and who coaches plan around keeping quiet when we play Port.
For us, it's typically been about keeping Dixon and Gray under control and while that may have led to Wingard getting off the leash on occasions I think we have taken that option.

He's a very good player when switched on but I can't come at having him rated a top 10 or elite player in the competition
He can hurt teams quickly not consistently in my opinion but that is the price you pay for those laconic but brilliant types who turn it on for a quarter or so.

More than happy to part with pick 6 but if he is a top 10 player I question why Port aren't paying him as an elite player.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Still don't understand why Port are considering moving him on. They have lost Polec which frees up cash, after recruiting heavily last year. Now all of a sudden they want to rebuild and hit the draft?

The argument about them being interested in SA talent doesn't match up. Wingard is SA talent. He's 25 and coming into his peak. He's proven. He probably has some issues in his game/prep but why would Port be happy to lose a proven (but maybe slightly inconsistent) star to take a gamble on the draft?

The other argument about them getting in a 'year early' to avoid free agency is also bizarre. If he's happy enough to be there (sounds like he was/is) and he's from SA, why wouldn't they back themselves in to re-sign him beyond next year?

If they are worried about the $$ then there are quite a few others they could ship off before Wingard.

Perhaps there's something else to it but on face value this looks a dumb move by Port.

[bornadog]

Still don't understand why Port are considering moving him on. They have lost Polec which frees up cash, after recruiting heavily last year. Now all of a sudden they want to rebuild and hit the draft?

The argument about them being interested in SA talent doesn't match up. Wingard is SA talent. He's 25 and coming into his peak. He's proven. He probably has some issues in his game/prep but why would Port be happy to lose a proven (but maybe slightly inconsistent) star to take a gamble on the draft?

The other argument about them getting in a 'year early' to avoid free agency is also bizarre. If he's happy enough to be there (sounds like he was/is) and he's from SA, why wouldn't they back themselves in to re-sign him beyond next year?

If they are worried about the $$ then there are quite a few others they could ship off before Wingard.

Perhaps there's something else to it but on face value this looks a dumb move by Port.

Maybe the player has told them he wants to move on and they just accepted it.

[mjp]

I think there is a massive difference between how you are seeing him and who coaches plan around keeping quiet when we play Port.
For us, it's typically been about keeping Dixon and Gray under control and while that may have led to Wingard getting off the leash on occasions I think we have taken that option.


If PA kicked the ball to Wingard as often as they kicked it to Gray (or CD) then how would we be looking at this? Gray is either DEEP i50 or mid - he isn't (or rarely) asked to play that graveyard link-up role across the HF line that Wingard plays every week. Dixon just loves playing against us because our defenders don't play with aggressive starting points and he is allowed to dictate terms...hence he comes out of the blocks thinking he is going to kick 5 and plays with that intent. If our coaches and players are putting 'real' time into combatting Dixon's approach then they are keeping it pretty well hidden once the siren goes.

Don't get me wrong - I love Robbie Gray. But if you want me to give up pick 6 for a deep forward come sometime mid coming off 2x knee recons or instead give it up for a motivated Chad Wingard (still only 25 and with 1/10th of the injury history) I am taking Wingard every day.

Dixon? Good player. Zero finals wins in his entire career. I think that says it all about the influence he has on games...his best game all year was versus us (a non-contender) at Ballarat (with a crowd of 1100 and tv audience of even less). No thank you.

(p.s. I am not saying Gray or Dixon are trade 'alternatives' to Wingard as I am sure they aren't...just that of the three Wingard is the one we SHOULD be targetting - and by happy chance the one who MIGHT be available).

[jeemak]

I think there is a massive difference between how you are seeing him and who coaches plan around keeping quiet when we play Port.
For us, it's typically been about keeping Dixon and Gray under control and while that may have led to Wingard getting off the leash on occasions I think we have taken that option.

He's a very good player when switched on but I can't come at having him rated a top 10 or elite player in the competition
He can hurt teams quickly not consistently in my opinion but that is the price you pay for those laconic but brilliant types who turn it on for a quarter or so.

More than happy to part with pick 6 but if he is a top 10 player I question why Port aren't paying him as an elite player.

Who we try and keep quiet when we play Port shouldn't be the barometer. I would think our attention probably goes towards who we don't have natural match-ups for rather than who we do, and I'd suggest this is why we plan more thoroughly for Gray and Dixon than we might Wingard.

Wingard plays the hardest role to play in the modern era, and sometimes is elite when doing so and other times is extremely effective when doing so. However, I agree with you that pick six is about right for a player who has been elite but has tapered off for whatever reason over recent years.

This thread seems to be going around in circles, nobody's willing to budge and I just wish this deal would get done one way or another so we can all move on!

[Axe Man]

Maybe the player has told them he wants to move on and they just accepted it.

Unless all the media reports are way off and Wingard himself is lying that certainly isn't the case.

[Sedat]

Still don't understand why Port are considering moving him on. They have lost Polec which frees up cash, after recruiting heavily last year. Now all of a sudden they want to rebuild and hit the draft?

The argument about them being interested in SA talent doesn't match up. Wingard is SA talent. He's 25 and coming into his peak. He's proven. He probably has some issues in his game/prep but why would Port be happy to lose a proven (but maybe slightly inconsistent) star to take a gamble on the draft?

The other argument about them getting in a 'year early' to avoid free agency is also bizarre. If he's happy enough to be there (sounds like he was/is) and he's from SA, why wouldn't they back themselves in to re-sign him beyond next year?

If they are worried about the $$ then there are quite a few others they could ship off before Wingard.

Perhaps there's something else to it but on face value this looks a dumb move by Port.
I reckon Port still have no salary cap room even after letting Polec go. They spent big last year and they still have the likes of Hartlett on fat contracts.

I think it's madness that Chad is even gettable (because of the precise points you raised) but I am certainly applauding our club for going hard.

[GVGjr]

Who we try and keep quiet when we play Port shouldn't be the barometer. I would think our attention probably goes towards who we don't have natural match-ups for rather than who we do, and I'd suggest this is why we plan more thoroughly for Gray and Dixon than we might Wingard.

Wingard plays the hardest role to play in the modern era, and sometimes is elite when doing so and other times is extremely effective when doing so. However, I agree with you that pick six is about right for a player who has been elite but has tapered off for whatever reason over recent years.

This thread seems to be going around in circles, nobody's willing to budge and I just wish this deal would get done one way or another so we can all move on!

I quite like the debate so far, strong and differing opinions are OK for discussions. One or two are willing to part with 2 first rounders, I think someone has suggested a first and second rounder and most think pick 6 is about right.

Port have also upped the ante with anyone trying to get Wingard and are placing a huge expectation on a deal to get it done.
Then there is also the issue now of Wingard being regarded as a top 10 player in the competition meaning he should be commanding a yearly salary of 1.1 to 1.2M perhaps even more. That adds even more complexity to the potential player movement and probably rules out some clubs from being in the mix.

I'm yet to be convinced that he is worth 2 first round picks unless you are willing to pay that on potential more so than recent 'on field' results. He's been very good but a long way off exceptional in my opinion and the type of investment being mooted to acquire his services is huge.
Perhaps 2 first round picks from the range of 14 to 18 might be an option but not if one of them is in the top 6 in what is also regarded as a strong draft.

I'm more than open to acquiring Wingard and I will be interested to see if his intention to leave is serious and what might have to be offered to get a deal done. There is plenty to play out.

I don't expect we will get a consensus on here but I'm looking forward to reading the more thoughtful comments.

[bornadog]

This thread seems to be going around in circles, nobody's willing to budge and I just wish this deal would get done one way or another so we can all move on!

Trade period starts October 8 ;)

[Twodogs]

Wouldn't Wingard be worth about the same as we got for Stringer last year?

[Axe Man]

I reckon Port still have no salary cap room even after letting Polec go. They spent big last year and they still have the likes of Hartlett on fat contracts.

I think it's madness that Chad is even gettable (because of the precise points you raised) but I am certainly applauding our club for going hard.

If that's the case they must have structured their contacts poorly. They apparently had one of the lowest payrolls in the league this year. Perhaps next year they are in trouble but then why on earth didn't they front load some contacts this year? The whole thing doesn't make sense to me.

[Axe Man]

Wouldn't Wingard be worth about the same as we got for Stringer last year?

Only if some revelations come out to hurt his value and only one club are really interested due to those revelations.

Also Wingard's best was better than Stringer's and his worst has been no where near as bad.

Wingard will also be on a significantly better contact than Stringer.

No matter which way you look at it Wingard is worth more unfortunately.

[bulldogtragic]

Are the Bulldogs In The Box Seat to Land Power Star Chad Wingard? (Aflnation.com.au/SEN)

"SEN Time On host Sam McClure says that the Western Bulldogs are in the most favourable position to land Port Adelaide star Chad Wingard...

The Western Bulldogs can give more in as far as a deal because they put pick six on the table, and they can also pay him a little bit more because of their salary cap room..."



So pick 6 on the table and 5 years on maybe around $850,000 to The Chad. He's right, it's a strong hand. Now nominate us already please Chad.

[EasternWest]

Are the Bulldogs In The Box Seat to Land Power Star Chad Wingard? (Aflnation.com.au/SEN)

"SEN Time On host Sam McClure says that the Western Bulldogs are in the most favourable position to land Port Adelaide star Chad Wingard...

The Western Bulldogs can give more in as far as a deal because they put pick six on the table, and they can also pay him a little bit more because of their salary cap room..."



So pick 6 on the table and 5 years on maybe around $850,000 to The Chad. He's right, it's a strong hand. Now nominate is already please Chad.

What salary cap room? Tom Boyd's forced out all our good players.

[bulldogtragic]

What salary cap room? Tom Boyd's forced out all our good players.

I know. Fuller, Hamilton & NMM all had to go. I can't believe people in the media are talking like this, it's one sided.

[bulldogtragic]

Alright, I've had a look at the draft order and I think if Chad nominates us there's a really good way for both clubs to walk away 'winning' on the trade side, leaving the player aside.

McClure says we've put pick 6 on the table, and Hinkley says they want more. Because of their depth of mid range picks with draft points we could use the system to benefit each other. It goes something like this:

Pick 6 and Dahl compo Pick 19/25. But they trade us (after shuffling down) pick 29, 50 & 51

In the case of getting Pick 19 Dahl compo, Hinkley & Port tell the world the dogs gave them two first rounders, one a very good single digit pick (true). In the case of pick 25, they got a very good single digit first rounder and an early second rounder (true). Port #winning.

It takes their overall position to picks 6, 9, 10 (Polec), 19/25, 21 and Lycett as a free agent and SPP if a trade is done. 5 draft picks inside the top 21/25, plus Lycett. That's a fast track rebuild so the late picks to us benefits them, but giving up the low pick doesn't hurt us as we are using them on West & Khamis.

So by sending back 29, 50, 51 & with our picks 44 & 45 (this hopefully third round Roughy compo) with picks 64 & 65 gives us around 2,000 draft points. More than enough points to take West high (Pick 15 is 1,112 points) and Khamis mid range (Pick 30 is 629) if needed. When we factor in the 20% discount they can both go higher, or if we want either of the other two NGAs (possibly Lachy Dawson) we've got points in the bank. Baring that perhaps we have picks 64 & 65 as back to back picks to add to the high end talent we've got coming in.

The short of it, because we want draft points and Port want more high picks and have many lower picks, there's an opportunity to beef up a trade offer to Port beyond Pick 6, but actually come out ahead on draft points which is our game primarily for West & Khamis. A win-win by using the system. When we start talking picks 6 & 19/25 for Wingard and lower picks flung back, we start putting more distance between us and Hawthorn. If our money is better also, then our hand is very strong.

[Hotdog60]

My Brain hurts :D

[GVGjr]

This might help people understand what BT is proposing


http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-11-24/your-guide-to-the-draft-live-bidding-system

[bulldogtragic]

My Brain hurts :D

It’s a bit like that. Simply, if Port gave us multiple mid range picks, we could give them pick 6 & 19/25, and both clubs would win the trade. Enough so that we could we could very significantly outbid Hawthorn as well as offer more cash to The Chad. There’s a real opportunity here potentially for both clubs. The picks they have, and the needs we have, this year is a perfect match if we could work together.

[jeemak]

I quite like the debate so far, strong and differing opinions are OK for discussions. One or two are willing to part with 2 first rounders, I think someone has suggested a first and second rounder and most think pick 6 is about right.

Port have also upped the ante with anyone trying to get Wingard and are placing a huge expectation on a deal to get it done.
Then there is also the issue now of Wingard being regarded as a top 10 player in the competition meaning he should be commanding a yearly salary of 1.1 to 1.2M perhaps even more. That adds even more complexity to the potential player movement and probably rules out some clubs from being in the mix.

I'm yet to be convinced that he is worth 2 first round picks unless you are willing to pay that on potential more so than recent 'on field' results. He's been very good but a long way off exceptional in my opinion and the type of investment being mooted to acquire his services is huge.
Perhaps 2 first round picks from the range of 14 to 18 might be an option but not if one of them is in the top 6 in what is also regarded as a strong draft.

I'm more than open to acquiring Wingard and I will be interested to see if his intention to leave is serious and what might have to be offered to get a deal done. There is plenty to play out.

I don't expect we will get a consensus on here but I'm looking forward to reading the more thoughtful comments.

Now now G, be nice! My comment born from frustration was unfairly directed at this thread when it's the broader carry on I have an issue with.

To clarify, I guess the question I have revolves around whether Port really is upping the ante. How can they up the ante on a player they refuse to pay? Players worth 2 x first rounders are worth what Wingard is asking, but yet they won't pay that. What's the point of Hinkley's comments? Anyone within the industry would know his claims that Wingard is a potential 2 x first round and top ten AFL player quality recruit, that they won't pay, are nothing but piss and wind.

For whatever reason Wallace has also decided Wingard is worth two first rounders. I'm questioning his reasons for doing so, in fact no I'm not, he's just doing it to generate conversation for commercial purposes. He doesn't really believe that.

I don't mean to sound flippant or disingenuous, but I find a lot of the posturing and pontificating at this time of year at the professional level ridiculous, self perpetuating and counter productive. The market usually gets it right, but for some reason there's a whole bunch of stakeholders who refuse to just let it take its course and think the crap that comes out of their mouths actually influences the ultimate result and does something other than make them look desperate or completely full of it.

[GVGjr]

I'd hope not many of us seriously think what we say will come to fruition but I do like reading and discussing the scenario's proposed

I do think Wallace is throwing his opinions out there to create conversations, perhaps Wingards manager is doing the same in an effort to get him a vastly improved deal with Port.

Since Chad's apparent availability has come too light discussions have moved away from the draft talent which for me is a bit of a shame. 12 months ago it was Naughton and a few others we were focusing on.

You're probably right, we should just let this play out and see what happens if he nominates us or not.

[jeemak]

I guess that's why I qualified my comments by calling out the likes of Hinkley - and make no mistake, people from our club do it too - for contradicting their positions with spurious claims for compensation on players they for whatever reason don't regard to the extent they believe the market should.


These threads are great at this time of year, especially when we're not involved in finals footy and don't have a lot going on club wise.

[Twodogs]

Only if some revelations come out to hurt his value and only one club are really interested due to those revelations.

Also Wingard's best was better than Stringer's and his worst has been no where near as bad.

Wingard will also be on a significantly better contact than Stringer.

No matter which way you look at it Wingard is worth more unfortunately.


So how do we organise his coach to come out and do something like that?


Are the Bulldogs In The Box Seat to Land Power Star Chad Wingard? (Aflnation.com.au/SEN)

"SEN Time On host Sam McClure says that the Western Bulldogs are in the most favourable position to land Port Adelaide star Chad Wingard...

The Western Bulldogs can give more in as far as a deal because they put pick six on the table, and they can also pay him a little bit more because of their salary cap room..."



So pick 6 on the table and 5 years on maybe around $850,000 to The Chad. He's right, it's a strong hand. Now nominate us already please Chad.

I've always said we should listen carefully to what Sam Maclure says about AFL football and trading in particular. The man is an oracle.

[bulldogtragic]

AFEL.com.au

Whispers: Contracted Port Adelaide star Chad Wingard is at the top of the Bulldogs' trade wish list. The Dogs will have to come up with a trade that convinces the Power to let Wingard go with a year remaining on his contract and will face stiff competition, particularly from Hawthorn, to win his signature. But with their first draft pick falling at No.6 – the Hawks hold No.14 – and Wingard's friend and former Port teammate Jackson Trengove already at the Kennel, the Bulldogs appear well placed to get their man.

[EasternWest]

AFEL.com.au

Whispers: Contracted Port Adelaide star Chad Wingard is at the top of the Bulldogs' trade wish list. The Dogs will have to come up with a trade that convinces the Power to let Wingard go with a year remaining on his contract and will face stiff competition, particularly from Hawthorn, to win his signature. But with their first draft pick falling at No.6 – the Hawks hold No.14 – and Wingard's friend and former Port teammate Jackson Trengove already at the Kennel, the Bulldogs appear well placed to get their man.

Pfft. I won't start considering it a real possibility until tradeguru69 starts tweeting about it.

[bulldogtragic]

Pfft. I won't start considering it a real possibility until tradeguru69 starts tweeting about it.

Tradeguru69 says the trade is for Tom Campbell, not pick 6 plus. Great trade for us.

[EasternWest]

Tradeguru69 says the trade is for Tom Campbell, not pick 6 plus. Great trade for us.

Thanks for your service Tom. Sorry it didn't work out. Oh, hai Chad.

[bornadog]

Tradeguru69 says the trade is for Tom Campbell, not pick 6 plus. Great trade for us.

Who is tradeguru69 ?

[Twodogs]

Who is tradeguru69 ?

In this case I think the name says it all. Some sad 48 year old tosser desperately craving relevance and making stuff up to get some.

[hujsh]

Who is tradeguru69 ?

The wrong hill to die on

[lemmon]

Mark Robinson and the Herald Sun reporting that Chad has informed Port he wants to stay at the club.

[EasternWest]

Mark Robinson and the Herald Sun reporting that Chad has informed Port he wants to stay at the club.

So Chad to the dogs is a certainty then.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

A little disappointing but I wonder who we next turn our attention to?

[Sedat]

Chad’s management have refuted Slobbo’s story in world record time. He hasn’t made his mind up yet.

[bornadog]

So Chad to the dogs is a certainty then.

You are right, report is not true.

EDit: Sedat beat me to it. What a dick Robbo is.

[bulldogtragic]

His management were lightning quick to tell trade radio that.

Chad lives yet.

[ledge]

Well he needs to hurry up and make up his mind !

[ratsmac]

I wonder if we have plan B if Chad stays at Port or chooses Hawthorn. Do we have other irons in the fire if we are prepared to offer up pick 6 or is it best available at the National Draft?

[Topdog]

I wonder if we have plan B if Chad stays at Port or chooses Hawthorn. Do we have other irons in the fire if we are prepared to offer up pick 6 or is it best available at the National Draft?

Im hoping plan B is use pick 6

[ratsmac]

Im hoping plan B is use pick 6

I agree but I'm always worried because of the Jarrad Grant and Christian Howard round 1 selection fiascos. Surely Sam Power can't stuff this year's pick 6 up with available top 10 talent pool.

What also worries me is that not all top 10 kids take the next step e.g. Tambling, O'rouke, Freeman, Toumpas, Anthony Banik an so on for whatever reason didn't live up to their early selection. Trading 6 for a known talent isn't a stupid idea.

I'm happy I'm not the one making these calls.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

How many kids do we need? We are already the youngest list in the comp with West and Buku to come. I'd argue we are desperate for a quality 21-26 year old.

On the flip side, we are unlikely to 'challenge' next year so from a forecasting perspective maybe we are better off taking Pick 6 to the draft, getting another year into our list and then look to trade for an established star at the end of next year.

Arguments to be made for both.

[GVGjr]

How many kids do we need? We are already the youngest list in the comp with West and Buku to come. I'd argue we are desperate for a quality 21-26 year old.

On the flip side, we are unlikely to 'challenge' next year so from a forecasting perspective maybe we are better off taking Pick 6 to the draft, getting another year into our list and then look to trade for an established star at the end of next year.

Arguments to be made for both.

I thought our acquisition of Schache was a great move last year, he is a player with plenty of upside and young enough so that we can hopefully have a long career with us. It's why I'm more open to getting someone that has been in the system for a couple of years but still has his best football in front of him.
Wingard is a very good player but he is a better option for us if we feel we can get back on track next year not in two or three years time.

Wingard might be able to kick 40 goals for us which would be huge if we are going to be contenders next season.

[Sedat]

Wingard is a very good player but he is a better option for us if we feel we can get back on track next year not in two or three years time.
Both scenarios are not mutually exclusive - at 25yo, Wingard can impact both immediately and in 3+ years' time

[bornadog]

Both scenarios are not mutually exclusive - at 25yo, Wingard can impact both immediately and in 3+ years' time

We have to convince him we will be playing finals next year, otherwise why would he want to come to a club and wait for 3 years.

[bulldogtragic]

We have to convince him we will be playing finals next year, otherwise why would he want to come to a club and wait for 3 years.

Get him to read that thing by the preeminent afel journo, Barrett, last week. Dogs & Wingard = finals so he says. And I always believe him, so The Chad should too.

[GVGjr]

Both scenarios are not mutually exclusive - at 25yo, Wingard can impact both immediately and in 3+ years' time

To me it's more about if we should be investing the big money contract into a player two or three years before we can become a genuine chance.
If we believe we will be a genuine contender within 12 months then no problems but to me this is all about how we gauge our list and our chances for next season.

We are coming from a fair way back and just need to have an honest assessment on where we actually are

[GVGjr]

We have to convince him we will be playing finals next year, otherwise why would he want to come to a club and wait for 3 years.

That's the way I see it, we need to be confident that we are in a window where we will play some finals by 2020.

[Sedat]

To me it's more about if we should be investing the big money contract into a player two or three years before we can become a genuine chance.
If we believe we will be a genuine contender within 12 months then no problems but to me this is all about how we gauge our list and our chances for next season.

We are coming from a fair way back and just need to have an honest assessment on where we actually are
Agree wholeheartedly if Wingard was 28yo, but at his age he is a rolled gold investment for both the inmediate future and the long term

[Go_Dogs]

To me it's more about if we should be investing the big money contract into a player two or three years before we can become a genuine chance.
If we believe we will be a genuine contender within 12 months then no problems but to me this is all about how we gauge our list and our chances for next season.

We are coming from a fair way back and just need to have an honest assessment on where we actually are

Good call. We might also be better placed to wait (if we can't extend Bont now) so we can ensure we are well placed to offer him a contract he can't refuse.

I tend to believe we are a good chance to play finals next year and recruiting Wingard simply adds to that. We should however be live to the fact that players like Naughton, Richards, Williams etc may not have as impactful years so there's a chance we see a bit of a dip based on the output from a few younger players who had pretty solid campaigns.

[EasternWest]

if we can't extend Bont

I've learnt to emotionally dissociate myself from connection to players, but if this were to happen I'd give up footy.

Some wounds run too deep.

[The Pie Man]

Watching Fox Footy for the first time in quite some time - getting the feeling this Wingard thing has fizzled out.

[Remi Moses]

This just reeks of Wingard wanting port to pony up more cash with a new contract .
I’m neither here nor there, as Hurley did the exact same thing

[Dancin' Douggy]

Happy to keep the pick

[jeemak]

This just reeks of Wingard wanting port to pony up more cash with a new contract .
I’m neither here nor there, as Hurley did the exact same thing

Not an unreasonable summary, though I think with Hurley he may have genuinely been on the hook and extenuating circumstances surrounding salary cap leniency yanked him from it.

[bornadog]

Watching Fox Footy for the first time in quite some time - getting the feeling this Wingard thing has fizzled out.

If you were watching AFL360 , it was Robbo who said Wingard is going nowhere, however his manager refuted the claim. Robbo being stubborn, obviously is continuing on with it/

[EasternWest]

This just reeks of Wingard wanting port to pony up more cash with a new contract .
I’m neither here nor there, as Hurley did the exact same thing

Doesn't he still have a year on his current contract?

Good to have you back too, Remi.

[The Pie Man]

If you were watching AFL360 , it was Robbo who said Wingard is going nowhere, however his manager refuted the claim. Robbo being stubborn, obviously is continuing on with it/

Was watching AFL tonight before it, that and Ch 9 SA (online) ran with more than likely to stay as he couldn’t get the mil a year he wanted.

If it turns around and we land him, great. Got enormous confidence our pick 6(7) will turn out a hellova player

[FrediKanoute]

To me it's more about if we should be investing the big money contract into a player two or three years before we can become a genuine chance.
If we believe we will be a genuine contender within 12 months then no problems but to me this is all about how we gauge our list and our chances for next season.

We are coming from a fair way back and just need to have an honest assessment on where we actually are

I believe we will be a genuine contender next year. Having exited the partyboys, there will be an increased focus by the rest of the group on football. I find that it is no co-incidence that the guys leaving - Dahlhaus, Biggs, Redders, have all been regarded as enjoying the social aspects of a footy club as much as the onfield.

[bulldogtragic]

Not sure where this is all headed. Hinkley at the airport wouldn’t comment at all. His management refuted Robbos story about him staying at Port in about 2 minutes. Afel.com.au now saying Hawthorn favourites to get Shiel, and I assume don’t have the $850,000+ to woo Wingard.

Do we take it that he’s either staying or coming to us?

[EasternWest]

Not sure where this is all headed. Hinkley at the airport wouldn’t comment at all. His management refuted Robbos story about him staying at Port in about 2 minutes. Afel.com.au now saying Hawthorn favourites to get Shiel, and I assume don’t have the $850,000+ to woo Wingard.

Do we take it that he’s either staying or coming to us?

Yes.

[bulldogtragic]

Yes.

Pop quiz hot shot. Wingard might stay at $850,000. But at $950,000 would likely leave for us. An extra $100,000 a year could be the difference between getting him and not. What do you do?

[Sedat]

Pop quiz hot shot. Wingard might stay at $850,000. But at $950,000 would likely leave for us. An extra $100,000 a year could be the difference between getting him and not. What do you do?
Give him the money

[Happy Days]

Yeah I reckon we got played. Again.

[GVGjr]

Pop quiz hot shot. Wingard might stay at $850,000. But at $950,000 would likely leave for us. An extra $100,000 a year could be the difference between getting him and not. What do you do?

If we are convinced he can make a positive effort to return us to the top 8 it doesn't sound like a lot of extra money so why not.
I wonder how much more we then need to add to the efforts to keep Bontempelli though. It typically is an issue for some other players when clubs are throwing around that sort of offers to attract players.

I just don't think this is the right question or challenge for the club regarding Wingard, to me it's about if we are prepared to offer more than pick 6 in this years draft given some comments by Hinkley? Some on here like Sedat would do it in a heartbeat, others would add the Dahlhaus compensation pick to the mix but are we still as interested if Port end up holding firm and demanding our 1st round picks in 2018 and 2019?

[Remi Moses]

Kane Cornes ( yeah I know, grain of salt ) reckons it’s a deliberate scare tactic from Hinkley on Chad .
Gotta say I find that tactic a bit unusual now .

[GVGjr]

Kane Cornes ( yeah I know, grain of salt ) reckons it’s a deliberate scare tactic from Hinkley on Chad .
Gotta say I find that tactic a bit unusual now .

It's a strange approach if true, he's basically inflating the players value but not necessarily being able to pay him close to his worth.
If he is a top 10 player in the competition and he is worth 2 x 1st rounders as Hinkley is stating then Chad should be paid well in excess of 1M a season

[azabob]

Pop quiz hot shot. Wingard might stay at $850,000. But at $950,000 would likely leave for us. An extra $100,000 a year could be the difference between getting him and not. What do you do?

Give him the money.

He is seriously talented. We desperately need a player of his ilk.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

We usually end up getting 'Cat-fished' during trade week. Seems likely again.
It's a moot point now but I wonder if we had not dropped so dramatically in 17 & 18, whether we'd be more likely to be in the conversation for more trades?
I find it staggering that a guy like McGovern would nominate Carlton ahead of us.

[bulldogtragic]

If we are convinced he can make a positive effort to return us to the top 8 it doesn't sound like a lot of extra money so why not.
I wonder how much more we then need to add to the efforts to keep Bontempelli though. It typically is an issue for some other players when clubs are throwing around that sort of offers to attract players.

I just don't think this is the right question or challenge for the club regarding Wingard, to me it's about if we are prepared to offer more than pick 6 in this years draft given some comments by Hinkley? Some on here like Sedat would do it in a heartbeat, others would add the Dahlhaus compensation pick to the mix but are we still as interested if Port end up holding firm and demanding our 1st round picks in 2018 and 2019?

As I've posted before, personally I'd hand over the Dahl compo (or if Adams got pick 22 from Brisbane) so long as they gave us their late second rounder and at least one of their mid/late third rounders. They get a top ten pick and either a late first/early second pick which is a good return for them. But they throw back some draft points with picks so we can do what we need to. I think it's a pretty reasonable position from our side. That's if $950,000 or so in what we are happy to pay.

[EasternWest]

Pop quiz hot shot. Wingard might stay at $850,000. But at $950,000 would likely leave for us. An extra $100,000 a year could be the difference between getting him and not. What do you do?

What just so he could buy a second house?

I'd probably give it to him. But then again, I've always been fiscally irresponsible.

[Twodogs]

What just so he could buy a second house?

I'd probably give it to him. But then again, I've always been fiscally irresponsible.

Having a second house is overrated. Promise him a flag!


Hang on, that's not one of my houses you are giving away, is it?

[ledge]

Offer him the minimum wage and give him a Macdonald franchise, sets him up for life And our salary cap is not affected :-)

[EasternWest]

Offer him the minimum wage and give him a Macdonald franchise, sets him up for life And our salary cap is not affected :-)

You're a man with Visyon!

[Mofra]

Pop quiz hot shot. Wingard might stay at $850,000. But at $950,000 would likely leave for us. An extra $100,000 a year could be the difference between getting him and not. What do you do?
He'd be behind Boyd (at least this year) and the Bont (from what I understand) in payment terms.
If we were to imagine the exact type of player who would make us a better side, a firing Wingard is almost the prototype - can run in the middle, tear an opposition team apart as a forward in only 10 minutes, is coming into his prime and will play for another 6+ years.

Then consider the cap is ~20% larger than when we offered a monster deal to a 19 year old. I'm firmly in the yes camp.

[bulldogtragic]

He'd be behind Boyd (at least this year) and the Bont (from what I understand) in payment terms.
If we were to imagine the exact type of player who would make us a better side, a firing Wingard is almost the prototype - can run in the middle, tear an opposition team apart as a forward in only 10 minutes, is coming into his prime and will play for another 6+ years.

Then consider the cap is ~20% larger than when we offered a monster deal to a 19 year old. I'm firmly in the yes camp.

This. As an aside, I personally love him as to see an indigenous superstar playing for us. I'm too young to remember Magic, Winmar & Koops were fizzes, our others haven't been legit superstars. And for years to see the Buddy's, Betts, Rioli's etc light up games of footy has me envious. We have the west of Victoria now, well populated with indigenous kids looking for a role model. He's a guy that makes you want to go to the footy and only take toilet stops at the main breaks because you don't want to miss a second because he can do a lot in that time. An outright indigenous superstar would be massive for a lot if reasons, so I'm in the yes camp on good coin too.

As another aside, we'd be truly the multicultural team if we can convince him to come. Wingard (indigenous), JJ (South Africa), Daniel (Adelaide), Khamis (Sudan), Jong (East Timor/Taiwanese). A true representation of the peoples of the West. We come from all parts, but we are one and equal under the Red, White & Blue.

[bornadog]

This. As an aside, I personally love him as to see an indigenous superstar playing for us. I'm too young to remember Magic, Winmar & Koops were fizzes, our others haven't been legit superstars. And for years to see the Buddy's, Betts, Rioli's etc light up games of footy has me envious. We have the west of Victoria now, well populated with indigenous kids looking for a role model. He's a guy that makes you want to go to the footy and only take toilet stops at the main breaks because you don't want to miss a second because he can do a lot in that time. An outright indigenous superstar would be massive for a lot if reasons, so I'm in the yes camp on good coin too.

As another aside, we'd be truly the multicultural team if we can convince him to come. Wingard (indigenous), JJ (South Africa), Daniel (Adelaide), Khamis (Sudan), Jong (East Timor/Taiwanese). A true representation of the peoples of the West. We come from all parts, but we are one and equal under the Red, White & Blue.

Lynch also indigenous and could work well with Chad.

[Twodogs]

This. As an aside, I personally love him as to see an indigenous superstar playing for us. I'm too young to remember Magic, Winmar & Koops were fizzes, our others haven't been legit superstars. And for years to see the Buddy's, Betts, Rioli's etc light up games of footy has me envious. We have the west of Victoria now, well populated with indigenous kids looking for a role model. He's a guy that makes you want to go to the footy and only take toilet stops at the main breaks because you don't want to miss a second because he can do a lot in that time. An outright indigenous superstar would be massive for a lot if reasons, so I'm in the yes camp on good coin too.

As another aside, we'd be truly the multicultural team if we can convince him to come. Wingard (indigenous), JJ (South Africa), Daniel (Adelaide), Khamis (Sudan), Jong (East Timor/Taiwanese). A true representation of the peoples of the West. We come from all parts, but we are one and equal under the Red, White & Blue.


*cough* Les Bamblett *cough*

[bulldogtragic]

Lynch also indigenous and could work well with Chad.

After the Richmond game, I want Lynch forward. Two lightning quick small forwards playing at the feet of hopefully Boyd & Schache. Sounds pretty nice to me.

[bulldogtragic]

*cough* Les Bamblett *cough*

Too young for me to recall like Magic. No disrespect to him.

[Axe Man]

'If Chad wants to stay, he'll be here': Davies (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2018-10-04/if-chad-wants-to-stay-hell-be-here-davies)

IT'S CHAD Wingard's decision whether he wants to stay at Port Adelaide but football manager Chris Davies says "right now, there's nothing to suggest he wants to leave".

Wingard is contracted until the end of 2019 and Davies acknowledged the talented but inconsistent star could explore his options, with the Western Bulldogs among the interested Victorian clubs.

"Where contracts have got to in the AFL competition is that with a year to go, whether it's the player or the manager or the club in some instances, they look at what they can potentially get in a year's time and work back from there," Davies told NAB AFL Trade Radio on Thursday.

The Power know what Wingard wants is pivotal.

"We're not the first cab off the rank in all of this. Chad is," Davies said.

"Fundamentally, Chad's got to have an offer that would suggest that he wants to go and right now, that's not the conversation that we're having. That'll play out over the coming days and weeks I'm sure."

However, Davies said Port doesn't want the 25-year-old to leave.

"Unless Chad gets to a point where he's got an offer on the table that would suggest he wants to leave, we plan for him to stay in 2019," Davies said.

"We're certainly not going to force Chad out. If he wants to stay at our footy club in 2019, he'll be here."

[bornadog]

Chad, come on down

[The Bulldogs Bite]

The wording from Port is a little strange.

Obviously a bit more to this story so the next few weeks will be interesting.

[Mofra]

The wording from Port is a little strange.
Certainly haven't shut the door on any deals, left themselves some room.

[bulldogtragic]

That says pretty much nothing. Except that they are prepared to trade. So maybe he's still in play.

[Ghost Dog]

This. As an aside, I personally love him as to see an indigenous superstar playing for us. I'm too young to remember Magic, Winmar & Koops were fizzes, our others haven't been legit superstars. And for years to see the Buddy's, Betts, Rioli's etc light up games of footy has me envious. We have the west of Victoria now, well populated with indigenous kids looking for a role model. He's a guy that makes you want to go to the footy and only take toilet stops at the main breaks because you don't want to miss a second because he can do a lot in that time. An outright indigenous superstar would be massive for a lot if reasons, so I'm in the yes camp on good coin too.

As another aside, we'd be truly the multicultural team if we can convince him to come. Wingard (indigenous), JJ (South Africa), Daniel (Adelaide), Khamis (Sudan), Jong (East Timor/Taiwanese). A true representation of the peoples of the West. We come from all parts, but we are one and equal under the Red, White & Blue.

True! We could also celebrate the English / Scot / Irish / Welsh backgrounds. if you were allowed to without wanting to be labeled 'racist'.:D

[bulldogtragic]

True! We could also celebrate the English / Scot / Irish / Welsh backgrounds. if you were allowed to without wanting to be labeled 'racist'.:D

Well, I love Tim English, I though Scot Welsh was very good and underrated, and an Irish rookie would be nice as we've never had a one (that I can remember).

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Well, I love Tim English, I though Scot Welsh was very good and underrated, and an Irish rookie would be nice as we've never had a one (that I can remember).

Didn't we have an Irish Rookie sometime ago Bernie..... (Collins?)never played a game..

[Axe Man]

Didn't we have an Irish Rookie sometime ago Bernie..... (Collins?)never played a game..

Yep, Bernie Collins is correct.
https://i.postimg.cc/d1tYy0ZD/167059.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Rocket Science]

That says pretty much nothing. Except that they are prepared to trade. So maybe he's still in play.

Hmmm. What it says to me is he'll leave if someone drowns him in folding stuff. It's there in black and white.

You'd think there's been some honest conversations at Alberton this year about expectations versus output and Chad's responded by going fine, let's see who else out there loves them some Chad, I'll show you lot. And here we are ...

There's been nothing else reported to suggest any other motive to go; no argy-bargy with the coach, no commentary about team direction or his role. Sure he's mates with Trengove & Impey but that's a convenient leverage point I think.

This fishing process will give Chad a bit of perspective I reckon, and he'll stay put. This year at least.

[Happy Days]

True! We could also celebrate the English / Scot / Irish / Welsh backgrounds. if you were allowed to without wanting to be labeled 'racist'.:D

Every single day in Australia is a "celebration" of English/Scot/Irish backgrounds

[SquirrelGrip]

As another aside, we'd be truly the multicultural team if we can convince him to come. Wingard (indigenous), JJ (South Africa), Daniel (Adelaide), Khamis (Sudan), Jong (East Timor/Taiwanese). A true representation of the peoples of the West. We come from all parts, but we are one and equal under the Red, White & Blue.

And don’t forget our Italians Bontempelli, Liberatore and Tom Boyd’s pretty well Danish.

[SquirrelGrip]

*cough* Les Bamblett *cough*


https://youtu.be/fPnOVLSvmKw

[ratsmac]

Hmmm. What it says to me is he'll leave if someone drowns him in folding stuff. It's there in black and white.

You'd think there's been some honest conversations at Alberton this year about expectations versus output and Chad's responded by going fine, let's see who else out there loves them some Chad, I'll show you lot. And here we are ...

There's been nothing else reported to suggest any other motive to go; no argy-bargy with the coach, no commentary about team direction or his role. Sure he's mates with Trengove & Impey but that's a convenient leverage point I think.

This fishing process will give Chad a bit of perspective I reckon, and he'll stay put. This year at least.

That's how I see it as well. We are being used just to test his market value. I hope we aren't all smitten over him and are willing chase other deals if it benefits us and not get caught out with no time left to strike any deals like last year almost.

[Axe Man]

Sam Power has confirmed our interest in Chad and we have expressed our interest to his management. Haven't heard anything back yet.

[Topdog]

True! We could also celebrate the English / Scot / Irish / Welsh backgrounds. if you were allowed to without wanting to be labeled 'racist'.:D

Those would be guys that win the Brownlows

[bornadog]

Sam Power has confirmed our interest in Chad and we have expressed our interest to his management. Haven't heard anything back yet.

Was that on Trade Radio?

EDIT

'No doubt' the Bulldogs are keen on Chad (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2018-10-04/no-doubt-the-bulldogs-are-keen-on-chad)

WESTERN Bulldogs list manager Sam Power has confirmed the club's interest in securing Port Adelaide star Chad Wingard.

Speculation has swirled that Wingard has been tempted by big money offers from the Bulldogs and several other Melbourne-based clubs ahead of next week's NAB AFL Trade Period.

The Dogs are looking to add some much-need firepower to help their poor conversion and goalkicking that's hampered them over the past few years and have identified the 25-year-old playmaker as a key target.

Speaking to AFL.com.au at the NAB AFL Draft Combine on Thursday, Power says Wingard is a player they'd like to complement their young list.

"There's no doubt we've got interest in Chad," Power said.
"There is a lot to play out and a lot of movement through the Trade Period, but we're always looking to improve our list.

"We definitely have some interest in Chad."

Port Adelaide football manager Chris Davies told NAB AFL Trade Radio on Thursday morning that Wingard was yet to seek move away from Alberton and the Dogs are also yet to get a clear indication on where the contracted forward wants to play his footy in 2019.

The Dogs are likely to dangle their first-round pick, currently selection six, as part of the deal to get the Power to trade them the two-time All Australian.

"Chad hasn't (told he wants to come to the club), but we've obviously signalled to his management he's a player of interest to us," Sam Power said.

Wingard took to Instagram later on Thursday afternoon to address some of the speculation around his future and said a statement will be made "when the time is right".

While they're looking to bring in Wingard, Power says the club is keen to retain the services of midfielder Tom Liberatore.

The 25-year-old is resuming from a second knee reconstruction in his eight seasons at Whitten Oval, and talks with his management will ramp up following his return on the weekend from an overseas trip.

"All the talk has been really positive with 'Libba' and his manager Tom Williams, so we've had some good discussions over the course of the season," Power said.

"Tom's been overseas and only just recently returned, so we'll deal with that and work through that over the short-term, but we're really confident Tom will be at the Bulldogs next year."

There's been no movement on a new contract for free agent Jordan Roughead, with Power saying he was yet to hear back from the premiership ruckman's management on a contract offer.

Power also confirmed Richmond forward Sam Lloyd had indicated to the Dogs that he wants to call the Kennel home next season.

"Sam, through his management, says he wants to come to the Bulldogs, which is fantastic," Power said.
"Now it's up to Richmond to tell us what a trade will look like.

"We definitely like to think (the trade will happen) because we think Sam is a player that would add to our list and we'd love him on our list for 2019."

Power was "surprised" to hear second-year ruckman Tim English's name thrown around in trade speculation and says the West Australian is enjoying his time in Melbourne.

He also said the futures out-of-contract duo Mitch Honeychurch and Tom Campbell are unlikely to be sorted until after the Trade Period.