Always Right Match Committee Thread - 2021 AFL Grand Final vs Melbourne

[Scraggers]

Welcome to the Always Right Match Committee Thread. The Match Committee threads has been named after long time WOOF member Always Right who tragically passed away in March 2018.

If you were on the Western Bulldogs match committee what changes would you make after our epic Preliminary Final win against against Port Adelaide for the Grand Final against Melbourne?

For those new to these threads, please give a brief explanation for your changes ... this would add a lot of value to the discussion.

[bulldogtragic]

In:

Weightman, Keath

Out:

VDM, Cordy


Sub From: Scott, VDM, Richards



Notes: Keath is confirmed as fit. Martin only played 68% so the week off should be enough to recharge his batteries.

[Mutz]

In:

Weightman, Keath

Out:

VDM, Cordy


Sub From: Scott, VDM, Richards

Notes: Keath is confirmed as fit. Martin only played 68% so the week off should be enough to recharge his batteries.

Agree completely BDT.

[bulldogtragic]

B: Duryea Keath Wood
HB: Dale Gardner Williams
C: Hunter Bonts B. Smith
HF: JJ Schache Treloar
F: Hannan Naughton Weightman
R: Martin Libba Macrae
Int: English, Daniel, Dunkley, R. Smith
Sub from: VDM, Scott, Richards


9 Premiership Players: Duryea, Wood, Hunter, Bontempelli, JJ, Libba, Macrae, Daniel, Dunkley
1 GF Experience: Treloar

Melbourne: 0

[The Bulldogs Bite]

VDM only tightness isn't it?

I thought he was excellent. Geez it's a hard decision to make. JJ played his best game since the GF too.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

It’s brutal. No one deserves to be out after that performance. Thought Cordy was great but reality is, Weightman and Keath come in. I think it’s Cordy and Smith/VDM out.

[bulldogtragic]

VDM only tightness isn't it?

I thought he was excellent. Geez it's a hard decision to make. JJ played his best game since the GF too.

Tough decisions. Keath & Weightman are no brainders.

Cordy probably out with Gardner’s height for Ben Brown.

I think a Weightman comes in for either VDM and JJ. The only other potential is R. Smith and he plays a very different role.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

This is brutality..
Cordy was rock solid tonight..but he's not Keath.

Weightman is in, but wow. JJ and VDM they had some stellar moments tonight.
I reckon VDM makes way. so stiff.

[Scraggers]

Just out of interest … anyone notice the time this thread was created?
#confidence :cool:

[westdog54]

I genuinely feel for the match committee this week. There will be at least two heartbreaks, made even harder by the performance across the board tonight.

Not one player who is in the gun to make way for Keath or Weightman played a bad game tonight.

It's going to be cruel.

[EasternWest]

Just out of interest … anyone notice the time this thread was created?
#confidence :cool:

Cheeky bugger.

[Doc26]

Tough decisions. Keath & Weightman are no brainders.

Cordy probably out with Gardner’s height for Ben Brown.

I think a Weightman comes in for either VDM and JJ. The only other potential is R. Smith and he plays a very different role.

Yep, Weightman in for VDM, with VDM pushing out to medical sub. Unfortunately Anthony Scott misses.

The tough one really is between Zaine and Roarke. One will be very very unlucky. To not go with Roarke would mean we’re sacrificing an important role player, whereas Cordy’s experience and hardness would be an asset, not to mention a back up if Keath goes down.

Maybe Cordy becomes the medical sub in place of VDM?

[whythelongface]

Cordy is a no brainer. Played well tonight.

Both Laith and JJ played but would leave JJ in mainly due to his experience but also because he has regained his swagger.

[soupman]

Thought Cordy was really good tonight but he'd be my pick to make way for Keath.

At the other end as others have stated it's a fight between JJ and Vandermeer for who has to be sub. I was super happy with Vandermeers game tonight so probably relegate JJ, but he was really good and has performed pretty well in past GFs so it's a real toss of the coin.

[bulldogtragic]

The curve ball. Last time we played them at the MCG, we went in with Keath, Cordy & Schache as defenders for McDonald, Brown and Jackson/Gawn. So we though we needed three KPDs. Then Keath got injured and it was just Schache & Cordy. Then we won. So the question I guess is do we NEED a third KPD?

[bornadog]

The curve ball. Last time we played them at the MCG, we went in with Keath, Cordy & Schache as defenders for McDonald, Brown and Jackson/Gawn. So we though we needed three KPDs. Then Keath got injured and it was just Schache & Cordy. Then we won. So the question I guess is do we NEED a third KPD?

Port had the three tonight

[Grantysghost]

So are we wearing the white strip?

[GVGjr]

The curve ball. Last time we played them at the MCG, we went in with Keath, Cordy & Schache as defenders for McDonald, Brown and Jackson/Gawn. So we though we needed three KPDs. Then Keath got injured and it was just Schache & Cordy. Then we won. So the question I guess is do we NEED a third KPD?

If we were were to go in with 3 talls who slides out?
I think it will be Keath for Cordy but I do like the idea of the 3rd tall

[soupman]

If we were were to go in with 3 talls who slides out?
I think it will be Keath for Cordy but I do like the idea of the 3rd tall

I think Roarke is the next most vulnerable. One of JJ and Vandermeer will be demoted to sub but not both.

Everyone else in the side is decidedly not fringe or plays a specific role (Schache) and has been doing it well. Wood is probably the most likely I guess but has been really good this finals series and was good tonight.

[GVGjr]

I think Roarke is the next most vulnerable. One of JJ and Vandermeer will be demoted to sub but not both.

Everyone else in the side is decidedly not fringe or plays a specific role (Schache) and has been doing it well. Wood is probably the most likely I guess but has been really good this finals series and was good tonight.

So we would go into the game with 8 defenders in Keath, Gardner, Cordy, Wood, Dale, Williams, Duryea and Daniel? I know we can move Daniel into other roles but it looks just a bit unbalanced.

[Vred]

I think Roarke is the next most vulnerable. One of JJ and Vandermeer will be demoted to sub but not both.

Everyone else in the side is decidedly not fringe or plays a specific role (Schache) and has been doing it well. Wood is probably the most likely I guess but has been really good this finals series and was good tonight.

It's tough but I'd actually be dropping Roake for Weightman and leaving VDM / JJ in.

[soupman]

So we would go into the game with 8 defenders in Keath, Gardner, Cordy, Wood, Dale, Williams, Duryea and Daniel? I know we can move Daniel into other roles but it looks just a bit unbalanced.

Basically I don't see it happening. If you wanted to maintain a bit of balance it's Wood, but no way is he being dropped. If you are bringing Keath in and want to play three tall defenders then that leaves you with Wood, Dale, Williams, Duryea and Daniel from that list. No chance any of them gets omitted.

[soupman]

It's tough but I'd actually be dropping Roake for Weightman and leaving VDM / JJ in.

I'd be open to that, but there is a role for him on Langdon (and from recollection he did a good job there last time round).

[bulldogtragic]

If we were were to go in with 3 talls who slides out?
I think it will be Keath for Cordy but I do like the idea of the 3rd tall

A hypothetical for a third tall.

This was my side from the last page with Keath & Cody for Cordy & VDM. Amended now with another tall, in Cordy. Who has Grand Final experience. The 7th defender is Wood as I just don’t see him being dropped. Daniel plays wherever he wants. Roarke Smith is the one that possibly becomes the sub. In 2016 we had Morris, Hamling & Roberts as three KPDs.


B: Duryea Keath Cordy
HB: Dale Gardner Williams
C: Hunter Bonts B. Smith
HF: JJ Schache Treloar
F: Hannan Naughton Weightman
R: Martin Libba Macrae
Int: English, Daniel, Dunkley, Wood
Sub from: R. Smith, VDM, Scott, Richards


10 Premiership Players: Duryea, Wood, Hunter, Bontempelli, JJ, Libba, Macrae, Daniel, Dunkley, Cordy
1 GF Experience: Treloar

Melbourne: 0

[josie]

It's tough but I'd actually be dropping Roake for Weightman and leaving VDM / JJ in.

From Bevo’s presser VDM is doubtful. Also if we bring Keath back in doubt we’d have 2 players with recent hamstrings in team.

[angelopetraglia]

So are we wearing the white strip?

When we have played Melbourne as the away team we have worn our white strip. My guess is yes.

[bulldogtragic]

From Bevo’s presser VDM is doubtful. Also if we bring Keath back in doubt we’d have 2 players with recent hamstrings in team.

Chris Grant told Tom Morris that another day and Keath would’ve played. And Keath is certain for the GF.

[jeemak]

The curve ball. Last time we played them at the MCG, we went in with Keath, Cordy & Schache as defenders for McDonald, Brown and Jackson/Gawn. So we though we needed three KPDs. Then Keath got injured and it was just Schache & Cordy. Then we won. So the question I guess is do we NEED a third KPD?

We go with our best defencive set up, and don't give a shit about whether they play one or two more whatevers or one or two less.

Keath in, Cordy out.
Cody in, Latham out.

I love Latham but I can't trust him and his legs. It's just been too much disruption this season. On the other hand JJ was just too good to ignore tonight. If BOG was awarded on roles he would be in the top ten on the ground for the evening.

[Go_Dogs]

Gee this is where it gets tricky. Every dynasty has a story or two of players missing out and no doubt we will have a few examples this time around too.

Questions:
Will Martin recover well and be better for the run? Hope so
Will VDM recover, or become to great a risk? Really hard to know but the way it was positioned with his soft tissue history and the type of role we ask him to play, it may make it tough.
How many tall defenders do we need? In some ways it may depend on the weather. 3 key defenders seems sensible but would not drop one of our small / medium defenders.
How many tall forwards do we need? With Lever and May I think 3 talls at most stages will give us the right look. Gee the forwards worked incredibly well together last night. More of that.


I’ll hold off for a week or so before having a go at a best 23.

At this stage, Keath and Weightman in.

[G-Mo77]

Martin injured ankle, VDM Hammy. Bevo said that VDM is doubtful but seemed more confident with Martin.

My gut says VDM our for Weightman. Someone is going to be very unlucky for Keath to come in.

[Topdog]

Dixon is a good match up for Cordy so I wasn't surprised that he played well but he will surely make way for Keath.

[Bulldog Joe]

It is a really tough decision.

I see Vandemeer out for Weightman and probably Cordy for Keath

Realistically the whole list of the winning team deserve medals as it takes more than the GF day to win a flag.

At the very least everyone who has played game time throughout the year has contributed to being in the GF.

[DOG GOD]

Roarke will tag Langdon

So-
In: Weightman and Keath
Out- Cordy, Scott, Vanders

Vanders or scott to be Sub

[bulldogsthru&thru]

It is a really tough decision.

I see Vandemeer out for Weightman and probably Cordy for Keath

Realistically the whole list of the winning team deserve medals as it takes more than the GF day to win a flag.

At the very least everyone who has played game time throughout the year has contributed to being in the GF.

Agree. I’ve always found it ridiculous only the players on the day get a medal. Everyone who plays a game for the year should get one. I actually think all players in the list should get one as it takes a village, but minimum one game is a nice compromise if it’s needed. While we’re at it, scrap the suspension ruling you out of the Brownlow rule.

[azabob]

Melbourne strength is their midfield and defence.

I agree Roarke Smith is in the discussion of being dropped but I don't think Melbourne in is the team we take a midfielder out and bring in a forward.

Both JJ and VDM deserve their spot but I think one of them will make way for Weightman.

Keath in for Cordy.

I'm sure this will change 29 times between now and Saturday week.

[jazzadogs]

We're going in to a Grand Final with Ryan Gardner as our CHB, and Josh Schache as our CHF - and I feel confident about them.

Could not have imagined that sentence being written even six months ago.

[Happy Days]

That one holding the ball brain melt aside, Gardner was rock solid last night. The player that he’s become is dumbfounding.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

We had a few silly holding the balls last night. I thought the umpiring was a little biased towards port. The frees against Martin, especially the one where he and Lycett were grappling eachother were crazy. Then the inconsistency in htb calls against Dale vs Aliir. On the whole I thought there was little influence. Anyway, my point being we aren’t hearing from these twerps about the umpiring. Why? Because we smashed a team whilst losing the free kick count. I understand the average idiot on social media saying that shit but when it comes out of people in the media you’ve gotta question their employer.

F*** the world who undermined us! And may it continue so we can continue to shove your face in it.

[MrMahatma]

Roarke will tag Langdon

So-
In: Weightman and Keath
Out- Cordy, Scott, Vanders

Vanders or scott to be Sub

Yep, this.

JJ had his best game in years and was very critical early. Even without injury cloud, VDM prob makes way for Weightman. That’s the toughest call I’d say. Cordy out for Keith pretty much just makes sense, again, not that Cordy did a lot wrong yesterday.

We should go into the GF only Bruce missing from our best 22 and all of the “fringe” players in their best form all year.

Can’t wait!

[angelopetraglia]

It is a really tough decision.

I see Vandemeer out for Weightman and probably Cordy for Keath

Realistically the whole list of the winning team deserve medals as it takes more than the GF day to win a flag.

At the very least everyone who has played game time throughout the year has contributed to being in the GF.

I can't believe the AFL has not come to the party on this. If you play in one game during the season you should get a Premiership Medallion. You have contributed to the team winning. It's so cruel that you can play in every game, get injured in a Prelim and you don't get a Medallion.

[angelopetraglia]

You would think it is almost 100% chance that the Medi-Sub gets a run. Whos is the best player to have an impact off the bench?

[comrade]

You would think it is almost 100% chance that the Medi-Sub gets a run. Whos is the best player to have an impact off the bench?

I think VDM is the one, if fit. Otherwise Scott or Richards would both be good options.

[bornadog]

I think VDM is the one, if fit. Otherwise Scott or Richards would both be good options.

Roarke on ABC radio today says VDM felt a little tightness and decided to pull the pin, and thinks he is ok. However, I prefer Cody over VDM and JJ's experience

[bulldogtragic]

Is it crazy. Just to reflect, that we just clocked out biggest ever finals win EVER and we now get back our Gun KPD and our outrageously talented non KPF. To make the 22/23 much better. It’s loco.

[comrade]

Roarke on ABC radio today says VDM felt a little tightness and decided to pull the pin, and thinks he is ok. However, I prefer Cody over VDM and JJ's experience

He fluffed a few decisions but I really liked VDM's pressure and productivity. Will be rough to see him miss but JJ was brilliant and Cody is a lock.

I think it comes down to Roarke and VDM for last spot in the 22, with the other as sub and my gut feel is Roarke gets the gig, given there is a real need for a defensive winger to stop Langdon.

[EasternWest]

There's no way Roarke Smith goes out. No way. Similarly JJ who has been excellent.

In: Keath, Weightman
Out: Cordy (unlucky), VDM
Sub: Scott or VDM.

[boydogs]

The curve ball. Last time we played them at the MCG, we went in with Keath, Cordy & Schache as defenders for McDonald, Brown and Jackson/Gawn. So we though we needed three KPDs. Then Keath got injured and it was just Schache & Cordy. Then we won. So the question I guess is do we NEED a third KPD?

Yeah I think we do. Brown was clunking them on Friday and Jackson & Gawn were both outstanding

[comrade]

Yeah I think we do. Brown was clunking them on Friday and Jackson & Gawn were both outstanding

Melbourne structure up similarly to Port with Charlie and Marshall taking the key spots, and Ladhams/Lycett resting forward. Melbourne have Brown and McDonald, with Jackson/Gawn.

Melbourne will be a tougher assignment, but if we can again restrict entries we should be ok. Timmy got back quite a bit too when he spent time in ruck.

[josie]

I really like Roarke and in interest of keeping side settled I think he will stay in. On other hand he is likely next in line for possible replacement (after VDM for Cody and one of Cordy or Gardner for Keath). What are Richard’s defensive traits like and can he play in wing ok (vs HBF/Woody’s role)? Do you think he is any chance of replacing Roarke and perhaps Roarke bring sub? (especially if VDM hammy doubtful).

What was Richard’s injury (was it shoulder I read somewhere)?

Got a feeling if MC confident Martin can back up his PF efforts and are out 4 quarters they will want speed as medi sub and Richards has that. Both he and Roarke reasonably tall without being KP size & both can take a good mark.

[Ozza]

Out: Cordy & VDM (both unlucky)
In: Keath & Weightman.

VDM the sub if fit.

Would love to see Wally as medi sub....but think it will be VDM or Scotty.

[angelopetraglia]

From Sam’s piece in the paper today.

“Last week Beveridge personally guaranteed Cody Weightman (concussion) he would be selected for the Grand Final should the Dogs progress and Alex Keath (hamstring) is also on track to return”

[comrade]

I'm just praying that Stef pulls up ok.

[Happy Days]

I'm just praying that Stef pulls up ok.

+1 for this. Even though his game in a vacuum was kinda bad he just makes everyone walk taller. We're gonna need some physicality put into Gawn too, especially now that he's apparently a 208cm Buddy Franklin.

[Sedat]

+1 for this. Even though his game in a vacuum was kinda bad he just makes everyone walk taller. We're gonna need some physicality put into Gawn too, especially now that he's apparently a 208cm Buddy Franklin.
Our clearance and contested ball numbers were outrageous in the first 6 rounds of the season when Stef was playing. He completely smothered Lycett, who was so destructive against us in R22 - no surprise that our mids dominated with him back on the weekend.

His presence also makes English twice as dangerous as both a key forward and a relief ruckman. I wonder if the prelim was the plan all along with Stef, knowing his age and the ability to get an extra week off to freshen up, and we had to hold fort using Young and others while the cavalry arrived.

[Happy Days]

Our clearance and contested ball numbers were outrageous in the first 6 rounds of the season when Stef was playing. He completely smothered Lycett, who was so destructive against us in R22 - no surprise that our mids dominated with him back on the weekend.

His presence also makes English twice as dangerous as both a key forward and a relief ruckman. I wonder if the prelim was the plan all along with Stef, knowing his age and the ability to get an extra week off to freshen up, and we had to hold fort using Young and others while the cavalry arrived.

I'd be lying if I said I didn't consider this too.

[The Pie Man]

I am a big VDM fan, but you get the feeling they won’t risk him.

In: Cody, Keath

Out: VDM, Cordy

Scott the sub, can play back or forward.

Must admit I’m a bit nervous about Keath with recurring issues.

Martin has to get up. Will be interested to hear how he pulled up

[bornadog]

I am a big VDM fan, but you get the feeling they won’t risk him.

In: Cody, Keath

Out: VDM, Cordy

Scott the sub, can play back or forward.

Must admit I’m a bit nervous about Keath with recurring issues.

Martin has to get up. Will be interested to hear how he pulled up

I heard on the weekend Keath probably could have played on Saturday, so that tells me he is right to go. (fingers crossed)

[bulldogtragic]

I heard on the weekend Keath probably could have played on Saturday, so that tells me he is right to go. (fingers crossed)

Chris Grant told Tom Morris if it was a GF he would’ve played. Just caution and only tightness. Nothing to worry about with two weeks of treatment and rehab.

[Mantis]

I heard on the weekend Keath probably could have played on Saturday, so that tells me he is right to go. (fingers crossed)

If it was GF they would've risked him, but thinking after a 2 week break he'll be cherry ripe... and I guess a good thing is it was the other hammy to the one he injured in Rd.19 so not an recurring issue.

[Ozza]

Just on the Stef Martin discussion....it was pretty telling that Bevo mentioned how the players (midfielders) had been asking when Stef would be right to play. They obviously have a lot of faith and trust in him.

And on Keath....really interesting that 'he would have played if it was a Grand Final' which I read into as we had a lot of confidence about our Prelim prospects! Practically resting blokes :p

[EasternWest]

Our clearance and contested ball numbers were outrageous in the first 6 rounds of the season when Stef was playing. He completely smothered Lycett, who was so destructive against us in R22 - no surprise that our mids dominated with him back on the weekend.

His presence also makes English twice as dangerous as both a key forward and a relief ruckman. I wonder if the prelim was the plan all along with Stef, knowing his age and the ability to get an extra week off to freshen up, and we had to hold fort using Young and others while the cavalry arrived.

We're infinitely better with an actual ruckman and Stef playing is irrefutable evidence of this.

Gawn is a fine player, but surely it's impossible to replicate that quarter again. That's lightning in a bottle stuff.

[Grantysghost]

We're infinitely better with an actual ruckman and Stef playing is irrefutable evidence of this.

Gawn is a fine player, but surely it's impossible to replicate that quarter again. That's lightning in a bottle stuff.

I still remember that pre season game (I know) but Martin was annoying the bejesus out of Gawn at stoppages around the ground.
I was sat in pretty much the bench and you could see him continuously whinging to the umpires.

Love it he's back with a run under his belt. It will just negate the demolition scenario we saw with Stanley.

[bulldogtragic]

I still remember that pre season game (I know) but Martin was annoying the bejesus out of Gawn at stoppages around the ground.
I was sat in pretty much the bench and you could see him continuously whinging to the umpires.

Love it he's back with a run under his belt. It will just negate the demolition scenario we saw with Stanley.

His experience with Gawn will be massive. Played with him and then a decade or so against him. That kind of physical experience over a very long time within our number one ruck is a great thing to have. He knows his moves, his technique, how to position against him, defend him, work off him to his mids, will know the plan a & b. That real life match experience that only he has on our list.

He’s blown out the cobwebs and five frees against. 68% game time. Hopefully after two weeks he’s feeling better and can nudge over 70% game time.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Confident Martin can provide a contest at centre bounce and stoppages, the concern is what Gawn can do running forward.

I think minimising Gawn and one of Petracca/Oliver (both ideally, but at least 1) is the real key. Do that and we win.

[Axe Man]

His experience with Gawn will be massive. Played with him and then a decade or so against him. That kind of physical experience over a very long time within our number one ruck is a great thing to have. He knows his moves, his technique, how to position against him, defend him, work off him to his mids, will know the plan a & b. That real life match experience that only he has on our list.

He’s blown out the cobwebs and five frees against. 68% game time. Hopefully after two weeks he’s feeling better and can nudge over 70% game time.

This is a Gawn quote on Stef, Max won't have things all his own way this time.


“Stef is purely one of the strongest players I’ve ever played,” Gawn once told the Herald Sun.

“He’s an amazingly strong person and you get caught anywhere on a bad angle with him and he’ll just put you on your ass.”

[bulldogtragic]

Hopefully that’s exactly what Stef does.

[Rhys]

I’ve heard the name Max Gawn about 283628727 times since Friday night alone. I know Melbourne are trying to break a huge drought, and that he is their in-form captain and spiritual leader.

However.

I hope he sheds one single tear at the final siren, knowing what could have been, as our boys roar into the sky in triumph.

[kruder]

I can't wait to see what the Bont can produce after a week off, it's exactly what he needed I reckon.

Good news re VDM if he does come up you still get a medal for being the sub, his attack on the ball was excellent last week deserves to play a role for mine.

[Ozza]

Feel sick about Wally missing out again.

Can't make the case for him to quite push into the 23.....but its a heart breaker.

[The Adelaide Connection]

Feel sick about Wally missing out again.

Can't make the case for him to quite push into the 23.....but its a heart breaker.

There is going to be some uncomfortably brutal hard luck stories.

I don’t know if this has been said, but I assume that an unused medical sub would still get a medal on the day? For me, if that is the case, it just strengthens the argument that everyone on the playing list should get one.

[Mofra]

Gawn will have Stef for aerobic capacity, he's very underrated in that department.
Let's not forget that English played virtually a solo ruck role in the last quarter against Brisbane and beat the Big O. English can run, he might be the best match up for Jackson/Gawn late in the game after Stef has softened him up.
I expect Stef will probably managed to get his TOG numbers up a bit, from say 68% against Port to 75% in the big dance.

[Ozza]

There is going to be some uncomfortably brutal hard luck stories.

I don’t know if this has been said, but I assume that an unused medical sub would still get a medal on the day? For me, if that is the case, it just strengthens the argument that everyone on the playing list should get one.

Yes the medi sub definitely gets a medal.

Will be interesting to see if the medical sub is strategically used by both (or either) team.
I would expect that someone will be told that they are doing a calf some time either side of 3 quarter time if there aren't any injuries already.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Yes the medi sub definitely gets a medal.

Will be interesting to see if the medical sub is strategically used by both (or either) team.
I would expect that someone will be told that they are doing a calf some time either side of 3 quarter time if there aren't any injuries already.

100% guaranteed both will be used. You’d be stupid not to. There’s no game the following week so no one will even know if there was a legit injury or not.

The way things have gone for both clubs, we’ll certainly have to use ours for a legit injury whereas Melbourne will use theirs strategically.

[Happy Days]

Nathan Jones has officially retired. Hopefully they can do his career justice and lose on purpose by 120 points.

[The Doctor]

Nathan Jones has officially retired. Hopefully they can do his career justice and lose on purpose by 120 points.

Like This?

http://www.demonwiki.org/Round+15+1985

[bornadog]

Like This?

http://www.demonwiki.org/Round+15+1985

That would be awesome as EW says.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Like This?

http://www.demonwiki.org/Round+15+1985

Yes please. As an aside, great Wiki... is there anything comparable for the Bulldogs out there that you know of?

[Grantysghost]

Nathan Jones has officially retired. Hopefully they can do his career justice and lose on purpose by 120 points.

Something very weird about his departure. I'd think he'd want to be on the ground at least celebrating if they win as his final act. I get there's a child birth at some stage a bit later on but hmmm.

He's the antithesis of Mitch Wallis.

[comrade]

Something very weird about his departure. I'd think he'd want to be on the ground at least celebrating if they win as his final act. I get there's a child birth at some stage a bit later on but hmmm.

He's the antithesis of Mitch Wallis.

His wife had twins within hours of him getting back to Victoria.

[Grantysghost]

His wife had twins within hours of him getting back to Victoria.

There you go. Thanks. I read here? that it wasn't until later.

Makes complete sense now.

Wallis comparison stands.

[Mantis]

Like This?

http://www.demonwiki.org/Round+15+1985

Beeza kicked 12 and gave away 7 free kicks.. He could've had a day out!

Free kicks 42-47... and they say the game is over-officiated now.

[jeemak]

There you go. Thanks. I read here? that it wasn't until later.

Makes complete sense now.

Wallis comparison stands.

Yeah I was joking that it was mid December, but the team encouraged him to go home for the birth of his twins so as to avoid a more awkward conversation.

So if that was it, I apologise for my skylarking.

[Grantysghost]

Yeah I was joking that it was mid December, but the team encouraged him to go home for the birth of his twins so as to avoid a more awkward conversation.

So if that was it, I apologise for my skylarking.

*bill lawry voice on*

Got him (me), fk off you're out!

I really should pay more attention, but I never look at afl media so this is my source of truth! xD

[Ozza]

Beeza kicked 12 and gave away 7 free kicks.. He could've had a day out!

Free kicks 42-47... and they say the game is over-officiated now.

Everyone says the 'old days' were better.....until they watch it ;)

[Bullies]

I can't wait to see what the Bont can produce after a week off, it's exactly what he needed I reckon.

Good news re VDM if he does come up you still get a medal for being the sub, his attack on the ball was excellent last week deserves to play a role for mine. Same with Martin as the second week is always the hardest after being out for so long. He has the extra week to get his body right and the extra massages. Could not have come at a better time for both he and Bont and you could throw in Keath as well.

[Dry Rot]

Did Martin play in the first match against the Demons this year?

[Dry Rot]

Something very weird about his departure. I'd think he'd want to be on the ground at least celebrating if they win as his final act. I get there's a child birth at some stage a bit later on but hmmm.

He's the antithesis of Mitch Wallis.

Next month, Jones will announce he is coming out of retirement to join the Cats on a three year deal.

[comrade]

Did Martin play in the first match against the Demons this year?

Nope. We haven't played the Dees with Stef, Dunks or Treloar.

[Dry Rot]

Nope. We haven't played the Dees with Stef, Dunks or Treloar.

Thanks.

Thought so.

We are going to belt these entitled pricks.

I see another 1954 coming up.

From the Archives, 1954: Dashing Bulldogs’ grand final victory over Melbourne

https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/from-the-archives-1954-dashing-bulldogs-grand-final-victory-over-melbourne-20210912-p58qy7.html

[merantau]

I am interested in the match ups. I do not want to see Oliver running around getting a free pass. I want to see a lot of attention paid to Fritsch. Dunkley for Oliver. One of the Baileys for Fritsch.

[Mofra]

I am interested in the match ups. I do not want to see Oliver running around getting a free pass. I want to see a lot of attention paid to Fritsch. Dunkley for Oliver. One of the Baileys for Fritsch.
And Roarke to Brayshaw to stop him killing our switches.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Nope. We haven't played the Dees with Stef, Dunks or Treloar.

They really are three massive ins that they haven't had to deal with previously.

For mine, the concerns are;

- Gawn: He's the one who could take it away from us.
- Oliver/Petracca: Curtail one of them and I think that goes a long way to winning.
- Fritsch: Punchable head but he's a dangerous goal kicking forward.

We obviously need to make May and Lever defend us, but I'm confident we'll do that after our last performance against them/our performance against Aliir last week.

[Mantis]

And Roarke to Brayshaw to stop him killing our switches.

Yep... happy for Hunter to take Langdon on the other wing.

[jazzadogs]

This thought process has all been prompted by a 1 second clip in the club's training video, where Schache was clearly with Stef Martin and the midfield group...

Are we going to pit Schache 1v1 vs Jackson? He competes against him in the ruck, and he goes with him as a defender when Jackson moves forward?

English and Naughton our 2 tall forwards. Hannan to play the defensive forward role on Lever.

Keath takes McDonald, Gardner on Ben Brown. Cordy out.

What do we think? Are we going to go wacky with Schache? (yes I am resharing my photoshop, I am very proud of it!)

1042

[comrade]

This thought process has all been prompted by a 1 second clip in the club's training video, where Schache was clearly with Stef Martin and the midfield group...

Are we going to pit Schache 1v1 vs Jackson? He competes against him in the ruck, and he goes with him as a defender when Jackson moves forward?

English and Naughton our 2 tall forwards. Hannan to play the defensive forward role on Lever.

Keath takes McDonald, Gardner on Ben Brown. Cordy out.

What do we think? Are we going to go wacky with Schache? (yes I am resharing my photoshop, I am very proud of it!)

1042

I think you could definitely be on to something. Might not be something we do all game, but at different times.

[bornadog]

This thought process has all been prompted by a 1 second clip in the club's training video, where Schache was clearly with Stef Martin and the midfield group...

Are we going to pit Schache 1v1 vs Jackson? He competes against him in the ruck, and he goes with him as a defender when Jackson moves forward?

English and Naughton our 2 tall forwards. Hannan to play the defensive forward role on Lever.

Keath takes McDonald, Gardner on Ben Brown. Cordy out.

What do we think? Are we going to go wacky with Schache? (yes I am resharing my photoshop, I am very proud of it!)

1042

Hannan played the defensive role on May last time.

[Mantis]

I think you could definitely be on to something. Might not be something we do all game, but at different times.

Was it telling that for the last 5-10min of our PF that Schache was running around in defence?

Maybe it was just a ploy to get a few numbers in defence given we were resting our influential players, but I do think Bevo will move players to where they're most needed.

[dog town]

Some early thoughts on areas of concern or interest for next week.

Transition Game- Melbourne are just so powerful running both ways but particularly frightening on the spread if they find a quick exit out of D50. You look at the screen and their smalls and even talls often have 5-10 metres goal side running forward into space. The key for us is that when we go inside 50 if we dont have a clear 1 on 1 we like or easy target then we defend with the ball. Get numbers in and get set behind the ball and try and score from a contested mark, pressure or score from stoppage. Their speed of ball movement and how we combat it is the second most important aspect of this game behind what happens around the ball in my view.

The other thing we did really well in round 19 in this space is that when they do clear the ball from D50 and give us a chance to win it back that we take it. Our high defenders, wingers and mids have to work hard to shut it down and turn the ball back our way. Once they get out the only way you are shutting it down is someone leaving their man and impacting a contest. I actually think our defenders and particularly our high defenders are the best in the game at reading kicks and coming off to impact so this will be interesting.

If they cant chain out by hand in D50 they will look at Langdon, Brayshaw or a half high forward to spread wide or come back at the footy for a mark. If that’s not on they are quite happy to just kick a scrubber to space and back themselves to out number (think Richmond).

Nullify Interceptors- This feeds into the above, bring it to ground (preferably mark ourselves) but don’t allow easy intercepts to turn into easy transition. Couple of reference points here, their game against Hawthorn and GWS but more recently their first qtr against Brisbane. Limited entries but every time it was nullified Rivers, Smith and even Bowie looked poor. I actually rate all 3 of them but they were taken out of their comfort zone.

Ruck- Really concerns me that Gawn might get an advantage here. I watched our pre season game and a 2019 Brisbane vs Melbourne game and Martin didn’t get dominated. My concern is if Gawn pushes forward aggressively. The last thing to come back after a long lay off is your awareness in the air, you just cant quite seem to get your feel for it the first few games back. Something else to consider is Martin will have a clear advantage on Jackson when Gawn isn’t there which will be minimal but will be on their minds.

Power from stoppage- We want this played in tight, they are a better contested ball team than us in general but I don’t think they are particularly dangerous in tight. We don’t want Oliver getting on loose balls and getting it to the outside or Petracca getting through traffic and breaking lines/drawing tacklers. Control the ring around the contest, win it and clear the area to turn them around. They will be sweating on our handball game so one handball to release and then kick unless we are completely out.

Tagging Decisions- Both teams trying to balance upsetting the apple cart with shutting down key players. Viney was amazing last week so to tag Libba they would have to turn him to a negating role or kick Viney out of the first string mids for Harmes. I think Viney will go to Libba. We can send Dunkley to one of Oliver or Petracca who are exactly the mobile types that have hurt us. Petracca plays in the Dusty mould with a license to free wheel which concerns me. On the other hand if Oliver gets on the hunt and starts taking the ball away from that little 5 metre bubble we like then that’s dangerous. I would go Oliver I think. Salem would be a hard one for us with the amount of games we need to play with our talls, we need to make sure we still have a positive ground level game.

Structure- They really are buying into the game plan they have and every player knows exactly where to stand, you can see it and its why it looks like they have extra players on the ground sometimes. They out number behind the ball and then still look uncontested going forward which is a great place to be BUT sometimes when you play like that it can be easier to take something away from you. What happens when something you have relied upon dries up? Can Beveridge manipulate our numbers game to make them doubt what they are doing?

Wingers- I saw some posts re Brayshaw and while he is incredibly important to their structure he is going to do what he does. Wont get a heap of the ball and it is going to be hard to stop him playing that wing role regardless of who you play there. Langdon is the one that drives their transition but I think Hunter and B.Smith have both kept up with and beaten him before so we have options. It is kind of a decision between trying to exploit Brayshaw (makes errors under pressure) a bit or just being happy to have a nil all draw with two role players out there. I am happy with Hunter and Langdon if it goes that way.

Defensive Match Ups- Not as worried about them playing 3 talls as some. We have to take a risk to beat them and in most games we have been happy to have a high talls matched up by Dale, Williams, Duryea or Wood. Last week Dale played on Marshall for periods if he was high and Dale also played on Jackson in round 19 for periods in a high defender role. Not sure what we will do with Fritsch, Williams seemed to be on him a lot last time but I quite like him defending higher. The only time I am worried about them playing 3 talls is when Max is forward, in this instance I expect a genuine talls to go to him and we take a risk on McDonald which we have done before. Pickett needs bumpers every time he turns to run towards goal or he will destroy us, elbow in the chest every time he turns.

Youth- They are young, really young if you think about it. If we get off to a good start hopefully the occasion gets to them.

Naughton/English- To me they have both been playing within themselves when forward. Naughton is nearly back to where he was but those one on ones he is still not as strong as he was. If he dominates it changes everything for them, big questions for Melbourne if we go with Hannan as our CHF like last week but we have options to manipulate regardless of what they throw at us.

Our Transition With Ball- It will be a pressure game and they set up really well behind the ball when it is in their 50. Obviously we want to find a mark or a handball receive to get out but I don’t think we can afford to be afraid to kick it to grass or a contest. They will out number most times but we don’t want to give them easy turnover goals or free kicks by being hesitant with the ball. If we win those 50/50s there is space over the back and they get scored on.

[jazzadogs]

Some early thoughts on areas of concern or interest for next week.

Transition Game- Melbourne are just so powerful running both ways but particularly frightening on the spread if they find a quick exit out of D50. You look at the screen and their smalls and even talls often have 5-10 metres goal side running forward into space. The key for us is that when we go inside 50 if we dont have a clear 1 on 1 we like or easy target then we defend with the ball. Get numbers in and get set behind the ball and try and score from a contested mark, pressure or score from stoppage. Their speed of ball movement and how we combat it is the second most important aspect of this game behind what happens around the ball in my view.

The other thing we did really well in round 19 in this space is that when they do clear the ball from D50 and give us a chance to win it back that we take it. Our high defenders, wingers and mids have to work hard to shut it down and turn the ball back our way. Once they get out the only way you are shutting it down is someone leaving their man and impacting a contest. I actually think our defenders and particularly our high defenders are the best in the game at reading kicks and coming off to impact so this will be interesting.

If they cant chain out by hand in D50 they will look at Langdon, Brayshaw or a half high forward to spread wide or come back at the footy for a mark. If that’s not on they are quite happy to just kick a scrubber to space and back themselves to out number (think Richmond).

Nullify Interceptors- This feeds into the above, bring it to ground (preferably mark ourselves) but don’t allow easy intercepts to turn into easy transition. Couple of reference points here, their game against Hawthorn and GWS but more recently their first qtr against Brisbane. Limited entries but every time it was nullified Rivers, Smith and even Bowie looked poor. I actually rate all 3 of them but they were taken out of their comfort zone.

Ruck- Really concerns me that Gawn might get an advantage here. I watched our pre season game and a 2019 Brisbane vs Melbourne game and Martin didn’t get dominated. My concern is if Gawn pushes forward aggressively. The last thing to come back after a long lay off is your awareness in the air, you just cant quite seem to get your feel for it the first few games back. Something else to consider is Martin will have a clear advantage on Jackson when Gawn isn’t there which will be minimal but will be on their minds.

Power from stoppage- We want this played in tight, they are a better contested ball team than us in general but I don’t think they are particularly dangerous in tight. We don’t want Oliver getting on loose balls and getting it to the outside or Petracca getting through traffic and breaking lines/drawing tacklers. Control the ring around the contest, win it and clear the area to turn them around. They will be sweating on our handball game so one handball to release and then kick unless we are completely out.

Tagging Decisions- Both teams trying to balance upsetting the apple cart with shutting down key players. Viney was amazing last week so to tag Libba they would have to turn him to a negating role or kick Viney out of the first string mids for Harmes. I think Viney will go to Libba. We can send Dunkley to one of Oliver or Petracca who are exactly the mobile types that have hurt us. Petracca plays in the Dusty mould with a license to free wheel which concerns me. On the other hand if Oliver gets on the hunt and starts taking the ball away from that little 5 metre bubble we like then that’s dangerous. I would go Oliver I think. Salem would be a hard one for us with the amount of games we need to play with our talls, we need to make sure we still have a positive ground level game.

Structure- They really are buying into the game plan they have and every player knows exactly where to stand, you can see it and its why it looks like they have extra players on the ground sometimes. They out number behind the ball and then still look uncontested going forward which is a great place to be BUT sometimes when you play like that it can be easier to take something away from you. What happens when something you have relied upon dries up? Can Beveridge manipulate our numbers game to make them doubt what they are doing?

Wingers- I saw some posts re Brayshaw and while he is incredibly important to their structure he is going to do what he does. Wont get a heap of the ball and it is going to be hard to stop him playing that wing role regardless of who you play there. Langdon is the one that drives their transition but I think Hunter and B.Smith have both kept up with and beaten him before so we have options. It is kind of a decision between trying to exploit Brayshaw (makes errors under pressure) a bit or just being happy to have a nil all draw with two role players out there. I am happy with Hunter and Langdon if it goes that way.

Defensive Match Ups- Not as worried about them playing 3 talls as some. We have to take a risk to beat them and in most games we have been happy to have a high talls matched up by Dale, Williams, Duryea or Wood. Last week Dale played on Marshall for periods if he was high and Dale also played on Jackson in round 19 for periods in a high defender role. Not sure what we will do with Fritsch, Williams seemed to be on him a lot last time but I quite like him defending higher. The only time I am worried about them playing 3 talls is when Max is forward, in this instance I expect a genuine talls to go to him and we take a risk on McDonald which we have done before. Pickett needs bumpers every time he turns to run towards goal or he will destroy us, elbow in the chest every time he turns.

Youth- They are young, really young if you think about it. If we get off to a good start hopefully the occasion gets to them.

Naughton/English- To me they have both been playing within themselves when forward. Naughton is nearly back to where he was but those one on ones he is still not as strong as he was. If he dominates it changes everything for them, big questions for Melbourne if we go with Hannan as our CHF like last week but we have options to manipulate regardless of what they throw at us.

Our Transition With Ball- It will be a pressure game and they set up really well behind the ball when it is in their 50. Obviously we want to find a mark or a handball receive to get out but I don’t think we can afford to be afraid to kick it to grass or a contest. They will out number most times but we don’t want to give them easy turnover goals or free kicks by being hesitant with the ball. If we win those 50/50s there is space over the back and they get scored on.

Amazing input dog town. I agree that the transition/turnover game will be vital - in our first matchup this year their pressure and defensive setup lead to some terrible turnovers which gifted them early goals, and then the game was over.

We can never be set up the way we want for a bad turnover, so if we make silly mistakes and cough it up they become almost guaranteed looks at goal for Melbourne.

[The bulldog tragician]

Some early thoughts on areas of concern or interest for next week.

Transition Game- Melbourne are just so powerful running both ways but particularly frightening on the spread if they find a quick exit out of D50. You look at the screen and their smalls and even talls often have 5-10 metres goal side running forward into space. The key for us is that when we go inside 50 if we dont have a clear 1 on 1 we like or easy target then we defend with the ball. Get numbers in and get set behind the ball and try and score from a contested mark, pressure or score from stoppage. Their speed of ball movement and how we combat it is the second most important aspect of this game behind what happens around the ball in my view.

The other thing we did really well in round 19 in this space is that when they do clear the ball from D50 and give us a chance to win it back that we take it. Our high defenders, wingers and mids have to work hard to shut it down and turn the ball back our way. Once they get out the only way you are shutting it down is someone leaving their man and impacting a contest. I actually think our defenders and particularly our high defenders are the best in the game at reading kicks and coming off to impact so this will be interesting.

If they cant chain out by hand in D50 they will look at Langdon, Brayshaw or a half high forward to spread wide or come back at the footy for a mark. If that’s not on they are quite happy to just kick a scrubber to space and back themselves to out number (think Richmond).

Nullify Interceptors- This feeds into the above, bring it to ground (preferably mark ourselves) but don’t allow easy intercepts to turn into easy transition. Couple of reference points here, their game against Hawthorn and GWS but more recently their first qtr against Brisbane. Limited entries but every time it was nullified Rivers, Smith and even Bowie looked poor. I actually rate all 3 of them but they were taken out of their comfort zone.

Ruck- Really concerns me that Gawn might get an advantage here. I watched our pre season game and a 2019 Brisbane vs Melbourne game and Martin didn’t get dominated. My concern is if Gawn pushes forward aggressively. The last thing to come back after a long lay off is your awareness in the air, you just cant quite seem to get your feel for it the first few games back. Something else to consider is Martin will have a clear advantage on Jackson when Gawn isn’t there which will be minimal but will be on their minds.

Power from stoppage- We want this played in tight, they are a better contested ball team than us in general but I don’t think they are particularly dangerous in tight. We don’t want Oliver getting on loose balls and getting it to the outside or Petracca getting through traffic and breaking lines/drawing tacklers. Control the ring around the contest, win it and clear the area to turn them around. They will be sweating on our handball game so one handball to release and then kick unless we are completely out.

Tagging Decisions- Both teams trying to balance upsetting the apple cart with shutting down key players. Viney was amazing last week so to tag Libba they would have to turn him to a negating role or kick Viney out of the first string mids for Harmes. I think Viney will go to Libba. We can send Dunkley to one of Oliver or Petracca who are exactly the mobile types that have hurt us. Petracca plays in the Dusty mould with a license to free wheel which concerns me. On the other hand if Oliver gets on the hunt and starts taking the ball away from that little 5 metre bubble we like then that’s dangerous. I would go Oliver I think. Salem would be a hard one for us with the amount of games we need to play with our talls, we need to make sure we still have a positive ground level game.

Structure- They really are buying into the game plan they have and every player knows exactly where to stand, you can see it and its why it looks like they have extra players on the ground sometimes. They out number behind the ball and then still look uncontested going forward which is a great place to be BUT sometimes when you play like that it can be easier to take something away from you. What happens when something you have relied upon dries up? Can Beveridge manipulate our numbers game to make them doubt what they are doing?

Wingers- I saw some posts re Brayshaw and while he is incredibly important to their structure he is going to do what he does. Wont get a heap of the ball and it is going to be hard to stop him playing that wing role regardless of who you play there. Langdon is the one that drives their transition but I think Hunter and B.Smith have both kept up with and beaten him before so we have options. It is kind of a decision between trying to exploit Brayshaw (makes errors under pressure) a bit or just being happy to have a nil all draw with two role players out there. I am happy with Hunter and Langdon if it goes that way.

Defensive Match Ups- Not as worried about them playing 3 talls as some. We have to take a risk to beat them and in most games we have been happy to have a high talls matched up by Dale, Williams, Duryea or Wood. Last week Dale played on Marshall for periods if he was high and Dale also played on Jackson in round 19 for periods in a high defender role. Not sure what we will do with Fritsch, Williams seemed to be on him a lot last time but I quite like him defending higher. The only time I am worried about them playing 3 talls is when Max is forward, in this instance I expect a genuine talls to go to him and we take a risk on McDonald which we have done before. Pickett needs bumpers every time he turns to run towards goal or he will destroy us, elbow in the chest every time he turns.

Youth- They are young, really young if you think about it. If we get off to a good start hopefully the occasion gets to them.

Naughton/English- To me they have both been playing within themselves when forward. Naughton is nearly back to where he was but those one on ones he is still not as strong as he was. If he dominates it changes everything for them, big questions for Melbourne if we go with Hannan as our CHF like last week but we have options to manipulate regardless of what they throw at us.

Our Transition With Ball- It will be a pressure game and they set up really well behind the ball when it is in their 50. Obviously we want to find a mark or a handball receive to get out but I don’t think we can afford to be afraid to kick it to grass or a contest. They will out number most times but we don’t want to give them easy turnover goals or free kicks by being hesitant with the ball. If we win those 50/50s there is space over the back and they get scored on.

This is an awesome analysis but has made me very nervous. They are a very good team doing a lot of things right.

[comrade]

This is an awesome analysis but has made me very nervous. They are a very good team doing a lot of things right.

Now we need mjp to come in and let us know we're going to smash them.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Now we need mjp to come in and let us know we're going to smash them.

So I’m not the only one refreshing the activity page waiting for that post?

[dog town]

They have plenty to worry about as well and Goodwin won't be sleeping that well. We defend transition as well as any team at the moment, our ground ball game is as strong as its been all year right now and we have weapons forward of the ball that will scare them.

[Ozza]

Yep... happy for Hunter to take Langdon on the other wing.

I thought when we beat Melbourne - Roarke and Langdon having a bit of a nil-all draw was a factor in us winning. I rate Langdon very highly so am keen for Roarke to try and quell his influence, and let Hunter be Hunter.

[bornadog]

I thought when we beat Melbourne - Roarke and Langdon having a bit of a nil-all draw was a factor in us winning. I rate Langdon very highly so am keen for Roarke to try and quell his influence, and let Hunter be Hunter.

Wasn't Hunter up against Brayshaw in that game?

[Rhys]

Probably doesn’t mean anything, but Angus Brayshaw trained away from the main group. Could be injured.

[Happy Days]

Oh no who’s going to stand on the wing doing nothing and make the game worse for his presence now?

[comrade]

Probably doesn’t mean anything, but Angus Brayshaw trained away from the main group. Could be injured.

Copped a corky earlier in the week.

[Rhys]

Copped a corky earlier in the week.

Should be fine for the grand final then, you would imagine.

[Dry Rot]

Bulldogs to devise plan to curb Gawn’s impact

https://www.smh.com.au/sport/afl/bulldogs-to-devise-plan-to-curb-gawn-s-impact-20210917-p58sml.html

Jon PierikSeptember 17, 2021 — 4.03pm

The Western Bulldogs will devise a battle plan to hinder Max Gawn’s run from stoppages in a bid to quell a man who could become only the second ruckman to claim the Norm Smith Medal.

The Bulldogs have taken note of Gawn’s stunning effort against Geelong in the preliminary final when the Melbourne captain and All-Australian ruckman stormed around Perth’s Optus Stadium and booted five goals in one of the great finals’ performances of recent times.

While dominant in the ruck with 33 hit-outs against the Cats, Gawn’s ability to run was clear, and he will test veteran Stef Martin in the showpiece event next Saturday. However, hardnut Tom Liberatore said he and his fellow Bulldog midfielders needed to ensure they set up well at stoppages to stymie Gawn’s impact when exiting.

“I think his (Martin’s) contest initially at the stoppage will set the tone for him. We all know Maxy is a good runner. That’s probably for us to negate as well, and high defenders,” Liberatore said on Friday.

“But you have got to make sure you stand … on his (Gawn’s) side, just make sure you can negate his influence at the stoppage. That should be able to quell his run away, just checking his run sort of thing, because he is, obviously, a pretty strong runner.”

Gawn was in excellent touch in the two matches between the clubs this year. In round 11, when the Demons claimed a 28-point win, he polled nine AFL Coaches Association votes after his 27 hit-outs, 21 disposals and a goal, when largely opposed by Jordon Sweet. In round 19, he did not poll an AFLCA vote despite having 18 disposals and a whopping 56 hit-outs, largely against Tim English, in the Bulldogs’ 20-point win.

Now comes the battle-hardened Martin, who had three years with Gawn at Melbourne, and knows how he plays.

“His (Martin’s) experience and knowledge around ruck contests and how to negate Max, I am sure they had a fair few battles … when they played together,” Liberatore said.

“He adds another layer of competition to the opposing ruckman. He makes it a lot more predictable for us to know where the ball is going.”

Essendon champion Simon Madden is the only ruckman to be voted Norm Smith medallist, having dominated Hawthorn in the 1985 grand final. He has urged Martin to not forget his own offensive game.

The Bulldogs had the day off on Friday but will have a solid training session on Saturday, where defender Alex Keath (hamstring) and Laitham Vandermeer (hamstring tightness) will look to push for selection.

Liberatore praised vice-captain and fellow father-son product Mitch Wallis for the manner in which he continued to conduct himself, despite Wallis having little hope of a recall.

Wallis has managed only six senior matches this season, none since round 17, and will be one of the hard-luck stories of grand final week, particularly as he missed the 2016 premiership because of a broken leg. He is likely to consider his options once the season is done.

“Most of the rest of the boys that aren’t playing, their training standards and how much care they have put into training, making sure the entirety of the group is at their best, that’s probably a key to how we have been going,” Liberatore said.

“Yesterday (Thursday) at training, Mitch was pushing blokes to do extras, those blokes are playing … his leadership has been extremely selfless.”

[Mofra]

Oh no who’s going to stand on the wing doing nothing and make the game worse for his presence now?
Brayshaw was the main reason they beat us in the first game.
His discipline to hold his line and cut off the switch has killed us and many teams this year. Underrated role.

[Happy Days]

Brayshaw was the main reason they beat us in the first game.
His discipline to hold his line and cut off the switch has killed us and many teams this year. Underrated role.

Maybe, but we paid it altogether too much respect. So what if Brayshaw is in the way of our switching? Take him on! He’s bad!

[Danjul]

Amazing input dog town. I agree that the transition/turnover game will be vital - in our first matchup this year their pressure and defensive setup lead to some terrible turnovers which gifted them early goals, and then the game was over.

We can never be set up the way we want for a bad turnover, so if we make silly mistakes and cough it up they become almost guaranteed looks at goal for Melbourne.

The turnovers were the worst I have ever seen. Melbourne did not generate a win,the dogs generated a loss.

Melbourne actually had few winners that day, only Oliver got over 25 possessions. But astonishingly bad kicking by the dogs meant 55 extra possessions did nothing to make inroads on the damage.

Could the backline (and Libba) hand the opposition so many gifted goals again? I doubt it. Actually itÂ’s impossible So I canÂ’t see the Demons winning.

[boydogs]

And Roarke to Brayshaw to stop him killing our switches.

How does an opponent stop him killing our switches? If Melbourne want to man up our defenders then it will be easier to go forward. When Melbourne beat us we kept trying to switch to avoid Gawn instead of short passing


- Gawn: He's the one who could take it away from us.

Martin will give us a contest in the ruck. Gawn as a marking target around the ground is more of a concern. Just need our other talls to compete with him


The only time I am worried about them playing 3 talls is when Max is forward, in this instance I expect a genuine talls to go to him and we take a risk on McDonald which we have done before

I wouldn't try and cheat by playing a small on McDonald. Very capable of contested marks and long straight kicks. Would rather play Cordy or Young

[dog town]

How does an opponent stop him killing our switches? If Melbourne want to man up our defenders then it will be easier to go forward. When Melbourne beat us we kept trying to switch to avoid Gawn instead of short passing



Martin will give us a contest in the ruck. Gawn as a marking target around the ground is more of a concern. Just need our other talls to compete with him



I wouldn't try and cheat by playing a small on McDonald. Very capable of contested marks and long straight kicks. Would rather play Cordy or Young We have done it all year, they wont play all 3 deep and the only way they will end up deep is if it is a slow play which gives us some protection. We need to win the game somewhere and having an extra runner might be that extra runner that gives us some relief from their defensive hold or allow us to keep it in our end.

Dale beat Marshall in several one on ones up the ground only last week. If you think back to the last time we played Melbourne we had Dale on Jackson and other mismatches, it is just about managing the risk of those match ups. We also have Wood who can play tall if required and Schache as a swing option. Playing an extra tall in the 22 just takes away too much for me.

[bulldogtragic]

So how do we see the emergencies?

If VDM & Cordy are dropped. (Which isn’t certain). Maybe Scott & Wallis. The latter deserves his name somewhere on the team sheet, if only as an emergency.

[Go_Dogs]

Getting really tough to pick the side with a healthy list.

JJ has done some great work the past 2 weeks and particularly against Port, plus has a Normie so hard to see him outside the 22.
VDM has also added pace and tenacity to our front half. While his set shot kicking hasn’t been great, his pressure and contribution has been important.

Really tough call perhaps for one of them to get Cody back into the side.

In the back half, it seems a Cordy out Keath in is logical, but like others does that leave us exposed against 3 talls in their forward line, particularly if Gawn spends more time forward like he did last week?

Going to be a bloody tough selection committee next week.

[comrade]

They have plenty to worry about as well and Goodwin won't be sleeping that well. We defend transition as well as any team at the moment, our ground ball game is as strong as its been all year right now and we have weapons forward of the ball that will scare them.

I'm struggling to see our clear path to victory or an area we can really get on top beyond just grinding them down for 4 quarters and converting our chances.

[Bulldog Joe]

We simply are forced to leave out 2 players who absolutely did enough last week to merit a spot.

While it is harsh on those it is just an imperative to include Weightman and Keath.

I have rewatched the PF twice and both Vandermeer and Cordy were strong contributors, but I come to the conclusion that they miss and Vandermeer as medi-sub forces Scott out.

[Mitcha]

Keath and the Flea back in are no brainers so that means from the 23 last week the unlucky outs are Cordy (good last week but I have trust issues) and Scott (stiff but probably aware he was only in due to Weightman's concussion the previous week).
Still leaves 23 with my medi sub being VDM with only other option but less preferred being JJ who stays in the starting 22.

[comrade]

Keath and the Flea back in are no brainers so that means from the 23 last week the unlucky outs are Cordy (good last week but I have trust issues) and Scott (stiff but probably aware he was only in due to Weightman's concussion the previous week).
Still leaves 23 with my medi sub being VDM with only other option but less preferred being JJ who stays in the starting 22.

JJ came on after half time against the Lions and had a big impact. Maybe we try and just hound and harass the Demons with VDM then look to activate JJ after half time and use his running power. I think the sub gets activated 100% this game, no matter what.

[Mitcha]

JJ came on after half time against the Lions and had a big impact. Maybe we try and just hound and harass the Demons with VDM then look to activate JJ after half time and use his running power. I think the sub gets activated 100% this game, no matter what.
Agreed, would be nice for us to activate the sub tactically rather than injury for a change.

[Grantysghost]

JJ came on after half time against the Lions and had a big impact. Maybe we try and just hound and harass the Demons with VDM then look to activate JJ after half time and use his running power. I think the sub gets activated 100% this game, no matter what.

I really like LVDM. Watching the first qtr back last week he was a major contributor.

I want him in the team.

JJ has been good too hate to be making that choice. I think Laith's pressure work gives him the nod for mine.

[Grantysghost]

Agreed, would be nice for us to activate the sub tactically rather than injury for a change.

I'm hoping concussion doesn't play a big part like with Vlaustin last season.
Considering in game there's zero long term match accountability for a perpetrator outside of a free kick in that moment, it's a real threat over your stars.
Imagine if Macrae cops a high hit early for eg.
I think there has to be some sort of card system implemented in the future to prevent something untoward in a GF.

[comrade]

I really like LVDM. Watching the first qtr back last week he was a major contributor.

I want him in the team.

JJ has been good too hate to be making that choice. I think Laith's pressure work gives him the nod for mine.

I loved his hit on Ladhams that led to Treloar's goal.

[dog town]

Wasn’t sure where to put this. It’s every clearance against Melbourne this year.


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=a0xEZL0Azqw

[boydogs]

I'm struggling to see our clear path to victory or an area we can really get on top beyond just grinding them down for 4 quarters and converting our chances.

Midfield depth is probably our biggest advantage which is a bit of a grind but we've been really good with scores from centre clearances since 6-6-6, especailly with Stef in the side. We can score really quickly like the 7 in the first quarter against Port, or our really dominant games against St Kilda & Gold Coast. You can never get on too much of a run against us or keep us out of the game given the strength of our mids unless our rucks are getting mauled

[Ozza]

Wasn't Hunter up against Brayshaw in that game?

Yes. And Roarke v Langdon.

[azabob]

Tom Morris reporting Gardner will be dropped for Keath.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Tom Morris reporting Gardner will be dropped for Keath.

Geez. I don't like it.

Gardner is better than Cordy in every way IMO.

[Happy Days]

Knew this thread existed but you can't expect me to look for it.

Astonishing call. Gardner is a perfect matchup for Brown and even aside from that what exactly does Cordy do better?

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Hope it's BS.

[The Pie Man]

Yikes, thought Ryan was very solid against Port. Outmarked Dixon at one point, did a fair bit right. Gee whiz

[bornadog]

Hope it's BS.

Exclusive: Bulldogs settle on brutal Grand Final selection call (https://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/teams/western-bulldogs/afl-news-2021-grand-final-teams-ryan-gardner-dropped-western-bulldogs-changes-luke-beveridge-dogs-vs-dees-tom-morris/news-story/a9bbd675b9df746510991a6343ed8643)

[Happy Days]

I'm pretty flat about this. Gardner worked really hard to make his way into the team and earned his spot. I really think this is a mistake whatever way you look at it.

Who will Cordy even play on? He's too slow for Fritsch, too small for Brown, and not strong enough for McDonald.

[MrMahatma]

How would this leak?

I call BS .

[josie]

How would this leak?

I call BS .

I hope so too - and if it is true do not like it was leaked either.

[The Pie Man]

How would this leak?

I call BS .

Ryan himself? (e.g to family)

Just guessing

Rough if true, he’s more suited to their tall forwards than Zaine is

[Mantis]

I was feeling super positive about our chances… this rumour doesn’t help with keeping up those positive vibes.

Can someone check on comrade?

[Happy Days]

This does feel like a personal attack on Comrade.

[The Pie Man]

Maybe Schache back?

[josie]

Maybe Schache back?

And Cordy forward? Doubt Bevo would make such a big call but who knows.

[Testekill]

Would much rather Gardner instead of Cordy, I thought that Cordy played very well last round but I just don't see who he plays on. He's not athletic enough to stay with Brown and he's not strong enough for McDonald. Then you add Jackson to the equation and I don't know what you'd do.

[comrade]

Cool.

[Grantysghost]

Wouldn’t be Bevo without something left field.

Keath and Gardner is my preferred 1st and 2nd defender, there’s got to be something funky going on here as I recall Fritsch did Cordy the first game at Marvel.

Wood may get him this time.

Keath Brown…so Cordy McDonald? Not sure he’s got the tank. Schache on TMac? I’ve got nfi Gardner just seems the best option.

[Grantysghost]

How would this leak?

I call BS .

I never trust their managers.

[comrade]

So Gardner has been the only key defender to play in every finals win and we leave him out in place of slower, smaller player? Genuinely feel crook.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

So Gardner has been the only key defender to play in every finals win and we leave him out in place of slower, smaller player? Genuinely feel crook.

It shifts my confidence in winning....

[comrade]

It shifts my confidence in winning....

And the fact we're leaking like a sieve a few days out from the GF. What the *!*!*!*! is that about?

[jeemak]

I think I might have said that there's no way Cordy and Wood don't get picked in one of our best 22 threads, so it's pretty much my fault.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Can’t be serious. We cannot play Cordy over Gardner. Madness. Gotta be fake.

[Testekill]

So I don't get the people that say that Cordy plays with mongrel, he hasn't had for years and he otherwise is just undisciplined. I could take the lack of mongrel if he had decent defensive positioning but he doesn't have that either.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Maybe a red herring? Great the nerves have gone into overdrive now awaiting team selection.

[angelopetraglia]

Gardner. Wow. Didn’t see that coming.

[angelopetraglia]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E_4wDZUVkAIBI5I?format=jpg&name=large

[MrMahatma]

Gardiner’s disposal is massively sketchy and so maybe they’re going with Cordy’s overall package being better cause he’ll turn it over less?

I’m just trying to work out why. I’d have to watch the prelim again and focus, but was Cordy the better of the two?

[Mantis]

I thought I would make it through to Saturday afternoon before the need time be violently ill, but it’s come on early… bring on the good times.

[josie]

If fox footy are correct then Pieman might be on the money regarding Schache to backline.

Schache back, Cordy forward. Or if Cordy plays in backline and looks like it’s not working he can go forward. Maybe it’s Cordy’s flexibility that gives him the nod? Having just watched all 4 x 2016 finals Cordy’s competitiveness at ground level is good and Cordy has mongrel in him that’s for sure.

Who plays on whom in backline? We have to counter Fritsch, Brown, McDonald and possibly one of Jackson or Gawn. One of our medium defenders like Duryea or Woody will probably get Fritsch.

[comrade]

Gardiner’s disposal is massively sketchy and so maybe they’re going with Cordy’s overall package being better cause he’ll turn it over less?

I’m just trying to work out why. I’d have to watch the prelim again and focus, but was Cordy the better of the two?

Cordy was good in the prelim and all I can think is that they're concerned about Gardner's ability to cope with the pressure on the biggest stage.

I'm more concerned that it has leaked early. Shit like that has the potential to be disruptive.

[Testekill]

If fox footy are correct then Pieman might be on the money regarding Schache to backline.

Schache back, Cordy forward. Or if Cordy plays in backline and looks like it’s not working he can go forward. Maybe it’s Cordy’s flexibility that gives him the nod? Having just watched all 4 x 2016 finals Cordy’s competitiveness at ground level is good and Cordy has mongrel in him that’s for sure.

Who plays on whom in backline? We have to counter Fritsch, Ben Brown, Mitch Brown and possibly one of Jackson or Gawn. One of our medium defenders like Duryea or Woody will probably get Fritsch.

Williams on Fritsch, Duryea on Cameron. Raffle off the other roles, Wood might end up getting the task of the resting ruck.

[Mofra]

I too would have had Garnder in ahead of Cordy.
I can't imagine how shattered he is if this is true

[Rhys]

I think it’s simply a case of us trusting Cordy’s experience in the biggest game of the year. Melbourne rank 17th for accurate kicks inside 50, and Cordy is better on the deck than Gardner is. If chaos ball ensues in the Dees forward 50, we may value Cordy’s ground ball game more. Bevo may also have a specific matchup or tactic in mind (Cordy as a defensive forward on Lever, Schache back). Not the selection I would have made, just playing devil’s advocate.

Surely at this stage of the season, after all of Bevo’s moves that we have questioned time and time again (Dale in defence, playing Schache at all after the Tigers game, playing Hannan when he was poop) you just have to trust him.

As alluded to above, the reason this got out (Most likely) is Gardner telling family. Might not have been leaked by anyone at the club.

Get on the Cordy for first goal scorer train, it’s on its way to premiership station!

[Mantis]

If fox footy are correct then Pieman might be on the money regarding Schache to backline.

Schache back, Cordy forward. Or if Cordy plays in backline and looks like it’s not working he can go forward. Maybe it’s Cordy’s flexibility that gives him the nod? Having just watched all 4 x 2016 finals Cordy’s competitiveness at ground level is good and Cordy has mongrel in him that’s for sure.

Who plays on whom in backline? We have to counter Fritsch, Ben Brown, Mitch Brown and possibly one of Jackson or Gawn. One of our medium defenders like Duryea or Woody will probably get Fritsch.

I don’t get the fascination with Cordy going forward. He isn’t good in that role. And whilst he was competitive at ground level in 2016, he doesn’t have the same agility now as he did then.

And I think the player you were searching for is Tom McDonald.

[comrade]

If Gardy has told family and they’ve gone straight to the media, that’s utterly ridiculous.

[Testekill]

Something that I am wondering is who gets the defensive forward role; we'll try and do what we did last time where Naughton tried to get himself on Lever as much as possible while Hannan was blocking May but who gets it from there? Schache and Hannan could both get the gig but English would be the best out of the three at getting it to the ground but would he be better suited taking Petty?

[josie]

Toot Toot insane Zaine Train here we go….

[josie]

I don’t get the fascination with Cordy going forward. He isn’t good in that role. And whilst he was competitive at ground level in 2016, he doesn’t have the same agility now as he did then.

And I think the player you were searching for is Tom McDonald.

You’re right - made correction regarding McDonald.

[Mantis]

I think it’s simply a case of us trusting Cordy’s experience in the biggest game of the year. Melbourne rank 17th for accurate kicks inside 50, and Cordy is better on the deck than Gardner is. If chaos ball ensues in the Dees forward 50, we may value Cordy’s ground ball game more. Bevo may also have a specific matchup or tactic in mind (Cordy as a defensive forward on Lever, Schache back). Not the selection I would have made, just playing devil’s advocate.

Surely at this stage of the season, after all of Bevo’s moves that we have questioned time and time again (Dale in defence, playing Schache at all after the Tigers game, playing Hannan when he was poop) you just have to trust him.

As alluded to above, the reason this got out (Most likely) is Gardner telling family. Might not have been leaked by anyone at the club.

Get on the Cordy for first goal scorer train, it’s on its way to premiership station!

After reading this the need to vomit hasn’t been lessened.

Time to go set up the rocking chair and put the straight jacket on.

[Rocco Jones]

To add to the Zaine not forward argument, Schache is coming off a great job v Aliir.

[Happy Days]

Okay now that I’ve stopped crying I’m ready to admit that, although this is the objectively wrong decision, if it costs us the game then we frankly don’t deserve it.

[azabob]

Okay now that I’ve stopped crying I’m ready to admit that, although this is the objectively wrong decision, if it costs us the game then we frankly don’t deserve it.

It only took you one hour to come off the ledge!

Beveridge press conference tomorrow will be interesting.

[Mantis]

Okay now that I’ve stopped crying I’m ready to admit that, although this is the objectively wrong decision, if it costs us the game then we frankly don’t deserve it.

Yep, if we play well enough it shouldn’t matter and we should be able to hide Zaine away, but the ability for me to tolerate Zaine being caught out of position at a crucial time and costing us a goal isn’t all that high.

[bulldogtragic]

I don’t understand. I hope by about 11.15pm Saturday I’m educated in the decision.

It leaking is embarrassing though. Has to be linked to Gardner. I’m assuming Weightman was told he’s not playing, or a second player is being dropped. But that players name isn’t named…

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Yep, if we play well enough it shouldn’t matter and we should be able to hide Zaine away, but the ability for me to tolerate Zaine being caught out of position at a crucial time and costing us a goal isn’t all that high.

The first time he gets led to the ball, i fear for my TV.

[bulldogtragic]

Also who is his match up? He doesn’t have an obvious one. I’m keenly paying attention to Bevo’s explanation tomorrow.

[The Pie Man]

I doubt I’m right cos it’s me, but we went with Josh as part of a back 3 at the G against them last time.

If Ryan’s out, I wouldn’t rule out Naughton & English as the lone tall forwards.

[josie]

To add to the Zaine not forward argument, Schache is coming off a great job v Aliir.

I think it’s the flexibility to swap Schache and Cordy that Gardner does not offer, plus the competitiveness and finals experience of Zaine. We all know how competitive Cordy was in 2016 albeit as a makeshift forward. If my memory serves me correct he was one of the few who could hold his head high in our elimination final loss to GWS a few years ago as a defender. Cannot recall how well he played vs Saints in elimination final last year as a defender.

[bulldogtragic]

Schache back. Jamarra replacing him up forward. If we’re going to commit, then let’s really commit.

[MrMahatma]

I doubt I’m right cos it’s me, but we went with Josh as part of a back 3 at the G against them last time.

If Ryan’s out, I wouldn’t rule out Naughton & English as the lone tall forwards.

I reckon that’d be nuts. Schache had a great match up fwd last week. And he played back vs the Dees cause Keath and Gardner were both injured.

[bulldogtragic]

I think it’s the flexibility to swap Schache and Cordy that Gardner does not offer, plus the competitiveness and finals experience of Zaine. We all know how competitive Cordy was in 2016 albeit as a makeshift forward. If my memory serves me correct he was one of the few who could hold his head high in our elimination final loss to GWS a few years ago as a defender. Cannot recall how well he played vs Saints in elimination final last year as a defender.

When was the last time Cordy played well forward? Did he do it last year or something?

[Axe Man]

I would be more surprised if Schache was in the backline than I was when it seemed the building I was in this morning was about to collapse.

And even more so if Cordy was forward.

[The Pie Man]

I reckon that’d be nuts. Schache had a great match up fwd last week. And he played back vs the Dees cause Keath and Gardner were both injured.

True

…except he started back before Keath pinged his hammy that night

[josie]

I doubt I’m right cos it’s me, but we went with Josh as part of a back 3 at the G against them last time.

If Ryan’s out, I wouldn’t rule out Naughton & English as the lone tall forwards.

To back your thoughts up….Schache has a good tank - maybe he floats around ground to counter Jackson & Gawn’s aerial threat and can also play forward and back to help out. Bont’s been great helping in backline during the 3 finals thus far too.

[bulldogtragic]

Maybe we don’t rate Brown or Jackson who will have significant reach over Cordy. Or speed. Or positioning. If only we had Gardner available.

[Sedat]

We're not winning or losing based on Cordy or Gardner. The game will be won and lost in the middle.

I really feel for Gardner. It would be a bitter pill to swallow. He's improved incrementally every season he has been with us, and that's all you can do.

[The Pie Man]

If we win we’re winning this in the middle with intensity around the ground

[josie]

When was the last time Cordy played well forward? Did he do it last year or something?

He hasn’t needed to. But I think he might be still capable of playing a role forward at times if needed. Finals are a different beast. I’m as bemused by this selection as other woofers - trying to put my Bevo genius hat on!! Having watched replay of PF Cordy was very good and his pressure and possibly his agility was at 2016 levels.

[bulldogtragic]

Cordy has kicked 2 goals in 5 years. Not even Bevo is that crazy to pull a move like that (forward).

[jeemak]

No tricks.

The MC just likes Cordy, Wood, Keath, Dale, Duryea and Williams as their core back six in this game.

I'm not sure if I do as well, but I'm not sure if I don't.

[Sedat]

I'm more concerned that it has leaked early. Shit like that has the potential to be disruptive.
Maybe the news has been released early with both Gardy's and the club's blessing. Take away from any distraction closer to game time.

[bornadog]

There are going to be heartbreaks and probably one more to come if Cody is selected (or not).

[jeemak]

There are going to be heartbreaks and probably one more to come if Cody is selected (or not).

I heard it reported last week that Cody was already told he'd be playing.

[bornadog]

I heard it reported last week that Cody was already told he'd be playing.

Then who comes out and who is medical sub? JJ, VDM or a surprise?

[kruder]

Id choose JJ over VDM for sure, VDM still struggles to run out a game he is the perfect sub IMO.

JJ played his best game for the year last week, is a norm smith medalists and I wouldn't be surprised to see he and Bailey Dale swap in the second half if we are behind and chasing the game.

Cordy for Gardy is interesting, one things for sure Bevo has gotten it right most weeks with selection this year. Just a reminder to all we did beat Port by more then 70 points with Cordy and Gardy playing key defensive posts, who would of thought? Lets be honest Keath is the key here along with the collective back 6-7.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

I mean given the point where we’re at, it’s hard to dispute Bevo and the MC. So I’ll back it. I don’t agree with it. But I have to back it as they got us to a grand final.

There’s got to be a matchup advantage they see somewhere as they didn’t drop Gardner for Cordy for the lions game.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

You’d think Keath goes to McDonald. So who’s going to Brown? I’ve thought for nearly two weeks that Gardner was the perfect matchup for him. Cordy is too short.

[jazzadogs]

I don't see Tom McDonald as a huge threat atm. Has only kicked 4 goals in his past 6 games, ~3 marks per game. 194cm 99kg - Zaine is 190cm and 90kg (at start of the year).

Stef v Gawn
Schache 2nd ruck, possibly following Jackson to the backline when he plays as a forward?
Keath on Brown (put body on and block his run, the big unco won't get near it), Cordy on Mcdonald
Duryea on Pickett, Williams on Fritsch. Wood to float and help out Keath/Cordy.
English and Naughton permanent key forwards
Hannan defensive fwd on Lever.
JJ/VDM defensive fwd on Salem.


How about that?

[westdog54]

You’d think Keath goes to McDonald. So who’s going to Brown? I’ve thought for nearly two weeks that Gardner was the perfect matchup for him. Cordy is too short.

Brown is the same height as Dixon and 7kgs lighter and Cordy had Dixon well covered.

He's no Dale Morris but he can punch above his weight.

Gardner's decision making, or lack thereof, will get found out in a GF.

That being said, it's a shit situation and I feel for everyone concerned.

[FrediKanoute]

I too would have had Garnder in ahead of Cordy.
I can't imagine how shattered he is if this is true

And Cordy wouldn't be shattered. There are no easy answers in this one. Team comes first

[jeemak]

Then who comes out and who is medical sub? JJ, VDM or a surprise?

I've got no idea BAD. You tell me!

Whilst you're going away and finding out that answer, here's how I'd go until you do:

FB - Williams, Cordy, Wood
HB - Dale, Keath, Duryea
C - R. Smith, Macrae, Hunter
HF - B Smith, English, Johansens*
FF - Weightman, Naughton, Hannan
Foll - Martin, Bontempelli, Liberatore
Int - Daniel, Treloar, Dunkley, Schache
Sub - Vandermeer

*In respect to the smartest and most successful knuckle dragger in the media, Gerard Healy

Firstly, that is possibly the sickest (channeling Happy Days here) team we have put on the park for a while. My heart breaks for Gardner, like it does for a lot of others who have missed out but with a few fluctuations with form and injury they could've been playing.

The shitting on Cordy isn't something I've ever really understood. He's relatively safe with the ball, he's always in the contest unless trapped in front and he can lay a decent tackle. It's as if we expect our backs to just not let good forwards get on top for parts of a game and that's unrealistic - especially if the system upfield breaks down which ours can do from time to time (like any good team's can). Good forwards beat good defenders all the time, it's going to happen to ours as well but as long as the group up the ground do what they should do to minimise the exposure then things should work out OK.

Gardner's dropping is disappointing and in honesty I'd have him in ahead of Cordy. But at the same time he slows us down when he gets the footy more than Cordy does and while the latter makes an occasional mistake with ball in hand he doesn't make us completely stagnant, and unfortunately Gardner does. I really feel for the bloke, I know what it's like to miss grand finals when you have a more than decent claim on being in the team and Saturday is going to rip him apart.

The forward mix I've selected versus those on the bench is just me thinking that the former gives us the best chance to get on the board early in the game, and then after seven to ten minutes start to rotate out and really hit Melbourne with our midfield depth as they get a bit tired. Schache is the everywhere man but I expect him to go forward to sit on Lever or May depending on who is in better form (there's no way May's hamstring is OK - trust this from someone who did five back related hamstrings in a single season), but it shouldn't happen until the game is settled a little bit.

It's going to be hot early and we need our midfield contingent and rolling up half forwards to blow valves early. They have back up in Treloar and Dunkley on the bench. There is a chance we'll be tightened up on and will struggle to score early, which means that things might need to be changed up early in the game getting these boys an early run.

Daniel is a massive wild card. He is agnostic to positions on the ground, he transcends common sense on a footy field because of how he finds it (which is an element of his game too often ignored and dreadfully underrated) and how he uses it. So I want us to just wait and see where and how he can be used best.

The medical sub in Vandermeer is the best choice. He can play forward from centre and we have a couple of players who can roll back to cover him if we lose a defender.

[boydogs]

Any chance this is a fake leak from the club to put Melbourne off?

[ratsmac]

Tom Morris is a massive Demons fan. Maybe he's trying to cause some disruption in our preparation. I find it hard to believe that we could leak any team selection in grand final week. Bevo is still dirty on Michael Talia for leaking information in a final. It would be a brave man to leak any selection news in a grand final under Bevo's watch

[dog town]

The Gardner news aligns with information I got earlier in the week about likely changes. I think it’s a mistake, dees crumbers have an uncanny ability to hit the ball at pace from spoils, Gardner is our best spoiler and puts angle on them. He never lets it get behind the pack and also has the reach and closing speed to play on multiple sizes/shapes in that team.

I think this takes away some flexibility, I can only assume they have a very specific group of match ups in mind. It could just be that they see the job Cordy did last week as too good to be dropped. He definitely can’t play on Brown in my view.

[Go_Dogs]

Got to say will be surprised if Gardner isn’t named.

I’m not sure on the best match ups but would have thought Keath on McDonald and Gardner a better match up for Briwn who will do most of his work on the lead. Presumably we will role the dice and go short in the backline or push Schache onto Jackson again to follow him wherever he goes.

Starting to feel the nerves now.

[comrade]

Slept on it and like others have said, Cordy or Gardner's performance isn't our path to victory and both have significant weaknesses. Cordy's prelim was rock solid so if he can bring that, we'll be ok. I am concerned about our lack of overall height in defence though.

Keath will get the deepest forward which will obviously change throughout the game but I expect he'll get Brown for a lot of the game. That leaves Cordy on McDonald which I don't really think is ideal and that's without considering Gawn or Jackson.

I think that means we'll see Schache in defence at times and try to force the same type of match ups up forward as we did in rd 19 (Naughton to Lever, Hannan to May). Having Stef to take 80-100 minutes of ruck time helps immensely as it allows English to stay forward and stretch them.

[Mantis]

I've got no idea BAD. You tell me!

Whilst you're going away and finding out that answer, here's how I'd go until you do:

FB - Williams, Cordy, Wood
HB - Dale, Keath, Duryea
C - R. Smith, Macrae, Hunter
HF - B Smith, English, Johansens*
FF - Weightman, Naughton, Hannan
Foll - Martin, Bontempelli, Liberatore
Int - Daniel, Treloar, Dunkley, Schache
Sub - Vandermeer

*In respect to the smartest and most successful knuckle dragger in the media, Gerard Healy

Firstly, that is possibly the sickest (channeling Happy Days here) team we have put on the park for a while. My heart breaks for Gardner, like it does for a lot of others who have missed out but with a few fluctuations with form and injury they could've been playing.

The shitting on Cordy isn't something I've ever really understood. He's relatively safe with the ball, he's always in the contest unless trapped in front and he can lay a decent tackle. It's as if we expect our backs to just not let good forwards get on top for parts of a game and that's unrealistic - especially if the system upfield breaks down which ours can do from time to time (like any good team's can). Good forwards beat good defenders all the time, it's going to happen to ours as well but as long as the group up the ground do what they should do to minimise the exposure then things should work out OK.

Gardner's dropping is disappointing and in honesty I'd have him in ahead of Cordy. But at the same time he slows us down when he gets the footy more than Cordy does and while the latter makes an occasional mistake with ball in hand he doesn't make us completely stagnant, and unfortunately Gardner does. I really feel for the bloke, I know what it's like to miss grand finals when you have a more than decent claim on being in the team and Saturday is going to rip him apart.

The forward mix I've selected versus those on the bench is just me thinking that the former gives us the best chance to get on the board early in the game, and then after seven to ten minutes start to rotate out and really hit Melbourne with our midfield depth as they get a bit tired. Schache is the everywhere man but I expect him to go forward to sit on Lever or May depending on who is in better form (there's no way May's hamstring is OK - trust this from someone who did five back related hamstrings in a single season), but it shouldn't happen until the game is settled a little bit.

It's going to be hot early and we need our midfield contingent and rolling up half forwards to blow valves early. They have back up in Treloar and Dunkley on the bench. There is a chance we'll be tightened up on and will struggle to score early, which means that things might need to be changed up early in the game getting these boys an early run.

Daniel is a massive wild card. He is agnostic to positions on the ground, he transcends common sense on a footy field because of how he finds it (which is an element of his game too often ignored and dreadfully underrated) and how he uses it. So I want us to just wait and see where and how he can be used best.

The medical sub in Vandermeer is the best choice. He can play forward from centre and we have a couple of players who can roll back to cover him if we lose a defender.

Lots of good content here jee and I feel we are well covered for lots of situations that the game will throw at us. I really think we will back our core midfield group (Macrae, Bont & Libba) to go H2H at most times with Melb, but as soon as one of Oliver or Trac get off the chain then Dunks goes to them in a more defensive role than he would normally play. Was interested to notice that Scott when activated as the sub chased Clarry around a fair bit after he had 15 (largely ineffective) touches in the 1st qtr which lessened his impact.... and lots talk about Clarry's haphazard forward entries, but Melb play a ''messy'' game so they just want territory rather than precision.

I can only talk on me, but the thing that irritates me the most with Cordy as highlighted, is his positioning in transition when he gives up too much room behind and due to his physical limitations he can't make ground to spoil (think the mark Ladhams took in Rd 23 in the 3rd qtr). I also think his first 5 steps are awfully slow and he gets dropped on the lead way too easily.... but the MC have more faith in him than others so I guess we hope he doesn't get exposed.

[Mofra]

Well that's one change.
Who goes out for Weightman?
VDM to the medi-sub, Scott back to a regular emergency?

[bulldogtragic]

Well that's one change.
Who goes out for Weightman?
VDM to the medi-sub, Scott back to a regular emergency?

Surely paying $1.01

[bornadog]

I don't see Tom McDonald as a huge threat atm. Has only kicked 4 goals in his past 6 games, ~3 marks per game. 194cm 99kg - Zaine is 190cm and 90kg (at start of the year).


Zaine is 195cm ;) and 92kg see here (https://www.westernbulldogs.com.au/players/1084/zaine-cordy)


I've got no idea BAD. You tell me!

Whilst you're going away and finding out that answer, here's how I'd go until you do:

FB - Williams, Cordy, Wood
HB - Dale, Keath, Duryea
C - R. Smith, Macrae, Hunter
HF - B Smith, English, Johansens*
FF - Weightman, Naughton, Hannan
Foll - Martin, Bontempelli, Liberatore
Int - Daniel, Treloar, Dunkley, Schache
Sub - Vandermeer

*In respect to the smartest and most successful knuckle dragger in the media, Gerard Healy

The medical sub in Vandermeer is the best choice. He can play forward from centre and we have a couple of players who can roll back to cover him if we lose a defender.

I would go with JJ in and VDM medical sub. Need JJ's experience.

[Mantis]

Zaine is 195cm ;) and 92kg see here (https://www.westernbulldogs.com.au/players/1084/zaine-cordy)



I know we don't want to go down this path as it's been done to death, but do we trust the WB website to be correct (think Lewis Young) given Zaine is listed at 193, and seems about that size, on other websites?

[bornadog]

I know we don't want to go down this path as it's been done to death, but do we trust the WB website to be correct (think Lewis Young) given Zaine is listed at 193, and seems about that size, on other websites?

Listed on the club website at 195cm

[Axe Man]

I know we don't want to go down this path as it's been done to death, but do we trust the WB website to be correct (think Lewis Young) given Zaine is listed at 193, and seems about that size, on other websites?

Agree that 193cm feels about right for Zaine, he's definitely taller than 190cm.

[Axe Man]

Listed on the club website at 195cm

Brent Harvey's listed height was exaggerated for years, official heights aren't always correct for whatever reason.

[Bulldog4life]

Would much rather Gardner instead of Cordy, I thought that Cordy played very well last round but I just don't see who he plays on. He's not athletic enough to stay with Brown and he's not strong enough for McDonald. Then you add Jackson to the equation and I don't know what you'd do.

We need Cordy's knee.

[Mantis]

Listed on the club website at 195cm

I get that, but he's listed at 193cm on other websites (including footywire) as I suggested.

My example of Lewis being listed at 201cm on club websites as opposed to 197cm on footywire is smelly.

[bornadog]

I get that, but he's listed at 193cm on other websites (including footywire) as I suggested.

My example of Lewis being listed at 201cm on club websites as opposed to 197cm on footywire is smelly.

Footywire is not accurate. They list the heights of the players when they first start playing.

Anyway not a big deal, 2cm is nothing

[SquirrelGrip]

We need Cordy's knee.

Yes, who will his knee play on this time?

[The Bulldogs Bite]

I can only talk on me, but the thing that irritates me the most with Cordy as highlighted, is his positioning in transition when he gives up too much room behind and due to his physical limitations he can't make ground to spoil (think the mark Ladhams took in Rd 23 in the 3rd qtr). I also think his first 5 steps are awfully slow and he gets dropped on the lead way too easily.... but the MC have more faith in him than others so I guess we hope he doesn't get exposed.

Agreed.

I'm a broken record but I just don't see what Cordy brings beyond appetite for contest. I'll agree he's OK at scrapping for the ball on the ground, but he often gets beaten on the lead (his acceleration is awful) or beaten 1-v-1. He played really well against Port but one game doesn't cover the glaring weaknesses in his game.

I think what hurts Cordy is he doesn't appear to have a long reach either, whereas Gardner does and it enables the latter to often get a fist to the ball.

Gardy isn't good with ball in hand and is susceptible to errors, but I just can't believe we're going to drop him. He's been very reliable and his ability to play 100% game time, play on different types and use his athletic ability to our advantage is important.

I've slept on it and the more I think about this, the more I think it's a really bad selection.

[Bulldog4life]

Yes, who will his knee play on this time?

The question is who will his knee knock into oblivion.....just like Wardy.

[bulldogtragic]

Anyway not a big deal, 2cm is nothing

Speak for yourself. I bought a Swedish pump on the promise of getting an extra 2cm. It’s not nothing.

[bornadog]

Speak for yourself. I bought a Swedish pump on the promise of getting an extra 2cm. It’s not nothing.

Of course depends on what you are measuring.

[Mofra]

Of course depends on what you are measuring.
Or from where you start measuring

[bornadog]

Or from where you start measuring

Maybe they used with boots on

[azabob]

I know we don't want to go down this path as it's been done to death, but do we trust the WB website to be correct (think Lewis Young) given Zaine is listed at 193, and seems about that size, on other websites?

Because it is fun, so much fun.

I believe this responsibility should fall to Axeman and have players height and weight on the Contract Status Thread (assuming one exists).

[Axe Man]

Because it is fun, so much fun.

I believe this responsibility should fall to Axeman and have players height and weight on the Contract Status Thread (assuming one exists).

Unfortunately I lost my job at the carnival guessing peoples heights and weights when one particularly rotund lady took offence to my estimate...

[chef]

I think I prefer Cordy over Gardiner myself. Zaino was pretty good against Port and I trust him more not to crack under the pressure of a GF. And TBH this isn't going to effect our chances imo.

[The bulldog tragician]

I expected Gardner to play and Cordy to be dropped, but I’m still puzzled that it’s seen as a dramatic selection shock and so much focus on Gardner being shattered.

Cordy’s credentials are just as strong, he was a key player in a defence which saw us top 2 while Gardner was injured and unavailable for long stretches, he did a solid job last week when he shouldered a load in the team defence which rendered Dixon a non-factor, he is much more experienced than Gardner. Not saying Gardner should have been picked before him, but it would have been line ball and Cordy omitted would also be a hard luck story.

Gardner has surprised us all with his improvement but he was also gifted many chances when he wasn’t ready. Of course he’d be desperately disappointed that he’s not playing and I feel for him but this is hardly a sheedy dropping Kickett story.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Everyone just hanging out for team selection? Gone quiet for a grand final week!

[comrade]

Everyone just hanging out for team selection? Gone quiet for a grand final week!

Can't believe we still have 2 days to get through until the first bounce.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Can't believe we still have 2 days to get through until the first bounce.

It’s more agonising than I thought it would be. After the final siren against port I thought this 2 weeks will be awesome knowing we’re playing in the grand final. But it’s just been agonising as i want to win this more than anything.

[Grantysghost]

Stupid idea to have a week off prior to GF. It's lost all momentum.

[comrade]

Stupid idea to have a week off prior to GF. It's lost all momentum.

AFL stuffed themselves royally by not just having all finals from week 2 onwards held in WA or SA. The extra week was required for any quarantine requirements which wouldn't have been needed if they'd done that.

[Grantysghost]

AFL stuffed themselves royally by not just having all finals from week 2 onwards held in WA or SA. The extra week was required for any quarantine requirements which wouldn't have been needed if they'd done that.

Preach mate - exactly right.

I get the first week maybe to protect the surface from overload, but if Melbourne think they're winning a normal flag when we have travelled more than any team ever and have been only one of two teams in the eight to play against a home crowd (only team to have done it twice) they are having a laugh (are you having a laugh?).

I reckon what we've accomplished already trumps anything else possible. Those twats carrying on like they're all conquering will be vomit worthy.

They played a team that cheated their way into the top 4 on the back of our fail, and a bunch of geriatrics with gastro.

Unfortunately history wont see it that way.

[azabob]

Can't believe we still have 2 days to get through until the first bounce.

And at the time of your post 2 days and 1 hour, 43 minutes.

We need a countdown clock on the woof home page.

[EasternWest]

Unfortunately I lost my job at the carnival guessing peoples heights and weights when one particularly rotund lady took offence to my estimate...

I was more annoyed that you called me "ma'am".

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Gardner and VDM out.

[azabob]

Gardner and VDM out.

I would like but I don't want to.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

No mention of sub yet

[Axe Man]

No mention of sub yet

There's never any mention of the sub until I think 1 hour before game time.

[comrade]

Those 2 guys are extremely unlucky. Feel for them.

[azabob]

2021 Toyota AFL Grand Final

Melbourne v Western Bulldogs
Saturday 25 September, 5.15pm AWST (7.15pm AEST)
Optus Stadium, WA

B: Easton Wood, Alex Keath, Bailey Williams
HB: Caleb Daniel, Zaine Cordy, Bailey Dale
C: Bailey Smith, Tom Liberatore, Lachie Hunter
HF: Cody Weightman, Aaron Naughton, Adam Treloar
F: Josh Schache, Tim English, Mitch Hannan
R: Stefan Martin, Jack Macrae, Marcus Bontempelli

Int: Jason Johannisen, Josh Dunkley, Taylor Duryea, Roarke Smith

Emg: Laitham Vandermeer, Ed Richards, Anthony Scott, Ryan Gardner

[DOG GOD]

No mention of sub yet

Vanders sub ??

[bornadog]

Many hard luck stories, but happy team is good enough to win premiership

[SquirrelGrip]

Scott is sub

[The Pie Man]

Vanders sub ??

You’d think so, though it can make sense to make the sub versatile, like JJ or Scott.

I know VDM played HBF for Footscray in his first year, but I associate him purely as a forward these days.

All the same, would be surprised if he’s not in the 23

[bulldogsthru&thru]

JJ knocked VDM out with his superb performance against Port. We’re gonna need him to have that same effort on Saturday.

[Grantysghost]

2021 Toyota AFL Grand Final

Melbourne v Western Bulldogs
Saturday 25 September, 5.15pm AWST (7.15pm AEST)
Optus Stadium, WA

B: Easton Wood, Alex Keath, Bailey Williams
HB: Caleb Daniel, Zaine Cordy, Bailey Dale
C: Bailey Smith, Tom Liberatore, Lachie Hunter
HF: Cody Weightman, Aaron Naughton, Adam Treloar
F: Josh Schache, Tim English, Mitch Hannan
R: Stefan Martin, Jack Macrae, Marcus Bontempelli

Int: Jason Johannisen, Josh Dunkley, Taylor Duryea, Roarke Smith

Emg: Laitham Vandermeer, Ed Richards, Anthony Scott, Ryan Gardner

Ergh, I would've played Laith, but JJ has some decent GF pedigree!

[josie]

I like Laith and feel sad for him and Gardner. Gut wrenching decisions. One consideration for me is he thus far has been a poor kick for goal. With VDM hamstring history do you think he would be a good sub or do you think MC will go with Scott who is a plug holes, versatile type?

[Doc26]

Vanders sub ??


You’d think so, though it can make sense to make the sub versatile, like JJ or Scott.

I know VDM played HBF for Footscray in his first year, but I associate him purely as a forward these days.

All the same, would be surprised if he’s not in the 23

Although if Keath goes down early we’d be somewhat exposed down back, and have to push Shache back which may open up May / Lever.

[JohnGentStand]

INS - Keith , Weightman

Outs - Gardner , Scott

Sub - JJ (most versatile option)
I agree he was awesome last week.
If any doubt on VDM, I wouldnt play or sub him. Maybe JJ in & ED can sub ��*!♂️