AFL player tests positive for drugs

[jazzadogs]

I don't have a Herald Sun subscription but an AFL player for a finals team has tested positive for a banned substance, suspected cocaine. Mark Robinson has an article on it.

First positive from us not making finals - it can't be one of our players!

[Axe Man]

AFL drug bombshell: Player from Melbourne-based finals team returns positive test (https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/afl-drug-bombshell-player-from-melbournebased-finals-team-returns-positive-test/news-story/37c4ce9507ea1330287dd72011cb2a59)

A player from a Melbourne-based finals team has tested positive to drugs late in the home and away season.

A urine sample taken from the player after a game in the weeks leading up to the AFL finals returned positive for a banned substance, believed to be cocaine.

It’s understood the player took the drug just days out from a home and away match.

He was tested after the game by Sports Integrity Australia officials as part of regulation in-competition testing for performance enhancing drugs.

The result of the test wasn’t known until after the finals series.

A source close to the issue said the player was from a Melbourne club involved in the finals, which means he would play for either the Demons, Collingwood, Carlton or St Kilda.

The results of player’s A sample has only been known for a couple of days.

It’s believed Sports Integrity Australia has informed the player he has returned a positive test.

The AFL complies with WADA’s anti-doping code, which is governed in Australia by SIA, and cocaine is listed on the WADA in-competition prohibited list of stimulants.

The AFL on Thursday confirmed the positive test.

“The AFL is working with the player on this matter,” a spokesperson said.

The penalty for an “in competition” positive test is up to four years’ suspension, although there are provisions for a lesser penalty in some situations.

While a four-year suspension is possible, under the AFL’s anti-doping code, if the player can prove the violation was not intentional or there are other circumstances, the penalty could be reduced to as little as a month.

The code was updated on January 1, 2021, whereby “an athlete who has tested positive to a Substance of Abuse’ in-competition (which includes cocaine), the sanction is only three months if the athlete can prove the substance was used out of competition and was unrelated to sporting performance’’.

AFL rules dictate that the “in-competition” period starts at “11:59pm on the day before a competition in which the athlete is scheduled to participate through the end of such competition and the sample collection process’’.

Also, a suspension could be reduced to one month if the ‘’athlete completes a Substance of Abuse treatment program approved by AFL’’.

In 2019, Collingwood’s Sam Murray argued that he had inadvertently ingested a tiny amount of cocaine before he was given an 18-month suspension.

In 2020, former Gold Coast ruckman Brayden Crossley accepted a 12-month suspension for an unintentional anti-doping violation.

In 2015, then Collingwood players Lachie Keeffe and Josh Thomas accepted two-year bans for testing positive to the drug clenbuterol.

They were tested in February of that year, which was out of competition.

More recently, Willie Rioli, when he was at the Eagles, was suspended for two years after being found guilty of substituting his urine during two anti-doping drugs tests.

[Axe Man]

First positive from us not making finals - it can't be one of our players!

Technically it could be Harmes? :D

[jazzadogs]

Technically it could be Harmes? :D

Do they count Casey finals?

[Grantysghost]

I'm not saying it's Clayton Oliver. I'm not. Just to clear that up.

[chef]

Joel Smith.
AFL statement on Joel Smith (https://www.afl.com.au/news/1054977/afl-statement-on-joel-smith)

[Axe Man]

AFL STATEMENT (https://www.afl.com.au/news/1054977/afl-statement-on-joel-smith)

The AFL confirms that a mandatory provisional suspension (which is effective immediately) has been imposed on Melbourne FC player Joel Smith following notification to him by Sport Integrity Australia of an Adverse Analytical Finding (AAF) and a potential violation of the Australian Football Anti-Doping Code (Code).

It is asserted that a sample provided by Smith during an In-Competition doping control test on 20 August 2023 returned an AAF for the presence of Cocaine and its metabolite Benzoylecgonine being a Prohibited Substance under the Code.

Smith was tested after the Round 23 Melbourne vs Hawthorn game on Sunday August 20, 2023 and was notified by Sport Integrity Australia last week in relation to the finding. The AFL was made aware of the test results at the same time.

The matter is now progressing in accordance with the Code, initially involving further investigation by Sport Integrity Australia supported by the AFL.

In the interim Smith will not be part of Melbourne’s football program.

The AFL is unable to make any further comment at this time.

[bulldogtragic]

Is that a two year ban?

If true, Josh Schache loves this news!

[SquirrelGrip]

What a coincidence this news came out today, not the last day or two of Trade Week!

[Axe Man]

Is that a two year ban?

If true, Josh Schache loves this news!

Could be anywhere between 1 month and 4 years.

[bulldogtragic]

Could be anywhere between 1 month and 4 years.

Come on down Josh Schache.

[jeemak]

If he's smashing gear at 11:59pm the day before a game then the sport's probably not for him.

[Grantysghost]

This really was wasted effort...

https://i.postimg.cc/3rq1hJTQ/Mematic-20231019-112241.jpg (https://postimg.cc/Z0rpFmnw)

[GVGjr]

Melbourne have had some culture challenges since the GF there has been doubts on the coach, attitude issues with May and a heap of problems with Oliver and now Smith.
Worrying signs for the competition but at least this news was after the trade period.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Melbourne have had some culture challenges since the GF there has been doubts on the coach, attitude issues with May and a heap of problems with Oliver and now Smith.
Worrying signs for the competition but at least this news was after the trade period.

Very similar to our path post 2016.

[Flamethrower]

Gives a whole new meaning to the Range Rover set and their like for snow.

[jazzadogs]

Who got higher, Joel or Shaun Smith?

[Rocket Science]

This really was wasted effort...

https://i.postimg.cc/3rq1hJTQ/Mematic-20231019-112241.jpg (https://postimg.cc/Z0rpFmnw)

Au contraire ...

https://i.ibb.co/QPMy1xf/Screen-Shot-2023-10-19-at-1-18-45-pm.png (https://ibb.co/rxHD1Xm)

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Very similar to our path post 2016.

Imagine how they would've reacted if they had won a proper premiership.

[Grantysghost]

Au contraire ...

https://i.ibb.co/QPMy1xf/Screen-Shot-2023-10-19-at-1-18-45-pm.png (https://ibb.co/rxHD1Xm)

Brilliant.

[GVGjr]

Very similar to our path post 2016.

That point is not lost on me.

The competition has been struggling with distracted players since the Covid years interruptions and more players are challenged by staying within the requirements of being an AFL footballer.

I wonder where this will fit in terms of a ban?

[Twodogs]

Another one bites the dust. Carlton have just confirmed that Elijah Hollands has been to appear before a Qld court for cocaine possession.

Carlton saying that they were aware when they traded him in.

[GVGjr]

NEW CARLTON recruit Elijah Hollands has been served notice to appear in court over possession of an illicit substance.

Hollands was traded to the Blues from Gold Coast on Wednesday, joining younger brother Ollie at Ikon Park.

Carlton says it was made aware last month that Hollands had been served with the notice to appear, but it did not deter the club from recruiting him.

Sam Edmunds hinted that Hollands would be returning back to Vic for compassionate reasons the other day.

Of course the AFL manages the information and made sure this was made public after the trade period.
No wonder he went cheap

[GVGjr]

I mean what are the chances that 2 players get linked to illicit drugs the day after the trade period?
At least it didn't impact the show.

[Twodogs]

That point is not lost on me.

The competition has been struggling with distracted players since the Covid years interruptions and more players are challenged by staying within the requirements of being an AFL footballer.

I wonder where this will fit in terms of a ban?

It's a bit complicated. Basically it comes down to whether Smith owns up and takes responsibility. Then Sports Integrity Australia van issue a sanction of as little as a month.

[jazzadogs]

It's a bit complicated. Basically it comes down to whether Smith owns up and takes responsibility. Then Sports Integrity Australia van issue a sanction of as little as a month.

Even though it was on game day?

[Twodogs]

Even though it was on game day?

He has the option to prove or say that he ingested the drugs before the in competition period started. That's before 11.59pm on the day before the game.

If it goes tits up for him he could cop a four year ban. If it all goes well for him he could get away with a month's ban.

The drug policy is ridiculously all over the place

[hujsh]

Can we change the thread to tests positive for cocaine? My brain keeps reading it as positive test for dogs and that's worse than this actual story

[josie]

Can we change the thread to tests positive for cocaine? My brain keeps reading it as positive test for dogs and that's worse than this actual story

Time for a visit to spec savers.

[hujsh]

Time for a visit to spec savers.

Well technically it's not vision that's the problem, it's how our brains interpret visual simuli and convert that into something we can comprehend as sight. When reading rather than look at every letter you kind of glaze over most of them and your brain fills in gaps with what it thinks makes most sense in context. My brain is trying very hard to be efficient turning dgs into dogs given this is a Bulldogs forum but it is sadly doing more harm than good.

[jeemak]

Time for a visit to spec savers.


Well technically it's not vision that's the problem, it's how our brains interpret visual simuli and convert that into something we can comprehend as sight. When reading rather than look at every letter you kind of glaze over most of them and your brain fills in gaps with what it thinks makes most sense in context. My brain is trying very hard to be efficient turning dgs into dogs given this is a Bulldogs forum but it is sadly doing more harm than good.

Consider that EXPLAINED Josie!!!!!!

He even got technical on your arse!


;)

[hujsh]

Consider that EXPLAINED Josie!!!!!!

He even got technical on your arse!


;)

Damn did I just mansplain?

Sorry lol

[SquirrelGrip]

I mean what are the chances that 2 players get linked to illicit drugs the day after the trade period?
At least it didn't impact the show.

As the say in the classics, “Deidre Chambers, what a coincidence!”

[jeemak]

Damn did I just mansplain?

Sorry lol

You could have "they" splained.....we don't know how you identify! :)

[ledge]

I feel sorry for Shaun he has had a lot of mental struggles since he retired and now this with his son .

[bornadog]

Tested positive after round 23 but still played finals

[bulldogtragic]

Expect a three month ban, served over summer, able to play round one (HUN)

[GVGjr]

Expect a three month ban, served over summer, able to play round one (HUN)

Yep, on face value it's a ban but it was never going to be serious enough to impact the following season.
AFL must justify their stance on players taking illicit drugs to keep the players association on board.

[GVGjr]

Had Melbourne won the flag what would have been the implications of this positive test?

[bulldogtragic]

Elijah Hollands has to front court over possessing illegal substance. Charge goes back a month or so.

[EasternWest]

Unpopular opinion: I don't care about AFL players using illicit drugs.

I get it's illegal. I just don't care.

I'd rather the AFL do something about the players constantly spitting. That's just vile.

[hujsh]

Unpopular opinion: I don't care about AFL players using illicit drugs.

I get it's illegal. I just don't care.

I'd rather the AFL do something about the players constantly spitting. That's just vile.

Pretty much. Probably not great to do it game day though.

[Mantis]

Unpopular opinion: I don't care about AFL players using illicit drugs.

I get it's illegal. I just don't care.

I'd rather the AFL do something about the players constantly spitting. That's just vile.

If only there was a thread where you could post such a thing.

But given there's no precedence for that type of thing on this forum you're excused.

[Twodogs]

Unpopular opinion: I don't care about AFL players using illicit drugs.

I get it's illegal. I just don't care.

I'd rather the AFL do something about the players constantly spitting. That's just vile.

Me either. I don't understand how non performance enhancing drug use is anyone's business.

[ReLoad]

Me either. I don't understand how non performance enhancing drug use is anyone's business.

I certainly see your point, but on the flip side, i see kids who idolise footballers who are in the process or normalising drug use

its a quandary thats for sure, living in the public life and choosing that line of work has the responsibilities along with it.

[Topdog]

I certainly see your point, but on the flip side, i see kids who idolise footballers who are in the process or normalising drug use

its a quandary thats for sure, living in the public life and choosing that line of work has the responsibilities along with it.

But if we stopped talking about it no one would know they were using drugs and it wouldn't become normalised.

[josie]

Unpopular opinion: I don't care about AFL players using illicit drugs.

I get it's illegal. I just don't care.

I'd rather the AFL do something about the players constantly spitting. That's just vile.

Tend to agree. Understand angle of role models for children and all that but it’s parents who have main responsibility to guide, lead by example, explain etc. after all. As long as no performance enhancement aspect of course. Given the drug education the AFL provides and the potential social & mental & physical well-being aspects it surprises me players cannot wait until after the season or after their AFL careers are over to indulge.

Reading book by Talking Heads drummer Chris Frantz at present. He said when punk started (they weren’t punk but same time) and they played as supporting act to Ramones on Euro Tour the punk fans would gob/spit on stage-hitting group members, equipment etc. The stage after Ramones played in parts of UK would be covered in spittle. He pitied the poor stagehands who had to clean up the vile gobs. Ramones copped it much worse than Talking Heads. I’d have walked off stage myself. Common decency not to spit. No need for it, especially in current times with our health knowledge.

[Twodogs]

I certainly see your point, but on the flip side, i see kids who idolise footballers who are in the process or normalising drug use

its a quandary thats for sure, living in the public life and choosing that line of work has the responsibilities along with it.

Yeah true. But is there anything to be said for legalising or decriminalising small amounts of drugs? Remove the glamorous aspect that criminalising drugs brings?

Can we arrest our way to winning the war on drugs? I'd suggest it hasn't worked but then I'm probably not the right person to ask given all the problem I've faced over the years with polysubstance abuse.

[Twodogs]

Tend to agree. Understand angle of role models for children and all that but it’s parents who have main responsibility to guide, lead by example, explain etc. after all. As long as no performance enhancement aspect of course. Given the drug education the AFL provides and the potential social & mental & physical well-being aspects it surprises me players cannot wait until after the season or after their AFL careers are over to indulge.

Reading book by Talking Heads drummer Chris Frantz at present. He said when punk started (they weren’t punk but same time) and they played as supporting act to Ramones on Euro Tour the punk fans would gob/spit on stage-hitting group members, equipment etc. The stage after Ramones played in parts of UK would be covered in spittle. He pitied the poor stagehands who had to clean up the vile gobs. Ramones copped it much worse than Talking Heads. I’d have walked off stage myself. Common decency not to spit. No need for it, especially in current times with our health knowledge.

The Birthday Party and and the Saints had the same problem in England when they first went there. I can't remember if it was Nick Cave or Chris Bailey who got the point that it wasn't appreciated by whacking an audience member with their mike stand

[ReLoad]

Yeah true. But is there anything to be said for legalising or decriminalising small amounts of drugs? Remove the glamorous aspect that criminalising drugs brings?

Can we arrest our way to winning the war on drugs? I'd suggest it hasn't worked but then I'm probably not the right person to ask given all the problem I've faced over the years with polysubstance abuse.

Unquestionably whats currently in play isn't working, and the criminal aspects of victims certainly needs to be factored in. Its by no means a "lets just decriminalise some drugs" type scenario.

Its a hugely complex piece for which I'm far from equipped to base a conversation on, apart form my drive by comment: "Players know when they become AFL players what the rules are, and that they are in the limelight, and should of course be mindful of the roles they have on developing minds"

So I think I'm still leaning into the "The players should know and do better" camp for my .5 West Footscray Roubles worth.

[hujsh]

Unquestionably whats currently in play isn't working, and the criminal aspects of victims certainly needs to be factored in. Its by no means a "lets just decriminalise some drugs" type scenario.

Its a hugely complex piece for which I'm far from equipped to base a conversation on, apart form my drive by comment: "Players know when they become AFL players what the rules are, and that they are in the limelight, and should of course be mindful of the roles they have on developing minds"

So I think I'm still leaning into the "The players should know and do better" camp for my .5 West Footscray Roubles worth.

More than just decriminalising you've also got to put the money involved in enforcing/punishing offenders into education and programs that help people with drug issues that require help. So from an AFL player perspective that'd mean rather than punishing players for any positive test maybe you'd work on creating environments where players can be open about their drug use and resources would be available to help anyone that needs it.

Personally I'd rather do what we can prioritize avoiding another Ben Cousins type scenario and I don't think the current regime of punishing players if they happen to test positive really does much towards that end.

[EasternWest]

If only there was a thread where you could post such a thing.

But given there's no precedence for that type of thing on this forum you're excused.

I'm tired of looking for non existent threads on this forum and I won't waste any time on it.

[anfo27]

I certainly see your point, but on the flip side, i see kids who idolise footballers who are in the process or normalising drug use

its a quandary thats for sure, living in the public life and choosing that line of work has the responsibilities along with it.

There in lies the problem. Footballers are not role models & can not be idolised, neither can rock stars or actors. Role models need to be the parents, somebody the children know & can respect. Footballers are just that, footballers. Kids know nothing about them other than that.
The money side is just bollocks. I don't care how much they get paid. These sports stars, musicians & actors get so much money because corporations see them as influences, every single one of them. Alot of these people will put there name next to anything for money.
Yes we can appreciate their skill on the football field but thats where it ends.

[GVGjr]

There in lies the problem. Footballers are not role models & can not be idolised, neither can rock stars or actors. Role models need to be the parents, somebody the children know & can respect. Footballers are just that, footballers. Kids know nothing about them other than that.
The money side is just bollocks. I don't care how much they get paid. These sports stars, musicians & actors get so much money because corporations see them as influences, every single one of them. Alot of these people will put there name next to anything for money.
Yes we can appreciate their skill on the football field but thats where it ends.

That argument doesn't quite wash with me. The AFL, the clubs and the players involved promote a healthy lifestyle to the fans, sponsors and the TV networks who fund the game and rules and there regulations are in place to support that.
The clubs and the players need to be socially responsible and if players prefer to have a less than totally professional approach to performing their job then they also have the option to go and play in the lower leagues where the scrutiny.
Turning a blind eye to the challenges or continued softening of standards when players aren't meeting their obligations is not a solution.

[anfo27]

That argument doesn't quite wash with me. The AFL, the clubs and the players involved promote a healthy lifestyle to the fans, sponsors and the TV networks who fund the game and rules and there regulations are in place to support that.
The clubs and the players need to be socially responsible and if players prefer to have a less than totally professional approach to performing their job then they also have the option to go and play in the lower leagues where the scrutiny.
Turning a blind eye to the challenges or continued softening of standards when players aren't meeting their obligations is not a solution.

No offence G but that is rubbish. Healthy lifestyle while promoting McDonalds? Thats stuff is not even real food, its poison & yet players & the AFL think its totally ok to INFLUENCE the public into eating poison. What about the gambling ads? The AFL does not care, all they care about is image & their narrative.

There are no morale standards anymore just standards & the corporations who put up the money determine those standards. Clubs use all the buzz words like leadership but very few know what that means.

Kids need to be taught this stuff because then they can see it for what it is. Socially responsible? Was it responsible for our club & the AFL to support medical apartheid? Yep I said it! There is no sugar coating it, thats what it was.

[GVGjr]

No offence G but that is rubbish. Healthy lifestyle while promoting McDonalds? Thats stuff is not even real food, its poison & yet players & the AFL think its totally ok to INFLUENCE the public into eating poison. What about the gambling ads? The AFL does not care, all they care about is image & their narrative.

There are no morale standards anymore just standards & the corporations who put up the money determine those standards. Clubs use all the buzz words like leadership but very few know what that means.

Kids need to be taught this stuff because then they can see it for what it is. Socially responsible? Was it responsible for our club & the AFL to support medical apartheid? Yep I said it! There is no sugar coating it, thats what it was.

We will have to disagree but that's rubbish from my perspective as well.
Players aren't eating McDonalds or are they allowed to bet on footy games and they certainly aren't supposed to be taking illicit drugs. They are just side issues. If we are prepared to let players take drugs or turn a blind eye when they do I don't think we are doing the right thing by them or the competition.

[anfo27]

We will have to disagree but that's rubbish from my perspective as well.
Players aren't eating McDonalds or are they allowed to bet on footy games and they certainly aren't supposed to be taking illicit drugs. They are just side issues. If we are prepared to let players take drugs or turn a blind eye when they do I don't think we are doing the right thing by them or the competition.

I never said let them take drugs G. I'm merely stating as a father I would always be telling my kids these people are people you should not look up to & idolise.
If they aren't eating McDonalds then its even worse to be doing ads for them. Thats the problem with society & its highlighted by celebrities. As long as there is some coin in it for them, then they'll put their name to it. No principles, stand for nothing! Its only McDonalds, its only BET263 (or whatever its called). You are selling a little bit of your soul by influencing people to spend their hard earned on products that don't serve them well. There is no honour in that.

[Twodogs]

Another thing that I'm curious about. How did it take 8 weeks for the sample to be tested and the positive outcome to be returned?

At most workplaces where they have drug testing the results are instant.

[hujsh]

No offence G but that is rubbish. Healthy lifestyle while promoting McDonalds? Thats stuff is not even real food, its poison & yet players & the AFL think its totally ok to INFLUENCE the public into eating poison. What about the gambling ads? The AFL does not care, all they care about is image & their narrative.

There are no morale standards anymore just standards & the corporations who put up the money determine those standards. Clubs use all the buzz words like leadership but very few know what that means.

https://media.tenor.com/l0mcywGlqPoAAAAj/nodding-philip-j-fry.gif



Kids need to be taught this stuff because then they can see it for what it is. Socially responsible? Was it responsible for our club & the AFL to support medical apartheid? Yep I said it! There is no sugar coating it, thats what it was.

https://media.tenor.com/pMOjimKlrngAAAAC/awkward-collar-tug-the-simpsons.gif

[GVGjr]

Another thing that I'm curious about. How did it take 8 weeks for the sample to be tested and the positive outcome to be returned?

At most workplaces where they have drug testing the results are instant.

The timing of the announcements was a crock as well. Two case get announced straight after the trade week is over isn't a coincidence.

[GVGjr]

I never said let them take drugs G. I'm merely stating as a father I would always be telling my kids these people are people you should not look up to & idolise.
If they aren't eating McDonalds then its even worse to be doing ads for them. Thats the problem with society & its highlighted by celebrities. As long as there is some coin in it for them, then they'll put their name to it. No principles, stand for nothing! Its only McDonalds, its only BET263 (or whatever its called). You are selling a little bit of your soul by influencing people to spend their hard earned on products that don't serve them well. There is no honour in that.

At club land they've got welfare staff to support the players and we've even got a mentor or a minder type set-up. Most Clubs are also been working their way off the pokies money and divesting interests there.
If you don't want the likes of McDonalds, Mars bars and Pancake Parlours to be part of the clubs sponsors well that might be a struggle but all those are okay in moderation and are certainly not illicit or illegal activities in the football code.

I get that I'm out of step with the majority of society in terms of how drug taking is viewed but I just don't believe we can accept it the way many people seem to be prepared to. It's a tough challenge no doubt but not one we should be walking away from.

[Twodogs]

The timing of the announcements was a crock as well. Two case get announced straight after the trade week is over isn't a coincidence.

The saying that when you're given a choice between a cock up and a conspiracy go with the cock up 9 times out of 10 applies in the reverse on this case.

[jazzadogs]

No offence G but that is rubbish. Healthy lifestyle while promoting McDonalds? Thats stuff is not even real food, its poison & yet players & the AFL think its totally ok to INFLUENCE the public into eating poison. What about the gambling ads? The AFL does not care, all they care about is image & their narrative.

There are no morale standards anymore just standards & the corporations who put up the money determine those standards. Clubs use all the buzz words like leadership but very few know what that means.

Kids need to be taught this stuff because then they can see it for what it is. Socially responsible? Was it responsible for our club & the AFL to support medical apartheid? Yep I said it! There is no sugar coating it, thats what it was.

Not gonna lie, you had me in the first half.

I agree that the AFL has no moral high ground on any subject given their major sponsors, however that is also a product of the world we live in where it is very rare to be able to make a purely ethical choice.

[Grantysghost]

Not gonna lie, you had me in the first half.

I agree that the AFL has no moral high ground on any subject given their major sponsors, however that is also a product of the world we live in where it is very rare to be able to make a purely ethical choice.

McDonald's is a great employer of our youth!

It's a shame it's cult like in its indoctrination of kids, but education should lead them out of the mist.

#standbyronald

[Dry Rot]

At least there's one thing we know about the Demons (and even Smith) in the finals this season.

Clearly none of them were on performance enhancing drugs.

[Twodogs]

It says on the front page of the Herald Sun that Oliver was at Smith's place just before he ended up at Footscray Hospital.

Smith must live in Footscray or Yarraville or thereabouts.