I wasn’t aware of that - could that be why he slipped in the draft? (and not just the fear of wasting early picks on young skinny tall guys)
Without looking up stats, reckon Cox was still decent in the actual ruck contest.
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I get that he is going to be pushed aside around the ground and at boundary throw-ins, but I can't quite work out why he doesn't get his hand to more centre bounces where the opposition ruckman is unable to out muscle him. Is his leap just not very big or is it a technique thing?
Say hello to the new Simon Beasley.
This is down to guile and technique. Physics also plays a big part. Simon Madden (the greatest ruckman I’ve seen) commented that early in his career, despite being much taller, more athletic and having a better leap, simply could not get his hand on the ball at centre bounces against an ageing Sammy Newman.
Ruckmen jump early, jump at each other and there’s plenty of nuances and technique. With that in mind, weight and bulk comes into play. English has some filling out to do and some bulk to put on.
Despite being more know as a media performer in later years, Sam Newman was a very highly regarded ruck coach for many years. One of the scores of ruckmen he helped was our own Andrew Purser - who regularly gave up inches to his opponents, yet was rarely beaten. In fact, Madden himself sought Newman out for coaching as soon as he’d retired and says his rucking massively improved as a result.
English is still very raw and very green.
Finally, I clearly recall watching Grundy playing reserves when he was English’s age. Check the records, it was the day we had our break through win against the Swans in Sydney. The one Bob Murphy described at the time as the “best win ever.” Grundy was older and more physically developed than English is now, yet was still learning his craft in the VFL. Some important context, I think.
Max Gawn’s development was a very, very similar story.
The ruck technique thing makes sense - I'm about 1 foot short of being a ruckman so I don't have much personal experience to draw from!
Just on Grundy - I think I've mentioned this before but English is not all that comparable to Grundy at the same age. English was drafted as a 19 year old it must be remembered.
That win against Sydney was in 2015 I believe, when Grundy had just turned 21 and was in the middle of putting together a 19 game season, having already played 22 games over the previous 2 seasons.
English will be 22 in August and just played his 13th game.
I don't think any sensible person would not give Tim plenty of allowance for his lack of age, but more importantly lack of experience and physical development. He is odds on to be an excellent ruckman but is likely to take him a little bit longer than Grundy.
Agree that Gawn probably has more in common with English, although his early career was significantly injury affected I believe.
Or Luke Darcy. He was quite good early doors playing in a forward pocket and providing a few minutes relief to Scott Wynd every now and then. As a result he was ready to assume the full time ruck role by the time Wynd retired. But I'm happy to see English develop in the ruck.
In the last couple of centre bounces on friday night English didn't leap but stayed on his feet and was first to tackle whatever Collingwood player got his hands on the ball first. It's a tactic that Bevo used whenever last year when Dunkley and Jong had to compete at centre bounces.
Technique.
I have watched him closely and he does have a good leap, but he so often mistimes his leap, fresh airs his tap or on the rare occasions he does get his hand to it, he just hits it forward and straight to the opposition.
His ruckwork is really poor, and it gets worse as the game goes on and he gets tired of getting pantsed.
I don't think it is helping that we are throwing him in the deep end. You are not learning when your are hopelessly out of your depth.
It's like being a c grade cricketer and asked to play for the firsts. What possible learning do you get from that experience if it's clearly a grade too far ahead. Tim is only going to lose confidence and struggle.
He needs some time playing for Footscray so he can hone his craft.
Quite often he seems to get his hand to the ball first but the other ruckman will then make contact with the ball (or his hand) and are able to direct it where they want it to go.
I’ve pulled out the AFL app a few times and noted that even when the opposition ruckman are making contact with his hand that they get credited with the tap (presumably as they are being seen as having more impact on where the tap goes?).
Quigley at Bigfooty puts together pretty good mock drafts, he was one of the few to have English sliding into the second round.
It's an interesting read:
https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threa...kings.1152444/Quote:
Call me old fashioned but I actually like my rucks to actually be able to ruck. Its great if they might qualify to be a C grade midfielder like English does but ultimately you want to the win the taps and English is poor in that aspect of the game. He is overaged and weak in the body and often does not even compete in the ruck contest. I usually rate rucks ahead of most people, including the AFL recruitment community, but I just am not onboard with English.
Got pushed out of a marking contest early in the 1st qtr and it looked like another long day ahead.
Which was true for other reasons - thought Tim was much better today.
Had to find something positive...what a dirty day
Straight swap for Nat Fyfe or no deal Freo.
DOCKERS TO HAVE ‘MASSIVE CRACK’ AT WA DOG
Western Bulldogs ruckman Tim English has been earmarked as a player of the future.
But whether or not he’ll play his best footy at Whitten Oval is up for debate.
According to Fox Footy senior AFL reporter Tom Morris, Fremantle is keen to secure the West Australian native, despite English still having a year to run on his contract.
“He’s signed until the end of next year and the Bulldogs really rate him,” Morris told On The Couch.
“But I think Freo is going to have a massive crack at getting him at the end of this year.”
The Dockers have had the luxury of Aaron Sandilands leading their ruck charges for more than a decade, but the 36-year-old hasn’t featured at all in 2019.
Rory Lobb has been shouldering the load, while 20-year-old Sean Darcy is also highly rated.
But luring English back home to Perth could ensure Fremantle has another generational ruckman.