Western Bulldogs hope Ballarat clash persuades state government to boost Eureka Stadium’s capacity

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THE Western Bulldogs hope their historic Ballarat fixture this season persuades the state government to almost double Eureka Stadium’s capacity.

In Round 22 the Dogs host Port Adelaide in what looms as a September-shaping clash with both clubs targeting the top four.
But thousands of the club’s approximated 43,000 members could be locked out due to an expected capacity of 11,000 when the stadium’s $15 million upgrade is completed in June.

The renovation will shrink the playing surface to mirror Etihad Stadium and add a 5000-seat grandstand.
Bulldogs chief executive Gary Kent wants Eureka Stadium to grow to about 20,000, similar to Tasmania’s Hobart and Launceston venues.
The Dogs are exploring the possibility of hosting two Ballarat matches for premiership points next season plus an AFL Women’s fixture.

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Kent said the club made a strategic decision to “win over the town of Ballarat” given the region is home to 100,000 people and remains an untapped market.
But Kent said the extra Ballarat game in 2018 might not come at the expense of the Dogs’ annual Cairns fixture against Gold Coast.

That would drop the Dogs to only eight home matches at Etihad Stadium.
Hawthorn plays four home games in Launceston each season but struggles to fill the venue.
“We’ve got to make this a real success and convince the state government to go to the next stage, so it’s closer to the capacity at Launceston and Hobart in future years,” Kent told the Herald Sun.

“We need to make (Round 22) a great success and show what demand there is in Ballarat for a venue of that size.”
Kent said the allocation of tickets wasn’t finalised, but urged Dogs fans to secure seats quickly.

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“It’s only 11,000 capacity and out of that we’re allocating tourism packages, because part of the whole arrangement with us, the state government and the city of Ballarat is to promote the city.

“We’ve got over 43,000 members, so they won’t all be coming.
“People are used to not buying their tickets and seats until quite close to the game. That’s one of the things we’re trying to get the message out to people to take up these offers.

“When general tickets go on sale there’s going to be a pretty big rush.”

The Dogs are selling $140 three-game Ballarat memberships and $75 add-ons to residents in the region.
Power business and marketing manager Matthew Richardson said their fans were already making inquiries.
“Our members and supporters like when we play in Victoria and we get a good number travelling to games,” Richardson said.

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Bob Murphy will lead the Dogs in Ballarat. Picture: AAP Images

“We also have several thousand Victorian members who have access with their memberships. The ‘away’ club always gets an allocation for their members and we are sure this game will be no different.”

AFL fixturing boss Travis Auld said it was too early to predict demand for the Round 22 clash.
“At the moment (Eureka Stadium) is considered to be a good size, certainly to launch games into Ballarat,” Auld said.
“The facility is going to be outstanding as a regional ground. It’ll have everything you need to host a home-and-away game.
“Over time we’ll have to assess whether there’s opportunity to further expand the ground.”

Would have thought they'd build a stadium with at least 20 thou to begin with.

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Originally Posted by Remi Moses

Would have thought they'd build a stadium with at least 20 thou to begin with.

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More money required and if local/state government was to tip in, you'd expect they'd want more than 1 or 2 AFL games a year. Would you be happy with 4 games in Ballarat a year?

Yes it's not like 11000 is a big crowd . Would like to know the Last time we played a game with less in Victoria.
Even if it was 20,000 it would still be full.
I don't like the way this could end up being so small, member revolt, complaints etc. we could end up losing members.

Understandably they started off slowly but i dont think our fans will have the patience to wait another 3 years for an extension to 20k.
I know dealing with councils and governments is often a slow process but they need to attack this with some urgency now.

It always looked to be half done and before we've even played a game we want it expanded. I think many of us predicted this.

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Originally Posted by GVGjr

Understandably they started off slowly but i dont think our fans will have the patience to wait another 3 years for an extension to 20k.
I know dealing with councils and governments is often a slow process but they need to attack this with some urgency now.

It always looked to be half done and before we've even played a game we want it expanded. I think many of us predicted this.

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What does half done mean though? There was only funding for phase 1.

It feels a little Edgewater to me. Another $15,000,000 or so to increase crowds for 2 games a year is irresponsible by any government. Irrespective of what we want as members of a football club. North Ballrat could fold (like Bendigo Gold) and then it's a big money pit with little return on investment for the branches of government. They'd probably need 4 games to argue the case, and mirror the Hawthorn example. That we are obviously not interested in dropping the Cairns match, has me concerned as a member. Firstly, that we've lost every week, every time after playing in Cairns which hurts us on field, but if we are flogging off 3-5 games to make more money then that also hurts us potentially by reducing our games at Etihad. Then as above, if members can't get in, then members get pissed off. There's a fair bit of risk financially, on field and impact on members - I hope the reward is worth it and eventuates.

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Originally Posted by bulldogtragic

It feels a little Edgewater to me. Another $15,000,000 or so to increase crowds for 2 games a year is irresponsible by any government. Irrespective of what we want as members of a football club. North Ballrat could fold (like Bendigo Gold) and then it's a big money pit with little return on investment for the branches of government. They'd probably need 4 games to argue the case, and mirror the Hawthorn example. That we are obviously not interested in dropping the Cairns match, has me concerned as a member. Firstly, that we've lost every week, every time after playing in Cairns which hurts us on field, but if we are flogging off 3-5 games to make more money then that also hurts us potentially by reducing our games at Etihad. Then as above, if members can't get in, then members get pissed off. There's a fair bit of risk financially, on field and impact on members - I hope the reward is worth it and eventuates.

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Agree that we must cut ties with Cairns if we are to proceed with Ballarat.

Disagree that this is an Edgewater type scenario. For one, the club isn't on the hook for millions, nor are they tasked with running the stadium. The Ballarat council is about to pay millions to take over the stadium from North Ballarat to ensure its long term survival, so even if the Roosters fold, the ground isn't at risk.

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Originally Posted by comrade

What does half done mean though? There was only funding for phase 1.

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Read the post again and draw some obvious conclusions.

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Originally Posted by GVGjr

Read the post again and draw some obvious conclusions.

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The club wants the capacity to double, is that what you're referring to as half done? I agree that dealing with governments and councils is slow going, and by publicly stating our desire for capacity to increase, it seems like we are trying to force this through.

I doubt the club ever thought an 11,000 capacity stadium was going to be sufficient, hence the multiple phases in the initial planning brief. So no one here predicted it per se, increased capacity was always the plan.

The wheels of govt and beurocracy grind slowly. Establishing a presence in 2017 with a fully funded 11k stadium and a genuine footprint in a fast growing footy mad region of Victoria that is our region alone makes very smart business sense IMO.

It is actually risk averse for the club - we are diversifying and spreading our risk so as to not be exposed if we put all our eggs in the one basket. Do we honestly believe Etihad will survive the next 20 years? It is some of the most lucrative land value in the country and it is now owned by the AFL, who let's be honest have shown a propensity in the past to be motivated by nothing more than filthy lucre. I would be staggered if Etihad was still in operation by 2037.

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Originally Posted by Sedat

The wheels of govt and beurocracy grind slowly. Establishing a presence with a fully funded 11k stadium and a genuine footprint in a fast growing footy mad region of Victoria that is our region alone makes very smart business sense IMO.

It is actually risk averse for the club - we are diversifying and spreading our risk so as to not be exposed if we put all.our eggs in the one basket. Do we honestly believe Etihad will survive the next 20 years? It is some of tbe most lucrative land value in the country and it is now owned by the AFL, who have shown a propensity in the past to be motivated by filthy lucre.

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Yeah, I don't see too many downsides to investing in the Ballarat region, on the proviso that we cut ties with Cairns. To me, that is the obvious move and needs to be implemented from 2018 onwards.

Please drop Cairns. Really should be replaced by Ballarat (hell even up it to three games there and invest in the area if you want)

Funny isn't it . We can play at a stadium that only fits 11,000 but can't play a game at Whitten oval.

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Originally Posted by comrade

Yeah, I don't see too many downsides to investing in the Ballarat region, on the proviso that we cut ties with Cairns. To me, that is the obvious move and needs to be implemented from 2018 onwards.

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I'm not quite as anti Cairns as others - happy to get rid of it once the next stage of Eureka is completed. But $500k plus for one game is still critically important for our bottom line, and this game would be a massive loss if played at Etihad in front of 17-18k.

If we play 4 games at Eureka in front of 20k (GC, GWS, Port and Freo as examples) and 7 home games at Etihad against all the higher drawing clubs that is a fantastic mix IMO.

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Originally Posted by Sedat

I'm not quite as anti Cairns as others - happy to get rid of it once the next stage of Eureka is completed. But $500k plus for one game is still critically important for our bottom line, and this game would be a massive loss if played at Etihad in front of 17-18k.

If we play 4 games at Eureka in front of 20k (GC, GWS, Port and Freo as examples) and 7 home games at Etihad against all the higher drawing clubs that is a fantastic mix IMO.

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My anti-Cairns position stems from the fact we never win after playing there.

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Originally Posted by comrade

My anti-Cairns position stems from the fact we never win after playing there.

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Yep, we've signed Asics, Mercedes, PowerCor, PCCU and re-signed Mission. Coteries & Social Club sold out. The Premiership cheque. 8,000 new members up on last year. More exposure to Friday & Saturday nights. And Ballarat hopefully bringing in some cash.

Agree, I get Cairns makes good money too, but it's not helping on field performance and we've got a chance to remodel our finances to leave Cairns out among these new revenue sources (especially if we can improve WO to make more cash). If it means taking Ballarat to 3 games so be it.

But Ballarat right now seems a little shaky to me. If the club was confident in Ballrat then surely Cairns would go. The inference I draw is we are not prepared to let Cairns because we are not as confident in Ballarat.

Sacrificing on field performance for a cash injection is a small club behaviour that we need to get away from. I'd hope we're very close to being in a position to forgo Cairns, given all the off field goals we've kicked in the last 6 months (as BT detailed).

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Originally Posted by comrade

The club wants the capacity to double, is that what you're referring to as half done? I agree that dealing with governments and councils is slow going, and by publicly stating our desire for capacity to increase, it seems like we are trying to force this through.

I doubt the club ever thought an 11,000 capacity stadium was going to be sufficient, hence the multiple phases in the initial planning brief. So no one here predicted it per se, increased capacity was always the plan.

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All what you've said is a given. My point is phase two can't take 3 years plus because there is a strong chance our members will just write off going there if it's too hard to get a seat and then vastly more expensive to acquire. Has Phase 2 even been funded yet?
For Gary Kent to come out before we have even played our first game and say it needs to be closer to 20K to me is a sign he's reading the play and hoping he can up the ante.

Having worked on a couple of high priced projects over the years there are always compromises that can be reached and settling for a venue that holds 11K was always far from ideal but now possibly made worse by our expanding membership base.
We have also discussed this on other threads but Phase one needed to be closer to 15K especially if we are drawing teams from SA to the venue because we are anticipating they will travel there.

We have some challenges ahead to make this work.

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Originally Posted by bulldogtragic

Yep, we've signed Asics, Mercedes, PowerCor, PCCU and re-signed Mission. Coteries & Social Club sold out. The Premiership cheque. 8,000 new members up on last year. More exposure to Friday & Saturday nights. And Ballarat hopefully bringing in some cash.

Agree, I get Cairns makes good money too, but it's not helping on field performance and we've got a chance to remodel our finances to leave Cairns out among these new revenue sources (especially if we can improve WO to make more cash). If it means taking Ballarat to 3 games so be it.

But Ballarat right now seems a little shaky to me. If the club was confident in Ballrat then surely Cairns would go. The inference I draw is we are not prepared to let Cairns because we are not as confident in Ballarat.

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Don't we also need to push for a more favorable draw when we play at Cairns? Could we play there before the bye?

I agree with your inference, we need to keep Cairns for the short term.

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Originally Posted by ledge

Yes it's not like 11000 is a big crowd . Would like to know the Last time we played a game with less in Victoria.
Even if it was 20,000 it would still be full.
I don't like the way this could end up being so small, member revolt, complaints etc. we could end up losing members.

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There is no benefit in playing a game at WO. The reason for Ballarat is to increase our membership into regional areas.

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Originally Posted by Sedat

I'm not quite as anti Cairns as others - happy to get rid of it once the next stage of Eureka is completed. But $500k plus for one game is still critically important for our bottom line, and this game would be a massive loss if played at Etihad in front of 17-18k.

If we play 4 games at Eureka in front of 20k (GC, GWS, Port and Freo as examples) and 7 home games at Etihad against all the higher drawing clubs that is a fantastic mix IMO.

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I think that would be ideal.

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Originally Posted by comrade

More money required and if local/state government was to tip in, you'd expect they'd want more than 1 or 2 AFL games a year. Would you be happy with 4 games in Ballarat a year?

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I'd imagine you're right, and more money would be tipped in if we play more games up there.
I'd say 4 would do it and Cairns getting the Tijuana

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Originally Posted by GVGjr

Don't we also need to push for a more favorable draw when we play at Cairns? Could we play there before the bye?

I agree with your inference, we need to keep Cairns for the short term.

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Originally Posted by bornadog

I think that would be ideal.

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Cairns before the bye should be our first request, I wonder if our club has asked for that?

If we needed to play 3 at Ballarat, then I think we need to push for more Etihad games to be the venue for at least 3 away games. That is we will play other tenants there no matter what (home or away team), but some away teams like Geelong & Collingwood occasionally play home games there. So we should be asking for 3 replacement games for our members all at Etihad and for support for us growing into regional Victoria. With the AFEL now owning Etihad, more games at their ground suits them too.

So I'd say a mix like (dependant on ladder position, and grouping):

(Based on this year, indicative only)

3 Ballarat (Port, GWS, Brisbane)
8 Etihad - Home (North, St Kilda, WCE, Adelaide, GCS, Richmond, Melbourne, Sydney)
4 Etihad - Away/Replacememt (minimum 3) (North, Essendon, Carlton, Geelong)
5 Interstate - Away (No Cairns) (WCE, Freo, Sydney, GWS, Brisbane)
2 MCG - Away (Collingwood, Hawthorn)

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Originally Posted by bulldogtragic

Yep, we've signed Asics, Mercedes, PowerCor, PCCU and re-signed Mission. Coteries & Social Club sold out. The Premiership cheque. 8,000 new members up on last year. More exposure to Friday & Saturday nights. And Ballarat hopefully bringing in some cash.

Agree, I get Cairns makes good money too, but it's not helping on field performance and we've got a chance to remodel our finances to leave Cairns out among these new revenue sources (especially if we can improve WO to make more cash). If it means taking Ballarat to 3 games so be it.

But Ballarat right now seems a little shaky to me. If the club was confident in Ballrat then surely Cairns would go. The inference I draw is we are not prepared to let Cairns because we are not as confident in Ballarat.

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My takeout from the article is that Cairns will go as soon as the next phase of construction for Eureka is confirmed, and Gary Kent is doing the right thing to keep this issue in the public domain. I'd be very happy to give Cairns the 'lemonade and sars' as soon as Eureka is at 20k capacity, but the reality is that we still need Cairns and the cash injection until such a time as an alternative arrangement presents itself - hopefully this is Ballarat. Playing GC at Etihad would be a disaster - the net loss would be closer to 750k (loss of Cairns revenue plus loss of gate receipts for hosting the match at Etihad) and we'd be scheduled an extra interstate away match in any event.

That whole article was written to deliver one message to the new management of Etihad stadium:

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That would drop the Dogs to only eight home matches at Etihad Stadium

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Don't dick us around any more. We will take our club and our support elsewhere. Things have changed, get used to it.

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Originally Posted by Sedat

My takeout from the article is that Cairns will go as soon as the next phase of construction for Eureka is confirmed, and Gary Kent is doing the right thing to keep this issue in the public domain. I'd be very happy to give Cairns the 'lemonade and sars' as soon as Eureka is at 20k capacity, but the reality is that we still need Cairns and the cash injection until such a time as an alternative arrangement presents itself - hopefully this is Ballarat. Playing GC at Etihad would be a disaster - the net loss would be closer to 750k (loss of Cairns revenue plus loss of gate receipts for hosting the match at Etihad) and we'd be scheduled an extra interstate away match in any event.

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And frankly who wants to see Gold Coast play footy live. At least on TV you only have to pretend to be interested.

I love the Cairns games. The prospect of travelling to Ballarat in the middle of winter does absolutely nothing for me. If they go there, I'll be watching from home.

Cairns is an aberration. No home crowd, climate, membership or home ground advantage.
Ballarat given the chance and with the right promotion, can cover all of these bases.
I live in Brisbane, love the Dogs.. and I will NEVER travel there. What's the attraction, apart from giving a potential boost to Gold Coast for a parochial, and tiny Qld audience. Yay for the 100 Bulldog supporters that ultimately choose to seek a bit of sun up north.
I'd rather the noise of 5000 parochial Dogs supporters who make the journey to Ballarat, and perhaps the 8000 locals and near locals who appreciate the Dogs for getting an AFL game to Ballarat.

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Originally Posted by Yankee Hotel Foxtrot

Cairns is an aberration. No home crowd, climate, membership or home ground advantage.
Ballarat given the chance and with the right promotion, can cover all of these bases.
I live in Brisbane, love the Dogs.. and I will NEVER travel there.

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Cairns do you mean YHF? Cairns is lovely but footy is the last thing I associate with it. Great Barrier Reeef, the Daintree and Kuranda and the sugar train are what I remember about Cairns. And the Hard Ons happened to play two shows while we were there-they were as surprised to see us as we were to see them " I thought you guys never left St Kilda" Keish said.

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Originally Posted by ledge

Funny isn't it . We can play at a stadium that only fits 11,000 but can't play a game at Whitten oval.

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We are focused into Ballarat now but certainly wish that was a possibility still. Certainly would need a revamp from its current state although it has certainly progressed in getting a lights for night games there. I wonder why we didn't go for the WO option originally? I'd say for our country supporters are great opportunity for them to go to a game closer to home.

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Originally Posted by Yankee Hotel Foxtrot

Cairns is an aberration. No home crowd, climate, membership or home ground advantage.
Ballarat given the chance and with the right promotion, can cover all of these bases.
I live in Brisbane, love the Dogs.. and I will NEVER travel there. What's the attraction, apart from giving a potential boost to Gold Coast for a parochial, and tiny Qld audience. Yay for the 100 Bulldog supporters that ultimately choose to seek a bit of sun up north.
I'd rather the noise of 5000 parochial Dogs supporters who make the journey to Ballarat, and perhaps the 8000 locals and near locals who appreciate the Dogs for getting an AFL game to Ballarat.

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The attraction?,How about getting out of Melbourne's oppressively cold winter and seeing the sun for few days. I went last year for the first time, left work at 4.30 and it was 10 degrees. 10 bloody degrees. Arrived up north the next day at lunch, and it was 24 (and that was unseasonally cool) . Absolutely no contest. I don't know how you reach the conclusion that the climate isn't a factor, or that Ballarat can match the climate. The ground has a great atmosphere and the locals love having us up there. I won't ever go to a game in Ballarat in winter. It'll be just another game on TV.

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Originally Posted by AndrewP6

I won't ever go to a game in Ballarat in winter. It'll be just another game on TV.

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As is the Cairns game for 99% of Dogs fans.

And an even better bonus of playing in Ballarat? We may actually have a chance at winning the week after, given we don't have to slog it out in tropical conditions.

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Originally Posted by comrade

As is the Cairns game for 99% of Dogs fans.

And an even better bonus of playing in Ballarat? We may actually have a chance at winning the week after, given we don't have to slog it out in tropical conditions.

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The game is on July 22 at 4:30pm, the temperature will be below 25 degrees. The older blokes will probably have a better time of it than in Ballarat. We have an 8 day break afterwards against Essendon at home

I get selling home games is not great for our heartland, but Ballarat is not going to come close in terms of the money it nets the club

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Originally Posted by boydogs

The game is on July 22 at 4:30pm, the temperature will be below 25 degrees. The older blokes will probably have a better time of it than in Ballarat. We have an 8 day break afterwards against Essendon at home

I get selling home games is not great for our heartland, but Ballarat is not going to come close in terms of the money it nets the club

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We need to move beyond chasing money over on field results. Check our record in the round following the Cairns match. It's not pleasant.

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Originally Posted by boydogs

The game is on July 22 at 4:30pm, the temperature will be below 25 degrees. The older blokes will probably have a better time of it than in Ballarat. We have an 8 day break afterwards against Essendon at home

I get selling home games is not great for our heartland, but Ballarat is not going to come close in terms of the money it nets the club

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Ballarat represents a great opportunity to grow our membership base in a football area. Cairns offers nothing other than coin.
Any Cairns locals at the game are going to be supporting Gold Coast.
As for the climate for our players comfort, i think a cold game will be more easier in termsof post match recovery than a humid game in Cairns.

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Originally Posted by Yankee Hotel Foxtrot

Ballarat represents a great opportunity to grow our membership base in a football area. Cairns offers nothing other than coin.
Any Cairns locals at the game are going to be supporting Gold Coast.
As for the climate for our players comfort, i think a cold game will be more easier in termsof post match recovery than a humid game in Cairns.

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Plus the players save 8 hours of flight time, and get to sleep in their own beds, maintain normal routines and I'd imagine getting able to do quicker and more thorough post game recovery. If that helps with winning the game, and a better chance of winning the next week then take the cash on offer at Ballarat and drop the Cairns game. With revenue from Ballarat memberships, Ballarat Council and you'd think a percentage from gates and food/grog sales then even if we only make $300,000 compared to $500,000 (Cairns), it's worth it from a winning perspective. Which is actually the point of a footy club that has plenty of sponsors, which we now do.

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Originally Posted by Yankee Hotel Foxtrot

Ballarat represents a great opportunity to grow our membership base in a football area. Cairns offers nothing other than coin.
Any Cairns locals at the game are going to be supporting Gold Coast.
As for the climate for our players comfort, i think a cold game will be more easier in termsof post match recovery than a humid game in Cairns.

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Not necessarily. Spoke to quite a few, and there were neutrals there happy to see us.

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Originally Posted by comrade

As is the Cairns game for 99% of Dogs fans.

And an even better bonus of playing in Ballarat? We may actually have a chance at winning the week after, given we don't have to slog it out in tropical conditions.

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They'll find another excuse. If players who are professional athletes, highly trained with the latest and greatest support systems on offer, can't sit on a plane for 3 and a bit hours, or pay a match in weather conditions that are very mild, I give up. They don't walk to Cairns.

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Originally Posted by AndrewP6

They'll find another excuse. If players who are professional athletes, highly trained with the latest and greatest support systems on offer, can't sit on a plane for 3 and a bit hours, or pay a match in weather conditions that are very mild, I give up. They don't walk to Cairns.

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How long have you been a qualified Sports Scientist?

In all seriousness, why do you think we struggle to win post-Cairns matches?