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  1. #1
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    Collingwood and the Cap

    It's been widely reported Collingwood have issues with the cap - hence Aish's departure.

    With Grundy signing and Beams' issues, they again face a squeeze this year. Moore and De Goey are the high profile signings, but there are other players that have performed well with little fanfare.

    An interesting one is Tom Phillips - outside runner with a huge tank and performance clauses in his contract he smashed last year. He could be a target for a team looking for a solid wingman who just flies under the radar.
    Western Bulldogs: 2016 Premiers

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    Re: Collingwood and the Cap

    Quote Originally Posted by Mofra View Post
    It's been widely reported Collingwood have issues with the cap - hence Aish's departure.

    With Grundy signing and Beams' issues, they again face a squeeze this year. Moore and De Goey are the high profile signings, but there are other players that have performed well with little fanfare.

    An interesting one is Tom Phillips - outside runner with a huge tank and performance clauses in his contract he smashed last year. He could be a target for a team looking for a solid wingman who just flies under the radar.
    At least some of Beams' salary will be wiped off in short order, you'd imagine.
    Our 1954 premiership players are our heroes, and it has to be said that Charlie was their hero.

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    Re: Collingwood and the Cap

    This article talks about the Beams situation and Tom Phillips:

    How much will the Dayne Beams deal cost the Pies, or can they break even despite his exit?

    On September 1 2018, Dayne Beams stood in front of the Brisbane faithful and declared his love for the club and his future within it.

    That connection was the “driving factor” in him wanting to honour his contract. Beams’s final message was: “I love you boys.”

    But in the hours after that best-and-fairest second placing the Lions reconciled themselves to his eventual departure.

    During a long and emotional late-night discussion with club powerbrokers, Beams railed against his second placing to Dayne Zorko, adamant he would have been a worthy winner.

    It would take the better part of two months for Brisbane to trade Beams back to Collingwood, yet by the end of that night the Lions knew they would trade him if the right deal was presented.

    As one Lions insider said, a captain who should be the most low-maintenance figure at a football club had instead become its most high-maintenance.

    Despite its public position to the contrary, Brisbane had reconciled itself to trading its star midfielder.

    Beams is now a Collingwood player in name only as his management and the club work on a financial settlement that could still be months in the making.

    But to present this as a case of Collingwood bungling a $2 million deal with reckless disregard for Beams’s issues is unfair, too.

    Collingwood knew that Beams’s mental ill health was multifaceted and borne out of more than grief for his father’s death.

    The club that once hired a private investigator and spoke to chief commissioner Christine Nixon about the risk profile of Ben Cousins will have its own thoughts on its levels of due diligence.

    But it shared the view of Brisbane’s mental health experts: that like many players in football, Beams would need help and guidance to maximise his mental health, but could be effectively managed.

    To go into those details helps no party given Beams remains away from the game consulting experts about his mental health.

    But Beams was the last deal done in trade week — half an hour before deadline — and the Lions weren’t desperate to retain Beams (having just traded for Lachie Neale). But they wouldn't have done so without a quality trade.

    If Collingwood cannot get salary cap relief from the AFL for Beams’s extraordinary circumstances — and why wouldn’t it ask — it will be on the hook for whatever it eventually settles for with Beams.

    The Pies know more than anyone premierships are won and lost on fine margins, privately aware they wouldn’t have done the deal if they hadn’t been so close against West Coast a month before.

    Only time will tell whether those selections and cap space cost them the players that might have been the difference when the next opportunity comes around.

    The $2 million salary handed to Beams might be more problematic long term than the two first-round picks Collingwood handed up for the midfielder.

    When the Magpies traded for Beams he was fresh off the All-Australian squad after averaging 29 disposals and 5.6 clearances. The Pies had just lost a Grand Final by a kick.

    He had the backing of good mate Steele Sidebottom and met with coach Nathan Buckley to repair an at-times frosty previous relationship.

    Collingwood, having secured Jordan De Goey and Jack Crisp in its initial trade with Brisbane for Beams, gave up picks 18 and 56 and its 2019 first-rounder, and got back Beams plus picks 41 and 44.

    It immediately parlayed those picks into academy selection Isaac Quaynor (pick 13), and father-son Will Kelly (29), also securing academy kid Atu Bosenavulagi (77).

    Last November as a result of handing its first-rounder to Brisbane, its first pick was midfielder Jay Rantall at pick 40, then Trent Bianco at 45 and Trey Ruscoe at 55.

    If you want to kick the Pies you can say they handed over picks that in 2018 gave the Lions exciting midfielder Ely Smith and the Power in 2019 likely Round 1 debutant Mitch Georgiades (Port swapped picks with the Lions).

    The Pies took Beams knowing they had a trio of father-son and academy picks coming up.

    Quaynor is now exciting the Magpies after a huge pre-season while late pick Bosenavulagi is also showing promise.

    Rantall hasn’t missed a beat all summer and he, too, might make an early debut.

    If Quaynor turns into an elite half-back and former basketballer Tom Wilson can fire after a strong pre-season as a Category B rookie, it’s not the lost first-round selections that will hurt.

    The sum total of their gains and losses from the two-year period might be a breakeven.

    It’s the salary cap effect that potentially hurts.

    Last year’s sleeper trade that never happened was of wingman Tom Phillips, who the Pies were willing to move on despite a new contract signed in early 2019 and his 572-possession year.

    Geelong was a suitor given it needed outside run and might have offered a long-term deal, but Phillips simply wasn’t interested. Fair enough, given his new deal.

    If Phillips hits the markers for his performance clauses he can make a lucrative sum this season, which will put even more pressure on the Pies’ salary cap.

    He runs all day, rarely misses a game and is the kind of mid-priced player a tight cap could squeeze out.


    Brodie Grundy’s seven-year deal actually gives the Pies flexibility to defer some of his money to later years.

    If Darcy Moore puts together a solid season he will be paid accordingly, but the wildcard is the unpredictable De Goey, soon to be with his third management group.

    But the Pies will feel the fallout from Beams’s salary if Phillips is tipped out or De Goey accepts a mega-deal elsewhere that the Pies could have matched with that lost salary cap space.

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  5. #4
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    Re: Collingwood and the Cap

    Quote Originally Posted by comrade View Post
    At least some of Beams' salary will be wiped off in short order, you'd imagine.
    There has been talk that unlike Tom Boyd, Beams will not leave the money on the table and may even be asking for his full contact to be paid. In that case Collingwood may have to include it all in the cap.

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  7. #5
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    Re: Collingwood and the Cap

    Quote Originally Posted by Axe Man View Post
    There has been talk that unlike Tom Boyd, Beams will not leave the money on the table and may even be asking for his full contact to be paid. In that case Collingwood may have to include it all in the cap.
    The rumour mill is in overdrive about Beams, including the decision to step away from football isn't entirely his own.
    Either way it's been a terrible deal for Collingwood.
    Western Bulldogs: 2016 Premiers

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    Re: Collingwood and the Cap

    One thing that article highlights to me is how well Brisbane have traded in recent history. Of course you're going to trade Beams in that circumstance (imagine complaining about a second place finish in the B&F) but you wouldn't have known it at the time. Quite the contrast to the normal circumstances (like Stringer with us)

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    Re: Collingwood and the Cap

    Quote Originally Posted by hujsh View Post
    One thing that article highlights to me is how well Brisbane have traded in recent history. Of course you're going to trade Beams in that circumstance (imagine complaining about a second place finish in the B&F) but you wouldn't have known it at the time. Quite the contrast to the normal circumstances (like Stringer with us)
    All of the industry insiders would have known.
    Nobody's looking for a puppeteer in today's wintry economic climate.

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    Re: Collingwood and the Cap

    Quote Originally Posted by Axe Man View Post
    There has been talk that unlike Tom Boyd, Beams will not leave the money on the table and may even be asking for his full contact to be paid. In that case Collingwood may have to include it all in the cap.
    Yeah, just read that. I assumed he'd cut a deal ala Boyd, but not everyone is cut from the same cloth as big Tommy.
    Our 1954 premiership players are our heroes, and it has to be said that Charlie was their hero.

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    Re: Collingwood and the Cap

    Quote Originally Posted by comrade View Post
    Yeah, just read that. I assumed he'd cut a deal ala Boyd, but not everyone is cut from the same cloth as big Tommy.
    He had it all, talented, articulated and intelligent. Not sure if Beams has the same post career prospects as our Tom.
    Nobody's looking for a puppeteer in today's wintry economic climate.

  12. #10
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    Re: Collingwood and the Cap

    Quote Originally Posted by jeemak View Post
    He had it all, talented, articulated and intelligent. Not sure if Beams has the same post career prospects as our Tom.
    That's true, his circumstances are different.
    Our 1954 premiership players are our heroes, and it has to be said that Charlie was their hero.

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    Re: Collingwood and the Cap

    Quote Originally Posted by jeemak View Post
    He had it all, talented, articulated and intelligent. Not sure if Beams has the same post career prospects as our Tom.
    I guess you could ask what Beams lacks. As a player he is/was certainly talented.

    Maybe he struggles with the other 2 traits.
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    Re: Collingwood and the Cap

    Collingwood still have cap issues.

    Sam Edmund:

    There's been rumours floating around relating to more Collingwood players who have pushed money back. Now Pies footy boss Graham Wright on @SENBreakfast this morning: "There's still a hangover in relation to the salary cap. We've still got some issues we're dealing with there"
    Can we help them again and take Darcy Moore off their hands
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    Premierships: AFL 1954, 2016 VFA - 1898,99,1900, 1908, 1913, 1919-20, 1923-24, VFL: 2014, 2016 . Champions of Victoria 1924. AFLW - 2018.

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  16. #13
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    Re: Collingwood and the Cap

    Quote Originally Posted by bornadog View Post
    Collingwood still have cap issues.

    Sam Edmund:



    Can we help them again and take Darcy Moore off their hands
    He’s out contract next year, and a free agent. They’re going to have to match his $800,000 as a minimum long term. If Moore could get that money elsewhere at a contender, and they got a great trade back and fixed their cap, it might demand some consideration from them. They might still say no, but who knows if they haven’t fixed it by now.
    Rocket Science: the epitaph for the Beveridge era - whenever it ends - reading 'Here lies a team that could beat anyone on its day, but seldom did when it mattered most'. 15/7/2023

  17. #14
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    Re: Collingwood and the Cap

    Quote Originally Posted by bulldogtragic View Post
    He’s out contract next year, and a free agent. They’re going to have to match his $800,000 as a minimum long term. If Moore could get that money elsewhere at a contender, and they got a great trade back and fixed their cap, it might demand some consideration from them. They might still say no, but who knows if they haven’t fixed it by now.
    I mean, if it was even a possibility, you would hope we'd do everything in our...power...to make it happen. Moore in our backline, I can't even fathom how good it would be.
    Our 1954 premiership players are our heroes, and it has to be said that Charlie was their hero.

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    Re: Collingwood and the Cap

    Quote Originally Posted by comrade View Post
    I mean, if it was even a possibility, you would hope we'd do everything in our...power...to make it happen. Moore in our backline, I can't even fathom how good it would be.
    They wouldn’t want a first rounder this year, owing to Daicos. We’d need it to cover Darcy.

    Spitballing. So a future first rounder, Young to give them KP depth for Moore leaving and then a genuinely good player. Would Richards (yet to re-commit) and a famous club family be enough? Or is it more Bailey Smith?
    Rocket Science: the epitaph for the Beveridge era - whenever it ends - reading 'Here lies a team that could beat anyone on its day, but seldom did when it mattered most'. 15/7/2023

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