List Management for 2020/21

[The Doctor]

Schack did have a number of injuries in the second half of the season. True he was dropped savagely but really never had the time to work on it uninjured and push for a place. The potential plus side with Schack is worth keeping him on, particularly ahead of players like Dale, Gowers, Greene and Lloyd, and with Dicko retired. He's our mobile forward mid who happens to be a lot taller.

Can we find him a mentor who will turn it around for him? Johnno maybe?

What about Chris Grant?

I think Schache has not been handled all that well by the club this year. There are certainly things in his game the club wants him to better at which is fair enough but they also came out and publicly said he needed to be more aggressive, physical etc. It implied he wouldn't play until he developed that side of his game.

What I don't get then is the hypocrisy of then playing Lipinski who is arguably the softest player on our list and was a complete liability in a final for the 2nd year in a row.

As I said in another thread I think our forward line functions better, generally, with Schache in it. He leads well, is more mobile than Bruce, and a very good set shot. In 2019 with him in the team we were the 3rd highest scoring team. This year without him, but Bruce in, we were the 6th highest scoring team.

I'd like to see us persevere with Schache a bit more.

[SquirrelGrip]

What about Chris Grant?

I think Schache has not been handled all that well by the club this year. There are certainly things in his game the club wants him to better at which is fair enough but they also came out and publicly said he needed to be more aggressive, physical etc. It implied he wouldn't play until he developed that side of his game.

What I don't get then is the hypocrisy of then playing Lipinski who is arguably the softest player on our list and was a complete liability in a final for the 2nd year in a row.

As I said in another thread I think our forward line functions better, generally, with Schache in it. He leads well, is more mobile than Bruce, and a very good set shot. In 2019 with him in the team we were the 3rd highest scoring team. This year without him, but Bruce in, we were the 6th highest scoring team.

I'd like to see us persevere with Schache a bit more.

Chris Grant is another good mentor option for him. There is definite upside with Schache. The reason I suggested Johnno is because I think his success is going to be as that mobile forward mid rather than a Chris Grant key position physical and aggressive player. Johnno is our club's best ever mobile forward mid.

[soupman]

Is Alex Pearce an option?

That's why I brought up Brennan Cox earlier. Pearce is their first choice tall defender (along with Logue), but was injured a fair bit of this year. Pearce is very good, and they'll be keen to keep him. But they won't play all three of those guys, meaning Cox, who acquitted himself quite well in the absence of the other two should be available and for a reasonable price.

I would be happy to go for Pearce but he will cost a lot more and is very injury prone.

[SquirrelGrip]

That's why I brought up Brennan Cox earlier. Pearce is their first choice tall defender (along with Logue), but was injured a fair bit of this year. Pearce is very good, and they'll be keen to keep him. But they won't play all three of those guys, meaning Cox, who acquitted himself quite well in the absence of the other two should be available and for a reasonable price.

I would be happy to go for Pearce but he will cost a lot more and is very injury prone.

And I guess getting Hamling back is probably thereabouts too.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

It was interesting in what he said, Ryder plays taller than his 197cm height and that they had (was it?) 7 players around that height
He then said something about they caught us with their pace.
Perhaps we need to strike a better balance if we can recruit well

They have Marshall, Ryder, Howard, King and Carlisle at that height compared to us with Naughton, Bruce, English, Keath, Gardner and Cordy. So we had more "tall" players but 4 out of their 5 are 200cm+ as opposed to just 1 for us. Then you need to consider the physicality of their bigs compared to ours.

On the other end, they have a great blend of speed whereas we are quite slow. They've got Hill, Jones (although I don't think he's as quick as the media make out), Clark, Butler, Billings, Sinclair and even Lonie can be quick of a step (not over distance). Us? Well we have JJ and Richards and to a degree Smith.

The saints have a great blend of physical talls and speed at ground level. They've got a great balance. We don't. We have talls who don't like physical contact save for Naughton, Bruce and Keath. Then we have one-paced mids who either don't like physical contact, or they can't kick with any penetration. Bont and Smith are the exceptions. On their own, the players on our list are good footballers. But as a team they don't complement eachother at all.

[soupman]

I really like the Daicos suggestion. It would seem unlikely he would be available but if they are struggling to fit in all of Moore, De Goey, Mihocek etc and there was a chance we should be having a real dip.

Yep at worst we make life tough for Collingwood and I think we really lack that creative half forward type that brings others into the game and is dangerous himself, man i wish we went after him at the end of last year when he was worth nothing.

We have long been linked with Isaac Smith who could still be a FA option for us. Bur what about Lewis Jetta? He is actually a bit younger than Smith and a 2 time premiership player who might be available.

That's a good suggestion and one I hadn't considered. His kicking is awesome too which could be a real point of difference to Hunter.

Interesting that there are many indigenous players available that seem to fit our needs this year. If we come out of this off season again lamenting that the reason we don't have any indigenous blokes on our list is because there weren't any available I will be very disappointed, JUH should definitely have company.

Jake Carlisle will be 29 next year and in his prime for a key defender and could easily anchor our defence. I get all the numpty accusations but what do we want? A team of choir boys? He's a very good player and I actually liked he went home to be with his wife for the birth of their child. It looks like Saints will let him go so I doubt he would cost much more than a late pick or possibly even be a DFA.

I've never really liked him before but i have really warmed to the idea. We don't need him to star, but to have a huge guy like him with a pretty impressive grab makes the roles of Keath and Gardner/Cordy so much easier. Sure he is slow but if he plays that anchor role in defence I think we could make it work.

In a year where we have limited draft picks some of these boys would help fill holes in our list without incurring heavy cost and all would be expected to play round 1 next year.

And the thing is we love handing out multiple years to marginal talents to give them every chance of succeeding (see Dale, Lynch, Smith, Sweet, Hayes, Khamis, Greene). Why don't we grab some of these guys that have shown glimpses (or more) at AFL level, fill areas of need and have a point of difference to the rest of our list, could have an impact immediately and all save us that first year or two of investment in a draftee new to the AFL system.

[soupman]

Also big no to Peter Wright. After Josh Bruce and Tom Boyd I don't want yet another lumbering tall who is a mediocre mark, liability on the ground and wouldn't even be on a list if they were 10cm's shorter.

[jazzadogs]

Bruce was disappointing, unfit and struggled to adapt to our structure this year. This does not mean that the trade is a failure and he will never play a good game for us. Here are his highlights from only 12 months ago - while there is always a chance that he won't get this speed and agility back, I think you could visibly see that he was fitter as season 2020 went on.



FWIW, I also really like Schache and would love to see him get more opportunities.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

There's no doubt that Schache gets judged on what he can't do, as opposed to what he can do. Our forward half was so STAGNANT this year, the movement was awful and one of the only games it actually HAD movement was v Norf when Schache played (and played well).

I do think his lack of urgency/aggression is a concern, but he's the most natural forward on our list (minus Dickson who's retired). The key with Schache is putting the right players around him and that's high energy forwards who can apply pressure.

The problem is that Wallis, Lloyd, Dale, Weightman, Bruce, Lipinski etc. are all horrible at applying pressure, so they don't compliment Schache.

It may become a question of playing only one from that list above, max of 2. I like Wallis and respect what he's done, but a slow medium forward who doesn't pressure and relies on 1-v-1's? I'll pick Schache.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Bruce was disappointing, unfit and struggled to adapt to our structure this year. This does not mean that the trade is a failure and he will never play a good game for us. Here are his highlights from only 12 months ago - while there is always a chance that he won't get this speed and agility back, I think you could visibly see that he was fitter as season 2020 went on.



FWIW, I also really like Schache and would love to see him get more opportunities.

Yeah I'm not writing him off just yet. He's capable of so much better. Plus it would be very difficult being a forward for us with our putrid delivery and setup. That's not to excuse him, he's been poor and obviously unfit but any forward for us is up against it.

[bornadog]

There's no doubt that Schache gets judged on what he can't do, as opposed to what he can do. Our forward half was so STAGNANT this year, the movement was awful and one of the only games it actually HAD movement was v Norf when Schache played (and played well).

I do think his lack of urgency/aggression is a concern, but he's the most natural forward on our list (minus Dickson who's retired). The key with Schache is putting the right players around him and that's high energy forwards who can apply pressure.

The problem is that Wallis, Lloyd, Dale, Weightman, Bruce, Lipinski etc. are all horrible at applying pressure, so they don't compliment Schache.

It may become a question of playing only one from that list above, max of 2. I like Wallis and respect what he's done, but a slow medium forward who doesn't pressure and relies on 1-v-1's? I'll pick Schache.

Agree, we can't play all those players together. We really need a small pressure forward who can also crumb the ball and kick goals.

Back in Rockets day, we were one of the highest scoring teams, and there were at least 4 players that kicked 20 plus goals each for the year. We need more contributors.

[soupman]

Yeah I'm not writing him off just yet. He's capable of so much better. Plus it would be very difficult being a forward for us with our putrid delivery and setup. That's not to excuse him, he's been poor and obviously unfit but any forward for us is up against it.

He is, which means its frustrating to see him not being dropped for being so much worse than he should be. I don't get to keep my job because I have the potential to do it to a competent standard.

[SquirrelGrip]

Do we have a Round 1 Team 2021 thread yet?

What's our best lineup moving forward? Who will be next year's Flying Dutchman/Bailey Williams and take the big step up? West, Garcia, Butler, Weightman?

[bornadog]

Do we have a Round 1 Team 2021 thread yet?

What's our best lineup moving forward? Who will be next year's Flying Dutchman/Bailey Williams and take the big step up? West, Garcia, Butler, Weightman?

You can always start one up.

[comrade]

Do we have a Round 1 Team 2021 thread yet?

What's our best lineup moving forward? Who will be next year's Flying Dutchman/Bailey Williams and take the big step up? West, Garcia, Butler, Weightman?

I'm hopeful Garcia brings some pace and intensity to our forward line.