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  1. #46
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    Re: Always Right Match Committee - Round 8 Vs Carlton 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by FrediKanoute View Post
    Out: Schache, Hannan, JJ, Scott

    In: English, Wallis, Garcia, McNeil

    Cordy maybe, but only if you bring in Lew Young. I think the kid needs to play and its either him or Cordy, but I don't believe Cordy deserves the criticism he is getting here.
    Why in your opinion was Zaine's game better than the rest of us are judging him on?

  2. #47
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    Re: Always Right Match Committee - Round 8 Vs Carlton 2021

    I don't think Zaine necessarily played bad either. He just played to his capabilities which unfortunately is no longer AFL standard. He's undersized for a KPD and too slow for anything else. I think his time at AFL level is over and him getting a game for us highlights our KPD stock deficiencies.

  3. #48
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    Re: Always Right Match Committee - Round 8 Vs Carlton 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by Mantis View Post
    Why in your opinion was Zaine's game better than the rest of us are judging him on?
    I know the question is not directed at me but I'll jump in to just say that on Friday night Zaine Cordy and Alex Keath were Poland 1939. There was only going to be one result against the Blitzkrieg-like high ball entries they experienced. Richmond smelt blood down there before the game and fully exploited it. It's not so much about Zaine having a good game or a bad game it's more about the fact that he was severely undersized for the role assigned to him coupled with the sheer weight of high ball entries he had to contend with. Sure he buckled, sure he brain faded on the line but sheez he was up against it for extended periods and a little bit of help up the ground wouldn't have gone astray. I'm happy for Zaine to stay in but he needs to play on the third tall. He can't be playing on McKay or Casboult. If that means bringing Lewy in as well then so be it. I'm sick of being undermanned in defence and I'm sure Zaine is as well, he's on a hiding to nothing.

    Other posts have raised interesting points regarding his skill set. If he plays on the third tall like he should can he find the balance between being able to defend and launch? Can he do this? He's been a lockdown second tall for so long I'm not so sure. I think his game has been stunted by being played out of position for so long. I think Wood and Crozier (and Williams when he returns) are equally proficient in the air against a third tall and far more accomplished at helping get the ball out of D50 in a clean and systematic manner.

    Poor Zaine he should be Dylan Grimes but he's just not savage enough and probably lacks a yard of pace.
    But then again, I'm an Internet poster and Bevo is a premiership coach so draw your own conclusions.

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  5. #49
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    Re: Always Right Match Committee - Round 8 Vs Carlton 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by bulldogsthru&thru View Post
    I don't think Zaine necessarily played bad either. He just played to his capabilities which unfortunately is no longer AFL standard. He's undersized for a KPD and too slow for anything else. I think his time at AFL level is over and him getting a game for us highlights our KPD stock deficiencies.
    Yeah, I agree with this. He’s just not equipped to take good key forwards, and Crozier/Wood are way ahead of him when it comes tot taking the mid sized guys. He just doesn’t have the physical tools and no amount of ‘competitiveness’ can make up for it.
    Our 1954 premiership players are our heroes, and it has to be said that Charlie was their hero.

  6. #50
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    Re: Always Right Match Committee - Round 8 Vs Carlton 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by 1eyedog View Post
    I know the question is not directed at me but I'll jump in to just say that on Friday night Zaine Cordy and Alex Keath were Poland 1939. There was only going to be one result against the Blitzkrieg-like high ball entries they experienced. Richmond smelt blood down there before the game and fully exploited it. It's not so much about Zaine having a good game or a bad game it's more about the fact that he was severely undersized for the role assigned to him coupled with the sheer weight of high ball entries he had to contend with. Sure he buckled, sure he brain faded on the line but sheez he was up against it for extended periods and a little bit of help up the ground wouldn't have gone astray. I'm happy for Zaine to stay in but he needs to play on the third tall. He can't be playing on McKay or Casboult. If that means bringing Lewy in as well then so be it. I'm sick of being undermanned in defence and I'm sure Zaine is as well, he's on a hiding to nothing.

    Other posts have raised interesting points regarding his skill set. If he plays on the third tall like he should can he find the balance between being able to defend and launch? Can he do this? He's been a lockdown second tall for so long I'm not so sure. I think his game has been stunted by being played out of position for so long. I think Wood and Crozier (and Williams when he returns) are equally proficient in the air against a third tall and far more accomplished at helping get the ball out of D50 in a clean and systematic manner.

    Poor Zaine he should be Dylan Grimes but he's just not savage enough and probably lacks a yard of pace.
    I have no idea why Zaine was matched up on Lynch to start with, it's a question only the MC can answer, but it was a dumb move... and it cost us. Zaine is the same height as Riewoldt and only a couple of kilo's lighter (going by the stats I viewed) so it seems a no-brainer that he plays on Riewoldt from the start, but perhaps that was too sensible a move?

    As mentioned Zaine is a bit in no-man's land in terms of a role and I think it's time to look at someone else.

  7. #51
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    Re: Always Right Match Committee - Round 8 Vs Carlton 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by Mantis View Post
    I have no idea why Zaine was matched up on Lynch to start with, it's a question only the MC can answer, but it was a dumb move... and it cost us. Zaine is the same height as Riewoldt and only a couple of kilo's lighter (going by the stats I viewed) so it seems a no-brainer that he plays on Riewoldt from the start, but perhaps that was too sensible a move?

    As mentioned Zaine is a bit in no-man's land in terms of a role and I think it's time to look at someone else.
    Zaine on Lynch and Schache on Balta all night. Dimma must have been chuckling in the coaches box.
    Our 1954 premiership players are our heroes, and it has to be said that Charlie was their hero.

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  9. #52
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    Re: Always Right Match Committee - Round 8 Vs Carlton 2021

    We’ve gotta play Lewis Young this week. His form up and downs are pretty akin to Cordy’s but his ceiling is so much higher, and he really was excellent in the 2s.
    - I'm a visionary - Only here to confirm my biases -

  10. #53
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    Re: Always Right Match Committee - Round 8 Vs Carlton 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by bornadog View Post
    He should have tagged Houli who killed us on the rebound
    Wonder if Bevo would be well supplemented with a decent match day coach to advocate for changes when the "system" is being beaten.

    Maybe he does, but there was no clear evidence of it on Friday and my memory doesn't work well enough to go back further .

    Not saying he's not a good match day coach, but they must've seen some of the glaring issues on Friday.
    Tigers bringing extras up from forward line, Houli running rampant, Lynch match up, Schache postioning.

    I often see an animated Dean Cox in the Swans coaches box, quite often in heated discussion with Longmire.

    Without knowing how our setup works I wonder from a distance if we need a similar dissenting voice.

  11. #54
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    Re: Always Right Match Committee - Round 8 Vs Carlton 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by Grantysghost View Post
    Wonder if Bevo would be well supplemented with a decent match day coach to advocate for changes when the "system" is being beaten.

    Maybe he does, but there was no clear evidence of it on Friday and my memory doesn't work well enough to go back further .

    Not saying he's not a good match day coach, but they must've seen some of the glaring issues on Friday.
    Tigers bringing extras up from forward line, Houli running rampant, Lynch match up, Schache postioning.

    I often see an animated Dean Cox in the Swans coaches box, quite often in heated discussion with Longmire.

    Without knowing how our setup works I wonder from a distance if we need a similar dissenting voice.
    Will always be matches that get away from you or decisions that don’t come off, that’s the game. I am more than comfortable with the tactical and game day acumen of Luke Beveridge. Widely regarded as exceptional in this aspect.

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  13. #55
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    Re: Always Right Match Committee - Round 8 Vs Carlton 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by comrade View Post
    Zaine on Lynch and Schache on Balta all night. Dimma must have been chuckling in the coaches box.
    Broad on West wasn't advantageous to us either.... I really battled with our forward-line set up and positioning on Friday night. It was all over the shop.

    Why did we have Hannan on the wing for large parts?
    Why did it seem our 3 talls were always our deepest forwards?
    Why didn't someone (JJ or Scott) try and lock-down Houli?

    I'm going to refrain from doing my ins & outs until we get a feel for who might be back, but I think our defence needs a big re-shuffle and feel we're carrying too many of the same type down there and need some POD. Also think we need to work out our best fit for the wing role as we aren't using this position like other good teams are.

  14. #56
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    Re: Always Right Match Committee - Round 8 Vs Carlton 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by Mantis View Post
    As mentioned Zaine is a bit in no-man's land in terms of a role and I think it's time to look at someone else.
    Agree with that but the key part of the above statement is "someone else". Lewis Young has fans here but he is similarly unreliable. Schache and Bruce are desperation suggestions. I see no downside to giving Khamis a run - he is different but can offer aerial cover through his leap and can also provide run and carry - we've been a bit stodgy in that area since we lost Williams. Wood is Wood (doing the Morris role well but doesn't provide any attacking drive), Crozier is out of form and Daniel is also not at his best.
    "Look at me mate. Look at me. I'm flyin'"

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  16. #57
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    Re: Always Right Match Committee - Round 8 Vs Carlton 2021

    Zaine is NOT a kpd, even when we were on top/competitive in the first 1/4 I think Lynch took 5 or so marks in the first 10 minutes. Cordy is alas no longer AFL standard as the speed of the game this year has gone past him. Friday was a finals preview and his performance is exactly what we could expect in such a match imo. Harry McKay would be eyeing the Coleman medal.

  17. #58
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    Re: Always Right Match Committee - Round 8 Vs Carlton 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by Sedat View Post
    Agree with that but the key part of the above statement is "someone else". Lewis Young has fans here but he is similarly unreliable. Schache and Bruce are desperation suggestions. I see no downside to giving Khamis a run - he is different but can offer aerial cover through his leap and can also provide run and carry - we've been a bit stodgy in that area since we lost Williams. Wood is Wood (doing the Morris role well but doesn't provide any attacking drive), Crozier is out of form and Daniel is also not at his best.
    I'm all for swapping in Khamis for Crozier who isn't providing us much at all at present... and TBH hasn't for a while.

    Williams is a huge, huge loss for us... His ability to navigate through traffic and buy space for himself (and others) is such a rare asset.

    I'm not sold on Young either, but he at least can take a mark and has some aerial presence... he clearly is on the nose with Bevo, but he isn't afforded the same luxuries in terms of chances as the players he competes with a spot with which I'm calling out as BS... He was very good against Brisbane and then was the fall guy after a 10 goal victory. I would've been *!*!*!*!ing shitty too if I was axed in these circumstances after waiting so long for an opportunity.

  18. #59
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    Re: Always Right Match Committee - Round 8 Vs Carlton 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by dog town View Post
    Will always be matches that get away from you or decisions that don’t come off, that’s the game. I am more than comfortable with the tactical and game day acumen of Luke Beveridge. Widely regarded as exceptional in this aspect.
    Fair enough, I'm not as sure, he may well be amazing I just was left scratching my head a few times on Friday.
    Dissenting voices, disruption can be good.
    Wonder if Matthew Boyd would be useful in this type of role; recent conversations I've had with some people close to it relay he can be bloody stubborn our Luke (think we already know this).

    Re changes this week to keep it on thread, in the VFL game I thought Garcia, Khamis, Sweet, Weightman, Wallis were the standouts.
    Not sure yet what changes I'd make.
    Last edited by Grantysghost; 03-05-2021 at 11:15 AM. Reason: Forgot Wally.

  19. #60
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    Re: Always Right Match Committee - Round 8 Vs Carlton 2021

    The discussion on this forum following our first loss have been really interesting. Beveridge needs matchday tactical support, our depth sucks, Beveridge gives certain players way more leeway than others etc. 2020 vibes everywhere minus the ruck problem.

    Our 6-0 start was great, but our 2nd half on Friday did have me thinking of 2020. As usual, the reality is somewhere in the middle. Like the ruck problem, the issues currently being discussed on here have been around for some time.

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