Lets make the hard calls

[G-Mo77]

What about someone like JJ? I don't like moving on good clubman, he seems to be a well liked player amongst the group but his role is diminishing. He gained a bit more stock later in the season and could be of some value on the table. Contract is pretty weighty as well.

Just throwing it out there.

[GVGjr]

What about someone like JJ? I don't like moving on good clubman, he seems to be a well liked player amongst the group but his role is diminishing. He gained a bit more stock later in the season and could be of some value on the table. Contract is pretty weighty as well.

Just throwing it out there.

He might look for a more permanent position in the back line at another club.
I doubt we would get much for him but even though I like him he might be having a rethink if he should stick with us.

[Happy Days]

We don’t need to move anyone if we get a ruckman who can move sideways.

[jeemak]

I've been a massive supporter of his, and think he's been unfairly maligned due to a change in role resulting in different types of performances whilst effective not being as noticeable as previous ones, however, the hard call I'd be making would be tapping Easton on the shoulder for an earlier than expected retirement.

We need a more defencive and pacier edge through the midfield, and this is where I think the challenge needs to be thrown at Rhylee West to get as fit and strong as he possibly can be to help with the former (keeping in mind that while he isn't the fastest in a straight line he placed third in the smart speed agility test at the draft combine and that helps with not being lost in traffic). This might mean we get Macrae onto a wing more often if West is going to play that role. Garcia can help with the pace and class, and I look forward to seeing how far he can go with a full preseason under his belt.

I'd also be looking elsewhere for a midfielder who is quick and defencively minded, at the expense of JJ and Crozier who should be traded out. We just don't get back quickly enough, and it was shown up in the second half of the game where Melbourne were on top of the ground probably due to being fresher than us, but also because they bust a gut to go both ways. The pace at which their mids run back versus the pace that ours do is noticeable.

There's no hard calls to be made regarding tall defenders and rucks. We're clearly deficient in these areas and one must assume they're front of mind for Sam Power and the MC etc.. I don't think Sweet is retained if we land someone, rather, Martin goes to the rookie list, we persevere with Tim and see what we can find in the state leagues as further back up for 2023 assuming competition gets rolling again in 2022.

I feel Treloar and Dunkley both get better with an uninterrupted preseason and this helps both of them with their two way running. The latter's kicking really really concerns me. It's just not good enough and crumbles under pressure. I know he won't be traded, but someone getting the ball as often as he does is a bit of a liability under pressure in big games, and I just don't know what we do about it or if he can get better.

In our heart of hearts do we really think Khamis is going to make further strides and reach the fitness levels required after another preseason? He might, but I wonder if the resources in development might be better placed elsewhere.

I don't think we hang onto Young, Wallis or Lapinski and that's probably OK. But I do think Young could be a genuine interceptor and with Wood being retired we may now have the chance to configure our defence and train for that accordingly over the preseason but I'm resigned to that being unlikely.

But I think the hardest call needs to be made with how our on field leadership functions, and who helps Bont lead at the coal face. Bont seems to me to be a lead by example/ deeds type of captain and that's great, but there needs to be someone in the group who is respected and able to get into the ears of the likes of him, Jacko and Libba to help them think situations through more clearly and respond to what's happening on the ground in the heat of the moment........or after the same thing happening a few times, or being likely to happen as was the case last night and numerous times in the season.

[Vred]

What would we have to give up for Naitanui and is it even possible?

I ask because, I feel that if we had NN in our side, we’d have been a chance last night. Being dominated in the ruck is too big of a Achilles heel with the 6, 6, 6 rule in place. Because that’s where they got hold of us and swung the game. We fought hard for the secondary stoppage, but the dam wall eventually burst.

I can’t help thinking that big Nick would potentially turn us into the yardstick of the competition.

Would an English trade and a pick get him? JU-H?
Would we be prepared to do it?

If the media and rumors behind the scenes are to be bought into, hearing that the club is potentially shopping English around to the WA teams, for what? I don't know. Why? Supposedly wants to head back to WA to be with his missus.

Adam Cooney on his show is adamant English won't be on our list next year, but again, grain of salt.

Hypothetically, if we could turn English into an actual competent ruck, I'd take it. Is NicNat the answer tho? Doubt it.

[soupman]

Really good post Jeemak.

Wood just signed a deal for next year, and I will thus settle for his spot not being guaranteed. In his defence I thought he played a solid finals series excluding last night, and that was hardly just a him problem. I do want us to try to turn his spot into something else that isn't either he nor Crozier (who are both shadows of what they used to be in the air, not as good one on one as they need to be and liabilities by foot).

I quite like the idea of Schache there, he would brings good footskills and composure to the spot. Duryea becomes our only medium lockdown guy, and the Cordy/Gardner/any okish tall defender spot remains. Alternatively I'd look to get someone who can play as that main lockdown tall to take that spot and free Keath up a bit, but don't think thats really Bevos go.

[soupman]

As for the idea of getting a leader in, there are a few options.

Nick Vlastuin could be an option. Takes the Wood role and is an immediate upgrade (although shorter than what I mentioned). Tough and successful, i think he is a leader type and is only 27. Don't think he's gettable but could be an interesting one to ask the question.

Another different type could be Jeremy Howe, in a real effort to reincarnate peak Wood/Crozier. Is 31 and it a bit injury prone so not sure on him (don't watch much Collingwood) but would probably be cheap and we could "help" them with their salary cap. Less of a leader type though.

The other one I like (but would require us to find another spot in our midfield rotations) is Liam Shiels. Is only 30, has been kind of the unsung member of the Hawks dynasty, is a really good support mid who does the defensive stuff so the others don't have to. Could be an interesting option to give our midfield a bit more of a two way ability. Probably the best fit in terms of addressing our midfields weakness.

[jeemak]

Really good post Jeemak.

Wood just signed a deal for next year, and I will thus settle for his spot not being guaranteed. In his defence I thought he played a solid finals series excluding last night, and that was hardly just a him problem. I do want us to try to turn his spot into something else that isn't either he nor Crozier (who are both shadows of what they used to be in the air, not as good one on one as they need to be and liabilities by foot).

I quite like the idea of Schache there, he would brings good footskills and composure to the spot. Duryea becomes our only medium lockdown guy, and the Cordy/Gardner/any okish tall defender spot remains. Alternatively I'd look to get someone who can play as that main lockdown tall to take that spot and free Keath up a bit, but don't think thats really Bevos go.

Thanks soup.

While he should be tapped on the shoulder it's unlikely to happen so at a minimum the course of action you mention is something I'd be comfortable with, as long as we stick true to it. And again, I agree that his finals spot was justified but he did seem shaky a lot of the time and on edge irrespective of the solid performances. He had an injury interrupted year, so it will be interesting to see if he can stop the slide with a really good preseason or whether it's how it is from here on.

See I considered Schache because he has great foot skills and they're something that Young doesn't have. If you recall from earlier posts when debating his exclusion I've pointed to Young's disposal efficiency and the possibility that while he does play long minutes and cover substantial ground when in defence he might not do it to the level others can. Schache can be superior in these areas but the one thing Lewie does have is an innate ability to actually read the ball in flight and intercept. So I guess it comes down to what's more important for the role, and whether Schache can learn how to intercept at Lewie's level. If he can, which I'm kinda doubtful of - but willing to be surprised, he could be the right option.

[soupman]

If the media and rumors behind the scenes are to be bought into, hearing that the club is potentially shopping English around to the WA teams, for what? I don't know. Why? Supposedly wants to head back to WA to be with his missus.

Adam Cooney on his show is adamant English won't be on our list next year, but again, grain of salt.

Hypothetically, if we could turn English into an actual competent ruck, I'd take it. Is NicNat the answer tho? Doubt it.

I know he signed a contract already but would Lloyd Meek be worth talking to? If English goes surely you could get a top 10 pick + Meek back. Freo have pick 8 (and probably 6 for Cerra) so it's feasible.

That would fill the first ruck spot (this is assuming Meek is actually good).

Then if you still wanted a second ruck to replace English's spot in the side you could enquire about Ladhams who I don't think would cost much. He may be a bit of a douche but he's a decent mobile option and I'm getting the sense that there aren't a bunch of clubs fighting over him.

[soupman]

Thanks soup.

While he should be tapped on the shoulder it's unlikely to happen so at a minimum the course of action you mention is something I'd be comfortable with, as long as we stick true to it. And again, I agree that his finals spot was justified but he did seem shaky a lot of the time and on edge irrespective of the solid performances. He had an injury interrupted year, so it will be interesting to see if he can stop the slide with a really good preseason or whether it's how it is from here on.

See I considered Schache because he has great foot skills and they're something that Young doesn't have. If you recall from earlier posts when debating his exclusion I've pointed to Young's disposal efficiency and the possibility that while he does play long minutes and cover substantial ground when in defence he might not do it to the level others can. Schache can be superior in these areas but the one thing Lewie does have is an innate ability to actually read the ball in flight and intercept. So I guess it comes down to what's more important for the role, and whether Schache can learn how to intercept at Lewie's level. If he can, which I'm kinda doubtful of - but willing to be surprised, he could be the right option.

I liked the idea of Young in that role but have conceded that two seasons of the mc being utterly disinterested in playing him unless it's as our least-worst-non-ruck-ruck means that it isn't going to happen.

If Young was going to be picked I'd think he'd be fighting for the Cordy/Gardner spot. I don't think we would choose to play with three low output key defenders (Keath is ok but doesn't give a lot of drive). Schache I can see atleast becoming a bit of a hybrid one, maybe like a poor mans Lukosius? His ability with the ball is a real point of difference to the other tall backs.

[jeemak]

As for the idea of getting a leader in, there are a few options.

Nick Vlastuin could be an option. Takes the Wood role and is an immediate upgrade (although shorter than what I mentioned). Tough and successful, i think he is a leader type and is only 27. Don't think he's gettable but could be an interesting one to ask the question.

Another different type could be Jeremy Howe, in a real effort to reincarnate peak Wood/Crozier. Is 31 and it a bit injury prone so not sure on him (don't watch much Collingwood) but would probably be cheap and we could "help" them with their salary cap. Less of a leader type though.

The other one I like (but would require us to find another spot in our midfield rotations) is Liam Shiels. Is only 30, has been kind of the unsung member of the Hawks dynasty, is a really good support mid who does the defensive stuff so the others don't have to. Could be an interesting option to give our midfield a bit more of a two way ability. Probably the best fit in terms of addressing our midfields weakness.

Great suggestion but as you say, if the Tigers think they're going to have another crack at it he might be off limits. He'd definitely be able to bring some valuable leadership experience and knowledge of what it takes to play as a team consistently to the table. Also, I like the idea of a defender being that guy because he can see it from the point of view of the players really getting hammered by the results of the inaction we speak of. Plus defenders push so high up now they're constantly interacting with midfielders in general play, so communication shouldn't be an issue.

As for the other suggestions I kind of like the idea of peak Jeremy Howe, but not sure how the playing group would adjust to having Easton removed from regular footy to be replaced by someone pretty much the same age and injury prone.

How quick is Shiels these days?

[Danjul]

I liked the idea of Young in that role but have conceded that two seasons of the mc being utterly disinterested in playing him unless it's as our least-worst-non-ruck-ruck means that it isn't going to happen.

If Young was going to be picked I'd think he'd be fighting for the Cordy/Gardner spot. I don't think we would choose to play with three low output key defenders (Keath is ok but doesn't give a lot of drive). Schache I can see atleast becoming a bit of a hybrid one, maybe like a poor mans Lukosius? His ability with the ball is a real point of difference to the other tall backs.

For me the player who impressed most in the finals was Young.

He is not a ruckman but, because we had no one else, he was thrown into that role. And we all saw him get smashed. What nobody has mentioned is despite Essendon and Brisbane winning the hitouts they couldnÂ’t control the centre. Our midfielders won the centre clearances ( 14:7 and 13:10) in games we were worried about. Compare that to the GF. Our centres lost the clearances 11:19

I hope Young has impressed someone at another club who will give him some real opportunities.

[1eyedog]

As for the idea of getting a leader in, there are a few options.

Nick Vlastuin could be an option. Takes the Wood role and is an immediate upgrade (although shorter than what I mentioned). Tough and successful, i think he is a leader type and is only 27. Don't think he's gettable but could be an interesting one to ask the question.

Another different type could be Jeremy Howe, in a real effort to reincarnate peak Wood/Crozier. Is 31 and it a bit injury prone so not sure on him (don't watch much Collingwood) but would probably be cheap and we could "help" them with their salary cap. Less of a leader type though.

The other one I like (but would require us to find another spot in our midfield rotations) is Liam Shiels. Is only 30, has been kind of the unsung member of the Hawks dynasty, is a really good support mid who does the defensive stuff so the others don't have to. Could be an interesting option to give our midfield a bit more of a two way ability. Probably the best fit in terms of addressing our midfields weakness.

That's an interesting out of the box suggestion that I don't hate. I wonder if we are looking at all options whether Vandermeer can be this player? He's quick enough to run with, close space effectively and creates a lot of uncertainty in the forward line. He has bought into being a highly defensive forward and I think he's good at it.

Can he be moulded into a highly-defensive mid and play there flexibly when we start to struggle with centre clearances?

[bornadog]

For me the player who impressed most in the finals was Young.

He is not a ruckman but, because we had no one else, he was thrown into that role. And we all saw him get smashed. What nobody has mentioned is despite Essendon and Brisbane winning the hitouts they couldnÂ’t control the centre. Our midfielders won the centre clearances ( 14:7 and 13:10) in games we were worried about. Compare that to the GF. Our centres lost the clearances 11:19

I hope Young has impressed someone at another club who will give him some real opportunities.

How about Young taking over from Wood/Cordy and become the intercept player we are missing?

We can't play Wood and Cordy in the backline anymore.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

How about Young taking over from Wood/Cordy and become the intercept player we are missing?

We can't play Wood and Cordy in the backline anymore.

I don’t know why Young hasn’t replaced Cordy or Wood for this reason. Bevo obviously doesn’t trust him for one reason or another. But the kid can take a mark and reads the ball well. It’s another one of those unsolved mysteries.