It's probably just me, but this team is hard to love!

[Grantysghost]

I love this team, as I do all Bulldog teams

* Love to watch The Bont, especially his long kicking with his big left foot,

* Love watching Naughton flying through the air, and if he misses the mark, but still manages to pounce on the ball,

* Love watching Libba dig that ball out of a pack, or flip the handball over his head to a player running past.

* Love watching Tim English develop his ruck skills but also the around the ground work

* Love watching Weightman and what he brings to the forward line

* Love watching Macrae work hard and rack up so many possessions in a consistent manor

* Love watching Adz bouncing and running towards goal

* Love the backline players in Dale, Caleb and Ed

* Love watching Bailey Smith get better and better, he is strong, quick and a real bull

Just to name a few.

Looking forward to seeing JUH and Darcy develop in the future, and seeing what Arty can do.

You loved watching Billy Gowers celebrate like he just won the Melbourne cup!

[Danjul]

I love this team, as I do all Bulldog teams

* Love watching Naughton flying through the air, and if he misses the mark, but still manages to pounce on the ball,

That’s where we differ. You obviously enjoyed his goal on Friday but I was annoyed that the team selection meant that he was double tagged and wasted In the ruck all night and didn’t get the other 4 we needed.

All night we saw the ball bounce out of the scoring area because the whole team believes the way to victory is through Naughton flying above packs. Same against Adelaide when Schache was moved forward just in time to be dropped for getting only 2 goals in the second half.

[bornadog]

You loved watching Billy Gowers celebrate like he just won the Melbourne cup!

When did I say that?

[bornadog]

That’s where we differ. You obviously enjoyed his goal on Friday but I was annoyed that the team selection meant that he was double tagged and wasted In the ruck all night and didn’t get the other 4 we needed.

All night we saw the ball bounce out of the scoring area because the whole team believes the way to victory is through Naughton flying above packs. Same against Adelaide when Schache was moved forward just in time to be dropped for getting only 2 goals in the second half.

Naughton Kicked 48 goals last year, and has 30 in 12 games. He was the top contested mark last year and this year he sits on 6th out of what 700 plus players in AFL? He is also 4th for tackles inside 50, other talls no where near it.

Yes I love watching Naughton play

[whythelongface]

You refer to Friday’s game.

With 15 minutes to go I was expecting a win. And so was most of the crowd sitting near me. Geelong had stalled and we were in control. Geelong was battling to keep us out.

Then what do I see. Naughton in the ruck. We have gone into the game with one strong forward and he is in the ruck???

The problem is the sensational arrogance. Before the game we are told One ruck is enough because Geelong rucks are crap. We only need one tall forward because Geelong’s backline is crap. And our midfielders are unbeatable.

Only took 15 minutes to see it was all rubbish. The team battled on admirably only to be beaten in the end by Geelong looking for their second tall specialist forward. Who’s ever heard of a a team having a second tall forward?

It is not the players. It is the rubbish game plan that they have to keep polishing.

But it is the players. If we didn’t let their mids dominate I the early stages of the game we probably wouldn’t have lost. How can this not be the players? I get you don’t rate Bevo but it ain’t him on the field serving up the crap of not getting their hands on the ball. Apart from getting out their himself what the hell is he meant to do. When are we going to hold our players accountable for some of the shit dished out rather than just blaming the coach and the game plan. We win the 1st quarter we win the game.

[whythelongface]

This team is so frustrating but I still love ‘em. It sucks that we don’t live up to our potential and it sucks that we are waiting away the opportunity for another flag with a core group of very talented players but I still love ‘em. They represent the Bulldogs so of course I love ‘em. How can you not? Did you not live team in 2004 (or was it 2003) when we were rock bottom and finished last, or through the McCartney years when we we had talent but no coaching nous or do you only love the team when we are living up to our potential (rhetoric question and I know the answer)?

[The bulldog tragician]

I think I know where you’re coming from MJP. There was something so magical about 2016 that captured us all. There were young kids who just didn’t buy into our story of failure. There were veterans who’d seen heartbreak and were hanging on for dear life to get a flag. There were battlers rejected by other clubs or cruelled by injury who had an insatiable desire for the footy. There was a coach who was able to, amazingly, gel and inspire them all. Everything he touched turned to gold.

This “group” doesn’t have the same story. Sure we still have some of those same guys, the remaining premiership boys who have in the main gone on, inevitably, to sometimes disappoint us. The departures of others in various ways were disillusioning even when necessary. There are newer guys haven’t quite caught our imagination the same way, with the exception of Aaron Naughton. [re Bailey smith, I actually think he plays a surprisingly blue collar brand of footy at odds with his image off field]. There are battlers who are harder to root for because while they are good stories, we can also see their limitations.

I don’t care as much if they win or lose as much as I used to. The brilliance of those finals wins v Bris and Port can’t even be celebrated as much because of the way the group lost the GF. Covid has also led to a certain detachment. I still love the club. And I’ve been there for so many other crap terrible seasons. Maybe we’re in a holding pattern waiting for a new story to emerge?

Maybe just because we saw the greatest premiership fairytale ever and nothing can top it.

[Grantysghost]

But it is the players. If we didn’t let their mids dominate I the early stages of the game we probably wouldn’t have lost. How can this not be the players? I get you don’t rate Bevo but it ain’t him on the field serving up the crap of not getting their hands on the ball. Apart from getting out their himself what the hell is he meant to do. When are we going to hold our players accountable for some of the shit dished out rather than just blaming the coach and the game plan. We win the 1st quarter we win the game.

When the players do well though the coach never cops any criticism either.
So when is it OK to question the tactics?

[Danjul]

Naughton Kicked 48 goals last year, and has 30 in 12 games. He was the top contested mark last year and this year he sits on 6th out of what 700 plus players in AFL? He is also 4th for tackles inside 50, other talls no where near it.

Yes I love watching Naughton play

He got 1 goal yesterday. You should be allowed to watch him play and take contested marks and kick even more goals while I watch a winning team. And that’s a game we should have won (along with others this year) where a lot of his firepower was wasted.

I could not believe how many ruck contests he attended, and in my opinion each one takes us further from a win.

Not criticising him, just the game plan he is playing in. Double teamed because the opposition has no one else to guard and then out in the ruck

[Grantysghost]

He got 1 goal yesterday. You should be allowed to watch him play and take contested marks and kick even more goals while I watch a winning team. And that’s a game we should have won (along with others this year) where a lot of his firepower was wasted.

I could not believe how many ruck contests he attended, and in my opinion each one takes us further from a win.

Not criticising him, just the game plan he is playing in. Double teamed because the opposition has no one else to guard and then out in the ruck

He attended 12 ruck contests.

English 57
Stanley 54
Blicavs 21
Khamis 13
Hawkins 9

[Danjul]

But it is the players. If we didn’t let their mids dominate I the early stages of the game we probably wouldn’t have lost. How can this not be the players? I get you don’t rate Bevo but it ain’t him on the field serving up the crap of not getting their hands on the ball. Apart from getting out their himself what the hell is he meant to do. When are we going to hold our players accountable for some of the shit dished out rather than just blaming the coach and the game plan. We win the 1st quarter we win the game.

In the early minutes we had entries into the scoring zone and the ball bounced straight out again. We had only one forward target, being double tagged. Who didn’t see that coming? Look at English’s two kicks into the left forward pocket at about the 10 minute mark. By the end of the quarter we still had only 3 less scoring shots. And the same problem continued until the end of the game.

The sections of the game plan that led to the defeat are the same sections that have failed previously in the season. Who sees them coming good in the last half? I hope their optimism is rewarded.

[whythelongface]

When the players do well though the coach never cops any criticism either.
So when is it OK to question the tactics?

Nothing wrong with questioning tactics, selections or any other coaching decisions but there needs to be more scrutiny placed on our playing group, particularly our midfield, for the crap that was dished out in the first quarter. That is not the fault of the coach. These guys are experienced enough to prevent this from happening yet it happens on a regular basis. But some put this solely on the coach.

[whythelongface]

In the early minutes we had entries into the scoring zone and the ball bounced straight out again. We had only one forward target, being double tagged. Who didn’t see that coming? Look at English’s two kicks into the left forward pocket at about the 10 minute mark. By the end of the quarter we still had only 3 less scoring shots. And the same problem continued until the end of the game.

The sections of the game plan that led to the defeat are the same sections that have failed previously in the season. Who sees them coming good in the last half? I hope their optimism is rewarded.

Yes there are selection issues and another tall target may have helped but it doesn’t change the ease at which Geelong transitioned and also winning the clearances and early contested footy. No coaching is changing that attitude. The on field leadership could have stemmed the tide and taken responsibility. Rather than being 34 points down at qtr time we could have been half that and presto we probably win the game. Ain’t tactics to me but simply players needing to work harder. Don’t need a 2nd ruck to prevent this from happening, this was early when all players were fresh. They should have been primed instead they bent over and let Geelong dominate.

[Danjul]

He attended 12 ruck contests.

English 57
Stanley 54
Blicavs 21
Khamis 13
Hawkins 9

I could be wrong here but When Hawkins took ruck contests they were close to goal and there was still a tall forward free.

Khamis was our second ruck, he should be taking more of the ruck load than our full forward and allowing the forward to be a moving target. Just my opinion. Maybe I am not taking these losses as well as others.

[Grantysghost]

Nothing wrong with questioning tactics, selections or any other coaching decisions but there needs to be more scrutiny placed on our playing group, particularly our midfield, for the crap that was dished out in the first quarter. That is not the fault of the coach. These guys are experienced enough to prevent this from happening yet it happens on a regular basis. But some put this solely on the coach.

I don't disagree, however just to continue along the counter point our game plan is very midfield dependant. We push up a half forward to the contest most times and try to outnumber and overlap.
If this isn't "on" or our mids who lift a fair load for us are off what's the fall back?
Where's the go slow tempo shift?
I think it's an equal measure of tactics, recruitment and acute performance/intensity fluctuations so to discount the former appears to be somewhat disingenuous to me.

It's a good discussion.