What does an aggressive trade period look like to you?

[Mantis]

That's my point. It's OK to join the 'No more Zaine' train but SOMEONE has to play in the key post. Whatever he is, he is a player who commits to the contest and knows the system.

If our system is to have Cordy, who at best struggles athletically stand 20m front of his opponent… well our system is broken.

Understand he wouldn’t do any better standing back shoulder but surely there’s some sort of middle ground?

[bornadog]

If our system is to have Cordy, who at best struggles athletically stand 20m front of his opponent… well our system is broken.

Understand he wouldn’t do any better standing back shoulder but surely there’s some sort of middle ground?

Is he just following instructions? and yes, our system is broken

[mjp]

If our system is to have Cordy, who at best struggles athletically stand 20m front of his opponent… well our system is broken.

Isn't that a different question?

[mjp]

So I’m interested in your thoughts, do we only need a tweak? Do we need to show ruthless aggression? Will losing the like of JJ and Dunks be enough to revitalise the list.

There are at least two ways to look at it, but primarily this are the scenarios:

1/. Our 'REAL' level is the team that made the GF in 2021 under really difficult circumstances.
2/. Our 'REAL' level is 'maybe' win a final. We have played finals for the last 4x years and - had we not gotten a lucky CBD free-kick against Brisbane our record would be 1-4...with that one win against a team that sacked it's coach within 12-months of the game and is widely regarded as the worst finals side in the past decade.

So...pick your point of view.

If your POV is window 1 (GF Team), identify the pillars (Bont, Naughton, Daniel, English, Dale etc) and have a 'cold light of day' external review of the weaknesses (key back, small defender, small forward + a couple of game-style 'issues'). Spend whatever you have to in order to fix those problems.

If your POV is window 2 (bottom of the 8, no more) then you need to sacrifice one or two players out of the 'core' group in order to rebuild around our best player since Chris Grant (Bont). If we don't do that quickly, well, 2016 will be our last premiership for a really (really) long time.

So - I guess it depends on where you think we are at?

I get the impression a lot of people right now think our squad is a GF team but our coaching team/MC are bottom 4...I sort of think our squad is middle of the road but our coach in excellent...I just wish he would be happy to play GOOD football rather than being so determined to come up with 'clever' ideas that lead to feast/famine type outcomes. I love the way he thinks laterally about problems and creates interesting solutions - we are a unique footy side in so many ways - but when the chips are down you need to be able to defend one-on-one and move the ball cleanly from the defensive goal-square to the wing and give your defenders time to SET. We dont do either of those things consistently enough which results in goals against.

[bornadog]

If your POV is window 2 (bottom of the 8, no more) then you need to sacrifice one or two players out of the 'core' group in order to rebuild around our best player since Chris Grant (Bont). If we don't do that quickly, well, 2016 will be our last premiership for a really (really) long time.

Personally I am of the view we are in window one, but need to fix defence urgently.

However, let's assume Scraggers question needs to be answered and we are in POV window 2?

Who do we sacrifice in order to get some decent draft picks? We have to give away good players in order to get some good players. No use thinking of a Crozier or another fringe player, we will get nothing for them (nothing decent).

North have said they are open to trading pick one, maybe another club like Hawks or Adelaide would be willing to give up their first round for someone decent. What type of player do they need.

We know Dunks is 50/50, then maybe he is the first to be traded and maybe we need to look at one other player - perhaps a Bailey Dale (yeah it hurts), or Bailey Smith? I don't know. Perhaps offer up Treloar to go with Dunks?

[Grantysghost]

There are at least two ways to look at it, but primarily this are the scenarios:

1/. Our 'REAL' level is the team that made the GF in 2021 under really difficult circumstances.
2/. Our 'REAL' level is 'maybe' win a final. We have played finals for the last 4x years and - had we not gotten a lucky CBD free-kick against Brisbane our record would be 1-4...with that one win against a team that sacked it's coach within 12-months of the game and is widely regarded as the worst finals side in the past decade.

So...pick your point of view.

If your POV is window 1 (GF Team), identify the pillars (Bont, Naughton, Daniel, English, Dale etc) and have a 'cold light of day' external review of the weaknesses (key back, small defender, small forward + a couple of game-style 'issues'). Spend whatever you have to in order to fix those problems.

If your POV is window 2 (bottom of the 8, no more) then you need to sacrifice one or two players out of the 'core' group in order to rebuild around our best player since Chris Grant (Bont). If we don't do that quickly, well, 2016 will be our last premiership for a really (really) long time.

So - I guess it depends on where you think we are at?

I get the impression a lot of people right now think our squad is a GF team but our coaching team/MC are bottom 4...I sort of think our squad is middle of the road but our coach in excellent...I just wish he would be happy to play GOOD football rather than being so determined to come up with 'clever' ideas that lead to feast/famine type outcomes. I love the way he thinks laterally about problems and creates interesting solutions - we are a unique footy side in so many ways - but when the chips are down you need to be able to defend one-on-one and move the ball cleanly from the defensive goal-square to the wing and give your defenders time to SET. We dont do either of those things consistently enough which results in goals against.

You want me to say Macrae... I can feel it.

I really struggle with trying to make a case for getting rid of good players.

I think we are POV 2 - the list is 5-8 and needs to shore up the defence, and get some more dynamic midfielders. The point raised about the handball club, and going sideways and not forward is so true.

I watched very closely in the Freo game, and they were setup so well we appeared to have no clue what to do with it.

To be honest if I do it the other way it's easier. Untouchables.

Naughton, Bont, Smith, Dale, Darcy, Marra, Richards, Liberatore, McNeil.

[F'scary]

This just feels like we are talking about tearing apart the fabric of the club.

Sure - JJ gets 3x years and I'm happy for him. Martin retires.

Hunter needs to be rehabilitated whatever that looks like. Sounds like he needs support not to be kicked to the curb.

I am in the minority I guess but I hope Cordy re-signs for 2-years.

Hunter returned to form after a couple of matches and was far from our worst in the 13 point (after 54 point turnaround) loss to Freo. He knows how to find the ball and has generally good disposal skills, which is more than you can say for our overly extensive group of fringe mids/list cloggers.

Cordy, hmmm . I see Khamis, Cleary and Raak, along with Darcy and possibly L Jones. That is a lot of competition for 3rd tall or key position back.

[mjp]

You want me to say Macrae... I can feel it.

Umm. Not really.

He is a ball winner like no-one I have ever seen.

I think it is fair to call him out when he is sooking it up on the field - which he does - just because he isn't playing in his preferred position.

[Grantysghost]

Umm. Not really.

He is a ball winner like no-one I have ever seen.

I think it is fair to call him out when he is sooking it up on the field - which he does - just because he isn't playing in his preferred position.

If we are in POV 2, who would you out of the supposed 'untouchables' offer up or be ok with moving on for the greater good? It's not an easy exercise.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

For me, the only true untouchables are Bont and Naughton.

I'm listening to everything else.

[mjp]

If we are in POV 2, who would you out of the supposed 'untouchables' offer up or be ok with moving on for the greater good? It's not an easy exercise.

I would say Bont and Naughton are 'TRUE' untouchables and would listen to offers re- anyone else IF we are in 'WINDOW 2'.

I wouldn't offer anyone up - I don't know the group as well as the coaches...but if someone came knocking, why wouldn't you listen?

I tend to think we are in window #1 by the way.

[Mofra]

'Aggressive' may well be overpaying for a player in a position of need, which for us is obviously a KPD in a tight market.

Aidan Corr is going at $600k and Logue's offer from north is being reported at $650k. Average to good swingman McStay is looking at a $650k x 5 deal from the pies. We went at $700k for Keath a few years back.
Who do we look to and what do we pay for them?

[azabob]

'Aggressive' may well be overpaying for a player in a position of need, which for us is obviously a KPD in a tight market.

Aidan Corr is going at $600k and Logue's offer from north is being reported at $650k. Average to good swingman McStay is looking at a $650k x 5 deal from the pies. We went at $700k for Keath a few years back.
Who do we look to and what do we pay for them?

Melbourne were aggressive with Jake Leaver and Steven May...

[hujsh]

I would say Bont and Naughton are 'TRUE' untouchables and would listen to offers re- anyone else IF we are in 'WINDOW 2'.

I wouldn't offer anyone up - I don't know the group as well as the coaches...but if someone came knocking, why wouldn't you listen?

I tend to think we are in window #1 by the way.

I'm unsure what the Window 2 vs Window 1 distinction is. Is it 1st crack at a premiership before a slight rejig of the playing list and a second attempt?

Could you maybe elaborate?

[Grantysghost]

Melbourne were aggressive with Jake Leaver and Steven May...

They pretty much missed the 2018 draft, but then fell arse into luck by being shit and snaring Pickett and Jackson.