Luke Beveridge and our challenges

[bornadog]

Does anybody? That is kind of the problem.

Footy is tribal and passionate. City Hall is the place for globalist corporates, and really is where someone like KW-W would thrive and prosper. In club land, we need everybody from the top down to be fervently tribal and 1000% in our corner, over and above being talented/well connected - the latter is not enough to be a successful club president that cuts through. We were spoilt rotten with Peter Gordon and David Smorgon as our leaders, who led us in far more difficult circumstances than current incumbent IMO.

The Club President doesn't need to deal with the day to day stuff but should be visible when important off field issues arise like funding, stadium deals and dealing with HQ. Peter and Smorgo were Presidents during tough times when the financial viability of the club was a big issue amongst other major problems. Thank goodness they steered us into a great off field position.

[Sedat]

I like kww.

Agree she could be more visible, however maybe the days of us needing a president being out on the front foot and in the spotlight are over.
I'll judge them on the role they're there to do.

This is not an attack on KW-W. I just don't have much regard for the career global corporate types when it comes to being an effective and impactful leader of a footy club. I would have absolutely the same opinion if our president was Richard Goyder or Gill McLaughlan (or any other career corporatist). These types simply don't have that inherent tribalism and passion required to be a succesful club president IMO.

When we were travelling around the countryside during the 2021 finals series like we were the Leyland Brothers, we didn't hear a peep from KW-W. We silently took the absurd restrictions and state govt overreach without any protest or comment whatsoever. At the end of the day, she is a company woman and will never break ranks in support of the club over the code, and our supporters deserve and expect much more from the president. We were going through one of the most arduous finals campaigns in history and we didn't hear anything - not even encouragement for our maginificent 3 week and 2.5 quarter run. Contrast this radio silence to Peter Gordon during our 2016 finals campaign - it is chalk and cheese.

Also KW-W (and Bains and Grant) have left Bevo to do all the heavy lifting when it comes to our media profile and our media brand - again, that is just not good enough IMO. He frayed at the edges last year after basically being the lone spokesperson for the club for the last few years since Peter Gordon retired.

[Grantysghost]

I agree the load needs to be taken off Bevo, I don't think the board is the source though it needs to be the executive.
Grant and Ameet.
We don't need any more Koch-eys!

[Boots]

I find the talk about KWW a distraction at best. I've worked a lot with executives and board chairs, sat on a few boards myself, and been trained in board membership. The President is a figurehead when compared to most other roles. She's almost certainly part-time (and it'd be a few days a year), may even be unpaid, and has zero input into strategic decisions. Unless the club is run radically differently to other associations, it's an oversight role and it's mostly interested in fiduciary matters; the best she could do is ask some questions, but by that point most policy/strategy questions are resolved. Arguably, Gordon was maybe TOO active as a president (as are/were other active AFL presidents like Brasher or O'Neil) and got us used to something that maybe wasn't actually a good thing.

She could probably play a part in removing a CEO, but you'd expect she'd have little to do with anything football-department-related. If I'm thinking about on-field success, I couldn't care less who she is or what she thinks. If you have to have a go at executives, have a go at Bains.

[GVGjr]

I find the talk about KWW a distraction at best. I've worked a lot with executives and board chairs, sat on a few boards myself, and been trained in board membership. The President is a figurehead when compared to most other roles. She's almost certainly part-time (and it'd be a few days a year), may even be unpaid, and has zero input into strategic decisions. Unless the club is run radically differently to other associations, it's an oversight role and it's mostly interested in fiduciary matters; the best she could do is ask some questions, but by that point most policy/strategy questions are resolved. Arguably, Gordon was maybe TOO active as a president (as are/were other active AFL presidents like Brasher or O'Neil) and got us used to something that maybe wasn't actually a good thing.

She could probably play a part in removing a CEO, but you'd expect she'd have little to do with anything football-department-related. If I'm thinking about on-field success, I couldn't care less who she is or what she thinks. If you have to have a go at executives, have a go at Bains.

Tend to agree, it would be great to see more of her because I went to an East Meets West dinner last year and she makes a great impression but I question if it's good have her fronting the media with on field challenges. You would hope she has connected with Luke given the media's focus and the fans displeasure.

Back to the issue du jour, I'd really like to get an understanding of why we have looked so poor but some points to consider are:
- Has the changes to the footy department with soft cap challenges and the departures of experienced assistant coaches (King, Hansen) and key personnel (Maple, Graham) taken their toll or exposed some gaps?
- Has the relocation to Skinner reserve and the harder surface prior to Xmas caused a few more injuries and disruptions?
- Has the sports science and medical teams planned out a poor program for the players off season training?
- How much of are problems are directly related to the coach?
- Has our lets say stubborn approach to recruiting finally caught up with us?
- Does our game plan really measure up well against other teams?

There could 10 or more reasons but I feel like we've got a lot of issues we need to review before we make any decisions of changing personnel. You may placate a number of angry fans with a hasty decision and then in the longer term alienate more by getting it wrong.

[bornadog]

Back to the issue du jour, I'd really like to get an understanding of why we have looked so poor but some points to consider are:
- Has the changes to the footy department with soft cap challenges and the departures of experienced assistant coaches (King, Hansen) and key personnel (Maple, Graham) taken their toll or exposed some gaps?
- Has the relocation to Skinner reserve and the harder surface prior to Xmas caused a few more injuries and disruptions?
- Has the sports science and medical teams planned out a poor program for the players off season training?
- How much of are problems are directly related to the coach?
- Has our lets say stubborn approach to recruiting finally caught up with us?
- Does our game plan really measure up well against other teams?

There could 10 or more reasons but I feel like we've got a lot of issues we need to review before we make any decisions of changing personnel. You may placate a number of angry fans with a hasty decision and then in the longer term alienate more by getting it wrong.

Do you think LADE has changed things up in the midfield and it is effecting the way we play?

[GVGjr]

Do you think LADE has changed things up in the midfield and it is effecting the way we play?

Not from my perspective and I don't have anything negative to say about Lade or the assistant coaches but I suspect we need to review how they're performing as a group.

[SonofScray]

I sharpened an axe early in R2 2018 and have considered swinging it in 2018, 2019, 2020, and now.

2020/21 I tempered my feelings around the coach based on the fact I was concentrating more on not dying during the pandemic and my empathy was high for anyone in a leadership position navigating the mess we were all. in. 2021 was good fun and remains proof of two things, we have a talented list and a coach who can get them up at times. I'm also growing more and more resentful of the way we collapsed, because it has been a pattern across Bevo's tenure to collapse or get shut down for long stretches in games.

The rote, repetitious manner in which we lose. The listless, joyful football we play when we are off, I've had enough of it and want to get a different look at it.

I'm prepared to accept it mightn't be Bevo that's actually the issue. I am curious about the director of football, I am curious about Baines, I am curious about the President.

- Baines appears to be running a good ship financially, which is the key thing for him I feel. He has made us a more conservative, bland organisation though. Real by the numbers sort of stuff. Not inherently a problem, but there are some areas he could be leading from the front on. Bevo shouldn't have had to be the face of the club on every factor like he is.

- President is just a non factor, respectfully. She may or may not be doing wonders. Who knows? We don't really see her in front of the cameras, or advocating for the club in the way we've come to expect from more combative leaders and figurehead types in Smorgo (I never liked him, which is blasphemous I know) and PG (who I loved as a leader). I don't know who else would be fit and able to lead us in that capacity, so Kylie gets more time to craft her own story with the club.

- Grant. Might have a bit to answer for. His fate is linked to Bevo's now as far as I am concerned. Strongly agreed with his decision to extend the contract, made sense to me. Not because it was blind faith in a good coach, but that it bought time to plan for the worst. Which is what is happening now and if we zoom out a little, feels like it has set in.

The quickest option and the one that makes sense for me though, remains to make a change at the Senior coach level. He's had enough time and I can't envisage a future where he stays on and we become the team I want us to be. It didn't happen with my other favourite coaches at the back end of their time with us, Eade and Wallace, what's different here? We know what we are getting.

It's harsh, its emotional, its whatever folk want to frame it as, I don't care. I don't get an actual say in it and I'll be paying up, attending and barracking hard regardless. I changed my tune over summer, and backed them all in, but we've got more of the same and are staring down the barrel of a complete collapse, I am anxious about getting the most out of the Bont's best years. I am disappointed that we've strayed so far from a mentality and style of footy that was close to the best version of ourselves as a club I'd ever witnessed to this absolute stuttering, meek mess we have now.

*my family have informed me I am being annoying and have been a broken record for 5 years or so, so sorry for subjecting you to more of it here too!

[bornadog]

Not from my perspective and I don't have anything negative to say about Lade or the assistant coaches but I suspect we need to review how they're performing as a group.

Not necessarily negative, but more a change that the players are not adopting to?

[JanLorMill]

The Club President doesn't need to deal with the day to day stuff but should be visible when important off field issues arise like funding, stadium deals and dealing with HQ. Peter and Smorgo were Presidents during tough times when the financial viability of the club was a big issue amongst other major problems. Thank goodness they steered us into a great off field position.

So invisible just when the coach or club are under pressure?

[bornadog]

So invisible just when the coach or club are under pressure?

What would you like her to say?

[JanLorMill]

What would you like her to say?

how about just defending the club or coach?

[bornadog]

how about just defending the club or coach?

There have been two rounds, no need to panic and bring in the President.

[DOG GOD]

The players are not playing as a team, and there can only be 2 reasons..
1) they don?t want to play for beveridge
Or
2) the tightness of the playing group that beveridge keeps instilling to the media, is an outright lie.

Something has been wrong since 2017 as far as I’m concerned. Dunkley spoke about lack of professionalism when he asked to be traded the first time, only to not get his Essendon trade, and now gone. Hunter’s off field issues, smith the same. Players getting games ahead of others. Clear favouritism in the playing group?you could go on and on and on.

Jamarra and Darcy fell in our laps, and because of that we haven’t gotten any of the young mids. That’s telling.

We look slow, disinterested with a pathetic gameplan that to me, watching live, makes little to no sense. Nothing much has changed since last year.

I said I felt we would miss the 8 and inwardly was probably mocked on here, but I could see the Dunkley/Hunter losses as major, and the Lobb and Jones adds as MEH. Other teams improving, meaning someone would have to drop off. Carlton got us into the finals. That’s a fact. We were relatively poor last year and after 2 weeks this year, we look like the Rhode years. Something stinks at the club. Let’s not sugar coat it. Turning the year around from here would be like turning the titanic around in a porter potty. Either way, it smells like shit.

[soupman]

I've been on the fence with Beveridge for a few years now, and this pre-season was probably the most on board I have been, considering it felt like we kind of made moves to get better and the training reports have been very positive.

I am inclined to want him gone now, mainly because I see it as the easiest way to reinvigorate the club and group. I look at Collingwood, who are obviously the flavour of the month but also are super fun and enjoyable to watch, and think we are the antithesis of this. We were like them in Beveridge's first two years, but since then have just deteriorated to the point that for me (and I think many others) when we play well and are fun to watch the prevailing emotion is relief.

A bit like when loved players like Dahlhaus left, a big part of me was so relieved I didn't have to watch another 40m set shot fall short. I think I'll feel similiarly when Beveridge leaves.

I cannot wait until we get to discuss something else here, instead of the same issues every few weeks every season.

I cannot wait till I can get optimistic that the new coach can harness an energy in the group, when atm I am just constantly worried Beveridge can't get the necessary buy in this week.

I cannot wait until we start to move the ball with purpose, I cannot wait until we take goalkicking seriously, i cannot wait till we set up our defence in a conventional style, i cannot wait until it feels like our entire game doesn't depend on a marginal play where a skill error under pressure means we get torched out the back, and i cannot wait till we don't predictably underperform then overperform to just scrape into finals and then just have to hope that we might go on some stupidly improbable run again.

I desperately want this group to do well, and am hoping that a change can somehow change their mindset and mean we don't just fold over in 5 minute avalanches, that we are capable of fighting back when thing aren't going well, and that I can trust the playing group to actually care week to week.

I think changing our coach is the easiest path, we have too much talent we would need to move around and sell low to rejig the list, and we have already tried backing in Beveridge to fix it multiple times with poor results made better by a nuts and completely out of character finals series.

As for the thread question, I just don't know if we can keep going with Beveridge at half rat power. I guess I'd keep him till the mid season part at least, and maybe even let him see out the year. Unless we see Lade as the difference maker I think we stand to go backwards if we do cut Bevo now, but in no way do I think he is the future. Kind of a cursed position of all the options being shit atm.