Putting a defensive group together - Situational or???

[mjp]

We still have a few options, Darcy could be on the bench (well he is in my starting 23) Coffield might have to play tall, Lobb or Naughton swing back to steady the ship. Rather than move Williams back perhaps it Daniel or VDM. I suspect Bevo has a fair bit of faith in Williams so he's probably the first option but we do have a few others.

100% there are options...

But I guess that's the decision I'm asking about. Are you:
1/. Compromising the STRUCTURE of the backline by;
- Maintaining a personnel grouping (the selected back 7 + your defensive winger).
- Protecting the structure of the forward and midfield lines.

2/. Compromising the structure of the forward or midfield lines (eg. Moving Caleb or VDM back in your example) to support the defensive group.

:-)

[mjp]

So you want to have your core game plan that doesn't change or be swayed by the opposition, but have that swinging option to tweak and tune during the week.
You might have a Caleb down there for a small match up for eg, or run an extra tall like Keath if needed.

So - this is an approach based on the oppo forward half, swinging the selection 'axe' based on who we are playing...extra tall, Keath plays, extra small, Caleb slides back and Keath plays for Footscray...

[Mofra]

Synergy > structure
Structure > trying to second guess the opposition.

At a guess we'll roll with two talls (Jones & JOD my preference) one pure tallish interceptor (Coff) a couple of mid/general defenders (Dale & Richards) and one small (Duryea or JJ) and a bench spot that will rotate based on form.

Then we pray like hell that the bench spot is taken up by a guy who can run.

[GVGjr]

100% there are options...

But I guess that's the decision I'm asking about. Are you:
1/. Compromising the STRUCTURE of the backline by;
- Maintaining a personnel grouping (the selected back 7 + your defensive winger).
- Protecting the structure of the forward and midfield lines.

2/. Compromising the structure of the forward or midfield lines (eg. Moving Caleb or VDM back in your example) to support the defensive group.

:-)

Option 2 appeals the most. If Vandermeer is playing he would be my preferred option.

[mjp]

Synergy > structure
Structure > trying to second guess the opposition.

At a guess we'll roll with two talls (Jones & JOD my preference) one pure tallish interceptor (Coff) a couple of mid/general defenders (Dale & Richards) and one small (Duryea or JJ) and a bench spot that will rotate based on form.

Then we pray like hell that the bench spot is taken up by a guy who can run.

You need to name 7 backs - 6 start and 1 bench + a designated defensive winger/half-forward who rolls behind the ball during rotations, as a spare during stop plays etc. Of the 7, 2 of them (talls) will basically play 95%+ game-time. This is why the issues we had in Ballarat last year were so real. Not only did we lose two rotations - we lost two players who basically never come off...so the ratio of players to interchange breaks was compromised in a pretty major way.

[Uninformed]

So...that means you would change your selection each week depending on the oppo?

I'm happy either way, just curious what everyone thinks.

I would like to have a group that play together and develop a system consistently as a baseline.

But some teams have players that bother me and for which we often lack a solution. We don't seem to have an answer for Fritz at the Dees, and maybe Charlie Cameron at Brissie.

Do you think we need a specific match up for such as them or a work up with the system in consistent selections.

[jeemak]

You need to name 7 backs - 6 start and 1 bench + a designated defensive winger/half-forward who rolls behind the ball during rotations, as a spare during stop plays etc. Of the 7, 2 of them (talls) will basically play 95%+ game-time. This is why the issues we had in Ballarat last year were so real. Not only did we lose two rotations - we lost two players who basically never come off...so the ratio of players to interchange breaks was compromised in a pretty major way.

Which is what I tried to do.

[GVGjr]

You need to name 7 backs - 6 start and 1 bench + a designated defensive winger/half-forward who rolls behind the ball during rotations, as a spare during stop plays etc. Of the 7, 2 of them (talls) will basically play 95%+ game-time. This is why the issues we had in Ballarat last year were so real. Not only did we lose two rotations - we lost two players who basically never come off...so the ratio of players to interchange breaks was compromised in a pretty major way.

7 Backs
JJ - Jones - Coffield
Dale - JOD - Richards
Darcy off the bench

Vandermeer off the bench but primarily as a forward
Williams if we needed more support.

[jeemak]

To begin with I'd have one of Keath or Gardner in there as well, or Darcy. Depending on who's fit and/ or in form.

I don't really like the idea of just having Jones and one other, others do and that's fine but for your scenario I think it limits us and takes away from other areas. Plus, if we do lose Jones we're not bringing in an un-played Keath or Gardner (or Darcy) to take the lead the next week. Limiting the impact to our continuity.

From memory my predicted team accounts for this, I'll check it out.

Edit - this is the team I nominated on 1 December, obviously needs updating but I had Darcy at CHB (instead of Keath or Gardner - but I actually expect one of these guys to be selected more than not over Darcy) and Coffield as medium cover:

Richards, Jones, JOD
Dale, Darcy, JJ
Williams, Jacko, Smith
Scott, JUH, Treloar
Lobb, Naughton, Weightman

English, Bont, Libba

Sanders, Coffield, Daniel, Harmes

Sub: West

So say this was the team and we lose Jones, then we have JOD and Darcy playing tall and Coffield playing medium with relief from Williams.

Scott rolls up to a wing as required, West subs in and takes Scott's rolling up/ running away forward/ mid role.

I don't hate quoting myself.

[mjp]

Which is what I tried to do.

The problem is - with 3x talls in your group and Jones basically never coming off and the other 2x talls rarely coming off, well...you are going to be a rotation down. So what's going to end up happening is your designated rotator (which is Coffield) is going to come on for one of JJ, Dale or Richards (who will be cooked and need a blow at least once per q. So for large parts of the game you will end up with a defensive 6 (on field) of Darcy, Jones, JOD, Coffield and 2 out of Dale/Richards/JJ. It also means those running backs are going to be on the bench A LOT. Which is not great since they are some of our best players.

Basically, I don't think that's going to work in real terms.

This is one of the challenges we have right now with JOD (and one of the challenges that saw him played on a wing last year) - we need to play him and he's probably best 22 BUT if he can't play KPD then...

I genuinely think the best structure is going to be just two x talls in that back 7. With Coffield or Willams I guess the designated 'backup' key back if we lose one of the starters...or (I guess) if Darcy is in the team (and I don't see how right now) he is moved back.

Look at our list. The recruitment team can talk all they like about the number of 200cm and KPP players NOT being a problem, but we need to PLAY some of them. Buzz needs to play, Darcy needs to play...but WHERE?

If English rucks unchanged, and Naughton/Jamarra are the KPP's with Jones/(Gardner/Keath/JOD) the KPD's...and Lobb providing forward ruck support...there are no other spots.

So - back to my original question - how do we structure this group?

[Go_Dogs]

B: Coffield, Jones, Richards
HB: Dale, JOD, JJ

Jones and JOD play majority of the game.

Darcy starts on the bench and can key minutes when English / Lobb / Naughton / Marra / Jones / JOD / Coffield need a break. I guess at any given time we’ll have one of that group on the bench or thereabouts.

Buku / Buss / Gardner / Keath (in no order) are the KPD replacements for the spot in the 23. I wouldn’t see Darcy’s role changing if we cop an injury. He’s going to be our best utility tall playing everywhere and I think he’s going to make that a very important role pretty quickly.

Daniel / Poulter / Williams / Treloar can be the other smalls / mediums who can rotate back to chop out while someone has a rest and or cover an injury in game.

We’ve then got a few others in the VFL Cleary, Gallagher etc who could come in and play a role if needed and or shuffle other roles to move one of say Daniel or Williams back if we cop a LTI.

I keep coming back to continuity being king with our defensive group and we’ve got enough players and depth to cover multiple roles / scenarios both in game and across the year from a selection stand point. Some options preferred to others, but I can’t really think of a time in recent memory we’ve been deeper in this part of the ground.

[josie]

B: Coffield, Jones, Richards
HB: Dale, JOD, JJ

Jones and JOD play majority of the game.

Darcy starts on the bench and can key minutes when English / Lobb / Naughton / Marra / Jones / JOD / Coffield need a break. I guess at any given time we’ll have one of that group on the bench or thereabouts.

Buku / Buss / Gardner / Keath (in no order) are the KPD replacements for the spot in the 23. I wouldn’t see Darcy’s role changing if we cop an injury. He’s going to be our best utility tall playing everywhere and I think he’s going to make that a very important role pretty quickly.

Daniel / Poulter / Williams / Treloar can be the other smalls / mediums who can rotate back to chop out while someone has a rest and or cover an injury in game.

We’ve then got a few others in the VFL Cleary, Gallagher etc who could come in and play a role if needed and or shuffle other roles to move one of say Daniel or Williams back if we cop a LTI.

I keep coming back to continuity being king with our defensive group and we’ve got enough players and depth to cover multiple roles / scenarios both in game and across the year from a selection stand point. Some options preferred to others, but I can’t really think of a time in recent memory we’ve been deeper in this part of the ground.

I agree with you. Duryea for option if JJ is injured?

[Go_Dogs]

I agree with you. Duryea for option if JJ is injured?

Absolutely. I knew I was forgetting a few players and think he can still play a meaningful role for us this season. Maybe not in the best 23 but certainly in the mix.

[Before I Die]

Thinking about my response to this question also made me think about the club's KPD drafting. O'Donnell sort of fell into our lap, and Croft's development was, I believe, a bit of a surprise. Darcy was no surprise. Busslinger and Coffield (who apparently is 194cm) were targeted. The latter, this year. The former, the year before.
Jones is 32, Keath is 31, and Gardner is more insurance than best 23. So what was the plan? I suspect it means Busslinger is not ready for any more than cameo appearances at this stage but will hopefully replace Jones in 2025.

We may even end up trading out a tall, hopefully for a high draft pick.

At the moment, I think Darcy is competing with Lobb (who is 30). Only one of them plays.
In the backline I'd have Jones, O'Donnell and Coffield. That's three players over 194cm, plenty of height cover if one goes down. I don't think you plan for two going down as it compromises to much structure elsewhere. If it happens, you just improvise the best you can.

Williams is the first choice to slide back. Then Scott, Daniel, Vandermeer, Harmes, etc, whoever is playing and seems best option at the time. All of who should be trained in terms of our defensive structure.

So my 7 backs are Jones, Richards, Dale, O'Donnell, JJ, Coffield, and Duryea (until we find a better shutdown player) with Williams as the defensive winger. Subject to fitness and form, I'd play this line up against all opposition. Busslinger needs to knock the door down to get into the team, though I'm sure injuries will create opportunities.

[mjp]

At the moment, I think Darcy is competing with Lobb (who is 30). Only one of them plays.

I think only one of them CAN play unless Darcy takes one of the 2 KPD roles.

Betcha they both play though.