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  1. #31
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    Re: Where does our improvement come from in 2022?

    I feel another area of improvement will come if we actually have a VFL competition underway. This will benefit all teams, but we were particularly disadvantaged because of our long injury list. The conversation about whether to play Sweet or Young, or Rhylee West for that matter, would be different if we knew how they were performing at that level, plus there’d be the opportunity for those guys to work on weaknesses or what the match committee asked of them. I don’t think Dunkley or Treloar hit their straps properly either and VFL hit outs would have helped in that cause too.
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  2. #32
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    Re: Where does our improvement come from in 2022?

    Quote Originally Posted by The bulldog tragician View Post
    I feel another area of improvement will come if we actually have a VFL competition underway. This will benefit all teams, but we were particularly disadvantaged because of our long injury list. The conversation about whether to play Sweet or Young, or Rhylee West for that matter, would be different if we knew how they were performing at that level, plus there’d be the opportunity for those guys to work on weaknesses or what the match committee asked of them. I don’t think Dunkley or Treloar hit their straps properly either and VFL hit outs would have helped in that cause too.
    Yes that helps... us, and perhaps everyone else.
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  4. #33
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    Re: Where does our improvement come from in 2022?

    Quote Originally Posted by The bulldog tragician View Post
    I feel another area of improvement will come if we actually have a VFL competition underway. This will benefit all teams, but we were particularly disadvantaged because of our long injury list. The conversation about whether to play Sweet or Young, or Rhylee West for that matter, would be different if we knew how they were performing at that level, plus there’d be the opportunity for those guys to work on weaknesses or what the match committee asked of them. I don’t think Dunkley or Treloar hit their straps properly either and VFL hit outs would have helped in that cause too.
    We will get improvement from that and you would have to think that applies to most other teams that were prominent in the 8 last year. Port might be the exception

    I'm hoping improvement comes from the exposure that the likes of McNeil and Scott had in the seniors and a break out year for Roarke Smith will all start to pay bigger dividends for us.
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  5. #34
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    Re: Where does our improvement come from in 2022?

    Quote Originally Posted by GVGjr View Post
    We will get improvement from that and you would have to think that applies to most other teams that were prominent in the 8 last year. Port might be the exception

    I'm hoping improvement comes from the exposure that the likes of McNeil and Scott had in the seniors and a break out year for Roarke Smith will all start to pay bigger dividends for us.
    I'm not sure asking the 17th, 18th, 19th guys selected to be the driver of change and improvement is generally that successful.

    If I'm going to pin hope on anyone in the 22 to improve us, there are two players that just have to lift:

    1. Dunkley needs to get back to his pre-shoulder injury form. We lost him for a chunk of the year and with his form on return he was probably a bit lucky to keep his spot. His first month or so was sublime, and I expect Libba to be managed through this year. Dunkley has to step up. We know his best is simply outstanding, A-grade good.

    2. English. Martin's cooked and Sweet is raw. Our entire list management strategy seems to be 'hope like hell Timmy breaks out' and as much as I think he's a better no 2 ruck, the club don't seem to see it that way.

    Cody's interrupted pre-season means he may miss a few games early in the year just as he did in 2021, and Marra will be incredible for us but not in 2022 as he still develops. We had a few players have outstanding years that may not back it up as they had one out of the box (can Libba's body hold up, and can Bailey Dale back it up?)
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  7. #35
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    Re: Where does our improvement come from in 2022?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mofra View Post
    I'm not sure asking the 17th, 18th, 19th guys selected to be the driver of change and improvement is generally that successful.

    If I'm going to pin hope on anyone in the 22 to improve us, there are two players that just have to lift:

    1. Dunkley needs to get back to his pre-shoulder injury form. We lost him for a chunk of the year and with his form on return he was probably a bit lucky to keep his spot. His first month or so was sublime, and I expect Libba to be managed through this year. Dunkley has to step up. We know his best is simply outstanding, A-grade good.

    2. English. Martin's cooked and Sweet is raw. Our entire list management strategy seems to be 'hope like hell Timmy breaks out' and as much as I think he's a better no 2 ruck, the club don't seem to see it that way.

    Cody's interrupted pre-season means he may miss a few games early in the year just as he did in 2021, and Marra will be incredible for us but not in 2022 as he still develops. We had a few players have outstanding years that may not back it up as they had one out of the box (can Libba's body hold up, and can Bailey Dale back it up?)
    Bevo may move some interesting chairs around. Dale to the backline as an example.
    Our 2016 premiership team had plenty of those types of moves.
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  8. #36
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    Re: Where does our improvement come from in 2022?

    Health and durability of the list. A small increase in this department, be it through luck or improved management goes a long way.

    The ruck scenario. Either Sweet takes a huge leap, English finds that more consistent, competitive edge or Stef stays fitter for longer.

    VDM in and progressing is really important from the perspective of physical, high octane pressure into our forward play. Need to start seeing that brand of footy emerge across more youngsters. Can’t just be Libba holding the rough and tumble side of the game on his shoulders. Laitham can really blaze a trail.

    Quick adjustments to tactical changes from the opposition. Can’t have these wild swings in momentum. Cost us a flag.

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  10. #37
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    Re: Where does our improvement come from in 2022?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost Dog View Post
    Bevo may move some interesting chairs around. Dale to the backline as an example.
    Our 2016 premiership team had plenty of those types of moves.
    Are there many moves left to make? Our backline is probably more settled now than it has been previously. Perhaps a Richards swap for Doc if Doc cops an injury.
    Hunter rotating HF during the finals series was an interesting one. Roarke as a defensive wing might be seen a bit more this year.
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  11. #38
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    Re: Where does our improvement come from in 2022?

    You're a general in an army, outnumbered or outgunned. The only way is to make the most of what you have, one game at a time. Break even or win in each position across the ground.

    We are winning in most areas. Ruck is a concern. Have to find a way.
    You don't develop courage by being happy in your relationships every day. You develop it by surviving difficult times and challenging adversity. ― Epicurus

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  13. #39
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    Re: Where does our improvement come from in 2022?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost Dog View Post
    You're a general in an army, outnumbered or outgunned. The only way is to make the most of what you have, one game at a time. Break even or win in each position across the ground.

    We are winning in most areas. Ruck is a concern. Have to find a way.
    The history of the 'oblique order' finally overcoming the dominance of the phalanx (which was the military orthodoxy of the time) might be applicable here.

    You need to be ahead of the curve in something.
    In 2016 we jumped the comp with 'handball club' until the competition caught up.

    After that Richmond dumped some talented blokes in the front half for pressure animals, loaded up the backline with a 7 or 8 man defence at times, and jumped the competition.

    Hawks previously did it with sublime left-foot kicks.

    Where is our advantage? The only real one I can see is a midfield that bats so deep we play 1-2 genuine talents at HF and push them up to the contest (a la Bailey Smith late in the year).
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  14. #40
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    Re: Where does our improvement come from in 2022?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mofra View Post
    The history of the 'oblique order' finally overcoming the dominance of the phalanx (which was the military orthodoxy of the time) might be applicable here.

    You need to be ahead of the curve in something.
    In 2016 we jumped the comp with 'handball club' until the competition caught up.

    After that Richmond dumped some talented blokes in the front half for pressure animals, loaded up the backline with a 7 or 8 man defence at times, and jumped the competition.

    Hawks previously did it with sublime left-foot kicks.

    Where is our advantage? The only real one I can see is a midfield that bats so deep we play 1-2 genuine talents at HF and push them up to the contest (a la Bailey Smith late in the year).
    Another advantage we have had is our marking power up forward - thanks to Naughton and Bruce. We have been number one for marks inside 50 with Naughton the king of contested marks.

    With Bruce gone we need to make sure anything Naughton doesn't mark, the ball is scraped up by Cody, VDN, McSteel etc.

    PS: Bevo has publicly stated, Richmond took our game plan and went one better.
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  15. #41
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    Re: Where does our improvement come from in 2022?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mofra View Post
    It's not so much speed that is Langdon's go, but endurance. He'd be in the top handful of gut runners in the competition.
    We have one player who could possibly run with him, Hunter.
    Yes you are right about Langdon's gut running but he is also quick imo. My recollection of the GF was that Hunter was going up and down in the one spot while Melbourne tore us apart.

  16. #42
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    Re: Where does our improvement come from in 2022?

    I’m really intrigued to see how our backline structures up. It’s going to have a different look, and losing the on-field leadership Wood provides is a big one in my book (albeit he wasn’t playing as well as he did in peak years of course).

    B: Richards, Keath, Gardner
    HB: Dale, O’Brien, Williams

    Is probably how I’d go, with Duryea in the starting 22, along with Daniel, who can play through those spots.

    If we can get the balance right between shutdown, intercept, field coverage and how we transition, this group has the tools and versatility to be impactful.

    Schache the other one I’m really interested in. While his body work isn’t great, he reads the play well, can run all day, and he uses the ball very well for a big man. It would be great to see him given a role down back, but I wonder if he ends up more spare parts than a defined backline role? Bruce injury and likely need for a ~15% second ruck at stages may end up his go.

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  18. #43
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    Re: Where does our improvement come from in 2022?

    Quote Originally Posted by Go_Dogs View Post
    I’m really intrigued to see how our backline structures up. It’s going to have a different look, and losing the on-field leadership Wood provides is a big one in my book (albeit he wasn’t playing as well as he did in peak years of course).

    B: Richards, Keath, Gardner
    HB: Dale, O’Brien, Williams

    Is probably how I’d go, with Duryea in the starting 22, along with Daniel, who can play through those spots.

    If we can get the balance right between shutdown, intercept, field coverage and how we transition, this group has the tools and versatility to be impactful.

    Schache the other one I’m really interested in. While his body work isn’t great, he reads the play well, can run all day, and he uses the ball very well for a big man. It would be great to see him given a role down back, but I wonder if he ends up more spare parts than a defined backline role? Bruce injury and likely need for a ~15% second ruck at stages may end up his go.
    Same here GD, so many genuine options to play in our back 6 or 7 even 8.
    How we use O'Brien is the real starting point.
    If it's as a 3rd tall then we compromise a bit of run that has been a priority for us over a long time.
    If it's more as a 2nd tall then I think if leaves us exposed as being undermanned which would require Williams to play tall again.

    I like your back 6 but I don't think Richards plays there at the expense of Duryea or Daniel unless we are intending to move Daniel or even Williams into the midfield. Duryea is the best equipped at manning up against the better genuine opposition smaller forwards.
    Cordy and Gardner have a bit to prove and will be fighting it out with O'Brien to fill two spots in partnering Keath.

    From a depth perspective we have Crozier, Khamis and Butler around the mark.
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  19. #44
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    Re: Where does our improvement come from in 2022?

    Quote Originally Posted by GVGjr View Post
    Same here GD, so many genuine options to play in our back 6 or 7 even 8.
    How we use O'Brien is the real starting point.
    If it's as a 3rd tall then we compromise a bit of run that has been a priority for us over a long time.
    If it's more as a 2nd tall then I think if leaves us exposed as being undermanned which would require Williams to play tall again.

    I like your back 6 but I don't think Richards plays there at the expense of Duryea or Daniel unless we are intending to move Daniel or even Williams into the midfield. Duryea is the best equipped at manning up against the better genuine opposition smaller forwards.
    Cordy and Gardner have a bit to prove and will be fighting it out with O'Brien to fill two spots in partnering Keath.

    From a depth perspective we have Crozier, Khamis and Butler around the mark.
    I think we really need Gardi to come on. He has a lot of attributes and if he can stay on the park he’ll keep getting better. He was much better this season than last, so if he can continue the improvement trend he’ll be a lock 22.

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  21. #45
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    Re: Where does our improvement come from in 2022?

    T
    Quote Originally Posted by Go_Dogs View Post
    I’m really intrigued to see how our backline structures up. It’s going to have a different look, and losing the on-field leadership Wood provides is a big one in my book (albeit he wasn’t playing as well as he did in peak years of course).

    B: Richards, Keath, Gardner
    HB: Dale, O’Brien, Williams

    Is probably how I’d go, with Duryea in the starting 22, along with Daniel, who can play through those spots.

    If we can get the balance right between shutdown, intercept, field coverage and how we transition, this group has the tools and versatility to be impactful.

    Schache the other one I’m really interested in. While his body work isn’t great, he reads the play well, can run all day, and he uses the ball very well for a big man. It would be great to see him given a role down back, but I wonder if he ends up more spare parts than a defined backline role? Bruce injury and likely need for a ~15% second ruck at stages may end up his go.
    I agree with your thinking on defence. Would like to see Duryea Dunkley and Wallis played as forwards. Our attack was palpably weak in the GF. Also would like to see Daniel move into the midfield where his better disposal would lift our forward line. Wallis to play a tagging role to offset the dominance of Oliver. Prefer to see English as a key forward, with Sweet in the ruck. VDM to play given our lack of leg speed against Melbourne.

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