Can Lee recover?

[GVGjr]

His form has been down, he has had some off field distractions and now he is injured and will probably miss a month.
Given his age, can Brett Lee recover and return to the test side and once again make a strong contribution?

Can he reinvent himself as a cricketer? Does he need to?

Years ago when the great Imran Khan could no longer bowl with the same sort of pace I saw him change his game right around. Lee might have to do the same.
Khan was a talented number 7 or 8 batsman albeit with a batting average of well under 30 that eventually moved up to number 6 and finished his career with an average of 37. He averaged high 40's with the bat in his last 3 or 4 seasons

He changed his bowling to a vastly slower medium pace swing and seam style and whilst his days of taking 3 or 4 wickets in an innings were just about over over he would still chime in with a good scalp or two.

I think Lee needs to redefine his bowling and realise his days of muscling and intimidating the opposition batsman are limited so he will need to develop better control and try and out think the batsman. If he loses a yard in pace the so be it.
His batting could improve heaps because he has always had the talent. Paul Reiffel's batting improved in his last couple of years and I wonder if Lee could move up from an average of 20 to closer to 30 if he really applied himself to the task?

Lee always had the ability to be an all-rounder of sorts and if he has to move from a shock to a stock bowler backing it up with improved batting might just be the tonic to keep him in the side.

Thoughts?

[Mantis]

Re: Can Lee recover?

No, he is cooked.

He has always bowled with a flat trajectory which means the ball he bowls skids rather than bounces. When his pace is up around the high 140's and he is shaping the ball away he is a dangerous bowler. When he isn't moving the ball through the air and his pace is around the 140 mark he has no weapons.

At present he has no containing length. He is either full or short as he cannot the ball to rise off a length due to the balls low trajectory.

As far as his batting goes he is handy, but I think Johnson has much further scope for improvement and should be moved up to no.8 regardless of Lee's position in the side.

[Pedro Sanchez]

Re: Can Lee recover?

Harsh opinion there re he's cooked...

I think the guy has just been over bowled on some pretty flat batting friendly tracks. His strength has always been to be used as a strike bowler in bursts, but with the given changes in the bowling line-up and our new ability to leak runs at ridiculous rates he's also had to become the negating stock bowler too.

Overall I think he's all class - 300 odd career test wickets is proof of that. With his stress foot injury which also backs up the over-worked argument, lets allow him to freshen up, work through his marriage issues and get the selectors to pick 4 bowlers that actually work as a balanced unit and we'll see his best again. Here's hoping he and the team's bowling peaks around June 09 - just in times for the Ashes!

[bulldogtragic]

Re: Can Lee recover?

No, he is cooked.

He has always bowled with a flat trajectory which means the ball he bowls skids rather than bounces. When his pace is up around the high 140's and he is shaping the ball away he is a dangerous bowler. When he isn't moving the ball through the air and his pace is around the 140 mark he has no weapons.

At present he has no containing length. He is either full or short as he cannot the ball to rise off a length due to the balls low trajectory.

As far as his batting goes he is handy, but I think Johnson has much further scope for improvement and should be moved up to no.8 regardless of Lee's position in the side.

Second the notion.

Whilst acknowledging his service and the AB Medal and so on, at his age with hot spots in the foot, loss of real pace and this reversion back to short or full bowling seems to indicate it may be worth blooding a younger fast bowler than persisting.

I would prefer to play Hilfy and give him a decent run in the side. It's time for a radical cull, one that a lot of people wouldn't have seen in Australian cricket. Jacques, Hughes, D. Hussey could all walk into the side with the likes of Marsh, North and Voges. When CA issue contracts next year i would like to see them cut a few on the edges like Hodge and White. Both great Vic's, but neither likely to get into the side or do anything. Give Tom Cooper or Dave Warner a contract, give them a carrot to perform.

But back to Lee, i'd thank him for his service, he has over 300 test wickets and some runs, and wish him the best for his future. I can't see him being able to reinvent himself like you say GVGjr, nor can i see the need to with Johnson and Haddin bating down to 8, and Krejza/Hauritz not too bad at 9 and then with Siddle and Hilfy.

[Pedro Sanchez]

Re: Can Lee recover?

Again I think the sentiments on Lee are way too harsh... Quality test cricketers just dont grow on trees...

42-C you've mentioned some decent young-ish talent there but cant see how guys likes Voges and Hughes will just walk in and replace proven, experienced test players straight up when they haven't done it consistently at the level below for any extended peroid.

Sure no-ones spot is guaranteed but lets hold on to our hats. We might need to make one or two changes but thats it. Lets not forget that both SA and India are probably the two form sides in world cricket at the moment and its hardly like we've been getting pantsed by either of them. Overall I think lets resist the urge to make wholesale changes just for the sake of it.

[Mantis]

Re: Can Lee recover?

Harsh opinion there re he's cooked...

I think the guy has just been over bowled on some pretty flat batting friendly tracks. His strength has always been to be used as a strike bowler in bursts, but with the given changes in the bowling line-up and our new ability to leak runs at ridiculous rates he's also had to become the negating stock bowler too.

Overall I think he's all class - 300 odd career test wickets is proof of that. With his stress foot injury which also backs up the over-worked argument, lets allow him to freshen up, work through his marriage issues and get the selectors to pick 4 bowlers that actually work as a balanced unit and we'll see his best again. Here's hoping he and the team's bowling peaks around June 09 - just in times for the Ashes!

In 2005 at the peak of his power's (???) he was slayed in England.

He took 20 wickets @ 41.1 in that series and was one of the reasons we got beat. He was of more use with the bat.

How would he be able to improve on that series when he is 4 years older, has lost a yard of pace and can't move the ball??

[Sockeye Salmon]

Re: Can Lee recover?

I'm with Mantis, he's done.

He's been a good bowler but I've never rated him in the elite, just a good, honest bowler like Merv or Craig McDermott.

It's time.

[bulldogtragic]

Re: Can Lee recover?

Again I think the sentiments on Lee are way too harsh... Quality test cricketers just dont grow on trees...

42-C you've mentioned some decent young-ish talent there but cant see how guys likes Voges and Hughes will just walk in and replace proven, experienced test players straight up when they haven't done it consistently at the level below for any extended peroid.

Sure no-ones spot is guaranteed but lets hold on to our hats. We might need to make one or two changes but thats it. Lets not forget that both SA and India are probably the two form sides in world cricket at the moment and its hardly like we've been getting pantsed by either of them. Overall I think lets resist the urge to make wholesale changes just for the sake of it.

You've just got to do it. That's how young guys get into the team. The team is currently selected on reputation and appears to be a closed shop. Hodge, DHuss, Rogers and co are scoring so bloody many runs and have done for a long time and can't get into the team for any length of time. Martin Love didn't last despite a hundred in his last innings.

Just cut them. Hayden, Symonds and Lee to start. Now that Watson is out for another 6 months, start looking elsewhere for an all-rounder beyond Symonds and Hopes too.

Jacques deserves to come back when fit, Hughes needs a run, Marsh and North need to perform, Rogers and DHuss are older but are deserving.

We need to go through some pain to accelarate our rise back up. Like AFL cutting deadwood and senior players for youth, look at Geelong, Hawthorn and us. Get the kids in, blood them, give them time and put faith in them. Stop selecting teams on reputation i say.

[Sockeye Salmon]

Re: Can Lee recover?

If Watson can't bowl for 6 months his test career is on hold at best.

Andrew McDonald and Cameron White are now in the mix.

[azabob]

Re: Can Lee recover?

If Watson can't bowl for 6 months his test career is on hold at best.

Andrew McDonald and Cameron White are now in the mix.

Might as well bring back Simon O'Donnell. At this stage McDonald and White do not deserve to play for Australia.
One would assume they'd try and nurse through Symonds again wouldnt they? Not that he should be playing.

[GVGjr]

Re: Can Lee recover?

One would assume they'd try and nurse through Symonds again wouldnt they? Not that he should be playing.

If they think he is capable of bowling 10 overs per innings as a spinner then the selectors would probably stick with him.
Finding a replacement might be too hard or controversial for them.

[Sockeye Salmon]

Re: Can Lee recover?

Might as well bring back Simon O'Donnell. At this stage McDonald and White do not deserve to play for Australia.
One would assume they'd try and nurse through Symonds again wouldnt they? Not that he should be playing.

McDonald averages 46 with the bat and 23 with the ball in Shield cricket this year.

[LostDoggy]

Re: Can Lee recover?

McDonald averages 46 with the bat and 23 with the ball in Shield cricket this year.

Those are some serious figures. More deserving of a spot than the incumbent.

[ledge]

Re: Can Lee recover?

I think SA has pantsed Australia, win by 9 wickets and chased down the biggest second innings total easily is pantsed.
But i put it down to bad selection and bad captaincy more than Australia hasnt got the talent.

[dog town]

Re: Can Lee recover?

Why are we talking like Brett Lee is a great of the game? He has always been an average bowler who was a good foil to bring in for a fiery spell when he had some good bowlers around him. He had 18 months as a really good bowler but I dont think it was ever really sustainable. He has certainly been a gutsy competitior I just dont think he was really ever an elite bowler. I woudnt even consider bringing him back into the test team.