2013 Tour of India

[GVGjr]

Assuming we take 15 players on the tour of India which players would you select?

[Rocco Jones]

Re: 2013 Tour of India

Warner
Cowan
Hughes
Clarke
Khawaja
Doolan
Watson
Maxwell
Wade
Pattinson
Siddle
Bird
Starc
Hilfenhaus
Lyon

Not huge on Johnson anyway but especially not overseas against quality opponents. I'd have him as stand by for Pattinson.

Think selectors will go with Haddin and Johnson in for Doolan and Hilfenhaus.

[GVGjr]

Re: 2013 Tour of India

Like your team Rocco and i think its very close to what the selectors will go for.

If I were a selector I'd like to look at the following:
Openers
Watson, Warner and Cowan (No Hughes)
Middle Order
Doolan, Khawaja, Clarke and Henriques
Wicket keeper
Wade
Pace Bowlers
Siddle, Pattinson, Johnson and Starc (No Bird)
Spinners
Lyon, Hauritz and Maxwell

Selection thoughts
- I can't justify taking 4 openers on the tour given batting against spin blowing is likely to be the main way India tries to take wickets so to me Hughes misses out
- Doolan needs to be groomed as Hasham Amla type number 3 or 4.
- Cowan can slide to number 3 for the tour with Watson opening.
- Henriques selection is to provide us with the option of playing two spinners but having a 5th bowler. I'm being cautious with Watson.
- Khawaja should go well on the sub continent tracks.
- I wanted pace bowlers who hit the track hard so I would save Bird for the tour of England.
- I think we need two specialist spin bowlers

[lemmon]

Re: 2013 Tour of India

Don't think Ritzy will ever be in the frame for selection again, was hung out to dry after that tour of India and Beer has probably done enough to still be still be the second in line. Think he might do okay in India, its not the sort of environment where you really need to loop the ball up, flatter bowlers generally are quite successful, see the Panesar V Swann figures.

Interesting you see Doolan as more likely to succeed than Hughes? He's an attractive player but at the moment I'm not convinced this is any more than a purple patch, wait and see I'd say.

My squad would be:
Warner
Cowan
Hughes
Watson
Clarke
Khawaja
Wade
Johnson
Pattinson
Siddle
Lyon

Beer
Starc
Ferguson
Hastings

I'm a massive fan of Bird but I think he may be a bit excess, need a bit of pace through the air on the Indian tracks, think those bats could do what they did to Broad to him so he's left out in a 'horses for courses' selection. Beer gets in as the second spinner. Maxwell will be picked I have no doubt but I cant justify it, I'd rather leave out the spinning all-rounder when I don't have a good one rather then pick a guy I think will be a passenger. Hastings gets the last touring spot as my all round cover, don't think he's up to batting top 7 (or as a front line bowler) and its more a statement to Henriques/Doolan that more of the same should be expected before they are picked, half a season doesn't cut it. Ferguson is the guy who hasn't been talked about, he's my backup middle order bat. Has the second most runs in the shield and is a fairly mature head with a bit of international experience who could step in and perform better than anyone else going around in the Shield at the minute.

*Edit- I take back that Ferguson would be the most able shield batsman to step in, that would be Cosgrove...but I'm more chance of getting picked.

[dog town]

Re: 2013 Tour of India

I think we will take 8 batsmen, 5 quicks and just the one spinner. The selectors have shown their hand with the selection of Maxwell. I think they plan to use 3 quicks and Lyon with support from Watson,Maxwell, Warner and Clarke. It is a strategy I actually agree with. The worst thing you can do is play poor or inexperienced spinners just because the pitches are conducive to it.

Teams have and still do have success in India with pace bowling. In fact our best tour of India and South Africas best tour of India in the last 10 years came on the back of fast bowling. Bowl tight, create pressure, set defensive fields to allow the bowlers to bowl straighter and attack the stumps. It is a recipe that has worked before and can again. Englands quicks adjusted after the first game in the recent tour. The spinners were very good for them admittedly but Anderson showed you can still have success as a quick. I just dont see the point in playing an extra spinner if they are not up to it.

I think Siddle, Pattinson and Lyon all pick themselves. I wouldn't take both of Johnson and Starc because I just dont think we will play both in the same game. They leak too many runs to play them side by side. I think the selectors will take both of them and Bird though. Zampa from NSW is a big smoky for the tour. If he has a couple of good shield games it wouldnt surprise me if he got on the tour. It would be ridiculous as he has only played 1 shield game and a handful of 20/20 games but these selectors dont mind a punt. I honestly don't see a second spin option in the country. Hauritz is the number 2 but you are not going to play 2 defensive, drop off spinners. Beer is struggling, Holland is injured and the rest dont rate a mention.

The top 5 bats will stay the same and we will take Khawaja and Maxwell barring a disastrous showing in Sydney. The extra bat will more than likely be Doolan but dont be surprised if we go with Haddin as a specialist bat. The selectors like him and he is probably our second best player of spin.

We have a major issue with our batting for India in that we have quite a few guys who I would class as suspect against quality spin. I have watched India and Pakistan get stuck into England and South Africa with quality spin so many times. Of our current top 7 minus Mike Hussey I think only Clarke is a good player of spin. Warner has hard hands against it but can dominate it if he survives early. Watson and Hughes best defence against it is to heave it. That can be a good move but is unreliable. Hughes is basically cut or slog against spin. Cowan is just ok against it. Wade really struggles with it and can get bogged down if he isn't really attacking it, like Hughes and Watson his best defence is to go after it.

The batting order post Hussey will be fascinating both long and short term. Khawaja is the next best pure batsmen and will get his shot at some stage. I dont think he is a natural 6 though as your number 6 is usually a good counter attacker and capable of rotating the strike. Busy players normally thrive at 6. Khawaja can make a go of it but it leaves us in the strange position of having 4 natural openers, a number 3/4 (Khawaja) in our top 6. It is the biggest issue with our batting line up going forward with no obvious answer.

[dog town]

Re: 2013 Tour of India

Don't think Ritzy will ever be in the frame for selection again, was hung out to dry after that tour of India and Beer has probably done enough to still be still be the second in line. Think he might do okay in India, its not the sort of environment where you really need to loop the ball up, flatter bowlers generally are quite successful, see the Panesar V Swann figures.

Interesting you see Doolan as more likely to succeed than Hughes? He's an attractive player but at the moment I'm not convinced this is any more than a purple patch, wait and see I'd say.

My squad would be:
Warner
Cowan
Hughes
Watson
Clarke
Khawaja
Wade
Johnson
Pattinson
Siddle
Lyon

Beer
Starc
Ferguson
Hastings

I'm a massive fan of Bird but I think he may be a bit excess, need a bit of pace through the air on the Indian tracks, think those bats could do what they did to Broad to him so he's left out in a 'horses for courses' selection. Beer gets in as the second spinner. Maxwell will be picked I have no doubt but I cant justify it, I'd rather leave out the spinning all-rounder when I don't have a good one rather then pick a guy I think will be a passenger. Hastings gets the last touring spot as my all round cover, don't think he's up to batting top 7 (or as a front line bowler) and its more a statement to Henriques/Doolan that more of the same should be expected before they are picked, half a season doesn't cut it. Ferguson is the guy who hasn't been talked about, he's my backup middle order bat. Has the second most runs in the shield and is a fairly mature head with a bit of international experience who could step in and perform better than anyone else going around in the Shield at the minute.

*Edit- I take back that Ferguson would be the most able shield batsman to step in, that would be Cosgrove...but I'm more chance of getting picked.

Ferguson is well suited to playing in India. Not sure he is a long term answer though. Struggles with the short stuff and anything a bit lively. He is young enough to turn that around but its an issue at the moment.

I watch quite a bit of shield cricket. Teams definitely feel Ferguson is vulnerable to the short ball even if its to set him up. Maxwell will surprise some with his technique, certainly not the slogger he was when he first came on the scene. Scores all round the wicket and defends well. Not ready yet but wont disgrace himself.

Agree re Doolan being a bit of guess work. I guess he, Quiney and Maxwell performed in the tour games which gives them a jump on the rivals. I also think its dangerous using this seasons shield stats at this stage of the year. We just haven't had enough cricket. You are talking 6 hits for most of the players and mostly on lively pitches.

[comrade]

Re: 2013 Tour of India

Surprised that Bird isn't a certainty in the above line ups. I'm also shocked he's been dropped for Starc for tomorrow's match.

IMO, he could be the best fast bowling talent we've had since McGrath. He bowled more genuine international quality balls during the Boxing Day Test than Mitchell Johnson has all year.

I'd be picking him at every opportunity and build a line up around Bird, Pattinson, Siddle and Johnson as a bowling all-rounder.

Watson
Warner
Hughes
Khawaja
Clarke
Wade
Johnson
Siddle
Pattinson
Lyon
Bird

Obviously, with that lineup batting depth is a concern but I'd be confident of taking plenty of Indian wickets.

[comrade]

Re: 2013 Tour of India

Good to see Bird keep his spot for Sydney and Johnson slotting in at 7.

[dog town]

Re: 2013 Tour of India

Looks like they couldn't make a decision so didn't. I think its ridiculous that we are playing 5 bowlers. Johnson at 7 would never stand up against quality opposition which I suspect the selectors know. They simply didn't want to have to leave any of those bowlers out and know they can get away with it against this side.

[bulldogtragic]

Re: 2013 Tour of India

Looks like they couldn't make a decision so didn't. I think its ridiculous that we are playing 5 bowlers. Johnson at 7 would never stand up against quality opposition which I suspect the selectors know. They simply didn't want to have to leave any of those bowlers out and know they can get away with it against this side.

Couldn't agree more, it's an indictment on the resting/rotating policy. 5 bowlers could only happen against a half fit Lankans.

[Rocco Jones]

Re: 2013 Tour of India

Simply cannot go with Johnson at 7, showed contempt for the opposition.

Watson giving up bowling will have a big impact on the structure ofr the side. FWIW I would have him in the side on batting alone at the moment.

My XI with Watson as an all-rounder...
Warner
Cowan
Hughes
Khawaja
Clarke
Watson
Wade
Pattinson
Siddle
Lyon
Bird

Johnson/Starc to replace Pattinson if injured. They will get a go via rotations anyway.

If Watson gives up bowling, I think the selectors will go with another all-rounder in Maxwell in place of Khawaja.

[Greystache]

Re: 2013 Tour of India

Simply cannot go with Johnson at 7, showed contempt for the opposition.

Watson giving up bowling will have a big impact on the structure ofr the side. FWIW I would have him in the side on batting alone at the moment.

My XI with Watson as an all-rounder...
Warner
Cowan
Hughes
Khawaja
Clarke
Watson
Wade
Pattinson
Siddle
Lyon
Bird

Johnson/Starc to replace Pattinson if injured. They will get a go via rotations anyway.

If Watson gives up bowling, I think the selectors will go with another all-rounder in Maxwell in place of Khawaja.

My concern Rocco is that Watson hasn't shown any real ability to make consistent runs anywhere but opening. I understand the temptation to drop him down the order when he's bowling, but if he's playing purely as a batsmen then for me he has to open and do so at the expense of Cowan.

[lemmon]

Re: 2013 Tour of India

My concern Rocco is that Watson hasn't shown any real ability to make consistent runs anywhere but opening. I understand the temptation to drop him down the order when he's bowling, but if he's playing purely as a batsmen then for me he has to open and do so at the expense of Cowan.

I think the selectors and Micky Arthur signaled today that he'll be coming back through the Shield. I guess if he gets runs opening for NSW the spot will be his

[bulldogtragic]

Re: 2013 Tour of India

How good is Maxwells bowling for him to be considered an all rounder? Granted I have not seen that much, but he doesn't look like much more chop than Warner to me.

[GVGjr]

Re: 2013 Tour of India

How good is Maxwells bowling for him to be considered an all rounder? Granted I have not seen that much, but he doesn't much more chop than Warner to me.

I don't rate his bowling much at all. He is better suited to limited over cricket