The Monday Soapbox - Round 2, 2025

[GVGjr]

Time to get on your soapbox for the round 2 games.

Are Essendon really that bad?

[GVGjr]

Umpiring? Goodwin's comments on Gawn?
There is a bit to work with this week

[jeemak]

Umpiring? Goodwin's comments on Gawn?
There is a bit to work with this week

I think someone on First Crack said there's a family issue/ illness with Gawn. Goodwin was pretty quick to jump in on it.

[Grantysghost]

My soapbox is why do small clubs like Essendon get to play at the G so often when they can't draw a crowd?

We get 80k to games surely we should be the ones sharing the venue more often !!

[Bornadog]

I mentioned this in another thread on the weekend. AFL has once more lost the plot with dumb rules. Insufficient intent - we got robbed several times with this rule. Umpires need some common sense when making these decisions . Dale got pinged when he was running towards the ball, and it came off his body and went OOB. Daicos steps over the line, so blatant deliberate and wasn't pinged. These frees/non frees at a vital stage of the game.

The ball is not round, it can bounce anywhere, FFS

[Mofra]

North have genuinely turned the corner, I can feel it. Loved their game against Melbourne

[kruder]

North have genuinely turned the corner, I can feel it. Loved their game against Melbourne

No excuses for them anymore.

[kruder]

Marra not attending on Friday night is bloody sad to see.

[Pedro Sanchez]

Throwing this one out there… let it swing in the proverbial breeze.

Is the AFL slowly killing the natural, instinctive physical contest that defines our game? Feels like we’re watching it unravel in real-time, powerless to stop it.

Let’s look at the context. These days, the whistle blows more than in a netball match - four field umpires seemingly desperate to justify their presence, making calls in almost every contest, often with little regard for common sense of the general the spirit of the game.

And the weekly conversation? It’s less about the footy itself and moreso about MRP frameworks, ‘insufficient intent’, ‘hands in the back’ vs ‘push in the back’, concussion protocols - or whether an action looked bad enough to warrant suspension, regardless of injury or impact.

Meanwhile, coaches are handcuffed by AFL HQ, unable to call out the sub-par officiating as the game’s natural contest gets increasingly sanitised.

So where does this leave us in two years? Will common sense return? Will genuine physical contact be allowed again? Fat chance.

More likely, speccies will be outlawed - because a knee hitting someone’s head in a marking contest will be deemed ‘dangerous’. Tackles that bring players to ground? Gone. And what are we left with? A glorified possession drill - all hands-free, all execution - but the heart of the game, the contest, stripped away.

And do the commentators ever call it out? Absolutely not - they know where their bread is buttered.

My frustration with the game has never been higher. Even watching neutral games, I find myself annoyed.

Maybe it’s just me - maybe I’m the outlier. After all, crowd numbers are breaking records, revenues are up, and commercially, the game is flying.

But at what cost?

Would genuinely love to hear what others think…

Up the Dogs. Pedro

[jazzadogs]

Pies supporters whinging that we got one free kick they didn't agree with at the start of the game, and that somehow cancels out the rest of the match.

The Darcy Moore holding the ball was consistent with the way they have interpreted it this year and last year. Tackled with one arm pinned, and the ball in the other arm. He held the ball to his chest with no attempt made to dispose of it. Despite the no prior, you still need to make an attempt.

The comparisons they used later in the game, where the dogs 'threw' or 'dropped' the ball, involved Dogs players who had no prior and immediately tried to dispose of it once tackled. That's the interpretation these days. These idiots might need to actually check in on the rules before they lose their heads.

[jazzadogs]

The same moronic pies fans have been using vision of Maynard swinging his arm into Daniel Lloyds head a few years as reason why Lobb should have been suspended for his spoil.

Ignoring the fact that Maynard is a dumb thug, he clearly swings his f***ing arm and knocks the guy out. Lobb had a locked shoulder and elbow with a clear intention to hit only the ball.

TW: this clip contains Tom Morris

[soupman]

Pedro, I understand the sentiment, but I think the key premise of the following is flawed

Is the AFL slowly killing the natural, instinctive physical contest that defines our game? Feels like we’re watching it unravel in real-time, powerless to stop it.

I don't think the AFL is in control of the direction of the game, and its repeated efforts to try to stop the evolution is evident in a bunch of rule changes it has brought in.

The game has changed, but thats because in the last 20 odd years tactics have evolved from moving a CHB to CHF at halftime to changing the entire mindset of how teams want to play, what they want to allow, and how they setup the ground. The AFL has tried to stop it to a degree, but ultimately the only way they could do so is to bring in even more restrictive rules or simply replace all coaches and team leaders with people that will resist the temptation to enact better tactics to preserve the game style of the past.

Whether the changes are for the better is obviously a matter of personal opinion, and for me I really enjoy watching AFL and regularly watch at least a quarter of probably 6-7 games a round.

I guess more than the tactical change though you have an issue with the perceived lack of physicality now present in the game?

I don't think it is lacking, there are heaps of incredible contests every week from the fittest and strongest athletes the game has ever seen. Most of the efforts to reduce "physicality" have been towards things that aren't inherent to the actual game itself. Ensuring tackles or marking attempts or bumps don't hurt an opponent is not a bad thing surely, and I'm not sure which examples of these from the past that are now outlawed are things we are missing now?

I agree everything surrounding the AFL is a shitshow; the media, AFL HQ decisions, and I too am happy for players/coaches to be given a bit more rope although I don't trust them to use it well.

Umpiring is tough, they have an impossible job and imo mostly do it well, and I think generally in the spirit of the game according to the brief they are given.

Am i concerned with where the game is heading, yes, but more in terms of the way its managed and the outcomes it is trying to achieve (basically market share and money over who and what the game is actually for). I think it still holds up really well as being more for the fans and giving all clubs opportunity than almost every other professional sporting league I can think of, but I am worried this is being eroded more and more every year.

[Bornadog]

The game has changed, but thats because in the last 20 odd years tactics have evolved from moving a CHB to CHF at halftime to changing the entire mindset of how teams want to play, what they want to allow, and how they setup the ground. The AFL has tried to stop it to a degree, but ultimately the only way they could do so is to bring in even more restrictive rules or simply replace all coaches and team leaders with people that will resist the temptation to enact better tactics to preserve the game style of the past.

I have been banging on about this for the last 18 years on the forum. I have challenged the rule changes every time there is one.

The rules changes (except those protecting players) have been designed to do exactly what you say - preserve the game style of the past. What the AFL hasn't accounted for is the players are now faster, stronger, bigger, the coaches are smarter and more tactical, technology introduced helps to also rethink how the game plan evolves and the game evolves.

No rule changes ever will make the game the same as in the past.

The main thing I want is some common sense and adjudication on the fundamentals of the game ie correct disposal, running and bouncing the ball, tackling between shoulders and knees, no pushing in the back - just the basics have got to be ruled on. All the other rules are crap including stand, 666, the kick out after a point is scored, third man up, insufficient intent, and others I have forgotten at this time of night.

[Pedro Sanchez]

Pedro, I understand the sentiment, but I think the key premise of the following is flawed


I don't think the AFL is in control of the direction of the game, and its repeated efforts to try to stop the evolution is evident in a bunch of rule changes it has brought in.

The game has changed, but thats because in the last 20 odd years tactics have evolved from moving a CHB to CHF at halftime to changing the entire mindset of how teams want to play, what they want to allow, and how they setup the ground. The AFL has tried to stop it to a degree, but ultimately the only way they could do so is to bring in even more restrictive rules or simply replace all coaches and team leaders with people that will resist the temptation to enact better tactics to preserve the game style of the past.

Whether the changes are for the better is obviously a matter of personal opinion, and for me I really enjoy watching AFL and regularly watch at least a quarter of probably 6-7 games a round.

I guess more than the tactical change though you have an issue with the perceived lack of physicality now present in the game?

I don't think it is lacking, there are heaps of incredible contests every week from the fittest and strongest athletes the game has ever seen. Most of the efforts to reduce "physicality" have been towards things that aren't inherent to the actual game itself. Ensuring tackles or marking attempts or bumps don't hurt an opponent is not a bad thing surely, and I'm not sure which examples of these from the past that are now outlawed are things we are missing now?

I agree everything surrounding the AFL is a shitshow; the media, AFL HQ decisions, and I too am happy for players/coaches to be given a bit more rope although I don't trust them to use it well.

Umpiring is tough, they have an impossible job and imo mostly do it well, and I think generally in the spirit of the game according to the brief they are given.

Am i concerned with where the game is heading, yes, but more in terms of the way its managed and the outcomes it is trying to achieve (basically market share and money over who and what the game is actually for). I think it still holds up really well as being more for the fans and giving all clubs opportunity than almost every other professional sporting league I can think of, but I am worried this is being eroded more and more every year.

Appreciate your opinion on this. Just to be clear, I'm not saying the game is less physical at all. My point is that the majority of times there is a contest, an umpire gets involved to award a free. And then this is compounded by guys getting suspended for what are essentially common accidents on a field - just where do we go from that?

The best games, and its often finals, are when the umps put the whistle away. Yet in the two rounds already this season its like umpires cant wait to inject their influence on proceedings. And if players are regularly getting penalised or suspended from making a contest, then eventually they will avoid doing it.

A significant part of the game was founded on hunting and winning the ball - being in and under a pack was a badge of honour. Today, with the way holding the ball is interpretted, its moreso a matter of wait, hunt the player hunting the ball, then tackle and get the free. In my book that doesnt stack up for a sustainable game in the long run.