Brisbane - I mean - WOW.

[mjp]

Rightio.

I loved the Grand Final. LOVED IT. One goal the difference 5-mins to go in the 3rd when Brisbane unleashed the fury (aka Lachie Neale started winning stops for fun) and they put their collective feet on the throat of Geelong and that's all she wrote really.

But I've been thinking a lot about the game and the two sides that ran out there...and whilst what Geelong have done is impressive Brisbane are LADEN with talent.

You could make a case that Geelongs best 3x players are:

1/. Over 30.
2/. Either refugees from other clubs (Cameron and Dangerfield) or from the local leagues (Stewart).

Geelongs midfield is based around a surprisingly high draft selection (Holmes), a player who battled to get centre square time at another AFL club (Smith) and a 'hard trier' (Atkins).
Brisbane? A 2-time brownlow medallist who arrived at the club as a multi best and fairest winner from another club (Neale), a high draft pick at the absolute peak of his powers (McCluggage) and another best and fairest winner recruited from another club (Dunkley). None of the Brisbane crew - despite their quite incredible list of individual achievements - are 30-yet.

I could do the same comparison with the forward line where - I mean, sure, the Cats have Cameron...but it's honestly pretty thin after that unless you are one of the few remaining believers in Grien Miers and Tyson Stengle. I mean, good players but are you seriously comparing those smalls with Zac Bailey, Kai Lohman and Cam Raynor that they can be depended upon to deliver on the biggest stage? Sure, the Lions have a couple of kids playing as talls but no-one is asking them to catch the bloody thing...they have clear roles (be in this spot - don't let the bloke next to you mark it and stay out of Zac's way)...and that makes it all possible.

Behind the ball the comparison is not even close. Humphrey is gonna be a player (maybe he already is) but seriously the Lions are loaded behind the ball...go near the footy as an oppo forward and someone is going to tattoo their name on your butt before you think about getting another pick.

When Brisbane turned it on the difference in talent was just plain as day - and whilst I think it's worth admiring what the cats have done in terms of attracting players like Smith to their club, the small number of high picks and low number of genuine difference makers on their list was actually pretty staggering. They have an incredible home ground advantage but if you want to compare this team to say - 2007 - when they had Ablett, Chapman, Kelly, Bartel, Johnson, Scarlett et al running around...I mean, that team would win by 10 goals. I don't know when Taylor joined that merry band but that was a team to be genuinely reckoned with...they are doing it a bit with paper and string at the moment.

Anyway - not sure what everyone else thinks about all this but to me at least Geelong are not the threat right now - the Lions are a HUGE challenge though and one we were 7-goals up on over in Adelaide. We simply have to keep the faith - improve our crumbers in forward 50 and add another couple of genuine ball winners to share the load through the mids. I get the KPD debates - I really do - but to me it's not the priority right now that finding some more winners up the ground is - if you told me we could have Darcy WIlmot though you've officially got my attention.

[Aidan7557]

Brisbane are the standard. Going to be very hard to beat them unless they have an off day.

[jeemak]

Agree with all but the piece around the defence. Someone of Harris Andrews quality would make a huge difference to us, bordering on immeasurable. He can do everything.

The polish forward/outside is our next biggest priority though........as I think we can win the footy sufficiently with a full compliment.

[1eyedog]

Rightio.

I loved the Grand Final. LOVED IT. One goal the difference 5-mins to go in the 3rd when Brisbane unleashed the fury (aka Lachie Neale started winning stops for fun) and they put their collective feet on the throat of Geelong and that's all she wrote really.

But I've been thinking a lot about the game and the two sides that ran out there...and whilst what Geelong have done is impressive Brisbane are LADEN with talent.

You could make a case that Geelongs best 3x players are:

1/. Over 30.
2/. Either refugees from other clubs (Cameron and Dangerfield) or from the local leagues (Stewart).

Geelongs midfield is based around a surprisingly high draft selection (Holmes), a player who battled to get centre square time at another AFL club (Smith) and a 'hard trier' (Atkins).
Brisbane? A 2-time brownlow medallist who arrived at the club as a multi best and fairest winner from another club (Neale), a high draft pick at the absolute peak of his powers (McCluggage) and another best and fairest winner recruited from another club (Dunkley). None of the Brisbane crew - despite their quite incredible list of individual achievements - are 30-yet.

I could do the same comparison with the forward line where - I mean, sure, the Cats have Cameron...but it's honestly pretty thin after that unless you are one of the few remaining believers in Grien Miers and Tyson Stengle. I mean, good players but are you seriously comparing those smalls with Zac Bailey, Kai Lohman and Cam Raynor that they can be depended upon to deliver on the biggest stage? Sure, the Lions have a couple of kids playing as talls but no-one is asking them to catch the bloody thing...they have clear roles (be in this spot - don't let the bloke next to you mark it and stay out of Zac's way)...and that makes it all possible.

Behind the ball the comparison is not even close. Humphrey is gonna be a player (maybe he already is) but seriously the Lions are loaded behind the ball...go near the footy as an oppo forward and someone is going to tattoo their name on your butt before you think about getting another pick.

When Brisbane turned it on the difference in talent was just plain as day - and whilst I think it's worth admiring what the cats have done in terms of attracting players like Smith to their club, the small number of high picks and low number of genuine difference makers on their list was actually pretty staggering. They have an incredible home ground advantage but if you want to compare this team to say - 2007 - when they had Ablett, Chapman, Kelly, Bartel, Johnson, Scarlett et al running around...I mean, that team would win by 10 goals. I don't know when Taylor joined that merry band but that was a team to be genuinely reckoned with...they are doing it a bit with paper and string at the moment.

Anyway - not sure what everyone else thinks about all this but to me at least Geelong are not the threat right now - the Lions are a HUGE challenge though and one we were 7-goals up on over in Adelaide. We simply have to keep the faith - improve our crumbers in forward 50 and add another couple of genuine ball winners to share the load through the mids. I get the KPD debates - I really do - but to me it's not the priority right now that finding some more winners up the ground is - if you told me we could have Darcy WIlmot though you've officially got my attention.

Weren't you in the no to Zak Butters group 6 months ago? Do you still maintain that position?

In other words do you think he's a winner up the ground?

Interested in your thoughts as I find the shift in discussion from behind the ball (all the talk at the Dogs) to in front of the ball interesting and I tend to agree.

[1eyedog]

Brisbane are the standard. Going to be very hard to beat them unless they have an off day.

They actually had quite a few off days this season and were quite lucky to finish top 4.

[Bornadog]

They actually had quite a few off days this season and were quite lucky to finish top 4.

We match up well with them as shown in the two games this year. At the Gabba, 1 min to go and scores were level.

Amazing how they kept winning to make top 4, they never give up.

[GVGjr]

Brisbane are hungry for success, they want to make the most out of their strong position.

[Axe Man]

Brisbane are scary because they don't appear anywhere near falling off a cliff.

They don't have many too many key players north of 30 - Neale, Zorko, Lester, Gardiner, Fort, McInerney, Cameron are the 30 and over players from the Grand Final side and only Neale and Zorko are top tier.

They have young guns coming through in Ashcroft x2 (21 & 18), Fletcher (21), WIlmot (21) and Morris (20), plus the highly rated Daniel Annable in this draft. Although their NGA pipeline might be restricted it's not being cut off and they get the best of both worlds with father sons as well.

Sure they will lose some handy pieces in Starcevich and Ah Chee but will bring in a younger ruck in Draper to replace their aging 2 plus a guy that was a gun key forward a few years back in Allen.

Then you look at who wasn't in their grand final team - it's a fairly handy list - Berry, McCarthy, Doedee, Coleman, Hipwood, Payne.

It's hard to see how they don't have a sustained period of success.

[dukedog]

i read this and remember when the dogs won in 2016. i was like...... dogs will crush teams for years. and that thought is now history.

[NAUGHTY100]

Rightio.

I loved the Grand Final. LOVED IT. One goal the difference 5-mins to go in the 3rd when Brisbane unleashed the fury (aka Lachie Neale started winning stops for fun) and they put their collective feet on the throat of Geelong and that's all she wrote really.

But I've been thinking a lot about the game and the two sides that ran out there...and whilst what Geelong have done is impressive Brisbane are LADEN with talent.

You could make a case that Geelongs best 3x players are:

1/. Over 30.
2/. Either refugees from other clubs (Cameron and Dangerfield) or from the local leagues (Stewart).

Geelongs midfield is based around a surprisingly high draft selection (Holmes), a player who battled to get centre square time at another AFL club (Smith) and a 'hard trier' (Atkins).
Brisbane? A 2-time brownlow medallist who arrived at the club as a multi best and fairest winner from another club (Neale), a high draft pick at the absolute peak of his powers (McCluggage) and another best and fairest winner recruited from another club (Dunkley). None of the Brisbane crew - despite their quite incredible list of individual achievements - are 30-yet.

I could do the same comparison with the forward line where - I mean, sure, the Cats have Cameron...but it's honestly pretty thin after that unless you are one of the few remaining believers in Grien Miers and Tyson Stengle. I mean, good players but are you seriously comparing those smalls with Zac Bailey, Kai Lohman and Cam Raynor that they can be depended upon to deliver on the biggest stage? Sure, the Lions have a couple of kids playing as talls but no-one is asking them to catch the bloody thing...they have clear roles (be in this spot - don't let the bloke next to you mark it and stay out of Zac's way)...and that makes it all possible.

Behind the ball the comparison is not even close. Humphrey is gonna be a player (maybe he already is) but seriously the Lions are loaded behind the ball...go near the footy as an oppo forward and someone is going to tattoo their name on your butt before you think about getting another pick.

When Brisbane turned it on the difference in talent was just plain as day - and whilst I think it's worth admiring what the cats have done in terms of attracting players like Smith to their club, the small number of high picks and low number of genuine difference makers on their list was actually pretty staggering. They have an incredible home ground advantage but if you want to compare this team to say - 2007 - when they had Ablett, Chapman, Kelly, Bartel, Johnson, Scarlett et al running around...I mean, that team would win by 10 goals. I don't know when Taylor joined that merry band but that was a team to be genuinely reckoned with...they are doing it a bit with paper and string at the moment.

Anyway - not sure what everyone else thinks about all this but to me at least Geelong are not the threat right now - the Lions are a HUGE challenge though and one we were 7-goals up on over in Adelaide. We simply have to keep the faith - improve our crumbers in forward 50 and add another couple of genuine ball winners to share the load through the mids. I get the KPD debates - I really do - but to me it's not the priority right now that finding some more winners up the ground is - if you told me we could have Darcy WIlmot though you've officially got my attention.

Agree with alot of what you say there mjp , the player i would have if we can get him is Butters, he would be the perfect genuine ball winner you talk about , in fact he would take so much load off Bontempelli and Libba .
Having Butters winning 25 to 30 possessions per game would mean our back line would'nt be under as much pressure as they were this year, because the ball would not be in our backline as much , he would be a real needle mover , pumping it forward 25 times a game would give our forwards a real lift as well .

[Rocket Science]

Premierships. Best and Fairests. Dunkley's just doing this shit for fun now.

I'm not furious, you're furious.

[EasternWest]

Premierships. Best and Fairests. Dunkley's just doing this shit for fun now.

I'm not furious, you're furious.

Always and in perpetuity I blame Jeemak. And you should too.

[Sedat]

Premierships. Best and Fairests. Dunkley's just doing this shit for fun now.

I'm not furious, you're furious.

After what Brisbane did in the last 2 weeks of the season, preventing the filth and Geelong from getting their grubby hands on any silverware, Dunks has more than repaid his debt to us - he can win another 5 flags and B&Fs for all I care.

[mjp]

Weren't you in the no to Zak Butters group 6 months ago? Do you still maintain that position?

In other words do you think he's a winner up the ground?

Interested in your thoughts as I find the shift in discussion from behind the ball (all the talk at the Dogs) to in front of the ball interesting and I tend to agree.

I don't have anything about Zac Butters. I'm just so done with the whole trade conversations. Like (I think - it was a while ago) I said in my post I want to win the flag with a team of Bulldogs, not a team of imports. Every team needs more good players....

I guess what I was trying to talk about with the Lions was just the talent they are rolling out there and comparing it to Geelong who look pretty 'loaded' in isolation. Then you look closely and see players like Smith and Holmes in key midfield roles (with Atkins in support) and you kind of think to yourself..."RIGHT. Why are we scared of these guys?". Brisbane are on a different level to the Cats - and when you see the cats trying to recruit mid-liners like Woerpel you realise that whilst what they are doing (consistent top 4 finishes) is very impressive when you look back and compare to what they built under Thompson with access to high-level draft picks etc - well...it's just not the same...

I guess I'm rambling now but my take post Freo game has been that game rose and fell not on our inability to defend but rather our inability to move the ball out of D50 in the second q. The players weren't on the same page and banging the ball down the line hoping for Darcy to mark it was a poorly thought out plan. To me that isn't KPD's (though I think we need a 'meat and potatoes' defender who will 'take names' and apply a bit of a 'not on my watch' approach to oppo forward entries turning into scoring shots) as much as it is a bit more buy in to our ball movement plan which includes 18x players getting involved rather than just 5-6.

[Jasper]

Brisbane are scary because they don't appear anywhere near falling off a cliff.

They don't have many too many key players north of 30 - Neale, Zorko, Lester, Gardiner, Fort, McInerney, Cameron are the 30 and over players from the Grand Final side and only Neale and Zorko are top tier.

They have young guns coming through in Ashcroft x2 (21 & 18), Fletcher (21), WIlmot (21) and Morris (20), plus the highly rated Daniel Annable in this draft. Although their NGA pipeline might be restricted it's not being cut off and they get the best of both worlds with father sons as well.

Sure they will lose some handy pieces in Starcevich and Ah Chee but will bring in a younger ruck in Draper to replace their aging 2 plus a guy that was a gun key forward a few years back in Allen.

Then you look at who wasn't in their grand final team - it's a fairly handy list - Berry, McCarthy, Doedee, Coleman, Hipwood, Payne.

It's hard to see how they don't have a sustained period of success.

You would invest hard earned in them in making good returns for their shareholders. The next 3 or 5 years have strong projections.
I know we have traditionally done well with father son and NGA selections but they have really benefited from them. More to come as well.