The Clarke Experiment, Private Schools and Perceptions.

[Rocco Jones]

Re: The Clarke Experiment, Private Schools and Perceptions.

Don't we have a few guys from outside the bourgeoise ?

Gags. Freijah. Marra, Treloar without even looking.

Yeah I guess the theory/fact? is that the numbers are very skewed. Not that you cannot make it due to disadvantages like lower socioeconomics but that is is a lot more difficult. Also, Marra had the NGA advantage. Gags needed extra year in VFL right?

[hujsh]

Re: The Clarke Experiment, Private Schools and Perceptions.

Great post Mike.

I have my own bias because I?m from one of those private schools in Adelaide (oh dear, I?ve outed myself). While I?m sure there are nuances state to state, what you say rings true.

The part I don?t quite understand is:

For kids who don?t go through the private school pathway, are the talent programs not sufficient in making sure players have basic skills of knowing how to present on time in a reasonable state on a daily (or every other day) basis?

Many of the kids may have work / part time jobs - this is in many ways a lot harder to manage than a private school - why aren?t these things being highly regarded or seen as a sign of maturity? In many ways a football program is like a school program (I imagine) and therefore, it?s not so much needing maturity (I actually think you learn maturity once you?re out in the real world without those levels of structure - that?s when the rubber hits the road) but about being able to adhere to structure and time management. Dunno. Maybe I?m wrong.

I suppose my next question is, what complementary skill building can talent programs provide to help kids who don?t come from the cookie cutter pathway, and how do they get engagement in those programs so they?re actually moving the needle?

The academies is a great concept to help here if executed well, but it seems like more of the ?well rounded young man? stuff that?s what?s missing and that?s going to be hard to replicate outside of a school environment.

It almost reads more like rather than young men with real world experience or thoughts of their own based on seeing the world themselves and having a diverse set of experiences, AFL clubs prefer man-children who mostly know to do what they're told and are taken care of for the most part/ leave work/decisions outside of their immediate identified responsibilities to others (mum/dad, coaches/club staff). In which case is it any surprise we get cases like the supplements scandal where players don't know to say no to dodgy crap and in a lot of cases continue to be generally immature/irresponsible?

Don't we have a few guys from outside the bourgeoise ?

Gags. Freijah. Marra, Treloar without even looking.

IDK a lot about them but didn't Marra attend a private school? Even if the background is working class if you get a footy scholarship you're kind of on that pathway at that point right?

[Rocco Jones]

Re: The Clarke Experiment, Private Schools and Perceptions.

Yeah I guess the theory/fact? is that the numbers are very skewed. Not that you cannot make it due to disadvantages like lower socioeconomics but that is is a lot more difficult. Also, Marra had the NGA advantage. Gags needed extra year in VFL right?

Treloar was recruited by GWS a year earlier than normal. Had their support after turning 17. Freijah from Ballarat as OG posted mentioned too.

[Rocco Jones]

Re: The Clarke Experiment, Private Schools and Perceptions.

Don't we have a few guys from outside the bourgeoise ?

Gags. Freijah. Marra, Treloar without even looking.

In effect, I think how these 'expectations' got to AFL says a lot in how difficult it can be:
- Gags needed another year in VFL
- Freijah Ballarat private school
- Marra: NGA + going to Scotch
- Treloar: a bit of an older case but having support from GWS a year earlier than normal due to undrage drafting access

[Grantysghost]

Re: The Clarke Experiment, Private Schools and Perceptions.

I don't get the argument.

If you're a good kid once you're in the afl system you will be ok.

Of course clubs are going to look at the best schools.

Do you want your guys from Melton Tech?

Hey I went there, Tyson Lane and Shane Ellen are my bros and all but yeah i wouldn't trust them to deliver too often.

I was riding my bike to school footy with Ty.
We got pulled over by the cops, no helmets.

He gives a fake name!

I give my real name.

The percentages of where are they now from good schools will be higher that's just the facts.

If youre looking for truth Dr Tyree's philosophy class is right down the hall.

[Rocco Jones]

Re: The Clarke Experiment, Private Schools and Perceptions.

I don't get the argument.

If you're a good kid once you're in the afl system you will be ok.

Of course clubs are going to look at the best schools.

Do you want your guys from Melton Tech?

Hey I went there, Tyson Lane and Shane Ellen are my bros and all but yeah i wouldn't trust them to deliver too often.

I was riding my bike to school footy with Ty.
We got pulled over by the cops, no helmets.

He gives a fake name!

I give my real name.

The percentages of where are they now from good schools will be higher that's just the facts.

If youre looking for truth Dr Tyree's philosophy class is right down the hall.

I'm guessing mjp's thoughts are about early intervention. That at 15 these guys getting access to better programs, or more to the point, learning AFL system type things would mean footy has a larger actual talent pool.

And also, that if clubs can find a way to develop his talent, it could be a competitive advantage.

[Grantysghost]

Re: The Clarke Experiment, Private Schools and Perceptions.

I'm guessing mjp's thoughts are about early intervention. That at 15 these guys getting access to better programs, or more to the point, learning AFL system type things would mean footy has a larger actual talent pool.

And also, that if clubs can find a way to develop his talent, it could be a competitive advantage.

More important things than footy I reckon the money is heading to.

I wasn't discounting Mike his post was sublime.

But.. What's the answer. There's only so much money and footy ain't that important.

My wife is the exec for the mallee for the department of Ed. As in manages the entire area.

So many issues, you can't expect footy to be a priority.

[jeemak]

Re: The Clarke Experiment, Private Schools and Perceptions.

If the programs could be based at the AFL clubs, most of the facilities are ALREADY there...

It's not a massive cash problem. Providing access to gyms and rehab facilities, indoor training facilities (these guys aren't game planning but do need individual skill dev) and class room facilities isn't going to be a multi-billion $ excise.

And if you think the boys need this support, have you guys seen a thing called the AFLW???

What sort of appetite do you think the AFL has for keeping things simple, low key, and cost effective?

If there's no plaudits to be gained, it's hardly worth doing.

[Rocco Jones]

Re: The Clarke Experiment, Private Schools and Perceptions.

More important things than footy I reckon the money is heading to.

I wasn't discounting Mike his post was sublime.

But.. What's the answer. There's only so much money and footy ain't that important.

I was addressing you saying you were not getting the argument. There can be an argument even when there isn't an answer/solution that is realistic in certain environments.

The answer will come if it comes motivating enough for clubs and/or the AFL to pour money into it.

Having early intervention, programs for talented 15+ yos would improve the 'standard' of AFL but would fans really notice/care/contribute more to the bottom line? No motivation really for clubs to do it as they only have access at draft age.

[Rocco Jones]

Re: The Clarke Experiment, Private Schools and Perceptions.

What sort of appetite do you think the AFL has for keeping things simple, low key, and cost effective?

If there's no plaudits to be gained, it's hardly worth doing.

That's it.

[Grantysghost]

Re: The Clarke Experiment, Private Schools and Perceptions.

I was addressing you saying you were not getting the argument. There can be an argument even when there isn't an answer/solution that is realistic in certain environments.

The answer will come if it comes motivating enough for clubs and/or the AFL to pour money into it.

Having early intervention, programs for talented 15+ yos would improve the 'standard' of AFL but would fans really notice/care/contribute more to the bottom line? No motivation really for clubs to do it as they only have access at draft age.

Who is paying for it though? I hear you. But there's a hundred programs fighting for the cash.
Footy probably isn't that important in the grand scheme.

[Rocco Jones]

Re: The Clarke Experiment, Private Schools and Perceptions.

Who is paying for it though? I hear you. But there's a hundred programs fighting for the cash.

Oh I agree with you. I was just addressing you not getting the argument.

I think you get the argument. And I agree there's no real solution.

[Grantysghost]

Re: The Clarke Experiment, Private Schools and Perceptions.

Oh I agree with you. I was just addressing you not getting the argument.

I think you get the argument. And I agree there's no real solution.

Ah ok yep fair. Also get stuffed

[Rocco Jones]

Re: The Clarke Experiment, Private Schools and Perceptions.

Ah ok yep fair. Also get stuffed

Haha. Done.

It could be a massive competitive advantage. Not saying it's possible or not, probably not without early intervention and club's don't have that.

NBA clubs used to legit think black people couldn't learn to be in a team. That didn't change because Red Auerbach was a social justice hero, it was because he saw a way to win more.

[Grantysghost]

Re: The Clarke Experiment, Private Schools and Perceptions.

Haha. Done.

It could be a massive competitive advantage. Not saying it's possible or not, probably not without early intervention and club's don't have that.

NBA clubs used to legit think black people couldn't learn to be in a team. That didn't change because Red Auerbach was a social justice hero, it was because he saw a way to win more.

Love you
And also love mjp.
Hope Matt Kennedy can process that.