Game Day Round 3 2016 - Western Bulldogs V Hawthorn

[Twodogs]

Re: Game Day Round 3 2016 - Western Bulldogs V Hawthorn

I don't understand how that last quarter went for almost 36 minutes?

I remember thinking that at the 34 minute mark.


I think that Ceglar must have obscured the umpire's view. I saw the contest from side on from start to finish-I could see Ceglar running down the ground so I was watching him-from where I was(standing on level 1 behind aisle 31) and thought it was a free. Ray Chamberlain usually can't control himself when it comes to those frees, he loves running in and paying them.

[Bornadog]

Re: Game Day Round 3 2016 - Western Bulldogs V Hawthorn

It was directly in my line of view (from level 2). I thought Breust grabbed Murphy's jumper early on (as in with the ball in the air still 20-30 metres away) and from there on in just got in Bob's way of the contest.

Correct, if you see this footage, Breust is clearly pushing Murphy away from Sisley and giving him no chance to try and spoil. Sisley may have still marked the ball, but we will never know.

[jeemak]

Re: Game Day Round 3 2016 - Western Bulldogs V Hawthorn

Neither - for mine the contact was minimal enough and subtle enough to be ok, and Breust was smart enough to keep his eyes on the flight of the ball to make it look like he was going to contest the mark. If those were paid every time there would be 100 free kicks a game.

Happy for people to disagree with me.

Actually no, if that rule was applied properly and consistently people would stop doing it......

[BornInDroopSt'54]

Re: Game Day Round 3 2016 - Western Bulldogs V Hawthorn

It was directly in my line of view (from level 2). I thought Breust grabbed Murphy's jumper early on (as in with the ball in the air still 20-30 metres away) and from there on in just got in Bob's way of the contest.

Under the strictest interpretation of the rules, if the umpire saw the whole exchange from where he was - it was certainly a free kick for holding, and then for shepherding.

Having said that, it was moving quickly, and its a tough call (particularly when the two players are running back and both entangled) - and one I'd be filthy on if it was called and the teams reversed.

That's what I saw. The hold on the jumper double handed and Bob couldn't break it. I can't understand how you think that's OK and that you say you would be upset if the jumpers were reversed and the free was given. So you don't respect the rule and think it's OK to break it. I'm glad I expect more of the game and than you and Sedat. If you don't have rules you don't have a game. It's a given that umpires will make mistakes and I can understand the mistake in this incident, the ump must have been blindsided and it seems most supporters didn't see it. However to know that someone is holding on preventing someone from competing in a mark, for that to be happening when it did in the game on Sunday to Bob Murphy who does his knee as a result of the incident but to say that's OK, smells to me.

[BornInDroopSt'54]

Re: Game Day Round 3 2016 - Western Bulldogs V Hawthorn

Correct, if you see this footage, Breust is clearly pushing Murphy away from Sisley and giving him no chance to try and spoil. Sisley may have still marked the ball, but we will never know.

You can't see the hold from this footage, it happened before the camera gets there.

[Ozza]

Re: Game Day Round 3 2016 - Western Bulldogs V Hawthorn

That's what I saw. The hold on the jumper double handed and Bob couldn't break it. I can't understand how you think that's OK and that you say you would be upset if the jumpers were reversed and the free was given. So you don't respect the rule and think it's OK to break it. I'm glad I expect more of the game and than you and Sedat. If you don't have rules you don't have a game. It's a given that umpires will make mistakes and I can understand the mistake in this incident, the ump must have been blindsided and it seems most supporters didn't see it. However to know that someone is holding on preventing someone from competing in a mark, for that to be happening when it did in the game on Sunday to Bob Murphy who does his knee as a result of the incident but to say that's OK, smells to me.

Gee whiz.

Not sure where to start. I think I'm best to leave the 'expect more from the game' and the 'Bob Murphy does his knee as a result' comments alone.

In my post, I stated that in the strictest interpretation of the rule, it was a free kick. That is with the benefit of a clear line of view, being able to watch the replay etc etc. But I think we all know, that its a game with a hell of a lot of rules, an extremely difficult game to umpire and if umpires were to pay every single technical free kick - the game would be unwatchable. The hold was very brief - but it was there. Did the umpire see it? Did Murphy infringe on Breust also? Does Murphy having his back to the ball influence the decision.

There is heaps of grey in the game. It wasn't a blatant free kick - by anyone's measure.

The reason I said I'd be filthy if it was paid against us - is because that would literally be the reaction if we missed an opportunity to score based on a very very technical hold off the ball. My comment was about the likely visceral reaction to it.

[Missing Dog]

Re: Game Day Round 3 2016 - Western Bulldogs V Hawthorn

Yes we have, and it's quite possible that this new group will go the same way as its predecessors - the loss to Adelaide and to Hawthorn both included some really poor game sense and structural/communication mishaps, as well as some poor skill errors in the last couple of minutes. So far we have a sample size of 3 games - 1 win and 2 losses is not enough to make a definitive statement one way or another.

It will be very interesting to see how this group handles such a scenario when it next happens. It's not about skill or ability or desire - we smashed both Adelaide and Hawthorn into next week inside and at the clearances - it is about composure, poise, game sense, ruthlessness. Teams aren't going to gift-wrap the 4 points or a big final to us just because we are good to watch. Hawthorn dodged a bullet yesterday and they know it, as did Adelaide in the EF last year. We know it, the players know it and the coaching staff know it too.

I believe that people take a harsher view of their own team's mistakes, and with than in mind, the finishing cost us,and Bevo said as much. As did the look on his face in the box after the misses.

[BornInDroopSt'54]

Re: Game Day Round 3 2016 - Western Bulldogs V Hawthorn

Gee whiz.

Not sure where to start. I think I'm best to leave the 'expect more from the game' and the 'Bob Murphy does his knee as a result' comments alone.

In my post, I stated that in the strictest interpretation of the rule, it was a free kick. That is with the benefit of a clear line of view, being able to watch the replay etc etc. But I think we all know, that its a game with a hell of a lot of rules, an extremely difficult game to umpire and if umpires were to pay every single technical free kick - the game would be unwatchable. The hold was very brief - but it was there. Did the umpire see it? Did Murphy infringe on Breust also? Does Murphy having his back to the ball influence the decision.

There is heaps of grey in the game. It wasn't a blatant free kick - by anyone's measure.

The reason I said I'd be filthy if it was paid against us - is because that would literally be the reaction if we missed an opportunity to score based on a very very technical hold off the ball. My comment was about the likely visceral reaction to it.

You obviously think it wasn't much of a grab whereas I think it was a strong one. This is not an incident to be written off as a grey area. If I saw one of our blokes do what I saw Breust do to Bob and the free was paid, I'd be disappointed in our bloke and the loss of the game but I would have no complaints about the umpire and praise the call as a very good one. I saw a strong hold being resisted by Bob twisting away and doing his knee.

[Happy Days]

Re: Game Day Round 3 2016 - Western Bulldogs V Hawthorn

I thought it was a free, but honestly we deserved to have that goal kicked on us for being stupid enough to not pay any attention to Sicily.

[Hotdog60]

Re: Game Day Round 3 2016 - Western Bulldogs V Hawthorn

Yes I agree, he seems to lumber around a bit.

I hope his not carrying the dreaded OP.

[Go_Dogs]

Re: Game Day Round 3 2016 - Western Bulldogs V Hawthorn

I hope his not carrying the dreaded OP.

Over summer when I got out to training he wasn't moving well - I put it down to the surgery I understand he had to his hip in the off-season and perhaps he still isn't 100% or lacks a bit of conditioning.

[Hotdog60]

Re: Game Day Round 3 2016 - Western Bulldogs V Hawthorn

Over summer when I got out to training he wasn't moving well - I put it down to the surgery I understand he had to his hip in the off-season and perhaps he still isn't 100% or lacks a bit of conditioning.

I hope that maybe the case so he up and flying come the second half.

[Bornadog]

Re: Game Day Round 3 2016 - Western Bulldogs V Hawthorn

I hope that maybe the case so he up and flying come the second half.

Mantis also confirmed he wasn't running till after Christmas.

[merantau]

Re: Game Day Round 3 2016 - Western Bulldogs V Hawthorn

I thought it was a free, but honestly we deserved to have that goal kicked on us for being stupid enough to not pay any attention to Sicily.

I thought it was a free too. And the deliberate OOB paid against Suckling, from which Rioli scored a freak goal was a very poor decision. As I saw it Suckling was not in control of the ball and was actually pushed from behind and this caused the ball to cross the line.
But those are not the major reason we lost. We missed very get-able set shots and some handballs and kicks to advantage, from which we should have goaled, were well astray. Hawthorn know they will have to fight for every possession next time we meet. They will not feel comfortable at all knowing they will likely come up against us again

[jeemak]

Re: Game Day Round 3 2016 - Western Bulldogs V Hawthorn

I thought it was a free, but honestly we deserved to have that goal kicked on us for being stupid enough to not pay any attention to Sicily.

It wasn't the leaving of Sicily that hurt us - that's a symptom of how footy's played these days and having numbers back would have made it more likely the ball would pass through our half forward and wing area. What screwed us was the fact we couldn't kill a loose ball after the Hawks dropped a chest mark from a mongrel kick out.

At the ten second mark of the video BAD posted you see Jordan Roughead crowd the ball completely unnecessarily leaving Burgoyne to slip outside and clear. That created the clean ball practically under no pressure. It reminded me of the type of things we used to do in Bmac's years when we were unbelievably easy to score against.

I posted in the premiership thread that we're not disciplined enough to think our way through these situations as yet. We desperately need to be as instances like these up the ground make us easy to score against down the ground.