The Three Top KPPs In Three Drafts - All Bulldogs

[Bornadog]

Re: The Three Top KPPs In Three Drafts - All Bulldogs

I think Schache is a centre half back that hasn't been told it yet.

A lot of the criticisms of Josh are the same that were made of Darcy Moore and before him Lachy Henderson - not aggressive enough, doesn't crash packs, doesn't stay involved in the play etc etc.

What he does have is a beautiful field kick, he's a good athlete and moves well laterally for a man of his size, has enough bulk to play key defence, he has good hands and I think is underrated below his knees.

A lot of ingredients there to make a pretty good tall defender.

Naughton's marking is generational - to me he sits at centre half forward for the next 12 years and watches Nick Riewoldt tapes before bed. Boyd plays forward and second ruck to give him some support and stop him being double teamed as much.

Leaves a spot in the backline for Josh.

THis may very well be the case. I did hear Josh say he has never played in the backline, however, it may suit him.

[hujsh]

Re: The Three Top KPPs In Three Drafts - All Bulldogs

I hardly saw him forward in the VFL, spent more time in the ruck.
The club clearly see him as a ruck and I suspect the fact he can't mark a leading ball (can mark a high ball) has a bit to do with it.

They’ve seen how we play right? High ball is about all were likely to give him.

[Mofra]

Re: The Three Top KPPs In Three Drafts - All Bulldogs

THis may very well be the case. I did hear Josh say he has never played in the backline, however, it may suit him.

A lot of forwards enter the system then become defenders. Harris/Lake a case in point, and Turtle was predominantly a forward as a junior.

Outside of the bulldogs, Prestagiacomo was considered a 'high-flying forward' pre-draft! Then of course there's SEN's push for a certain 'explosive animal' to be named in the AA squad this year.

[LostDoggy]

Re: The Three Top KPPs In Three Drafts - All Bulldogs

The second paragraph is all you need and better illustrates your point. Marks per game is not a useful stat without further context. It’s a pretty useless stat normally. I’d like to give Boyd a go as a forward where we let him get form in the VFL then give him time in the seniors to prove himself. I don’t care to make a judgement before then personally. Will Boyd ever get this chance though? Maybe not. Maybe not under this coaching group.

Boyd was moved to the ruck because he offered so little fwd. Bev said so (but more politely) at the time. So think its a cop out to blame Bev or delivery for that matter.

Agree to disagree on marks per game. If Boyd could mark he would as any 200cm player who could mark should wherever he played. It actually should be easier to mark in the ruck where you don't have a dedicated beast KPD stopper on you.

As someone said, Boyd is like Nic Nat as far as marking goes. But unlike NN he doesn't offer match turning explosive hit outs and clearances as a ruck.

Time will tell the full story. But 6yrs in one suspects time has largely told its tale with Tom.

But who knows, a clear run with injuries and he may improve.

My biggest concern will be that English has his development interfered with by having to play fwd to accomodate Boyd who can only really play ruck with any degree of effectiveness.

[Happy Days]

Re: The Three Top KPPs In Three Drafts - All Bulldogs

Appreciate the thought but I don't buy it. He's a natural forward who lacks urgency to his game and willingness to commit to contests. I think that moving him to the backline will mitigate his strengths and do nothing for his weaknesses.

[Bornadog]

Re: The Three Top KPPs In Three Drafts - All Bulldogs

Appreciate the thought but I don't buy it. He's a natural forward who lacks urgency to his game and willingness to commit to contests. I think that moving him to the backline will mitigate his strengths and do nothing for his weaknesses.

Hey HD, are you talking about Schache?

[Happy Days]

Re: The Three Top KPPs In Three Drafts - All Bulldogs

Hey HD, are you talking about Schache?

Yep. Not having any appetite for the contest will cook him regardless of position, so assuming he can learn it we should keep him at the one he's proven to be good at.

[mjp]

Re: The Three Top KPPs In Three Drafts - All Bulldogs

This is a cool thread. The only problem is the original premise which is that Boyd, Schache and Naughton were the best talls in their draft.

The best tall in 2013 was McGovern - but he was a rookie, so give it to Cripps. But he is playing as a mid so give it to Barrass.
The best tall in 2015 'right now' is McKay. You would have to say his first few years were behind Schache and Wietering though.
Naughton is miles ahead of the next best for 2017.

The best players at 18 aren't always the best players at 21, or 24, or 27...some of it is environment, some of it is coaching, some of it is the player, some of it is just dumb luck.

[Greystache]

Re: The Three Top KPPs In Three Drafts - All Bulldogs

Boyd was moved to the ruck because he offered so little fwd. Bev said so (but more politely) at the time. So think its a cop out to blame Bev or delivery for that matter.

Agree to disagree on marks per game. If Boyd could mark he would as any 200cm player who could mark should wherever he played. It actually should be easier to mark in the ruck where you don't have a dedicated beast KPD stopper on you.

As someone said, Boyd is like Nic Nat as far as marking goes. But unlike NN he doesn't offer match turning explosive hit outs and clearances as a ruck.

Time will tell the full story. But 6yrs in one suspects time has largely told its tale with Tom.

But who knows, a clear run with injuries and he may improve.

My biggest concern will be that English has his development interfered with by having to play fwd to accomodate Boyd who can only really play ruck with any degree of effectiveness.

Boyd had played 16 games as a 19/20 y.o. key forward before we moved him to ruck/forward in 2016. To write off a dominant junior key forward that quickly at AFL level is beyond insane. I guess it's just bad luck we're coming into our third generation without developing a key forward. We just always get ones we immediately realize are no good.

[Go_Dogs]

Re: The Three Top KPPs In Three Drafts - All Bulldogs

Boyd had played 16 games as a 19/20 y.o. key forward before we moved him to ruck/forward in 2016. To write off a dominant junior key forward that quickly at AFL level is beyond insane. I guess it's just bad luck we're coming into our third generation without developing a key forward. We just always get ones we immediately realize are no good.

Naughton back to CHB Saturday?

[Greystache]

Re: The Three Top KPPs In Three Drafts - All Bulldogs

Naughton back to CHB Saturday?

Who knows, it's deck chairs... Defence is a disorganised mess so he'll be exposed there, but the forward line organisation and delivery is shambolic so he'll get crucified there again. We'll probably play him in the midfield switching into the ruck so we're unpredictable and he'll be lost and confused.

[bulldogtragic]

Re: The Three Top KPPs In Three Drafts - All Bulldogs

Who knows, it's deck chairs... Defence is a disorganised mess so he'll be exposed there, but the forward line organisation and delivery is shambolic so he'll get crucified there again. We'll probably play him in the midfield switching into the ruck so we're unpredictable and he'll be lost and confused.

We’re all lost & confused Rick. Why should he be any different??

[hujsh]

Re: The Three Top KPPs In Three Drafts - All Bulldogs

Could Naughton run the bench instead? Just throwing out different ways to get players involved.

[Greystache]

Re: The Three Top KPPs In Three Drafts - All Bulldogs

Could Naughton run the bench instead? Just throwing out different ways to get players involved.

I wouldn't mind seeing him in charge of the medical team. Does he know how to manage injuries conservatively?

[Bulldog4life]

Re: The Three Top KPPs In Three Drafts - All Bulldogs

This thread is getting ridiculous.