3 things you have learned Rd 14 2019 v Collingwood.

[bulldogtragic]

Re: Three things you have learned round 14 2019 v Collingwood.

BT, you would have observed that I have been very critical of Bevo's use of players/positioning this year - but I didn't have a problem with either of those two today. With Libba and Wally out, and Bailey Smith having shouldered a big workload inside this season, I thought it was very reasonable of Bevo to play Hunter inside mid for a lot of the game. He's turned to one of his most experienced players who can win a lot of footy, to do a job in the absence of some other experience players. And Hunter went pretty well.
On Bailey Williams - given we have so many half back flanker types, not everyone could be there today - and I actually thought Williams competed well forward.

So, I would say that over the whole season - I'm with you on the 'too smart by half' - but on today, I thought they came in with a plan that could win them the game, and it was only really poor conversion that got in the way. Probably the best Bevo has coached for a couple of months - so I have to give credit where due.

Completely agree on your goal kicking and Schache points.

Fair counter argument. But the issue of selecting too many half back flankers is the consensus. Because we have to play some players out of best position, I’d have gone with maybe Duryea forward (as he played a bit last year) and Williams back. Or since we all read about Williams moving to the midfield, maybe starting him there and leaving Hunter free to do his thing on the wing. The dropping of McLean hurt things in the middle rotations and the extra half backs just created an extra issue. I’m still not a fan of either decision, but the genesis of the match day moves was made days ago.

Which has me a little confused. Do we pick the best 22 based on all players, so we wind up some weeks over populated for back flankers or same paced mids. Or do we pick the best lines and cohesive unit across the board? It feels philosophically like we pick the 22 and if there’s too many of a type, we back in changes of roles will work despite no significant precedent for it.

[Ozza]

Re: Three things you have learned round 14 2019 v Collingwood.

Fair counter argument. But the issue of selecting too many half back flankers is the consensus. Because we have to play some players out of best position, I’d have gone with maybe Duryea forward (as he played a bit last year) and Williams back. Or since we all read about Williams moving to the midfield, maybe starting him there and leaving Hunter free to do his thing on the wing. The dropping of McLean hurt things in the middle rotations and the extra half backs just created an extra issue. I’m still not a fan of either decision, but the genesis of the match day moves was made days ago.

Which has me a little confused. Do we pick the best 22 based on all players, so we wind up some weeks over populated for back flankers or same paced mids. Or do we pick the best lines and cohesive unit across the board? It feels philosophically like we pick the 22 and if there’s too many of a type, we back in changes of roles will work despite significant precedent for it.

I'm hearing ya, but Williams went quite well at times forward in the second half of last year, and he was a better option to compete in marking contests than Duryea. Do we go with too many flankers - for sure - but other than Lewis Young, I'm not sure who comes in from the 2s. Toby has been down all season, and as it turns out we won heaps of the footy through the midfield, so I'm not sure thats where we were lacking.

I wouldn't mind seeing Cordy competing forward. Lewis Young to play down back. Roarke is probably surplus to requirements.

[bulldogtragic]

Re: Three things you have learned round 14 2019 v Collingwood.

I'm hearing ya, but Williams went quite well at times forward in the second half of last year, and he was a better option to compete in marking contests than Duryea. Do we go with too many flankers - for sure - but other than Lewis Young, I'm not sure who comes in from the 2s. Toby has been down all season, and as it turns out we won heaps of the footy through the midfield, so I'm not sure thats where we were lacking.

I wouldn't mind seeing Cordy competing forward. Lewis Young to play down back. Roarke is probably surplus to requirements.

I’m not too focused on the size of the player, but their best position. If we have say two too many back flankers so shoving them forward, why not select actual forwards be it Cavarra, even Gowers or West who would play forward pocket initially. Wood, JJ, Duryea, Crozier, Suckling, Daniel, Roarke & Williams seems excessive. Math says a good number will play somewhat out of position up the ground. Like they’re too talented to leave out, but too many also. In basketball terms, like having one centre, one guard and 8 point guards. Unless all 10 are Steph Curry, I don’t see it working. Maybe we can just pick the best ones and maybe a Roarke/Duryea miss.

On Hunter, I thought he was fine. I’d prefer him free from the square and better using his gut running and kicking to better advantage. His kicking maybe dinky, but hacked snaps and being tied in congestion don’t play to his many strengths.

[AshMac]

Re: 3 things you have learned Rd 14 2019 v Collingwood.

1. Brodie Grundy isnt just the best ruck in the league, he is a top 5 player
2. Bont is the most classy and slick player when on form I've seen since pendles was at his peak
3. Ed Richards is suffering from some serious second year blues

[Ozza]

Re: 3 things you have learned Rd 14 2019 v Collingwood.

1. Brodie Grundy isnt just the best ruck in the league, he is a top 5 player
2. Bont is the most classy and slick player when on form I've seen since pendles was at his peak
3. Ed Richards is suffering from some serious second year blues

Strange time to bring this up, when Richards had his best game of the season (which I'll agree has been well down on last year).
Ed was good today. And we should stick with him.

[bulldogtragic]

Re: 3 things you have learned Rd 14 2019 v Collingwood.

Strange time to bring this up, when Richards had his best game of the season (which I'll agree has been well down on last year).
Ed was good today. And we should stick with him.

Started on fire too. Got a career best 15 kicks, several of them I50’s. I thought it was a good run back from a spell.

[ratsmac]

Re: 3 things you have learned Rd 14 2019 v Collingwood.

1. Collingwood didn't win it as nearly as much as we lost it. Take your 4 points and never speak of this game again Collingwood.

2. We aren't that far off the pace. With some smart recruiting at seasons end we can be back to playing finals. Just not this year I'm afraid.

3. Roughead still looks shit in those colours (well shades).

[Grantysghost]

Re: 3 things you have learned Rd 14 2019 v Collingwood.

1. Moving the ball slowly and precisely in two thirds of the ground to avoid turnovers or scores on the back of them is nice; when you can spot up targets inside 50. Think we did that OK in this game, Collingwood just defended amazingly. They had 46 rebound fifties. (we had 31).
2. Stoppages against the pies; just avoid. So I see the above strategy being a bit of a way to do this. Keep the pill! However they were so good at manufacturing them with their mid group pressure when we did miss a target. Then they have it on their terms, and Grundy can do his thing. Centre clearances were pretty even, stoppages it was a different story 29-19 it was very evident at the game.
3. If Sam Lloyd is within 60 of goal he's having a shot.

[Missing Dog]

Re: 3 things you have learned Rd 14 2019 v Collingwood.

1. The Coach still has the players. Well and truly. Bevo started being thrown into the 'coaches under threat' discussions with Richo, Bolton etc before the bye. I don't think he should be in that discussion and if he is its not coz he's lost the players - they gave their all (and they did last week too).

2. Josh Schache has forward craft and the one quality so many of our blokes don't. He can kick for goal (in the main) straight.

3. The Bont was next level clearance wise in 2nd half. Brilliant.

[AshMac]

Re: 3 things you have learned Rd 14 2019 v Collingwood.

Strange time to bring this up, when Richards had his best game of the season (which I'll agree has been well down on last year).
Ed was good today. And we should stick with him.

He did start well, lovely pass to English in the first qtr, and got enough of it over the day. Several missed kicks under no pressure really stuck out. I’m unsure if we’ve got him playing a specific role tbh

Agree sticking w him, I’m a big fan

[Bornadog]

Re: 3 things you have learned Rd 14 2019 v Collingwood.

He did start well, lovely pass to English in the first qtr, and got enough of it over the day. Several missed kicks under no pressure really stuck out. I’m unsure if we’ve got him playing a specific role tbh

Agree sticking w him, I’m a big fan

His role is wing/half forward and to hit targets inside 50.

[Bornadog]

Re: 3 things you have learned Rd 14 2019 v Collingwood.

1. Moving the ball slowly and precisely in two thirds of the ground to avoid turnovers or scores on the back of them is nice; when you can spot up targets inside 50. Think we did that OK in this game, Collingwood just defended amazingly. They had 46 rebound fifties. (we had 31).
2. Stoppages against the pies; just avoid. So I see the above strategy being a bit of a way to do this. Keep the pill! However they were so good at manufacturing them with their mid group pressure when we did miss a target. Then they have it on their terms, and Grundy can do his thing. Centre clearances were pretty even, stoppages it was a different story 29-19 it was very evident at the game.
3. If Sam Lloyd is within 60 of goal he's having a shot.

We really missed Libba in the stoppages and clearances.

[Happy Days]

Re: 3 things you have learned Rd 14 2019 v Collingwood.

1. I couldn’t be at the game so I tried to eat the tape on it later that night with the result in mind, but had to turn it off in the third quarter. I’ve been far more disappointed before but I don’t think I’ve ever been that frustrated. This wasn’t a “dominate possession but lose general play” McCartney special - this was genuinely pissed up against a wall through terrible goal kicking and idiotic entry inside 50

2. English has improved! Only got manslaughtered by Grundy rather that summarily executed. We needed a contingency for poor Tim, and it’s not like Mihocek, underrated as he is, is such a devastating player that Trengove had to stay on him to lock him down.

3. When my beautiful girlfriend, upon seeing De Goey kick that effortless goal from the pocket to compound our series of impotent misses that much further, asked me where our player who could do that was, all I could respond with was “at Essendon”. Our forward mix has some consistency now, but very little danger about it.

[Ozza]

Re: Three things you have learned round 14 2019 v Collingwood.

I’m not too focused on the size of the player, but their best position. If we have say two too many back flankers so shoving them forward, why not select actual forwards be it Cavarra, even Gowers or West who would play forward pocket initially. Wood, JJ, Duryea, Crozier, Suckling, Daniel, Roarke & Williams seems excessive. Math says a good number will play somewhat out of position up the ground. Like they’re too talented to leave out, but too many also. In basketball terms, like having one centre, one guard and 8 point guards. Unless all 10 are Steph Curry, I don’t see it working. Maybe we can just pick the best ones and maybe a Roarke/Duryea miss.

On Hunter, I thought he was fine. I’d prefer him free from the square and better using his gut running and kicking to better advantage. His kicking maybe dinky, but hacked snaps and being tied in congestion don’t play to his many strengths.

I think in reality right now - Cavarra has missed a lot of footy and hasn't earned a spot yet, West is going ok but fades out of games, and Gowers is injured. I really think Lew Young is the one player who has regularly performed well at VFL level not getting rewarded - and I believe its because he is seen as similar to Schache in his contest/competitiveness.

Interesting to see how we go with the line up this week, after Port were successful last week going for a short line up and dropping some notable tall players.

[bulldogtragic]

Re: Three things you have learned round 14 2019 v Collingwood.

I think in reality right now - Cavarra has missed a lot of footy and hasn't earned a spot yet, West is going ok but fades out of games, and Gowers is injured. I really think Lew Young is the one player who has regularly performed well at VFL level not getting rewarded - and I believe its because he is seen as similar to Schache in his contest/competitiveness.

Interesting to see how we go with the line up this week, after Port were successful last week going for a short line up and dropping some notable tall players.

It's pretty confusing about where Le Young is right now. Playing a bunch of roles at VFL level. Also interesting is whether we see him in our medium to long term plans. With not a lot of games to go at AFEL level this year, if he can't break into the side and not having a contract for next year, I wonder what we are going to do.