To improve in 2024 we need less from Marcus Bontempelli

[Mofra]

The Bont - yes, he's great. Yes he's just had one of the best season a bulldog player has had.
Yes, he often carried the team this year. Yes he can do everything. And if he does it next year, we're screwed.

Our best years have been due to our 'extraordinary depth' in certain positions - rebounding defenders in the first couple of years in Bevo's reign, midfielders in 2021.
Right now it's Bont - a gap - Libba - a gap - Treloar - daylight. We play like under 15 kids who expect one or two stars to do all of the heavy lifting. It's hardly Bontempelli's fault, but if we are going to put all our eggs in one basket we're going to be a pretty easy team to stop next year.

We need to rest Bont at times away from the coalface. Rotate in the centre more heavily. Try and find a way of getting a more even contribution from the playing group so when the 22nd player gets a chance to really make the play, he does (instead of thinking 'my role is limited, let's see what the Bont does'). Our 'depth' comes in the form of forwardline quality - it actually works pretty well when we don't crowd the shit out of the F50. Our HFFs block exits rather than swamp the contest, even at repeat stoppages.

Bailey Smith gets more rotations, West & Garcia, as smaller hardnuts, gets their rotations. If we manage to draft a mid who earns his spot, they get a taste too. If it means Bontempelli gets statistically worse... well, it's a team game.

During Richmond's almost-threepeat, Cotchin's output dropped dramatically and Riewoldt went to he no 2 KPF option. I don't think they regret those roles at all.

I'm prepared to die on this hill.

[bulldogtragic]

Re: To improve in 2024 we need less from Marcus Bontempelli

Pretty sure Bont would take some finals wins over another AA too. If we can’t get a more even spread, as you say, we will continue to be predictable and thus more easily beaten. Plus he’s every bit of Pavlich, in that he could be great behind the ball and is a genuine threat up forward. Would be a luxury to see him able to hurt opponents in any and all areas of the ground.

[1eyedog]

Re: To improve in 2024 we need less from Marcus Bontempelli

You think this year was bad you reduce Bont's midfield minutes it's going to get a whole lot worse in 2024. Smith is a tattslotto ticket, Libba is on the edge of the cliff and Garcia is not even best 22 for for mine. We actually need Bont now more than ever.

There was also a certain someone called Dustin Martin and a very good enabler in Dion Prestia in Richmond's premiership wins and Riewoldt only started playing second fiddle when Lynch arrived.

I get the gist of the thread i.e. speading the load
but those players between 18-22 need to make a contribution for the right reasons and stop sweating on the hard work of others.

[Mofra]

Re: To improve in 2024 we need less from Marcus Bontempelli

You think this year was bad you reduce Bont's midfield minutes it's going to get a whole lot worse in 2024. Smith is a tattslotto ticket, Libba is on the edge of the cliff and Garcia is not even best 22 for for mine. We actually need Bont now more than ever.

There was also a certain someone called Dustin Martin and a very good enabler in Dion Prestia in Richmond's premiership wins and Riewoldt only started playing second fiddle when Lynch arrived.

I get the gist of the thread i.e. speading the load
but those players between 18-22 need to make a contribution for the right reasons and stop sweating on the hard work of others.

Well, we're in a chicken vs egg argument now - players can make more of a contribution when they get more opportunity to make a contribution.

Has there been a successful team since the late 90s that has relied on one player to constantly drag them across the line? I really can't think of one. If you look at our 2016 side, we still have nowhere near a consensus on the Norm Smith. 2nd in our B&F that year was a role player who had 1 brownlow vote for his entire 253 game career.

[Bulldog Joe]

Re: To improve in 2024 we need less from Marcus Bontempelli

I want Naughton doing some centre bounce work to add some explosive power to our rotations.

It would also get him away from all the scragging he gets forward.

We certainly need to change the mix to be less predictable. We probably don't lose to GWS in Ballarat if we could have thrown Naughton in the middle when Bont was being heavily tagged.

[josie]

Re: To improve in 2024 we need less from Marcus Bontempelli

I want Naughton doing some centre bounce work to add some explosive power to our rotations.

It would also get him away from all the scragging he gets forward.

We certainly need to change the mix to be less predictable. We probably don't lose to GWS in Ballarat if we could have thrown Naughton in the middle when Bont was being heavily tagged.

I like the idea. Cannot remember if we tried Cody there during that match.

[Hotdog60]

Re: To improve in 2024 we need less from Marcus Bontempelli

I think JUH needs to be FF and Naughton CHF and I think he maybe a better kick when he's not 10 meters out from goal it also gives space for JUH to lead into.
But I agree the team as a whole need to start owning their patch of grass.

[jeemak]

Re: To improve in 2024 we need less from Marcus Bontempelli

Smith and West need to have uninterrupted preseasons so they can be added more prominently to the rotational mix. Jacko needs to slim down and get a bit of spring back into his step and be put on the ball again.

Treloar is better at playing the forward who pushes up role than Jacko as well, and I'd revert back to having the latter being in the first choice of rotations.

Outside of that we need the middle tier and lower tiers to be more consistent in effort and output. There's no excuse for someone like Caleb Daniel to not get his hands on the footy. He's smart, and can run all day. Likewise Williams, it's in his head and he needs to repay the faith shown in him by the club with consistency in effort and concentration.

If these types of things happen and Bont still has massive influence, I'm OK with it.

[1eyedog]

Re: To improve in 2024 we need less from Marcus Bontempelli

Well, we're in a chicken vs egg argument now - players can make more of a contribution when they get more opportunity to make a contribution.

Has there been a successful team since the late 90s that has relied on one player to constantly drag them across the line? I really can't think of one. If you look at our 2016 side, we still have nowhere near a consensus on the Norm Smith. 2nd in our B&F that year was a role player who had 1 brownlow vote for his entire 253 game career.

Sure Aker in the early 2000s changed the face of two of Brisbane's flags. Won a Brownlow as well. Had some help sure but if you strip it back and really want to assess a players's true value it's what they do in critical minutes in a finals series = Aker. 08-09 onwards Franklin won multiple games off his own boot and later through Richmond's era as I said Martin is the guy.

There's lots of 2023 examples as well no-one has had more 30+ 2 goal games than Butters, Tract, Bont, Daicos. We need to better support a player like this if you have one, and we do. You don't reduce the workload hoping the minions step up. The minions simply need to step up.

I'm not sure if you're saying Bont don't be good or player 18-22 be better to be honest but my argument is we really need Bont to keep being Bont and our 18-22 to pull their finger out or we turn over the list.

It seems like we're kinda doing this.

Appreciating the dialogue.

[Mofra]

Re: To improve in 2024 we need less from Marcus Bontempelli

I want Naughton doing some centre bounce work to add some explosive power to our rotations.

It would also get him away from all the scragging he gets forward.

We certainly need to change the mix to be less predictable. We probably don't lose to GWS in Ballarat if we could have thrown Naughton in the middle when Bont was being heavily tagged.

It's actually not as weird a suggestion as it sounds.
Jono Brown was taking the odd centre square rotation in the Lions' glory years

[Bornadog]

Re: To improve in 2024 we need less from Marcus Bontempelli

I seem to recall MJP posting up something about the Bont, Libba, Macrae etc having the ball too much and not allowing the lesser lights to influence the game. I will try and search it, as it was an interesting take. Pretty much similar to what Mofra has said.

[Mofra]

Re: To improve in 2024 we need less from Marcus Bontempelli

Sure Aker in the early 2000s changed the face of two of Brisbane's flags. Won a Brownlow as well. Had some help sure but if you strip it back and really want to assess a players's true value it's what they do in critical minutes in a finals series = Aker. 08-09 onwards Franklin won multiple games off his own boot and later through Richmond's era as I said Martin is the guy.

There's lots of 2023 examples as well no-one has had more 30+ 2 goal games than Butters, Tract, Bont, Daicos. We need to better support a player like this if you have one, and we do. You don't reduce the workload hoping the minions step up. The minions simply need to step up.

I'm not sure if you're saying Bont don't be good or player 18-22 be better to be honest but my argument is we really need Bont to keep being Bont and our 18-22 to pull their finger out or we turn over the list.

It seems like we're kinda doing this.

Appreciating the dialogue.

We're pretty much arriving in a similar place from different perspectives.
Bont absolutely needs to still be him, but there are times he needs to be him outside of the centre square - even for a couple of minutes - if it gets his teammates into the game a bit more. Weightman taking a CBA or playing higher for a few minutes is a good example. If the game is congested, Caleb gets a few minutes as he can actually kick out of congestion.

It's not about Bont being less good, it's really about finding ways to create a greater and more even contribution from the playing group, as the best teams have a more even contribution and even the 22nd picked bloke will have important moments.

[azabob]

Re: To improve in 2024 we need less from Marcus Bontempelli

I seem to recall MJP posting up something about the Bont, Libba, Macrae etc having the ball too much and not allowing the lesser lights to influence the game. I will try and search it, as it was an interesting take. Pretty much similar to what Mofra has said.

The philosophy is “Less is More” from our top liners.

[Rocket Science]

Re: To improve in 2024 we need less from Marcus Bontempelli

This strikes me a development issue as much as a strategic one because my brain struggles to recall a time when we enjoyed legitimate competition for spots rather than the fruitless deckchair shuffling that passes for our last six picked as our fringe types reliably struggle to meet the grade.

We've even had the coach openly lamenting this but if we're keen to take some heat off our prime movers it'd be ace if someone afforded an opportunity actually seized it and graduated to regular duty.

[Go_Dogs]

Re: To improve in 2024 we need less from Marcus Bontempelli

I think we need more from people not named Marcus Bontempelli.