2008 Dogs vs 2009 Dogs (so far) - which is the better side?

[Dry Rot]

2008 Dogs side was clearly the third best, made the PF and came close to making the GF.

2009 Dogs (so far) has mostly the same personnel.

I'm pleasantly surprised that the older guys haven't faded, and while Cooney and Murphy have been hampered by injury, some younger guys like Ward, Harbrow, Hill and Minson have improved. And we have a new and very good tagger in Picken.

Which is the better side and why?

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Re: 2008 Dogs vs 2009 Dogs (so far) - which is the better side?

Easily 2009.

Whilst Johnson and Akermanis have been good players, we haven't relied on them like we did last year. By memory Aker kicked 39 goals last year and Johnson 50 - I doubt they'll both reach those targets again, but we're still kicking some very good scores. Admittedly they're both playing more than a part though - Johnson is second the last time I checked for goal assists.

The improvement from the younger players has been dramatic and it's made us a far better side than we were.

Ward - After his stint with Williamstown, he's been dynamic. He's winning a fair bit of the ball and is operating at a rate of 80% efficiency. He's really given us a harder edge around the stoppages with his ability to win the contested ball and break tackles. His outside game is steadily improving too - he's kicking a few goals.

Harbrow - He's one of our most important players at the moment. He has cemented a position in the back half, shutting down the dangerous small forward options. We've struggled with this in the past, but more so our run out of the back half. Since Griffen moved into the midfield, we've been too predictable with Gilbee. Harbrow has been given a license to run and create, something he's thriving on at the moment. They try and get the ball into his hands a fair bit, giving him the responsibility to clear the ball with his pace. His decision making and skills have improved significantly too - he's becoming far more reliable by hand and foot. He's not making irrational decisions and running to the wrong spots. It's helping Hargrave and Gilbee a lot - he's been our most improved player IMHO.

Picken - We've struggled to contain the oppositions best midfielder for years. Since Libba, we haven't had an effective tagger and the reality is - you need one. Picken's debut season has been well documented but the most pleasing thing is he's beginning to not only shut down his opponent, but find more of the ball himself too. Like Ward, he's hardened us up around the stoppages because he's full of courage. His decision making and skills have improved out of sight, he's a great kick for goal and has got on to a few lately. Been a huge pick-up.

Hill - He's a very dangerous player and sides are finding it difficult to contain him. He's a strong mark and very agile. He's an intelligent player, knows where to run and scoops the ball cleanly off the deck better than anyone. His defensive pressure has really improved in the last 5-6 weeks and as a result, we're really pressuring the oppositions backs into turning the ball over. This guy's a beauty - don't be surprised if he's the type of guy to get us over the line in a Final.

Higgins - He's surprised me. I wasn't sure if he could become a midfielder. He seemed to lack pace and was very poor defensively prior to this year. He's developed himself into a very, very good footballer though. His skills are equal to probably anyone else's in the competition. His decision making is even better. He's fantastic in contested situations and knows how to get on the end of an outside ball. Dare I say it - Higgins is becoming an elite player of the competition and he's really caught up to Cooney/Griffen. Higgins rarely loses a contest, he has a knack at being able to control a slippery and congested ball. No doubt a future captain.

Alongside these guys, Minson has been terrific. He's giving us first use of the ball in the ruck and around the stoppages. He's clearing a path and really making his presence felt. He's taking strong marks and really being a leader out there IMO. So far, his best season by a long way.

THE most exciting thing to come is the form of our 'elite'. That's what makes '09 much more enticing. We've started to hit our straps and we're only beginning to see the influence of Cooney. I expect Griffen to improve and obviously Murphy at full flight makes us a much better side. Hahn has slowly been improving over the last few weeks too. The fact that we've really been impressive in the last 4-5 weeks with our senior players playing more of a backseat role is a great sign. If they can all gel together and at the right time, this Finals series could be the best we've seen IMO.

The key is keeping the boys on their toes. We can't afford a lapse like last year.

[Mantis]

Re: 2008 Dogs vs 2009 Dogs (so far) - which is the better side?

^^^

That's an excellent summary there TBB, a job well done.

Your evaluations on the young players are right on the money and there importance to the teams improvement should not be understated. Eade has been very complimentary with his thoughts as evidenced by his comments after Saturday nights game .ie. 4 young players in our best

I like that you have added big Will into that list of improved younger players. He has really stepped up his game this year and is starting to become an important player in his own right.

[The Coon Dog]

Re: 2008 Dogs vs 2009 Dogs (so far) - which is the better side?

Rocket mentioned this late last year:

WESTERN Bulldogs coach Rodney Eade believes his side's improvement in 2009 must come from its up-and-coming talent.

The Bulldogs pups, who have been at the club between one and six years, return to Whitten Oval this week to commence pre-season training under new conditioning coach Bill Davoren.

Eade believes it is this crop of players that will potentially lift the Dogs higher next year.

"I think that's where our improvement has to come from; players that are 26 and under " Eade said on Friday.

Eade calls for pups to grow

[Bulldog Revolution]

Re: 2008 Dogs vs 2009 Dogs (so far) - which is the better side?

Fine summary TBB - terrific post

The growth and improvement of the players you mentioned has been terrific

I'm hoping that you are indeed on the money with the second half of the season seeing Murphy, Griffen, Cooney etc all hitting absolute top gear.

The other thing I'm hoping is that with a far more even spread of the workload in 09 that the veterans have more left in the tank to shape September action.

[Mofra]

Re: 2008 Dogs vs 2009 Dogs (so far) - which is the better side?

Realistically, we have only a few players who are having less of an impact:
Johnson
Murphy (injury)
Cooney (injury, regaining fitness)
Hudson (not by much)
Cross (arguably, probably same output however kicking is a little more important this year)

This is more than offset by players who have improved:
Harbrow (taken Callan/DFA's spot, provides more drive from defence)
Boyd
Minson
Ward
Picken (revelation)
Griffen (his defensive work has imporved, tackle count is up)
Eagleton (I thought he was bordering on fringe late last year)
Hargrave (last season was arguably his best, I think he has slightly improved)
Morris (disposal is slightly better)
Hill

Given Cooney & Murphy will regain full fitness and Cross & Johnson's decline hasn't been much, we're ahead on balance.

[FrediKanoute]

Re: 2008 Dogs vs 2009 Dogs (so far) - which is the better side?

So maybe.......just maybe I need to think about a ticket home......

[Mantis]

Re: 2008 Dogs vs 2009 Dogs (so far) - which is the better side?

Are you in the UK Fredi. If so, have a look at Air Asia. You can get a return flight for about $1,200

Going by his reports on the 'World Sports' board Fredi is living it up in Sth.America.

[Twodogs]

Re: 2008 Dogs vs 2009 Dogs (so far) - which is the better side?

Great report TDD. There's sort of nothing to add!

[Desipura]

Re: 2008 Dogs vs 2009 Dogs (so far) - which is the better side?

Are you in the UK Fredi. If so, have a look at Air Asia. You can get a return flight for about $1,200

You are all over it, aren't you? Thanks to you, I went to Canberra and now am off to the Gold Coast with my family on Wednesday for 5 days. Got 2 adults and a child for $264.00 return.
I booked the tickets in November last year, had a look at the fixure, we had the bye so I thought it was perfect timing!

[A MacGuffin]

Re: 2008 Dogs vs 2009 Dogs (so far) - which is the better side?

Going by his reports on the 'World Sports' board Fredi is living it up in Sth.America.

If that's the case maybe Fredi cant come home.

[robb]

Re: 2008 Dogs vs 2009 Dogs (so far) - which is the better side?

An interesting discussion about the demise of North on SEN today.

Spoke about North falling into the trap of topping up when drafting after they finished in a prelim final a few years back. The inference was that the list is now shot and will take many years of drafting kids to be finals competitive.

As Rocket suggested at the start of the year it will be the improvement in the home grown kids that will see us vying for a flag this year. Importantly it will also form a base for sustained success.

I never have agreed with topping up unless there is real gap on the list or a superstar such as Judd or acker comes onto the market.

The 2009 dogs side is better than 2008. It now has good finals experience with a nice blend of exciting youth. I suspect the 2010 side will be even better.

[LostDoggy]

Re: 2008 Dogs vs 2009 Dogs (so far) - which is the better side?

Fine post TBB, you've nailed it IMO! Let's just say........"I'm excited "

[AndrewP6]

Re: 2008 Dogs vs 2009 Dogs (so far) - which is the better side?

Thought I'd revive this thread. I've kept my views on this to myself, but after the drivel served up last night, I have to say it - I'm not sure we are better than last year. Yes, we have seen some players develop/emerge - Picken, Ward, Harbrow, Minson. But IMO, there're at least a half dozen who aren't matching last years efforts (Granted, there have been some injury issues). Some games we've won, we didn't look at all impressive - Melbourne, Nth Melb, and there've been losses that featured good efforts in only one or two quarters. Losses that could've been turned into wins with more consistent efforts. It's been good to have a few big wins, just keep thinking "If only"...

Maybe I'm just being pessimistic.

[Mofra]

Re: 2008 Dogs vs 2009 Dogs (so far) - which is the better side?

I have to say it - I'm not sure we are better than last year. Yes, we have seen some players develop/emerge - Picken, Ward, Harbrow, Minson. But IMO, there're at least a half dozen who aren't matching last years efforts (Granted, there have been some injury issues). Some games we've won, we didn't look at all impressive - Melbourne, Nth Melb, and there've been losses that featured good efforts in only one or two quarters. Losses that could've been turned into wins with more consistent efforts. It's been good to have a few big wins, just keep thinking "If only"...

Maybe I'm just being pessimistic.

It's not pessimism if you're raising some valid points.

Picken is picking up again - I though he was quiet the last two, but was holding his place last night. Seems a bit better overhead than I initially gave him credit for.
Eagleton would've been close to dropped before the Saints game for mine if we had a consistent performer at Willy, although I think he did enough to hold his spot for one more week, especially considering injuries. I don't think he'll be going around again, especially considering a Reid could push a Boyd/Ward out to the wing rotations.
Harbrow can get outbodied but his rebound is important and is much improved.

I would say our forwardline output is reduced - Welsh is looking a little slower, Johnno is working harder but a little more up the ground, Hill seems to have lost interest and Murph is battling injury, with Gia (underrated in terms of importance to the side) out too.

The real worry is we rarely play 4 quarters, and teams like Geelong & St Kilda create pressure for 4 quarters. so we will invariably be playing catch up football at some stage during the game against highly rated opponents.