Ryan Griffen?

[LostDoggy]

Re: Ryan Griffen?

With all things being equal I would take a 25 possession game from Griffen. He is always up near the top with metres gained so you would think that his stats will count. .

Just to provide some context to the discussion, 30+ possession games are 'rare' even from top-line possession getters. Most of the top guys (Judd, Coons, Crossy) average in the mid-20s (from memory Crossy is 24.5 and Juddy around 24.9?), but we all remember their 30+ games so assume that every game is like that for them. Of today's players only Gablett is a consistently 30+ possession getter, which is why he is a real freak (but he also makes every possession a double because in true Geelong style he immediately hands it off and runs to receive and so inflates the stats).

All this is just to say that if Griff is averaging 25 possies a game he would have become one of the games top-line ball winners and be a no-brainer top 5 player in the comp so we would all certainly 'take' it. He is currently averaging under 20 if my memory serves me correctly so it would be a huge step (but one he is capable of, no doubt).

[edit: just looked up his stats -- he's averaging 17.9 over his career but averaged 22.0 in 2009 which was a dramatic increase over previous years, so he's getting up there, and would suggest that 2009 WAS his 'break out' year despite popular perception.]

[LostDoggy]

Re: Ryan Griffen?

Griffin is paying $101.00 on Betchoice for the Brownlow. I have wacked a twenty on him. On form its looking like a great bet. I also have Cooney at $51.00.

Ditto, we had $10 on Cooney & Boyd @ $51, Higgins & Griff @ $101

[Mantis]

Re: Ryan Griffen?

Just to provide some context to the discussion, 30+ possession games are 'rare' even from top-line possession getters. Most of the top guys (Judd, Coons, Crossy) average in the mid-20s (from memory Crossy is 24.5 and Juddy around 24.9?), but we all remember their 30+ games so assume that every game is like that for them. Of today's players only Gablett is a consistently 30+ possession getter, which is why he is a real freak (but he also makes every possession a double because in true Geelong style he immediately hands it off and runs to receive and so inflates the stats).

All this is just to say that if Griff is averaging 25 possies a game he would have become one of the games top-line ball winners and be a no-brainer top 5 player in the comp so we would all certainly 'take' it. He is currently averaging under 20 if my memory serves me correctly so it would be a huge step (but one he is capable of, no doubt).

[edit: just looked up his stats -- he's averaging 17.9 over his career but averaged 22.0 in 2009 which was a dramatic increase over previous years, so he's getting up there, and would suggest that 2009 WAS his 'break out' year despite popular perception.]

Our fans (all fans) have become brainwashed by stats and it's due to fantasy footy.

More stats, means more points, which means the better player you are ?? I just don't buy it.

Point in reference in my opinion are Boyd & Cross. These guys consistently get 25+ touches per week, but the quality and effectiveness of these possessions can be poles apart. Very good players in their own right, but sometimes they just don't hurt you with the ball. In my opinion Crossy's 39 possesion game in the 08 QF was almost the worst 39 possession game of all time as his touches had no influence on the game. At the other end of the ground Hodge had less than 20 playing a similiar role and was the 2nd best player on the ground.

So what do we take from that litle rant? I couldn't give a stuff if Griffen or Cross or any other player get career high or career low (within reason) possession averages as what they do with the ball is more important. I am all for quality rather than quantity.

[Go_Dogs]

Re: Ryan Griffen?

The more and more I think about it I see Griffen as being the player who will turn us from a top 4 team into a premiership team... His ability to break from the clearance is just so damn important.

Agreed. Not just from the clearance either, just the spread he can create with his run when we are already in possession of the ball. He can get himself into dangerous spots with his acceleration, receive then ball and then accelerate away again.

[edit: just looked up his stats -- he's averaging 17.9 over his career but averaged 22.0 in 2009 which was a dramatic increase over previous years, so he's getting up there, and would suggest that 2009 WAS his 'break out' year despite popular perception.]

Yep, had his career best year last year by a long stretch, not that too many AFL followers seemed to notice (although quite a few here did). He'll continue to improve again this year I would think, and getting up to that 25 mark is quite possible.

[Mofra]

Re: Ryan Griffen?

Point in reference in my opinion are Boyd & Cross. These guys consistently get 25+ touches per week, but the quality and effectiveness of these possessions can be poles apart. Very good players in their own right, but sometimes they just don't hurt you with the ball. In my opinion Crossy's 39 possesion game in the 08 QF was almost the worst 39 possession game of all time as his touches had no influence on the game.

Fair point on Cross, not sure I agree on Boyd as of last year. He is creeping up to the goal per game mark and his kicking has improved dramatically over the past two seasons. I don't think a player can win a B&F at the 3rd placed club on the ladder if their disposal is sub-par.

[EasternWest]

Re: Ryan Griffen?

Griffin is paying $101.00 on Betchoice for the Brownlow. I have wacked a twenty on him. On form its looking like a great bet. I also have Cooney at $51.00.

Griffin will never win a Brownlow. Ryan Griffen might, but Griffin is no chance.

[Doggy]

Re: Ryan Griffen?

Yeah. Good on ya!!

[Dazza]

Re: Ryan Griffen?

Our fans (all fans) have become brainwashed by stats and it's due to fantasy footy.

More stats, means more points, which means the better player you are ?? I just don't buy it.

I don't follow supercoach/dreamteam at all I was just raising a point that when either of Gia, Griff or Eagleton get high amounts of the ball we generally win. If either of the 3 were to have a blinder of a season it would help us greatly with our chances this year. All 3 are pretty damaging with their disposls and all generally kick more than they handball.

[Sedat]

Re: Ryan Griffen?

Our fans (all fans) have become brainwashed by stats and it's due to fantasy footy.

More stats, means more points, which means the better player you are ?? I just don't buy it.

Could not agree more. That is why the likes of Joel Bowden and his cheapies-off-half-back heir apparent, Brett Deledio, have been amoungst the most expensive player types in recent DT and SC seasons.

For pure influence and impact on a contest, give me the Peter Matera 18 possessions, 5 goals and Norm Smith medal type games from the 1992 GF, or Hodge completely controlling the match with his 20 possessions in the 2008 QF, any day of the week.

[Greystache]

Re: Ryan Griffen?

[edit: just looked up his stats -- he's averaging 17.9 over his career but averaged 22.0 in 2009 which was a dramatic increase over previous years, so he's getting up there, and would suggest that 2009 WAS his 'break out' year despite popular perception.]

Yep, had his career best year last year by a long stretch, not that too many AFL followers seemed to notice (although quite a few here did). He'll continue to improve again this year I would think, and getting up to that 25 mark is quite possible.

Yet the club didn't feel his performances warranted a finish in the top 10 of the B&F yet again, do our supporters over rate Griffen's contribution or does the club and other AFL followers under rate him?

[Go_Dogs]

Re: Ryan Griffen?

Yet the club didn't feel his performances warranted a finish in the top 10 of the B&F yet again, do our supporters over rate Griffen's contribution or does the club and other AFL followers under rate him?

Just because he had a career best year, doesn't always guarantee a Top 10 B&F finish, especially when the club was a kick away from the big one.

I don't think the club underrates his contribution, but perhaps some AFL supporters do. (I know a few Crows supporters who were only too happy to bag him and suggest he wouldn't even make their side late last year - the same ones who'll probably be singing the 'come home Griff' anthem when FA starts up mind you!).

At a guess, Griff would have finished just outside the Top 10, and this just says to me, the side had a good year more so than Griff's contribution wasn't great. The fact that most believe he's capable of more may have also contributed.

FWIW, Griff did finish in the Top 10 in 2008 (I'm 99% sure it was 9th) and he clearly had a better year in 2009 for mine. Make of that what you will.

[Greystache]

Re: Ryan Griffen?

Just because he had a career best year, doesn't always guarantee a Top 10 B&F finish, especially when the club was a kick away from the big one.

That's the pint I was getting at. He's labelled by some of our supporters as elite, superstar, under rated by AFL followers, and a potential Browlow winner, yet in what some say is his break out year he still doesn't make our clubs top 10. That indicates to me he's rated about the right level by all other than some of our own supporters.

[Keepa Movin' Griff]

Re: Ryan Griffen?

Come on guy's he is clearly one of our best! Just so dynamic, no-one in our team has the ability to break through a pack like he does! I can see how his go at all costs can get us in strife at times, and you can find yourself cursing him, but all in all i absolutely love him, and i think his bravery & cunning is starting to rub off on our younger players, think Harbrow & (Everitt v Collingwood).

[Go_Dogs]

Re: Ryan Griffen?

That's the pint I was getting at. He's labelled by some of our supporters as elite, superstar, under rated by AFL followers, and a potential Browlow winner, yet in what some say is his break out year he still doesn't make our clubs top 10. That indicates to me he's rated about the right level by all other than some of our own supporters.

But as I alluded to above, finished in the Top 10 in 2008 when we also played off in a Prelim, and surely you wouldn't be suggesting his 2008 was better to his 2009?

I think a lot of our supporters like Griff and rate him highly because he is a very damaging player who is always threatening to break a game open. We don't have many other players that can do that. His finals form also indicates he's better than your average footballer. Hopefully we have a better indication by the years end as to just how good he may end up.

[LostDoggy]

Re: Ryan Griffen?

I think he has the ability to be elite but the reason why he does not have great results in our B and F is because it rewards consistency, something which he lacks.

Very rare he plays 4 good quarters or 5 or 6 good games in a row

Something he needs to work on