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  • The Doctor
    Coaching Staff
    • Jan 2007
    • 3702

    More Draft Talk

    Following on from the Trade and Draft strategy thread I thought it might be an idea to look at what we should do in regards to recruiting now that the trading is over and other clubs are finalising their pre-draft lists.

    This where I see our list at present,

    we started the year with 40 on the primary list including 2 veterans and 4 rookies.

    So far we have had 10 delistings (Grant, Darcy, Power, McMahon, Montgomery, Robbins, Walsh, Faulkner, McCormack, Baird) from the primary list. 2 rookies were cut (West & Pask).

    We have 2 incoming in Hudson and Callan.

    So that leaves 32 on the primary list and 2 rookies. Lets allow 2 spots on the primary list for veterans (Johnno and West). This means at present we are entitled to 8 selections between the drafts and 2 further rookies. Assuming Harbrow be elevated it would be 7 picks and 3 rookies.

    7 picks would mean we go into the national draft with picks 5,19,35,43,48,66,82. Or we drop the last pick and save one for the PSD.

    Now that we have established all this I'll get to the point.

    We have put ourselves into a pretty good position to rejuvenate our list as a result of some skilful trading and perhaps a bit of luck. It seems to me that there is plenty of talent being cut from other lists swelling the talent pool quite a bit.

    In my view I think we should do the following.

    * Use first 3 picks on the best juniors we can find
    * Use 2 mid range picks on young players delisted from other clubs
    * Use 1 late pick on an experienced player
    * Use 1 pick in the psd to get the best player available.

    Let me explain why I think like this;

    * Our first 3 picks are very good picks and should net us some fine young talent. A nice mix of KP's and perhaps a decent ball winning midfielder would compliment our list nicely.

    * Once we get to around picks 43 & 48 I would be tempted to use at least one if not two picks on players like Kep Bradley, Ryley Dunn, Darren Pfeiffer among others if they are available and would suit a need. These are young footballers who are ready to play now and just might be the kind of player/s who may find a change of scenery just the tonic. Young kids are always speculative at this stage of the draft so unless there is a must have junior still available then I can see some value in recycling a young experienced player.

    * What about using a late pick on a more experienced player. It wouldn't surprise me if Eade does this. A player like Mark Johnson from Essendon as a replacement for Monty perhaps. We usually reserve this pick for a highly speculative youngster. However we have lost a lot of experience this year and a player llike this could have some value for us.

    * PSD pick for the best player that happens to be around. Who knows what might come up. Perhaps we use it on a player who has spent the pre season with us. Maybe if the clubs preceding us commit early to uncontracted players we may be able to entice a player. What about Cousins?????

    food for thought?
    Listening to Brahm's 3rd Racket
  • Twodogs
    Moderator
    • Nov 2006
    • 27655

    #2
    Re: Draft & PSD Strategy

    Terrific post Doc. Well thought out and I'll give some more thoughts when I've got some time.




    Cousins is the real wild card in the pack.
    They say Burt Lancaster has one, but I don't believe them.

    Comment

    • LostDoggy
      WOOF Member
      • Jan 2007
      • 8307

      #3
      Re: Draft & PSD Strategy

      I would take 7 kids with our 7 national draft picks. Might get 2 or 3 good players out of that lot. Ben Cousins? Are you serious? He is turning 30 next year and that is the least of his problems

      Comment

      • Sockeye Salmon
        Bulldog Team of the Century
        • Jan 2007
        • 6365

        #4
        Re: Draft & PSD Strategy

        I expect Hughes to be elevated as well. I have some doubts about his disposal, but would we select him if he was available at pick 82? I suspect we would.

        That leaves 6 spots.

        Picks 5, 19, 35 & 43 on the best kids we can get. Ideally 2 x key forwards, 1 x midfielder & 1 x ruckman.

        I agree that a recycled big body would be worth a go, Bradley or Watts perhaps? Pick 48 would get us Bradley before Freo's pick 56. If Freo intended to use pick 40 on him they could have just traded it to Essendon.

        Pick 66 or PSD? There's only two reasons for using the PSD pick - if there's a player who's out of contract still available at our pick (the way things are looking this seems highly unlikely) or if you have more than one guy in mind and would like to have a look at them. The PSD is only a couple of weeks after the ND, so how much are you going to learn about them in a few training runs?

        I suspect we'll take a kid too young to be rookie listed with pick 66, the typical Clayton, 65kg "he'd be top 10 next year" type and pass on the PSD.

        A big fat pass on the likes of Mark Johnson. I don't agree that we're short on experience. We're short on old blokes, but that's a good thing. We have lots of blokes born in 81 or 82, 26-27 next year (that's right, Gilbee, Hahn and Hargrave all turn 27 next year, Murphy, Gia, Boyd, Morris and Harris 26. As Yabby Jeans once said "it's later than you think"!). These guys all have 100 odd games and enough experience.

        Comment

        • Mantis
          Hall of Fame
          • Apr 2007
          • 15449

          #5
          Re: Draft & PSD Strategy

          It is a very important draft and one which will mould our direction over the next 5 to 8 years. Both Clayton and Eade have to get this one right.

          I am sure at present Clayton as list manager would be carefully dissecting our list and determining the type of players we need to make our list more rounded. In saying that Clayton must also almost use a crystal ball to see where the young players on our list will be in 2 or 3 years time and what positions they will fill.

          The most obvious hole to fill is that of a key forward. We have no-one on our list who looks suited to that role. Tiller looks ok, but will play more as a leading type rather than pack marker, but who knows? We must use 2 of our first 5 selections to draft players who have the ability to play the role of a 'power forward' in years to come. Would think that one of our first 2 picks would have to be used on this type of player.

          The rest of his selections are a mystery and will stay that way til draft day. You have suggested to add in some experience, but do we need a player like Johnson? I would hope our core group of players in the 24-28 age bracket will come to play next year, add a tougher resolve to there game, and lead the way. Agree that we would look at picking up players who have been on an AFL list for 1-3 years (ex Freo??) as much of there development has begun.

          Also I think we will use the rookie draft to pick up the O'Shea types (speculative picks) rather than the national draft.

          Comment

          • Raw Toast
            WOOF Member
            • Jan 2007
            • 982

            #6
            Re: Draft & PSD Strategy

            Good thread Doc.

            Drafting strategy is always an intriguing question and this year more so than many I reckon. Clayton and Eade showed in 2005 that they were prepared to go for a young player from another club in Baird at pick 46, and the old-stager in Monty at 55 before punting on West at 57.

            FWIW I think like Sockeye that we're elevating Hughes as Eade said last week we've got 6 lives picks heading into the draft.

            It does seem like there's a bit more 'recyclable' young talent this year. It's interesting that a few clubs seem to have cut fairly deep into their lists when the bf hype keeps saying its a shallow draft. Part of it is probably the new coaches looking to put their stamp on things (Harvey and Knights in particular).

            It also seems like we're going to go fairly tall with some of our early picks, which makes sense both structurally and also with Clayton apparently rating a fair few of the young talls on offer. And another inside mid would be handy.

            I'd be happy with one-to-two of our late picks punting on the young delisted types. Unless Clayton was pretty bullish on a particular player you'd think we'd be influenced a fair bit in terms of need here, as well as with what's on offer in the untried mob. I'd like a forward contested mark option like Watts and a runner or rover if possible, but if Hughes is elevated we might only take one young delisted type. Collard is another I'm interested in but you'd have to be confident he's keen for a fresh start a long way from home.

            If there's an O'Shea-like player out there - that is a project player who's already got a decent body, then I'm happy for us to go for them with a late speculative pick. I'd prefer to stay away from the Wells, M West types who are yet to show they can play after significant injuries.

            Also don't mind if we rookie a ruck rather than pick one up in the draft. And not keen on an M Johnson type player, unless they meet a very particular need (and he doesn't I don't think).
            [SIZE="1"][B][CENTER][I]Although it broke our hearts it did not break our will[/I][/CENTER][/B][/SIZE]

            Comment

            • westdog54
              Bulldog Team of the Century
              • Jan 2007
              • 6686

              #7
              Re: Draft & PSD Strategy

              Great Post Doc.

              This is a question for those who've watched a lot of Werribee's games this year.

              What are the chances that Michael Rockefeller may end up at the Bulldogs through any of the three upcoming drafts?

              I remember seeing him making up numbers in the intra club, but he actually impressed me quite a bit.

              Comment

              • Mantis
                Hall of Fame
                • Apr 2007
                • 15449

                #8
                Re: Draft & PSD Strategy

                Originally posted by westdog54
                Great Post Doc.

                This is a question for those who've watched a lot of Werribee's games this year.

                What are the chances that Michael Rockefeller may end up at the Bulldogs through any of the three upcoming drafts?

                I remember seeing him making up numbers in the intra club, but he actually impressed me quite a bit.
                I think he will end up on someone's list, whether it's ours is another matter.

                He does rack up some good numbers, but has a few deficiencies in his game and maybe a bit to alike to some of our current players to find his way onto the Bulldogs list.

                Another player who may create some interest is another ex-Werribee player in James Allan. Had a great year in SA and must be a chance.

                I think with players such as Swan and Bartel playing so well this year I think there is still a spot in footy for 'pure' footballers. Not atheletes, just footballers.

                Comment

                • LostDoggy
                  WOOF Member
                  • Jan 2007
                  • 8307

                  #9
                  Re: Draft & PSD Strategy

                  I'd be happy to add a couple of experienced players within our selections and agree that Bradley might be worth a shot. Dunn also but not that keen on the otherwise talented Darren Pfeiffer given some of the things I have heard about his dedication. I'm not exactly sure why but Haddrill actually appeals as someone who could blend in well with our side and potentially release some others up forwards.
                  Mark Johnson is a bit to similar to our current midfield group and there unless there is a specific role in mind, he might not be a good one for us.
                  Collard has some star qualities about him but would be risky.

                  I'd select the best two players with our first two selections and make sure that we at least get one ruckman with one of our 3rd round selections. I actually think we need to select 2 young ruckman this year although one of them could be a rookie.

                  Comment

                  • LostDoggy
                    WOOF Member
                    • Jan 2007
                    • 8307

                    #10
                    Re: Draft & PSD Strategy

                    does anybody know why the two first year fremantle players were delisted? Clayton collard and caleb mourish? i just found that really odd, or were they from the psd or something?

                    Comment

                    • LostDoggy
                      WOOF Member
                      • Jan 2007
                      • 8307

                      #11
                      Re: Draft & PSD Strategy

                      Originally posted by sonofthewest
                      does anybody know why the two first year fremantle players were delisted? Clayton collard and caleb mourish? i just found that really odd, or were they from the psd or something?
                      What I have heard is that Collard like the social part of his life a bit more than professional footballers should and Mourish was a bit unlucky because the Dockers had an otherwise full list. I suspect that a couple of the Dockers might be re-drafted by them.

                      Comment

                      • dog town
                        Senior Player
                        • Jan 2007
                        • 1914

                        #12
                        Re: Draft & PSD Strategy

                        I have said it a few times now but I dont think we should neglect our running stocks. We have a little bit coming through but a little bit of pace would not hurt. Dont care how we get it but the last thing we want is to be one paced with a game plan that is based around breaking the lines.

                        I dont mind some of the things that Bradley has to offer but isn't he just giving you similar traits to Skipper and Wight? The bombers say that his best position is as a lead up CHF and thats where he played his best footy in the reserves this season (b&f). If he can play as a CHF then fine go for it but if he is going to play as a relief ruckmen or defender then I dont see the merit in it. I know some people will say he can play on a wing but the reality is that a guy that size on a wing in the modern game would be ridiculous. He is not a great kick and is obviously not as agile as guys 20cms smaller so whats the advanatge of playing him on a wing? The days of getting an advantage by playing tall marking options on the wing are pretty much gone because you just dont see those quick kicks out to a contest as much. You would basically be playing him their just to prove that he can.

                        Ryley Dunn was just a really tough and hard kid when I saw him in the U/18s. Not sure he had alot of other strings to his bow and that might be what has cost him as much as his injury problems. Known more for his smothering, tackling etc than he was for being a big ball winner or highly skilled.

                        Unless someone really jumps out as someone who can really help our list then I am always a fan of just pumping more kids into the list. Having said that I must admit if we have 7 picks then perhaps it is a bit much to be putting 7 18 year olds into your list so we should certainly have a good look at the talent around.

                        I have mentioned Grima from Geelong's rookie list before as a player that might be worth a look. James Allan always struck me as one of those guys who could step straight into the centre square mix at an afl club and immediately get his hands on the ball but we have alot of similar players in that area already. Would love to see him get a go though.

                        Comment

                        • LostDoggy
                          WOOF Member
                          • Jan 2007
                          • 8307

                          #13
                          Re: Draft & PSD Strategy

                          Ryley Dunn is still contracted to Freo and will be rookie listed. Despite the fact he couldn't get a kick in a electric chair

                          Comment

                          • Bulldog Revolution
                            Coaching Staff
                            • Dec 2006
                            • 3926

                            #14
                            Re: Draft & PSD Strategy

                            For me I'd like to see the first 5 picks used on kids. I would prefer not to recycle too many - I dont really see the sense in Bradley or Johnson, and we seem to have a few Collards on the list already i.e lightly built aboriginal kids.

                            For me Clayton has to
                            a) find some forward options in this draft.
                            b) rethink the lightly built types - he can take his favourite 1 but not 6
                            c) add a developing ruckman.

                            Comment

                            • westdog54
                              Bulldog Team of the Century
                              • Jan 2007
                              • 6686

                              #15
                              Re: Draft & PSD Strategy

                              Originally posted by jerry
                              Ryley Dunn is still contracted to Freo and will be rookie listed. Despite the fact he couldn't get a kick in a electric chair
                              The fact that he had a contract becomes irrelevant once he is delisted.

                              He can be rookie drafted by whoever picks him first. Or drafted in the National draft for that matter if he nominates.

                              Comment

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