Scott Welsh

[Sockeye Salmon]

Re: Scott Welsh

I suppose it depends who is also left in the draft. There are a couple of worthwhile options that will be in the PSD. Welsh is an inbetween player. For mine we have johnno, Aka, Higgins and Murphy as smalls in the forward line. I can't see Welsh adding anything to our team and in fact I think he'd hinder the development of guys like Tiller and Minson by taking up a forward line spot!

Welsh is 190cm - 1 cm shorter than Tiller. He's kicked over 50 goals in a season a couple of times and 49 last year.

He's inconsistant but leads and kicks well. Rather than hindering Tiller he would take some pressure off him and let play in a pocket or flank while he's learning the game. In 2-3 years when Welsh is done, Tiller would be more likely to be ready to take his spot.

At the moment Tiller is the most over-rated player on our list. The expectation on a kid who has played 5 games and never taken a contested mark in the AFL is unreasonable. I expect him to spend most of the year with Willi.

Minson is completely different to Weslsh and there's room in a forward line for both. Minson has also never shown anything as an AFL standard forward either.

If we had the chance to get Welsh in the PSD it would be a no-brainer.

[Sockeye Salmon]

Re: Scott Welsh

Has officially quit the Crows!

http://afc.com.au/Season2007/News/NewsArticle/tabid/4417/Default.aspx?newsId=53194

They intend to delist him rather than wait for him to go. He now has the option of nominating for the national draft or wait for the PSD.

Would he make it through to us at pick 4 of the PSD?
If he does nominate for the ND how early do you take him?

[mjp]

Re: Scott Welsh

Has officially quit the Crows!

http://afc.com.au/Season2007/News/NewsArticle/tabid/4417/Default.aspx?newsId=53194

They intend to delist him rather than wait for him to go. He now has the option of nominating for the national draft or wait for the PSD.

Would he make it through to us at pick 4 of the PSD?
If he does nominate for the ND how early do you take him?

Should get through to pick 4 I think. Mind you, Richmond have been known to do some odd things.

I dont see why he would go into the ND - the club that picks him could do what Adelaide have done (1 year deal) and he would have no leverage. If he needs two years, it has to be the PSD.

[Bulldog Revolution]

Re: Scott Welsh

Its been an interesting off season for the crows

They've lost a fair bit of experience: Riccuito retired, Torney delisted. Plus Welsh, Hudson, Meesen, Mattner all quit the club.

And it will be very interesting to see where Welsh ends up

[Sockeye Salmon]

Re: Scott Welsh

Its been an interesting off season for the crows

They've lost a fair bit of experience: Riccuito retired, Torney delisted. Plus Welsh, Hudson, Meesen, Mattner all quit the club.

And it will be very interesting to see where Welsh ends up

The Crows supporters were trying to blame Hudson for being a pratt who caused trouble. Seems to me that they have some others there who a few players didn't like.

[GVGjr]

Re: Scott Welsh

The PSD is the best option of getting him. ND wise probably one of the last two selections.

Would Kepler Bradley be a better option?

[mjp]

Re: Scott Welsh

To be truthful, I dont think any of us really know what Bradley might do in the future...he could turn into a useful leading forward, but no-one really knows for sure.

If we pick up Welsh AND if he can stay on the park, he will kick 40 goals a year for the next couple of seasons for what I expect would be a reasonable cap number. BUT. He in no-way fits the forward line structure that Eade has been trying to set up in that:

1/.He is not really a lead up, lead up, lead up target to give the on-ballers a target.
2/.He is not really a long-kick, marking target (think the way he tried to use Darcy and Hahn at various stages).

I think he is a pretty good player - but to me he is a slower, less hard leading, less versatile version of Brad Johnson. His best spot is full-forward, and how will that work out?

The question wont be should we pick him - but are we prepared to change the structure of the side to enable him to be successful?

[Sockeye Salmon]

Re: Scott Welsh

To be truthful, I dont think any of us really know what Bradley might do in the future...he could turn into a useful leading forward, but no-one really knows for sure.

If we pick up Welsh AND if he can stay on the park, he will kick 40 goals a year for the next couple of seasons for what I expect would be a reasonable cap number. BUT. He in no-way fits the forward line structure that Eade has been trying to set up in that:

1/.He is not really a lead up, lead up, lead up target to give the on-ballers a target.
2/.He is not really a long-kick, marking target (think the way he tried to use Darcy and Hahn at various stages).

I think he is a pretty good player - but to me he is a slower, less hard leading, less versatile version of Brad Johnson. His best spot is full-forward, and how will that work out?

The question wont be should we pick him - but are we prepared to change the structure of the side to enable him to be successful?

I would argue that we haven't exactly been successful with the structure we have.

Surely a 2nd Brad Johnson would be a good thing - even if he is a poor man's version.

He leads to the right spots and can convert.

What makes it a no-brainer is that he's heaps better than any other key forward we have - in fact, new draftees aside, we would be doubling the number of 190+ forwards on our list!

[Missing Dog]

Re: Scott Welsh

My first reaction is not that keen. It sounds like he's not afraid of a party off-field and IIRC he missed big sections of the season with injury fairly regularly.

But I can certainly see the argument to pick him up. We only have 1 established guaranteed-to-do-the-job forward in Johnno. While Welsh isnt as 'guaranteed' as Johnno, 3*50 goal seasons suggests someone who will most likely dtj (do-the-job). More so than say when we picked up Doogs. He certainly seems to know how to get out on his own in the fwd line, can take the odd screamer and always infuriates me when he plays us and kicks 7 or 8. I would say he is a very similar style fwd to Robertson and given it sounds like Rocket went pretty hard after Robbo it would suggest we would be interested.

Actually I think I've just talked myself into it. The way I abused him when we played at Football Park last season as being soft and wouldn't chase I'd say he is a cert to come to the Dogs.

[mjp]

Re: Scott Welsh

I would argue that we haven't exactly been successful with the structure we have.

Surely a 2nd Brad Johnson would be a good thing - even if he is a poor man's version.

He leads to the right spots and can convert.

What makes it a no-brainer is that he's heaps better than any other key forward we have - in fact, new draftees aside, we would be doubling the number of 190+ forwards on our list!

I don't disagree with what you are saying. I guess my point was he wont just plug straight in, and if there is not some kind of acknowledgement of that then it will be a massive failure. Welsh is NOT going to change - if we get him, we are getting him 'as is', and we need to give him a chance to do what he does well, and not expect him to become something different at 30 years of age.

On your previous comments re- Tiller:

1/.50-game rule. You know this. Any player who has played 5 games and NOT hailed a superstar is in real strife.
2/.I liked one thing - he went back one week and actually had a go when things weren't going well. To me, that showed character and game me hope for the future.
3/.Tom Williams is the most over-rated player on our list by supporters (again, 50-game rule, I know, but apparently he is the saviour of our forward line - where he has never even played - whilst Tiller is generally being seen as a 3rd tall option.)

Geez, I wish the draft period was over.

[GVGjr]

Re: Scott Welsh

Really before we even think about getting Welsh or Bradley we need to work out if 2008 is a development year or if we are a finals contender. If it is the latter then we should consider them. If its a development year then lets give other younger players the opportunity.

The only other consideration is trying to get competitive again after a very poor 2007. This might alter the thinking because they wouldn't want to give the fans a dreadful start to the 2008 season especially after the last 7 weeks of 2007.

[mjp]

Re: Scott Welsh

I've never read or heard any bulldog supporter say that he is the saviour of our forward line.

Really? Never heard anyone mention that Williams will move to CHF and be the great white hope? You must lead a sheltered existence!

[Mantis]

Re: Scott Welsh

Really before we even think about getting Welsh or Bradley we need to work out if 2008 is a development year or if we are a finals contender. If it is the latter then we should consider them. If its a development year then lets give other younger players the opportunity.

The only other consideration is trying to get competitive again after a very poor 2007. This might alter the thinking because they wouldn't want to give the fans a dreadful start to the 2008 season especially after the last 7 weeks of 2007.

We dont really have any young natural forwards besides Tiller and perhaps the 2 or more we draft this year who along with Tiller aren't/ wont be able to play 22 games at a consistent level.

We went into the trade period looking for a tall forward, but it didn't work out. Perhaps we may be able to get one via the PSD. Welsh probably doesn't fit all of our requirements, but he is better in some ways than what we currently have.

[Sockeye Salmon]

Re: Scott Welsh

Really before we even think about getting Welsh or Bradley we need to work out if 2008 is a development year or if we are a finals contender. If it is the latter then we should consider them. If its a development year then lets give other younger players the opportunity.

The only other consideration is trying to get competitive again after a very poor 2007. This might alter the thinking because they wouldn't want to give the fans a dreadful start to the 2008 season especially after the last 7 weeks of 2007.

Give which younger players the opportunity?

Tiller is the only forward we have on our list over 190cm - and at 191 he only just makes it.

Any kid we pick up this year won't be able to do the job for a few years, around the time Welsh will be giving it away.

[Bulldog Revolution]

Re: Scott Welsh

I am in agreement with most that Welsh is a good player but am unsure how he helps our forward structure.

And he seems to provide many of the things that are already provided by a projected forward line of Higgins, Johnson, Murphy and Hahn. But maybe it works because it adds more fire power - what are his chasing and tackling like. Hes obviously got good foot speed.

I see 2007 as a development year, but I believe making the finals should be the goal of that development.