Our forward line - changing places

[LostDoggy]

Re: Our forward line - changing places

A chicken and egg thing. The disposal has been woeful but are our forwards getting themselves into best position to take one on one contested marks. Do we lack that initial speed / knowhow / instinct to get the edge to be in front on a lead? Why is Jones trying to take hangers? Are players blocking and creating space for him? Surely being earlier on the lead and commanding the ball would be a better option. And when he commands the ball is he then capable of marking the thing? He sure seems to drop a lot of potential marks. Isn't it about his timing and his hands, not just the terrible disposal coming in?

I thought he wasn't too bad on the weekend, but I do get frustrated at how he drops marks he should take and how he gets himself out of position to take a mark in the first place.

[wimberga]

Re: Our forward line - changing places

The problem that I have with Jones is that if he does not mark it, he basically has no chance.

I have never had so little confidence in any player when the ball is in dispute or on the ground. And even when Jones does take a grab, his kicking is anything but reliable.

I'm not saying we have a better alternative right now, but I think that Jones fits into that category of being too good for the VFL but not good enough for the AFL. Unless something dramatically changes, I look forward to the day that Jones isn't our number 1 target inside 50.

[Cyberdoggie]

Re: Our forward line - changing places

I'm sure we have done this experiment last year before finding out that a second string ruckman is a better forward than Jones. Our results last year show that.

Didn't someone say the definition of insanity is trying the same thing over and over again and hoping for a different outcome?

Jones just isn't good enough to be the main man up forward. He needs someone bigger and better to take the spotlight then maybe he may fit into a supporting role.

[Ghost Dog]

Re: Our forward line - changing places

I was thinking the same thing myself. How long have our good players been used to shore up our defence? How long have our blokes down back battled on taller opponents? and how long has it been since we had a genuine target in our forward line?
It's a bit depressing, but soldier on. What else can we do?

[lemmon]

Re: Our forward line - changing places

A leading Fevola-type forward.

I haven't seen any aptitude towards that whatsoever. Fev was lighting quick on the lead, had wonderful forward's nous, he found space better than almost anyone and was a seriously underrated contested grab. Stringer is on the slow side and is yet to display much knowledge about what spots a 'key' forward should be working in to. Would it be wrong to say he spend 90% of his junior years before the leg break as a midfielder?

[Ghost Dog]

Re: Our forward line - changing places

Jones to wear gloves?

[jeemak]

Re: Our forward line - changing places

I haven't seen any aptitude towards that whatsoever. Fev was lighting quick on the lead, had wonderful forward's nous, he found space better than almost anyone and was a seriously underrated contested grab. Stringer is on the slow side and is yet to display much knowledge about what spots a 'key' forward should be working in to. Would it be wrong to say he spend 90% of his junior years before the leg break as a midfielder?

Stringer is most definitely not slow. I agree that he's not likely to be a Fevola type though, who was a master of a long and well timed lead from the goal square.

I think we're going to see bits and pieces from Stringer until he gets his fitness to a level where he can spend some time in the midfield. That means he'll be the second or third forward target and play high and low. I can't see him being the main leading target.

[Bulldog4life]

Re: Our forward line - changing places

Bingo - we kicked two goals in a half, and so did North who had both Petrie (playing oversized on Morris) and Black (playing oversized on Wood) who are quality forwards, as well as the 202cm Currie who had an inch or two on Roughead - yet Jones who was playing on an AA full back trying to create opportunities with some of the most woeful F50 entries the AFL has seen somehow comes under more scrutiny than any other forward?

We play dumb football that gives our forwards little chance - I'm all for trading in any decent forward we can get this year, but we had many guys on Sunday who performed worse than Liam Jones. Many.

And we had only one tall in the forward line for both our matches. We should have at least two.

[Remi Moses]

Re: Our forward line - changing places

I think we need to give Jones 6 or 7 weeks before looking to drop him. He is so important to our structure I'm prepared to give him that time.

Definitely. I've been prepared to give Liam some time , but it's time he delivered.

[SlimPickens]

Re: Our forward line - changing places

I can't agree with this. He has played 12 AFL games, he is still learning. The ball was being bombed into the forward line, he had no option but to try and take a contested mark. Wait till he has had a few more pre-seasons before we start bagging him.

Spot on BAD. Stringer is playing the role required, he is providing a good contest and is a danger around goal.

[1eyedog]

Re: Our forward line - changing places

I haven't seen any aptitude towards that whatsoever. Fev was lighting quick on the lead, had wonderful forward's nous, he found space better than almost anyone and was a seriously underrated contested grab. Stringer is on the slow side and is yet to display much knowledge about what spots a 'key' forward should be working in to. Would it be wrong to say he spend 90% of his junior years before the leg break as a midfielder?

Stringer isn't slow and no he was a key position player at Bendigo - playing at either end. He's quick, smart and has excellent hands. Was Fevola even at 10% of his peak output after 10 games of football. The assistant coaching staff at Bulldogs see him as a leading forward and that is why he was drafted.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/bendigos-jake-stringer-a-budding-afl-star/story-e6frf9io-1226341933066

[1eyedog]

Re: Our forward line - changing places

Stringer is most definitely not slow. I agree that he's not likely to be a Fevola type though, who was a master of a long and well timed lead from the goal square.

I think we're going to see bits and pieces from Stringer until he gets his fitness to a level where he can spend some time in the midfield. That means he'll be the second or third forward target and play high and low. I can't see him being the main leading target.

Not according to Shannon Grant who likened him to a young Fevola when I spoke to him at the Pound.

Sorry for the double post all.

[anfo27]

Re: Our forward line - changing places

Walked out of the game Sunday filthy in the result & our forward 50 entries & efforts but after sleeping on it i think i need to be more realistic of where we are at. Its easy to see some improvement & all of a sudden expect too much too quickly. We are still developing & still miles off in some areas of our game.

Looking at our forward line & our most experienced player is Crameri who has only played 60 games & 2 with us. I'm not including Gia as he only seems to be getting a quarter a game. Then there is Hunter, Stringer & Campbell who have played a dozen each, Dahl & Jones with about 50 each,Stevens & Dickson with 30 each as well. Other than the 2 expansion teams i don't know who would have a less experienced forward line than us. Its just simply going to take time & we just have to be patient. I'd like to see Murphy play forward for this reason.

On Jones, i was happy with his second efforts & pressure but he needs to have more of on influence in a game. Second efforts & pressure is great but not touching the pill in a half of football is not good enough.

I also like GVGs post on the sub. I'd be disappointed if Gia played the majority of the year as a sub when someone like a Honeychurch would be perfect fit for that role.

[jeemak]

Re: Our forward line - changing places

Not according to Shannon Grant who likened him to a young Fevola when I spoke to him at the Pound.

Sorry for the double post all.

Sorry, I couldn't really elaborate too much on my post as I was at work.

Him not being a lead up forward probably doesn't have much to do with his capacity to perform that role, more so, it's about how I see him developing as a footballer and how our list and game plan will develop.

I don't see us as a side that will be able to control games to the point where we'll be able to make use of open space coming out of defence for a forward like him to be isolated and lead into for a year or two at least. Aside from that, his development is likely from all reports (aside from Grant's, as you mention) to see him developing into a midfielder once his fitness base develops over that time.

Fevola was so good at that role firstly because he was a natural at it and had no other strings to his bow, and secondly because his team and the overall style of football played at the time allowed him to do it. I can't see the game as it develops allowing a Fevola type that sort of space in the short to medium term. I may be wrong of course.

I'd be wrapped if the game developed to allow a player like Stringer to be one out and capable of leading into space. I'd be absolutely stoked if we had the foot skills to service that sort of player in the coming year or two and beyond. It makes the task of scoring goals so much easier if you can do it.

Don't ever double post again by the way. Jeeeez.

[LostDoggy]

Re: Our forward line - changing places

I've every confidence that we'll select a key position player/smart medium forward with our first pick this year - likely to be no lower than pick 5.

Roughead and Cordy were the last KP size players taken in early picks way back in 2008. Hugh Goddard and Peter Wright are KP size and likely to go very early. Also at this early stage there's Christian Petracca and Pat McCartin and mid sized forwards who should also be early picks, although possibly not as high as our first.

Problem is that we ideally would have wanted a key target in the forward line coming through after two pre seasons by now.

Such is the Bulldog life.