RIP Queen Elizabeth II

[hujsh]

Re: RIP Queen Elizabeth II

I'm not a Monarchist and definitely firmly fit into the Republic camp. As a country we do really need to grow up and cut the ties back to the "mother country". We are bigger enough to stand up on our own feet and hold our own position in the world.

However, the Queen was our head of state. She was our LEADER. There is no argument around that, it is black and white. If a game of football no matter what they happen to be celebrating, can't allow one minute silence to respect the passing of the countries LEADER, we all have some serious issues that are far beyond my understanding. How is this offensive or inappropriate? We can't change history. (We can acknowledge what has occurred, learn from and be all better for it. We should all be better informed and I am deeply offended on how we as a country have not done enough to acknowledge the indigenous culture and how poorly they have been treaded on the journey since British settlement.)

Where does it stop? There is representation of Britain colonialism everywhere. Do we ban that during indigenous round too? The Australian Flag? The Victorian Flag? The state of Victoria is named after an Enlgish Queen? Avoid driving down King Sreet, Queen Street and especially Batman way? The coat of arms of Melbourne has the cross of St George. There are symbols and memories of colonialism everywhere as our origin is a British Colony. We can't change this!

Isn't part of that listening to those communities and hearing their preferences? I'm assuming the AFLW did that (and hey maybe I'm wrong and they just did an executive decision based on 'optics') and the preference was to at least wait until Indigenous round was over before doing the 1 minute silence?

It's not like waiting a week will make a difference. We're not talking about victims of a terror attack or anything tragic like that. A 96 year old lady died. Her family isn't here, I doubt they even know the AFLW exists. What's the harm in waiting a few extra days? Does that option really offend anyone?

[angelopetraglia]

Re: RIP Queen Elizabeth II

Isn't part of that listening to those communities and hearing their preferences? I'm assuming the AFLW did that (and hey maybe I'm wrong and they just did an executive decision based on 'optics') and the preference was to at least wait until Indigenous round was over before doing the 1 minute silence?

The issue is it doesn't help their case, it divides public opinion against them. Everyone needs to be MORE tolerant, not LESS tolerant.

[Bornadog]

Re: RIP Queen Elizabeth II

Isn't part of that listening to those communities and hearing their preferences? I'm assuming the AFLW did that

A minute silence was held before the Bulldogs match, but the person doing welcome to country refused to participate in protest. AFL then made the decision after consulting clubs.

[angelopetraglia]

Re: RIP Queen Elizabeth II

A minute silence was held before the Bulldogs match, but the person doing welcome to country refused to participate in protest. AFL then made the decision after consulting clubs.

Understand. The person doing the welcome for country ain't doing a good job representing their people if that is the case. More TOLERANCE is needed and they could have impacted many by doing the Welcome for Country.

I went to the MCG on Friday night. The Welcome for Country by Uncle Colin was fantastic. Everyone in the crowd was right into it and I'm certain that the education is helping everyone. Then the minute silence was also done really well, respect shown. The whole Friday night pre-game including Delta was fantastic.

[Bornadog]

Re: RIP Queen Elizabeth II

Understand. The person doing the welcome for country ain't doing a good job representing their people if that is the case. More TOLERANCE is needed and they could have impacted many by doing the Welcome for Country.

I went to the MCG on Friday night. The Welcome for Country by Uncle Colin was fantastic. Everyone in the crowd was right into it and I'm certain that the education is helping everyone. Then the minute silence was also done really well, respect shown. The whole Friday night pre-game including Delta was fantastic.

All good in theory, but you do need to understand that this country has not reconciled with it's indigenous population. We don't even recognise indigenous people in the constitution. Once a reconciliation has been completed, perhaps it will be different in the future.

[angelopetraglia]

Re: RIP Queen Elizabeth II

All good in theory, but you do need to understand that this country has not reconciled with it's indigenous population. We don't even recognise indigenous people in the constitution. Once a reconciliation has been completed, perhaps it will be different in the future.

Agree. It is a massive issue. We need to be better. There is plenty of work to do.

I just don't think this protest is the right approach to start healing the wounds that exist.

[hujsh]

Re: RIP Queen Elizabeth II

The issue is it doesn't help their case, it divides public opinion against them. Everyone needs to be MORE tolerant, not LESS tolerant.

If you think the burden should be on Aboriginal people to be more tolerant of us then I don't think there's much left to discuss.

A minute silence was held before the Bulldogs match, but the person doing welcome to country refused to participate in protest. AFL then made the decision after consulting clubs.

Thank you for the clarification BAD. Good on them for doing what they think is right.

[angelopetraglia]

Re: RIP Queen Elizabeth II

If you think the burden should be on Aboriginal people to be more tolerant of us then I don't think there's much left to discuss.

No. I don't. I think everyone needs to be more tolerant of each other. Escalation at this point is not taking us anywhere good.

I will repeat again, we have so much work to do and I for one are 100% fully supportive of greater recognition of both Aboriginal and Torres Straight Islander culture within our country and a greater level of teaching and education of all the wrongdoings (and let us be honest here, they are horrific) in our history.

[Grantysghost]

Re: RIP Queen Elizabeth II

If you think the burden should be on Aboriginal people to be more tolerant of us then I don't think there's much left to discuss.


Thank you for the clarification BAD. Good on them for doing what they think is right.

Who is us? I don't get the division.

The Queen was our Constitutional Monarch;she died so we should pay our respects.

She was an amazing person and source of great strength for people in the aftermath of WW2 which affected every Australian.

You don't have to like what the aristocracy represents to acknowledge her public service and a moment of silence is the least a respectful civilisation can do.

Doesn't mean we automatically forget historical atrocities, actually quite the opposite for me and not because of any comments made.

[hujsh]

Re: RIP Queen Elizabeth II

No. I don't. I think everyone needs to be more tolerant of each other. Escalation at this point is not taking us anywhere good.

I will repeat again, we have so much work to do and I for one are 100% fully supportive of greater recognition of both Aboriginal and Torres Straight Islander culture within our country and a greater level of teaching and education of all the wrongdoings (and let us be honest here, they are horrific) in our history.

The thing is you're using reconciliatory language but right now, in this example, you're applying it in one direction. We can be more tolerant and considerate of Aboriginal people and think about how the minute silence might affect them BEFORE someone needs to protest. Instead you've called out the person for protesting which I think is rather intolerant of their right to express their unease. I don't think you mean to do so, or that you have bad intentions, but that is how it reads.

Likewise you can say escalation won't help anyone but that just supports the status quo. We'll listen to you but only if it doesn't actually challenge us or make us change anything meaningful (or not even meaningful in this case).

I get where you're coming from and you're right that it's good to learn about the past but that doesn't mean much if we don't apply it to the here and now. Dismissing their concerns as 'divisive' just means we're using awareness of the past to make us feel above those crimes so we don't feel as bad about not righting those wrongs (but of course the people dismissing their concerns and defending the queen couldn't possibly be divisive could they?)

Ultimately this is all symbolic culture war stuff and doesn't address how we make material difference in the lives of Aboriginal and Torres Straight Islanders but if we can't listen to them over little things like this I doubt we'll ever manage the big important stuff anyway (not that I believe we'll do so in my lifetime).

[hujsh]

Re: RIP Queen Elizabeth II

Who is us? I don't get the division.

The Queen was our Constitutional Monarch;she died so we should pay our respects.

She was an amazing person and source of great strength for people in the aftermath of WW2 which affected every Australian.

You don't have to like what the aristocracy represents to acknowledge her public service and a moment of silence is the least a respectful civilisation can do.

Doesn't mean we automatically forget historical atrocities, actually quite the opposite for me and not because of any comments made.

White Australians in short. I'd expect the vast majority of people upset by this decision fall firmly into that bucket

I won't comment on the rest. I don't think people will want to discuss that here or now. I'll save those points for when Jeff Bezos dies and people want to talk about how much better we are for having Amazon or something

[GVGjr]

Re: RIP Queen Elizabeth II

All, Despite some very reasoned views being expressed I'm going to close this thread.

If you feel strongly that it should remain open please send me a private message.