How do we rebuild the Test side?

[Greystache]

Re: How do we rebuild the Test side?

So what does Cosgrove need to do to get a mention?

Lose 30kg's and show he actually wants it.

[Go_Dogs]

Re: How do we rebuild the Test side?

Cosgrove? Haha!

The whole make up of the team was wrong for the last few tests. Yes, I understand the need to bring in some younger players and give them game time but it wasn't done well at all. Back in the era where we were successful a lot of form players came in, played for a year or two, and then disappeared again. The core of the side however usually remaining fairly constant.

I like Hughes, but not as an opener. Only the very, very best can smash attacks around, and this guy is no Hayden (although perhaps a few years of smashing Shield attacks around he believes he is) and plays way too many loose shots to be an opener. Hughes should take a good look at Cook, and see how to build an innings. No need to play at every ball, and poking and prodding at one outside offstump is the most frustrating thing going around. I'd prefer him down the order.

Khawaja looked alright, however again needs to keep his concentration up and resist the urge to play some silly shots. He looks like he could be a guy to bat at #3 for the next 10 years though. His technique is a little strange, but it looks reasonably effective. At least worth persisting with for the time being.

Smith is another who I like, but I'm not convinced he's the answer at the moment. He needs another year or two playing Shield, and honing his skills in the ODI and T20 sides also. His batting isn't quite up to it, and he needs to offer more as a bowler if he can't get his test average up to the 40+ mark. At the moment, a genuine batter would be my preferred option. D Hussey, C White or C Ferguson come to mind.


As far as bowling stocks go, we need one strike bowler who can consistently get the job done. He doesn't need to be McGrath (although it would be nice) but someone who can bowl 20 economical overs, tidy line and length, move the ball and take wickets consistently. I think we have some reasonable cattle in the bowling stocks, however our bowling strategies seem to be a bit aimless or perhaps the execution just isn't there for sustained periods.

At the end of the day, our batters haven't done our bowlers any favours, as we've often been defending pathetic totals. England have no standout bowlers (although they probably have slightly better cattle than ours) however have bowled significantly better.


I hate cricket. Although looking forward to some more Big Bash and Pollard excitement.

[Sedat]

Re: How do we rebuild the Test side?

When Nathan Hauritz is racking up centuries in Shield Cricket, there's clearly an issue with the bowling depth the next tier down. Plenty of young potential has been mentioned but none of them, for various reasons including injury, have found consistency at Shield level. Ditto the batting stocks. Back in the 90's guys like Langer, Hayden, Martyn, Ponting, the Waughs, all averaged 50 or higher at first class level over an extended period of time, so they were able to handle the step up to test level with aplomb. The likes of Shaun Marsh and Ferguson average mid 30's at Shield level - they still have much to prove IMO if they are to become long-term test players. No openers are putting their hand up consistently and the less said about our spinning stocks the better.

David Hussey commands a place in our middle order, especially with such a tough run of opposition coming up in the next 18 months, and at 33yo he has at least 2-3 years in his prime to shore up our batting line-up which is as fragile at it has ever been. Selecting Smith as a no.6 is simply an insult to the likes of D Hussey.

The problem with selecting young players on potential and chopping and changing the team after every defeat is that we are going into solution mode before actually addressing the many and varied problems. Tackle the issues first and then look at the personnel next. In the meantime, select the best performed players at Shield level regardless of their age and inject some backbone and steel into our test team.

[Sockeye Salmon]

Re: How do we rebuild the Test side?

- Get the states to take into consideration what is best for the National team. Remove any state administrator who gets in the way of that.

Tell any National administrator who tries to do that to **** off.

[Topdog]

Re: How do we rebuild the Test side?

Cosgrove? Haha!

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/records/batting/most_runs_career.html?id=6096;type=tournament

2 hundreds and 2 50's in the Shield this year. Probably the most in form player there. I can understand the losing weight and showing he wants it but the fact that he is doing so well and gets no mention pisses me off.

[Go_Dogs]

Re: How do we rebuild the Test side?

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/eng...ype=tournament

2 hundreds and 2 50's in the Shield this year. Probably the most in form player there. I can understand the losing weight and showing he wants it but the fact that he is doing so well and gets no mention pisses me off.

Having watched him for quite a while down in SA he is not the sort of prospect I'd like to see at test level.

He has talent, sure, but he is simply unwilling to put in the hard yards. He probably would've had a heart attack and died during the long hours we spent in the field over the summer.

I'd also question how he'd stack up against consistent, quality bowling.

[Go_Dogs]

Re: How do we rebuild the Test side?

The likes of Shaun Marsh and Ferguson average mid 30's at Shield level - they still have much to prove IMO if they are to become long-term test players. No openers are putting their hand up consistently and the less said about our spinning stocks the better.

Don't disagree with your argument for D Hussey, but bit harsh on Ferguson there. He's averaging practically 50 this year, on the come back from an ACL - not too shabby if you ask me. Probably hasn't quite clicked into the form needed to command a spot, but isn't far off at all.

I'm also quite partial to S Marsh, as he has shown in the ODI he can stay at the crease for a while. Not sure whether this would translate to test cricket or not, but I think he's worth consideration in the very least, and will watch with interest if he gets a gig during the ODI's coming up.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Re: How do we rebuild the Test side?

OK, we have had our backsides kicked comprehensively by a team that was brilliantly prepared, disciplined to every detail and one that was obviously very hungry to amass big scores.

What is the recipe that we need to look at to get this side back on track?

Some of my thoughts are:
- Looking for tall quick bowlers with sound techniques.
- Look for batsman with a strong technique and a real appetite to bat for long periods.
- Get the states to take into consideration what is best for the National team. Remove any state administrator who gets in the way of that.
- Be prepared to cop our lumps for another season as team selections will be conducted with a view on the longer term positions.
- Conduct a comprehensive review on our current coaching and selector positions regardless of contracts currently in place.
There has been a tendency to blame the selectors, coaches and players for our current performance but I think the issues we need to deal with are actually a lot bigger than that.

Please add your thoughts here.

Agree with your assessment GVGJr, especially the bolded bits.
Highlighting the disconnect in our National selectors thinging, was the spinning options we used this year. At the start of the summer Hilditch endorsed Hauritz to get first crack and also picked Steve O'Keefe for the Aust A team against England and he looked okay. However they picked Doherty and then Beer ahead of both Hauritz and O'Keefe for the whole series. This just doesn't seem logical.

I can only assume that NSW not picking O'Keefe for most Shield games went against O'Keefe when National selectors were looking at spinning options during the Test Series.
This highlights the disconnect between national and state selection philosophies. This needs to be overcome if we are to have a coherent and working pathway for talented cricketers identified as Test candidates.

I also think the selectors boxed themselves into a corner, and put the balance of the team out of whack when they first moved Watson up to the opening position. Return him to the number 6 position. We need to find an opening combination that can more times than not give us a good starting base, and also ensure batsmen further down the order are not repeatedly coming in whilst the ball is still relatively new.

I think we need to be careful about pushing Shaun Marsh and Ferguson's case too soon. Neither have dominated shield attacks over a period of time. In particular Shaun Marsh who has been on the scene for 8 or so years, and yet has a sub 40 batting average. I don't think there is any reason to believe he is suddenly going to be a better test batsmen than his career average has suggested.

I really worry that our Domestic Cricket is on an inevitable course towards the 20/20 cash cow, and short of States creating two seperate teams built upon players suitable to either the long or the short form, I think we're going to find players unable to garner and ingrain the techniques & skills required for survival in Test Cricket.