2020 Player movement

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Re: 2020 Player movement

I agree this nominating thing is ridiculous. I'm happy to see essendon aren't rolling over but it's amusing to see nontheless.

[GVGjr]

Re: 2020 Player movement

Just getting my head around this one. You say Dodoro does a great job. This despite the state of Essendon’s list and performance, whilst also pointing out (quite rightly) that he blew the biggest trade deal he possibly could have done last year? I’ll also throw in that he way overspent on Dylan Shiel.

I’ll grant that Dodoro is a “tough” negotiator, but there’s a difference between a tough negotiator and a good negotiator. Being belligerent and not getting deals done for your club, having the list in a weak and precarious position, over spending on what you do bring in, forcing want away players to stay (Daniher and Fantasia) and also bringing poor cultural (Stringer & Saad) fits to your club is clearly not doing a great job, for mine. Just my opinion.

I think you have summed this up perfectly
He is a hard arse negotiator with mixed results but he's also not a great asset for their recruiting endeavours

It will be fascinating to watch how this all plays out

I'd try to achieve a major clean out if I was in the chair. They won't challenge in the next two years and may as well do something similar to North

[mjp]

Re: 2020 Player movement

GC tried to play hardball with Martin, but the system allowed Carlton to use PSD red tape to put him out of reach. It also seems pretty clear that no-one will take a player that hadn't nominated them anyway.

I do have SOME sympathy for the situation Martin found himself in. He was drafted to the GC - not so much against his will (he was taken as a 17year old and did not have to make himself eligible for that draft and just been drafted in his 18th year like everyone else - but, the kid did fly back to Geraldton the day after an 18's champs game to play country footy Sunday in order to help pay the rent on his family home...so he kind of needed to)...

I have ZERO sympathy for Saad. He wanted out of Gold Coast and CHOSE to go to Essendon. He CHOSE to sign that contract. He KNEW he was locking himself in until he became a FA...and if he didn't, well, that's between him and his manager...

My sympathy for Martin aside, the fact that Gold Coast were not prepared to use the PSD to re-draft Martin says to me that is one avenue of changing clubs that should 100% be closed down and the PSD is open to Free Agents and delisted players ONLY.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Re: 2020 Player movement

I've long been an advocate for removing players the ability to choose clubs, or else they can't have free agency. I don't think they can or should have both.
If players want free agency as part of the mix, then up until the point they meet the free agency requirements the club should retain the ability to choose who to trade and where they go.

As much as I love Dodoro having the blowtorch applied to him, it is not right that a player can just nominate a club, and then force the club he's currently at to just accept what's on the table.

[hujsh]

Re: 2020 Player movement

Well one would have to assume that about anyone who willingly decides to play for the bombers and then the blues.

Honestly you do have to question the motives and intelligence of these players who keep choosing the bombers and blues. Clubs who have been poor for years and questionable cultures.

I don't know. The post football life may be pretty nicely set up with a big club even if you don't see much team success in your time there. Depends on what the players are after.

[Grantysghost]

Re: 2020 Player movement

I agree this nominating thing is ridiculous. I'm happy to see essendon aren't rolling over but it's amusing to see nontheless.

The PA does seem to have positioned themselves in their agreement with the clubs and AFL very well recently. The players have a strong hand now in their ability to go where they want. However if the clubs didn’t like it, they probably should’ve fought it harder when they were negotiating I believe. Having said that of course push for the best deal you can, but I’m aware they all sat down and agreed to this scenario. Personally I really dislike the nomination of clubs, mainly because it always seems to be the same ones getting the good players and leads to inequities in player movement. I’ve been cynical of Wingard but gee he would’ve been nice on the weekend to help optimise our entries. Then I remember Smith.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Re: 2020 Player movement

I don't know. The post football life may be pretty nicely set up with a big club even if you don't see much team success in your time there. Depends on what the players are after.

That's what I mean by questioning their motives. I should have said motives OR intelligence. I don't want a player who just wants to coast for money. Kobe Bryant once said the NBA was easier than high school because in the NBA players played for financial security and were happy coasting along. That's fine. Players have the right to do that. But I wouldn't want such players on our list.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Re: 2020 Player movement

The PA does seem to have positioned themselves in their agreement with the clubs and AFL very well recently. The players have a strong hand now in their ability to go where they want. However if the clubs didn’t like it, they probably should’ve fought it harder when they were negotiating I believe. Having said that of course push for the best deal you can, but I’m aware they all sat down and agreed to this scenario. Personally I really dislike the nomination of clubs, mainly because it always seems to be the same ones getting the good players and leads to inequities in player movement. I’ve been cynical of Wingard but gee he would’ve been nice on the weekend to help optimise our entries. Then I remember Smith.

Yep. Where are all the high profile players going?

Essendon, Carlton, Collingwood, Hawthorn and Geelong. Richmond too. Not much of a pattern there is there.

[Bornadog]

Re: 2020 Player movement

For balance (and a bit of a tangent), there was a rumour that Bailey Smith manipulated the draft to avoid being drafted out of Victoria. It was a rumour so may not be true (and there may have been legitimate reasons if true) but that also doesn't really sit well with me.

Hawks fans think he is setting himself up for a big contract with them as he was a mad hawthorn supporter growing up.

We need to stitch up for the long term.

[Bornadog]

Re: 2020 Player movement

Oscar McDonald is available. I know nothing about him.

[EasternWest]

Re: 2020 Player movement

Oscar McDonald is available. I know nothing about him.

And that's enough.

I'd rather his brother Tom, and I absolutely detest him.

[Grantysghost]

Re: 2020 Player movement

And that's enough.

I'd rather his brother Tom, and I absolutely detest him.

Haha, gold.

Bad plums is his ceiling.

[jazzadogs]

Re: 2020 Player movement

I have ZERO sympathy for Saad. He wanted out of Gold Coast and CHOSE to go to Essendon. He CHOSE to sign that contract. He KNEW he was locking himself in until he became a FA...and if he didn't, well, that's between him and his manager...

Maybe I don't understand contracts properly, but the contract he signed is finished. He completed his contract - he's not breaking a contract halfway through. I don't really see the issue?

At the end of the contract Essendon also would have had the opportunity to delist him, so why does he lose the opportunity to look elsewhere at the end of his contract just because the Bombers still want him there?

[mjp]

Re: 2020 Player movement

Maybe I don't understand contracts properly, but the contract he signed is finished. He completed his contract - he's not breaking a contract halfway through. I don't really see the issue?

At the end of the contract Essendon also would have had the opportunity to delist him, so why does he lose the opportunity to look elsewhere at the end of his contract just because the Bombers still want him there?

Because he isn’t a free agent. Had he chosen to stay at Gold Coast he would be a RFA now...but because he already flipped once he has limited his ability to do so again. Yes - he has seen out his contract but he remains Essendon’s player. He knows that. His management know that. The fact he has decided he wants to quit on the club and team-mates who HE chose (he was not drafted by Essendon and had his choice of clubs) is down to him...

Every time you tell them it’s a game they treat it like a business. And every time you tell them it’s a business they want to make it abut the game...it’s the professional athletes lament but leaving a club in a competition where there are legislated restraints of trade is not as simple as changing your mind and it isn’t JUST about player contracts...there are also the rules around player movement that underpin the competition to be considered and in this case Saad is on the wrong side of them.

[ledge]

Re: 2020 Player movement

Because he isn’t a free agent. Had he chosen to stay at Gold Coast he would be a RFA now...but because he already flipped once he has limited his ability to do so again. Yes - he has seen out his contract but he remains Essendon’s player. He knows that. His management know that. The fact he has decided he wants to quit on the club and team-mates who HE chose (he was not drafted by Essendon and had his choice of clubs) is down to him...

Every time you tell them it’s a game they treat it like a business. And every time you tell them it’s a business they want to make it abut the game...it’s the professional athletes lament but leaving a club in a competition where there are legislated restraints of trade is not as simple as changing your mind and it isn’t JUST about player contracts...there are also the rules around player movement that underpin the competition to be considered and in this case Saad is on the wrong side of them.

I think Dodoro could sell sand to the arabs, one problem.
I also think something can happen in your time at a club that just destroys everything you liked at a club.
I see a few reasons why players want out..
1 promises made by the recruiter being false
2 making players stay that do not want to be there.
3 players aren’t fully invested in the game plan or coach.
4 not respecting long term/ much loved players who retire.
Essendon look like they have done all of these things, which is quite an effort in itself to self destruct.
Basically it’s an arrogance from above, the heirachy are so far up themselves unless they all fall on their sword and honest hard working humble people take over they will never be any good.
I wasn’t a fan of Worsfold but after his outgoing comment I seriously believe he gave up because he couldn’t change anything and just let it all take its course this year.
He couldn’t wait to get out.