The Bevolution. Are you yes or no?

[mjp]

Re: The Bevolution. Are you yes or no?

Ummm.

I have abstained from voting.

I'm still uncertain whether the "Bevolution" (as presented) is really revolutionary or simply a spin of the wheel of fate which means that some selection decisions have paid off vs not paid off.

I am all in with the Richards to the mids idea, the play Garcia idea and the 'we need TWO mature and competent key defenders' idea. I am not necessarily on board with some of the decisions - particularly those pertaining to our running defenders - HOWEVER happily acknowledge that things are working well enough right now.

I am also not on-board with the club considering what is happening right now "Bevo-lutionary" and therefore deciding to pump games into Busslinger, Jones, Clarke et al whilst the team is in contention. Make them knock the door down with their VFL performances...if all you do is tappity-tap for a couple of weeks then stay in the VFL. Do what Macrae did - 438 possessions and 200-clearances - basically MADE the MC pick him.

I think it's an open year. I don't think we're quite good enough but it's May. We have a strong-ish midfield group and some forwards who I wouldn't want to be planning for...Sydney this week have quite literally no matchup for Darcy, Jamarra or Naughton. I guess, Melican will have to take Darcy, Blakey will take Naughton and Francis will try to play on Marra? Or do they just tell Rampe to play on Marra and try and bash him up to allow Blakey to continue to be a spare? We are a genuine problem for most teams ahead of the ball...It sounds stupid given we lost to Hawthorn but it is 100% not season over time/look to the future time...sure, keep one eye on it but we can win games and finals NOW.

[azabob]

Re: The Bevolution. Are you yes or no?

Ummm.

I have abstained from voting.

I'm still uncertain whether the "Bevolution" (as presented) is really revolutionary or simply a spin of the wheel of fate which means that some selection decisions have paid off vs not paid off.
.

Ok, against my better judgement...

Interesting choice of words.

In my view, our approach to selecting younger players has been deliberate and, in some cases, planned since the preseason. This is evident with players like Gallagher, Sanders, and Khamis, to a certain extent.

We initially chose Lobb over Darcy as our first choice, but we couldn't ignore the performance of either player. The subsequent change has proven to be the right call.

Clarke is probably the only selection that hasn't worked out. Would he have been chosen if either Weightman or West were available? By all reports Freijah earned his spot with consistent performances in the VFL.

You had strong reservations about selecting James O'Donnell without exposed form. As a coach, have you ever supported a player and played them even when outsiders couldn't understand the decision? This seems to be the case with JOD.

I'm not really sure spinning the wheel of fate in this instance is a fair call.

[Bornadog]

Re: The Bevolution. Are you yes or no?

You had strong reservations about selecting James O'Donnell without exposed form. As a coach, have you ever supported a player and played them even when outsiders couldn't understand the decision? This seems to be the case with JOD

I think with all the players selected it certainly has been a case of good form in the preseason, or good form in VFL, except JOD.

I think he is being fast tracked as we need a big bloke like him to develop fast and hold down that CHB role. So far he has played well, and hope he can keep it up.

[DOG GOD]

Re: The Bevolution. Are you yes or no?

Cheers DG. First time for me unbelievably.

It is fkn awful. Never knew a human body could sweat so much.

Get your boosters folks, i was blase.

Yes my whole post was just about getting sympathy... Because.. Well.. I'm a man, and isolation sucks!

Hopefully you only get it once. I?ve had it 3 times. Terrible.

[GVGjr]

Re: The Bevolution. Are you yes or no?

Ummm.

I have abstained from voting.

I'm still uncertain whether the "Bevolution" (as presented) is really revolutionary or simply a spin of the wheel of fate which means that some selection decisions have paid off vs not paid off.

I am all in with the Richards to the mids idea, the play Garcia idea and the 'we need TWO mature and competent key defenders' idea. I am not necessarily on board with some of the decisions - particularly those pertaining to our running defenders - HOWEVER happily acknowledge that things are working well enough right now.

I am also not on-board with the club considering what is happening right now "Bevo-lutionary" and therefore deciding to pump games into Busslinger, Jones, Clarke et al whilst the team is in contention. Make them knock the door down with their VFL performances...if all you do is tappity-tap for a couple of weeks then stay in the VFL. Do what Macrae did - 438 possessions and 200-clearances - basically MADE the MC pick him.

I think it's an open year. I don't think we're quite good enough but it's May. We have a strong-ish midfield group and some forwards who I wouldn't want to be planning for...Sydney this week have quite literally no matchup for Darcy, Jamarra or Naughton. I guess, Melican will have to take Darcy, Blakey will take Naughton and Francis will try to play on Marra? Or do they just tell Rampe to play on Marra and try and bash him up to allow Blakey to continue to be a spare? We are a genuine problem for most teams ahead of the ball...It sounds stupid given we lost to Hawthorn but it is 100% not season over time/look to the future time...sure, keep one eye on it but we can win games and finals NOW.

Fully agree, at the moment we should continue to reward deserving players regardless of what might be considered ideal development of an emerging list. We clearly saw that Clarke wasn't ready and it would be somewhat foolish to continue that approach. Frejiah probably wasn't knocking the door down in a true sense but he had put up a number of good performances and was rewarded accordingly. We had a look a good look at Sanders and then sent him back to Footscray to work on some areas of his game and I think that's the right thing to do.
Getting games into Gallagher and JOD and sticking with them during some fluctuating form is okay given there isn't clear replacements for them. We've had a good look at Khamis and now have a couple of extra games to check on Cleary.
The big bonus to me is the form of Garcia who also earned his way in to help cover the likes of Liberatore.

Is it a Bevolution or Bevodelopment of the playing list I don't really know but I'd certainly like for him and his coaches to stick with the current approach.

Great thread Doc, a real thought provoker.

[AshMac]

Re: The Bevolution. Are you yes or no?

I?m all for playing the kids and am all for being a faster team at moving the ball - but I am still a hard no on Bevo.

I like what I see from some of the kids and we?re getting good mileage now from a couple of cheap trades last year. Whether the hard love worked with Macrae and Dale I don?t know but they are automatic best 22 again which is good.

One positive for me is our willingness to actually play our young draft picks rather than constantly mining coal with mature age mid season picks. This was a particular gripe over the last 2 years - imagine if all the games into McNeil were put into west over the last 2 years for example.

What I can?t stand is our team system and our complete inability to coach against other teams strengths. We don?t seem to adapt much week to week and we make very little change during games to curb opposition strengths or momentum.

The thing I just can?t understand is our inability to defend a turnover outside deep D50 individual brilliance or our forward system - the off ball movement, inability to lower the eyes kicking in, constant out marking in parks by tall defenders and ease teams get it out are infuriating. Goal kicking I can tolerate - it?s the inefficiency in there for me and I largely think it?s coaching.

Probably doesn?t help that 2 years in a row we?ve been told all off-season the coaches are aware and have fixed it

[1eyedog]

Re: The Bevolution. Are you yes or no?

Ready for change. 90% of you know you are too you're just one bad loss away from clicking the other button.

[1eyedog]

Re: The Bevolution. Are you yes or no?

Happy for him to see out the year no matter what though.

[mjp]

Re: The Bevolution. Are you yes or no?

You had strong reservations about selecting James O'Donnell without exposed form. As a coach, have you ever supported a player and played them even when outsiders couldn't understand the decision? This seems to be the case with JOD.

Maybe? Probably?? I don't know. No secret that I've spent my life in the pathway not in the AFL though. Again - I'm happy enough with JOD I just don't get the love for him by supporters AND by coaches. When he does something competent, his efforts are lauded. Hell, people are calling for Alex Keath (who has clearly outperformed him at senior level when he has played this year) to be omitted and JOD to be retained alongside Busslinger (yet to debut).

JOD is fine...I just don't get the overall love except for the fact that we all liked watching his Dad bat back in the 90's.

I'm not really sure spinning the wheel of fate in this instance is a fair call.

Fair. I guess I meant there has always seemed to be a bit of 'selection bingo' with Bevo - players with moderate/no VFL form plucked for the seniors. Hell, there may have been an instance where 5x injured players were all selected to play in one particular final vs West Coast a few years ago - the fates were with us that day and it has felt (at times) like they are with us again.

I know you've singled out JOD as the 'only one' not deserving of a game.
I would challenge that:
Khamis was not deserving of a game.
Clarke was not deserving of a game.
Freijah was not deserving of a game.

What makes you 'deserving'?
- Experienced players? Go back and DOMINATE aka do the 'Jack Macrae'. Make them pick you.
- Inexperienced players? Minimum of FIVE (5) games IN A ROW clearly out-performing the person ahead of you in the senior side.

I think the Clarke selection was a bit more of an 'arse pluck' than a 'real' selection (as in, "well, we've got no-one else, let's play the kid")...but I felt the same way when Jones (Artie) was picked last year and cannot understand people calling for his return this year.

If we - as supporters - want strong + consistent performances, then we need to pick strong and consistent players. Clarke isn't that. Jones isn't that (to be fair, he hasn't been picked). I think Sanders being sent back to the VFL was an example of the sort of decision making we all want to see from the MC. He's a kid who's learning...let him learn - there's so much time for him right now and whilst I will always believe it is critical to PLAY the draftees so we know what we've got, at the same time there is no need to play them 'forever'.

[Sedat]

Re: The Bevolution. Are you yes or no?

Clarke selection was simply apples with apples to replace the suspended West, and he was the best performed of the VFL small pressure forwards (Artie and McNeil) for that particular match committee selection meeting. It was a reach but under the specific circumstances at the time it was fine IMO.

[Bornadog]

Re: The Bevolution. Are you yes or no?

I know you've singled out JOD as the 'only one' not deserving of a game.

I would challenge that:
Khamis was not deserving of a game.
Clarke was not deserving of a game.
Freijah was not deserving of a game.

.

* JOD: Agree he is being fast tracked - but, he is 198cm and we don't have many athletic 198cm backman, and he has shown something

* Khamis - was excellent in the preseason and ended up being pretty good for a few weeks and in the top 5 intercept marks in the AFL (at that time). Fell away a little and was dropped.

* Clarke - Weightman and West out, and I guess no one else left. He did show some form in the VFL

*Freijah - was knocking on the door with some very good performances at VFL level.

I have no issues with these picks (except maybe Clarke)

[SquirrelGrip]

Re: The Bevolution. Are you yes or no?

* JOD: Agree he is being fast tracked - but, he is 198cm and we don't have many athletic 198cm backman, and he has shown something

* Khamis - was excellent in the preseason and ended up being pretty good for a few weeks and in the top 5 intercept marks in the AFL (at that time). Fell away a little and was dropped.

* Clarke - Weightman and West out, and I guess no one else left. He did show some form in the VFL

*Freijah - was knocking on the door with some very good performances at VFL level.

I have no issues with these picks (except maybe Clarke)

I agree with Freijah, definitely impressed with what I saw at Footscray and deserving of a run at senior level.

With Clarke, he was one of those players with the question of whether he would play better with better players around him. With Cody and West out, it was a fair and reasonable selection. Imagine this board's reaction if they'd picked McNeil instead! Clarke's first test failed, but hopefully like Sanders he knows what he has to work on and goes back to do exactly that.

[mighty_west]

Re: The Bevolution. Are you yes or no?

* JOD: Agree he is being fast tracked - but, he is 198cm and we don't have many athletic 198cm backman, and he has shown something

* Khamis - was excellent in the preseason and ended up being pretty good for a few weeks and in the top 5 intercept marks in the AFL (at that time). Fell away a little and was dropped.

* Clarke - Weightman and West out, and I guess no one else left. He did show some form in the VFL

*Freijah - was knocking on the door with some very good performances at VFL level.

I have no issues with these picks (except maybe Clarke)

Yeah i think with JOD, he was fast tracked to a certain extent however he came into the VFL side and played out of his skin from his first game, think he took a dozen grabs in the his first game with the 'Scray? and continued on after that to the point he was our best performed tall defender in a short period of time, plus the fact he was a mature ager, wasn't an 18 year old skinny runt so wasn't as big a stretch giving him a debut early on imo, and like you said a 198cm athletic type showing good signs and taking stacks of nice grabs.

For mine, Freijah was our best performed draftee slightly ahead of Sanders, Sanders ripped it apart a bit in the pre season but once the real games started i reckon Joel was showing the most even early on, showing so much poise and that type that had so much time with ball in hand, what's that old saying? When you know, you know!

Clarke, he just didn't look ready to me, sure showed some good signs in the VFL but does get a lot of cheapie out the back goals and like Jones, hasn't been consistent enough and i'm certain he played because of Westy copping a week, and in hindsight we probably would have been better off playing Daniel in the forward line like he did in the under 18's rotating between fwd and mid.

[mjp]

Re: The Bevolution. Are you yes or no?

When we say Clarke and Weightman are "like for like" I do wonder what we are all looking at.

Freijah was knocking quietly on the door...not banging it down. With Daniel available at half-back, he should have been made to bang.

JOD I have no comments on that I haven't already shared...there's a whole thread about it! Again, I like him fine but don't get the obsession. He is a very good looking man though so I guess that's part of it.

[GVGjr]

Re: The Bevolution. Are you yes or no?

When we say Clarke and Weightman are "like for like" I do wonder what we are all looking at.

Freijah was knocking quietly on the door...not banging it down. With Daniel available at half-back, he should have been made to bang.

JOD I have no comments on that I haven't already shared...there's a whole thread about it! Again, I like him fine but don't get the obsession. He is a very good looking man though so I guess that's part of it.

I don't see any real similarities in the way Clarke and Weightman go about their forward craft but perhaps Cody needs to become a bit more of a ground level player.
Agree that Freijah didn't knock the door down in a traditional sense but he did string a few solid performances together so deserved a chance and has grasped it pretty well. Regarding Daniel, he's lifted his work rate in recent training sessions and perhaps holding him back a bit longer might have sparked that.

JOD is the outlier based on his performances and has certainly been given a lot of time to find some form.
From a training POV he does look composed with his skills but given he's an ex cricketer he should be aware that at some point he needs to get some runs on the board and it's form in the middle rather than in the nets that count.
Coffield will be available soon enough and Busslinger is starting to get some good games behind him so there could be some competition for him to battle against.