Who's done the better recruiting, Dogs or Pies?

[Bornadog]

Re: Who's done the better recruiting, Dogs or Pies?

One thing Collingwood have done this year is bring in a lot of first gamers. I am pretty sure the players they have brought in weren't exacty playing for Willy and being BOG every week. We should be doing the same with our kids, especially whats left of the uninjured talls. I would bring in Everitt, Hill, Stack, Tiller (if he is ok with injury), etc. Not all at once, I mean give them a few games here and there when we have injuries or outs.

Players that have been around for awhile and have had their chance like Power, Faulmner, Robbins should spend some time at the BEES and see if they can capture any form.

We seem to have so called "Project Players", that we nurture at Werribee, and wait for them to grow up, put on Kgs, and develop but I don't think it works because we don't have control of Werribee. If the reserves comp was still in then this strategy could work.

We have developed some talls for the backline but nothing for the forward line.

[GVGjr]

Re: Who's done the better recruiting, Dogs or Pies?

One thing Collingwood have done this year is bring in a lot of first gamers. I am pretty sure the players they have brought in weren't exacty playing for Willy and being BOG every week. We should be doing the same with our kids, especially whats left of the uninjured talls. I would bring in Everitt, Hill, Stack, Tiller (if he is ok with injury), etc. Not all at once, I mean give them a few games here and there when we have injuries or outs.

Players that have been around for awhile and have had their chance like Power, Faulmner, Robbins should spend some time at the BEES and see if they can capture any form.

We seem to have so called "Project Players", that we nurture at Werribee, and wait for them to grow up, put on Kgs, and develop but I don't think it works because we don't have control of Werribee. If the reserves comp was still in then this strategy could work.

We have developed some talls for the backline but nothing for the forward line.

It's been a terrific effort by the Pies. I don't rate their list that highly but they have performed as a team much like the Crows do. The successful introduction of so many youngsters will really set them up for the future.

Regarding the project players I think we have focused a little too much in that area and we just need to balance things a bit better. The defence is taking shape and I'm very confident that Williams and Everitt will become good players for us and even Cam Wight should be more than serviceable. As you say the forward line isn't looking as promising but we have drafted Walsh, Minson, Skipper and Tiller and none of them have made the mark outside of Minson as a ruckman.
I haven't written off McDougall as yet because we imo we were never going to see the best of him in 2007.

A couple of good draft picks again this year really top off our list. A developing ruckman and a forward should be on the shopping list but I'm sure we will again look at some skilfull speedsters.

[alwaysadog]

Re: Who's done the better recruiting, Dogs or Pies?

It's been a terrific effort by the Pies. I don't rate their list that highly but they have performed as a team much like the Crows do. The successful introduction of so many youngsters will really set them up for the future.

Regarding the project players I think we have focused a little too much in that area and we just need to balance things a bit better. The defence is taking shape and I'm very confident that Williams and Everitt will become good players for us and even Cam Wight should be more than serviceable. As you say the forward line isn't looking as promising but we have drafted Walsh, Minson, Skipper and Tiller and none of them have made the mark outside of Minson as a ruckman.
I haven't written off McDougall as yet because we imo we were never going to see the best of him in 2007.

A couple of good draft picks again this year really top off our list. A developing ruckman and a forward should be on the shopping list but I'm sure we will again look at some skilfull speedsters.

I agree with most of what you are saying GVG, I would add that with the Pies it's necessary to see them across a season. They have so often looked white hot for a while and then cooled dramatically.

Equally they seem to produce these champion kids who 3 years on go no where. I don't think that this pattern is necessarily about to repeat itself, but I doubt they have suddenly unearthed a bunch of champions overnight.

IMHO recruiting is a gradual building process, from the last two drafts for us Higgins and Addison are commanding regular spots and from the most recent draft Harbrow and Lynch are exciting additons to the side. Going further back Williams has finally got his body healthy and Wight a relatively low pick did duty for half a season at CHB, while our first pick from the recent draft is doing OK and expected to debut in the near future.

What is evident is two different approaches. Malthouse is looking for short term gain, Eade is looking to develop the side longer term. I think we haven't jelled yet but I think Eade is looking to have us firing towards season's end.

[W W Biscuit]

Re: Who's done the better recruiting, Dogs or Pies?

A couple of years ago, when the Doggies cleaned up Collingwood in Round 1, I was happily chirping away to a Pie friend as we walked away from the G. Some of our youngsters played very well that day - Gilbee, Cross and Cooney I recall in particular. My friend was in a miserable mood. Whilst being impressed with our young fleet, he lamented that it wasn't going to get any better for Collingwood. They simply had no young players on the rise - "apart from Dane Swan, who looks alright." I got out the Footy record to look at the Collingwood list. Being totally impartial, I had to agree. Honestly, it didn't look that good for the Maggies, whilst the Dogs seemed to have a swag of young talent by comparison.

The point of this little anecdote is this, Grasshopper. More than ever, footy is a fickle business. Wasn't it just a few weeks ago that many were raving about Brisbane's young list? Hmmm. I'd agree that, at the moment, Collingwood look to have recruited very well. That's a snapshot after Round 13. However, over the last five years, I believe that we have recruited just as well, if not more effectively. This time next year, when Everitt is tearing opponents a new one, Lynch and Harbrow are causing havoc and Williams turns about to be the Dreamteam bargain of the century, then the very idea of our inferior recruiting might be scoffed at. That scenario is speculative, but it is just as likely as Ben Reid, Martin Clarke and Tyson Goldsack doing the same thing for Collingwood. Seriously, these guys have played something like three senior games between them. So Clarke debuts well and Ben Reid plays a good game for Williamstown? Using that as a guide, Carlton's Andrew Walker should have won a Brownlow by now. Hell, John Georgiadis would have lined up on the half forward line of our team of the century.

Maybe I'm getting old, but I am becoming more wary of hype. And Collingwood is Hype Incorporated.

[Sockeye Salmon]

Re: Who's done the better recruiting, Dogs or Pies?

I dont think things are quite as dire as you make out. When we draft Cal Ward next year he will happily slot in across half-back.

I thought Ward was a big secret?

[GVGjr]

Re: Who's done the better recruiting, Dogs or Pies?

I thought Ward was a big secret?

The coach mentioned him in the TAC/VFL record last week.

A question for mjp. The Jets played the Knights in the first round of the season, and had a close win, and I was wondering what he thought of the more highly regarded Knights players?

[Raw Toast]

Re: Who's done the better recruiting, Dogs or Pies?

Cox did a pre-season at our club before he was taken by the Pies. To say that this one upsets me - particularly having coached the kid - is an understatement of the highest order.

I think this is an example of how our inability to fund many rookies bit us. Surely if we picked up four or so rookies last year he would've been one of them.

[Bulldog Revolution]

Re: Who's done the better recruiting, Dogs or Pies?

I think this is an example of how our inability to fund many rookies bit us. Surely if we picked up four or so rookies last year he would've been one of them.

agreed, we've always managed without it, but its much nicer to have the ability to select harbrow, hughes, pask, mwest - gives the list so much more flexibility

[mjp]

Re: Who's done the better recruiting, Dogs or Pies?

The coach mentioned him in the TAC/VFL record last week.

A question for mjp. The Jets played the Knights in the first round of the season, and had a close win, and I was wondering what he thought of the more highly regarded Knights players?

Firstly Sockeye, the secret is still the secret. Hard not to get excited about the kid though. Can't wait to see him play against WA this weekend.

Knights certainly have some talent. Cotchin didn't play that day, and I guess he is the one getting hyped at the moment. I have seen him a couple of times, and he is certainly the most promising midfield prospect I have seen in the TAC Cup since Dale Thomas a couple of years back...I am sorry, but I was never a huge fan of Marc Murphy during his Oakleigh days.

Kreuzer did play that day, and was reasonable - not as good as I have seen him play in the past, but marked the ball well. Was beaten in the hit-outs by Sullivan - and this actually cost Northern dearly in the last quarter - but was too good for him around the ground. I honestly think he will play AFL footy round 1 2008, and stay there for 10 years - how good he will be, I have no idea, but if there are any certainties in the draft, surely he is it.

Vespremi played - I have seen him play better in the past. His work-rate and attack on the ball are both superb. Good player. Grimes missed I think, or I just didn't notice him. To me he is more of a grafter - just named Vic Metro captain though, so what do I know.

The most impressive kid was Bongetti. Absolutely towelled us up, we couldn't stop him. Lucky for me, he couldn't kick straight (2 goals 6 or something) and we were able to get away with the win. He has missed the VM squad - and I am sure his injury didn't help him here - but he is knocked for being too slow/small (about 190cm or so). All I know is he is leading the goalkicking despite missing more than a month of the season, and seems to be a pretty good player to me.

[GVGjr]

Re: Who's done the better recruiting, Dogs or Pies?

mjp, did you happen to see Sanfillipo and Grimes for Northern at all?

[mjp]

Re: Who's done the better recruiting, Dogs or Pies?

Um - Yep. Saw Grimes and mentioned him in my post. Hardworking midfield player, who I am not sure is all that special to be honest.

Apparently Sanfillipo played, but I honestly didn't notice him.