Eade rants upset players

[The Underdog]

Re: Eade rants upset players

I would argue that 16 AFL coaches would vehemently disagree with that.

I just don't think it's that black and white

[mjp]

Re: Eade rants upset players

Some players/people simply switch off when they are yelled at and the message is lost. Yet others are inspired by a spray, and return to the field trying to 'prove a point'. Others dwell on the criticism and don't recover as well/bounce back, for fear of making another mistake.

None of these reactions are wrong or a sign of mental weakness. They are just people being people - and all of us need to improve ourselves in some way (yes, even players and even me!). Just like coaches are people being people when they lose their cool and scream at a player/group from time to time.

I suspect that 99.9% of coaches would rather not yell and rant and rave. They want their comments/criticism to be direct and to the point, whilst offering the player/group a potential solution to the problem that they faced and struggled to overcome. It is about providing feedback in a manner that is helpful and provides a way forward.

I think treating your players with respect when times are tough, and offering them a solution rather than adding to their problems is probably the best way to go - after all, just yelling at blokes to 'go harder' probably isn't going to help too much in most situations. I also think Eade does this on the majority of occasions, but the pressure and difficulty of not playing to expectation EARLY in 2007 (yes, when we were winning games) would have been difficult to deal with - and when things started going really poorly, well...where do you go then?

Anyway - I think expectations (inside and outside) the club are very different approaching 2008, and Eade will be a different coach as a result. Plus, Bond isn't there with the pressure of trying to get a senior coaching role on his back next to him, and perhaps this will help too. And come 2009, as we enter the season as defending premiers, well, perhaps then we will see if Eade has learnt from what happened during 2007 in terms of managing and responding to expectations.

And yes, Malthouse, Pagan, Worsfold etc scream as well...but is that really the point? And do I care about them? No, not really.

[LostDoggy]

Re: Eade rants upset players

This is a man's game.

These blokes are paid $200,000 + per game and if they disobey team rules or instructions they deserve to be held to account in no uncertain manner.

If they can't handle it, they are mentally weak and unfit for this career.

Simple? Too bloody right it is.

Totally disagree. When managing a large group of people within the basic guidelines of what is right and wrong a good people managers know what to say to get the best out of the group. Some people only respond to a firm hand but you need to have some different approaches to get the best out of a diverse group.

Its definitely not a sign of being mentally weak.

[Mantis]

Re: Eade rants upset players

Some players/people simply switch off when they are yelled at and the message is lost. Yet others are inspired by a spray, and return to the field trying to 'prove a point'. Others dwell on the criticism and don't recover as well/bounce back, for fear of making another mistake.

None of these reactions are wrong or a sign of mental weakness. They are just people being people - and all of us need to improve ourselves in some way (yes, even players and even me!). Just like coaches are people being people when they lose their cool and scream at a player/group from time to time.

I suspect that 99.9% of coaches would rather not yell and rant and rave. They want their comments/criticism to be direct and to the point, whilst offering the player/group a potential solution to the problem that they faced and struggled to overcome. It is about providing feedback in a manner that is helpful and provides a way forward.

I think treating your players with respect when times are tough, and offering them a solution rather than adding to their problems is probably the best way to go - after all, just yelling at blokes to 'go harder' probably isn't going to help too much in most situations. I also think Eade does this on the majority of occasions, but the pressure and difficulty of not playing to expectation EARLY in 2007 (yes, when we were winning games) would have been difficult to deal with - and when things started going really poorly, well...where do you go then?

You would think last year would have been one of the more frustrating in Eade's career. The message it seemed just didn't get through. From the lack of personnel available to the poor form shown by many of the players things just didn't go right.

It showed late in the season when Eade was just about out of answers. Everything he tried backfired and the lack of fight and spirit shown by the playing group would have been very dis-concierting. If he had hair he would have been pulling it out and most would agree that he was entitled to.

Anyway - I think expectations (inside and outside) the club are very different approaching 2008, and Eade will be a different coach as a result. Plus, Bond isn't there with the pressure of trying to get a senior coaching role on his back next to him, and perhaps this will help too. And come 2009, as we enter the season as defending premiers, well, perhaps then we will see if Eade has learnt from what happened during 2007 in terms of managing and responding to expectations.

Agree that if we can move forward this coming year and beyond, 2007 will go down to one big learning experience. A year when hopefully Eade learnt what strings he can pull with the playing group in terms of motivation and criticism and year when the playing group learnt what is expected and demanded of them from both the coaching staff and the suit wearer's of the club.

[beaser]

Re: Eade rants upset players

Surely the players should be man enough to take it on the chin if there not performing im sure Eade had plenty of supporters going off tap too with the second half.
Hes the appointed coach of the club and like the boss at work hes not there to win a popularity contest.

[LostDoggy]

Re: Eade rants upset players

I play footy for a club with a fairly bad name...not proud of it, but it's the closest place to home. Anyway, my coach has had a few screaming sessions with us, attacking each individual player around the circle, so if a bunch of girls can suck it up and play on, then I think a bunch of grown men can too.

[The Underdog]

Re: Eade rants upset players

I play footy for a club with a fairly bad name...not proud of it, but it's the closest place to home. Anyway, my coach has had a few screaming sessions with us, attacking each individual player around the circle, so if a bunch of girls can suck it up and play on, then I think a bunch of grown men can too.

But did it make you play better, go out on the field more motivated? Or do you just hate your coach?

[mjp]

Re: Eade rants upset players

Surely the players should be man enough to take it on the chin if there not performing im sure Eade had plenty of supporters going off tap too with the second half.
Hes the appointed coach of the club and like the boss at work hes not there to win a popularity contest.

Correct. He is there to win games of football...

If screaming at players (if the rumours are true and Eade is screaming at players!) is not helping achieve this goal, then whether some people on here believe it is a sign that the players are metally weak, or whether the fact that a bunch of girls can suck it up and play after a spray and so should hardened AFL players, well the reality is those comments simply are not important or relevent. If it is having a negative impact on performance then the screaming has to stop.

You have summarised it beautifully. It is not about being popular - equally it is not about engaging in self-indulgence by ranting and raving...it is about winning footy games, and whatever helps do that is what should be done.

[LostDoggy]

Re: Eade rants upset players

Any coach watching Harris give Petrie 30 metres space for an entire quarter or witnessing Mc Mahon spearing passes to the opposition on their forward line or watching Mc Mahon behave like a rabbit caught in the headlights when the ball was kicked into the air to Lappin is entitled to spew forth his venom at the offender.

And if the offender does not respond in a positive manner to this and withdraws into himself he has no place on a football field and is very definitely weak - mentally or otherwise.

I'm not talking about screaming and yelling for the sake of it but when this sort of incompetence occurs, which renders the team's effort useless, then it is entirely appropriate and understandable. Especially when these blokes are paid more than the Prime Minister of the country for their skills.

[The Underdog]

Re: Eade rants upset players

Surely the players should be man enough to take it on the chin if there not performing im sure Eade had plenty of supporters going off tap too with the second half.
Hes the appointed coach of the club and like the boss at work hes not there to win a popularity contest.

And when your boss screams at you does that make you go, well I really need to pick up my game or does it make you go, gee that guys a prick?

My point all the way through is that ranting and raving just isn't the most effective way to motivate most people. Sure it's got a place and it might make us feel better to see Eade going off when we play badly. But it didn't appear to help the players out much. Screaming at players seems to be the bastion of a coach who doesn't have anything left, nothing else to pull out of the hat. The coach should be the last person to be overly emotional out there. He needs to be the one who stays calm and sees things clearly.

[LostDoggy]

Re: Eade rants upset players

We are all made up differently. Ranting and raving does not do it for me. A coach who has many ways of getting the best out each individual.........who gives them confidence and ability to take the risks they should....will always achieve better outcomes than those who try the one size fits all approach. Distant and remote coaches have power but not commitment. Footballers are no different to anyone else in society where taking risks, showing leadership, showing courage is more likely to happen if we feel good about ourselves and what we are doing. I cannot see how self belief can be instilled if we are slagging off players. And at the end of the day, it's whatever it takes to reach that button that makes us run on top of the ground.

[southerncross]

Re: Eade rants upset players

We are all made up differently. Ranting and raving does not do it for me. A coach who has many ways of getting the best out each individual.........who gives them confidence and ability to take the risks they should....will always achieve better outcomes than those who try the one size fits all approach. Distant and remote coaches have power but not commitment. Footballers are no different to anyone else in society where taking risks, showing leadership, showing courage is more likely to happen if we feel good about ourselves and what we are doing. I cannot see how self belief can be instilled if we are slagging off players. And at the end of the day, it's whatever it takes to reach that button that makes us run on top of the ground.

Same here. Yelling at the group is one thing but singling out some wont get the best results all the time. Guys like Harris might respond to it well but Everitt probably wouldn't. Eade would be acutely aware of this though.

[Mofra]

Re: Eade rants upset players

The AFL players obviously have fairly strong contacts with each other, despite not playing for the same club (senior players especially).

If Eade has "lost the players", why would Hudson & Welsh look at the Bulldogs as their preferrered destination (as did Aker last year)? They'd know the score far more than any of us would.

[GVGjr]

Re: Eade rants upset players

The AFL players obviously have fairly strong contacts with each other, despite not playing for the same club (senior players especially).

If Eade has "lost the players", why would Hudson & Welsh look at the Bulldogs as their preferrered destination (as did Aker last year)? They'd know the score far more than any of us would.

I guess that Aker had to leave the Lions and saw us as a chance to keep him in the finals.
Hudson hadn't behaved well in SA and realised that our ruckman hadn't performed and knew he could get the number one position. He liked the area as well after his stint with Werribee.
Welsh knows we need a key forward and its his best chance of getting a regular senior gig.

Now that might sound a bit cynical but the Bulldogs are a good fit for all of these guys regardless of Eade.

[The Underdog]

Re: Eade rants upset players

I guess that Aker had to leave the Lions and saw us as a chance to keep him in the finals.
Hudson hadn't behaved well in SA and realised that our ruckman hadn't performed and knew he could get the number one position. He liked the area as well after his stint with Werribee.
Welsh knows we need a key forward and its his best chance of getting a regular senior gig.

Now that might sound a bit cynical but the Bulldogs are a good fit for all of these guys regardless of Eade.

And when it comes down to it, there's only 15 other clubs to choose from once you've decided to leave a club and realistically (unless you're C.Judd) only 3-4 are going to be intersted in a certain player.
All of these guys fit needs we have, for a ruck, a forward and a HFF with a big mouth and a big off-field profile