Australia vs South Africa

[Mantis]

Re: Australia vs South Africa

I wonder if they would punt on playing Watson as the opener?

The replacement for Krejza is Hauritz. which continues the shuffle of spinners.

Not a chance especially when you have Rogers & Hughes making consistent runs at shield level.

[azabob]

Re: Australia vs South Africa

I wonder if they would punt on playing Watson as the opener?

The replacement for Krejza is Hauritz. which continues the shuffle of spinners.

Again it appears as they are making changes for the sake of making changes, to say hey we made a change. I think its similar to the bulldogs situation when we went through our losing streak. Eade and the match committee had confidence in say 20 blokes and the remaining two spots were up for grabs depending who played poorly or well.

[Mantis]

Re: Australia vs South Africa

Some other observations:
1. Australia's batting tail over the past 12 months has been the best technique-wise in cricket history (it would be even better with Clark in for Siddle at #11) - this single-handedly kept our noses in front for the majority of the test and saved the top 6's collective arse in both innings.

Agree with most of that except the bit on Clark. Clark has a good eye, but not a good technique.

2. To win a test, you need to take 20 wickets - vale Warne and McGrath (supported by Gillespie and Kaspa)

These bowlers were all able to bowl consistent line and lengths and were always able to get a little bit of life out of the wicket. Our bowlers at present can't tie down a batsman and can't get the ball to move off a straight line.

Warne was something else.

3. Saffers won comfortably despite poor and reactive captaincy from Smith (especially late in both of Australia's innings), no contribution with the bat whatsoever from their tail and not a lot of threatening swing and pace from Steyn. They actually have some improvement left in them, so Australia will have to improve out of sight in all disciplines to get back into the series

Not so sure. They batted pretty damn well in this match and there bowling isn't all it's cracked up to be. Steyn is a bully of shit batting attacks and Morkel is just learning and their spinner was gifted a few wickets by some poor shot selection by our players. Ntini is still a very handy bowler.

4. Saffers caught everything in sight in the cordon to keep them in the hunt in both innings - they looked like the Aussie slips cordon with Warne and M Waugh circa 2001-2004 (as an aside, the Aussie slips cordon has deteriorated markedly since M Waugh retired)

Besides the keeper I can't think of too many grassed chances by our slip cordon. Ponting is brilliant at 2nd slip (perhaps even better than M.Waugh) and Hayden is on a par with Warne at 1st slip. de Villers took a couple of excellent catches, but the rest were pretty much regulation.

[Sedat]

Re: Australia vs South Africa

Not so sure. They batted pretty damn well in this match and there bowling isn't all it's cracked up to be. Steyn is a bully of shit batting attacks and Morkel is just learning and their spinner was gifted a few wickets by some poor shot selection by our players. Ntini is still a very handy bowler.

Reckon you're being a little harsh on Harris - he extracted more turn and bowled much less rubbish than Krazy. The wickets he took may have looked like slogs but there were subtle variations in flight and pace with most of them - he bowled the sucker ball that was spanked followed by the more flighted deliveries which the batsmen could not resist and paid the price (it was an especially beautiful piece of spin bowling that removed Symonds in the first dig when he top-edged one that was flighted and slower to a similar looking delivery Harris bowled earlier in the over that was dispatched).

Besides the keeper I can't think of too many grassed chances by our slip cordon. Ponting is brilliant at 2nd slip (perhaps even better than M.Waugh) and Hayden is on a par with Warne at 1st slip. de Villers took a couple of excellent catches, but the rest were pretty much regulation.

More a comment on other inferior touring sides that always seem to grass crucial regulation chances in the slips. Can't agree with Ponting being a better 2nd slip that Junior. Ponting has grassed plenty in the cordon in recent seasons - he is brilliant patrolling the off-side in close but is quite hit and miss in the slips. Warne had buckets as big as anyone - he dropped virtually nothing at 1st slip throughout his career. Hayden is very good but Warne was about as good as you get standing next to the keeper (apologies to Stephen Fleming and Tubby).

[westdog54]

Re: Australia vs South Africa

I disagree somewhat, they also struggled to make scores on a flat deck as well.

Maybe so, but they were on the wrong end of the second highest run chase in test history. That, in itself, is damning.

[Mantis]

Re: Australia vs South Africa

More a comment on other inferior touring sides that always seem to grass crucial regulation chances in the slips. Can't agree with Ponting being a better 2nd slip that Junior. Ponting has grassed plenty in the cordon in recent seasons - he is brilliant patrolling the off-side in close but is quite hit and miss in the slips. Warne had buckets as big as anyone - he dropped virtually nothing at 1st slip throughout his career. Hayden is very good but Warne was about as good as you get standing next to the keeper (apologies to Stephen Fleming and Tubby).

1. Give me some examples?

2. Nothing you say. He dropped Pieterson at a crucial time in the Ashes series we lost in England and dropped a regulation catch on a hat-trick ball from D. Fleming. Sure he took his fair share, but he was also prone to the odd error.

[LostDoggy]

Re: Australia vs South Africa

Maybe so, but they were on the wrong end of the second highest run chase in test history. That, in itself, is damning.

A bowling line up with McGrath, Gillespie, Lee, Bichel and MacGill in it couldn't stop the highest run chase.
Tells me if its a flat deck then it doesn't matter who is bowling.

[Mantis]

Re: Australia vs South Africa

A bowling line up with McGrath, Gillespie, Lee, Bichel and MacGill in it couldn't stop the highest run chase.
Tells me if its a flat deck then it doesn't matter who is bowling.

MacGill's 1-149 didn't really help the cause.

[LostDoggy]

Re: Australia vs South Africa

MacGill's 1-149 didn't really help the cause.

Still its a better line up then the one that played in WA. I believe the bowlers were poor but the batsman seem to have escaped all blame when they were just as bad.

[Mantis]

Re: Australia vs South Africa

Still its a better line up then the one that played in WA. I believe the bowlers were poor but the batsman seem to have escaped all blame when they were just as bad.

They were worse.

In the 1st innings we were 5-166 and managed to get 375.

In the 2nd innings we were 5-148, then 7-162 and manged to get 319.

If our bowler's didn't make runs in both innings and Johnson didn't get 5 wickets in 20 balls we would have gotten beaten by an innings.

[mighty_west]

Re: Australia vs South Africa

I wonder if they would punt on playing Watson as the opener?

The replacement for Krejza is Hauritz. which continues the shuffle of spinners.

In a one dayer sure, but no way known for a Test, Watson doesn't have the right temperment for an opener, i'd play Hussey before Watson as an opener, then again, there are a few waiting for Haydens spot and all in red hot form.

[mighty_west]

Re: Australia vs South Africa

Still its a better line up then the one that played in WA. I believe the bowlers were poor but the batsman seem to have escaped all blame when they were just as bad.

Probably due to 2 things, the first innings recovery after being 3 for 16 or so, and nutting out a half decent first innings score, plus we had plenty on the board to bowl out Sth Africa in that final innings, no team should ever chase down over 400 in a 4th innings!

[GVGjr]

Re: Australia vs South Africa

It's interesting that we have had two major big bag of wicket performances by Krejza in the last test against India and Johnson on the last test against SA and yet still could not win either game.

You just know that it was McGrath or Warne grabbing those bags of wickets we would have won both of those games easily but there currently isn't the supporting players to take advantage when one of the team is on a roll.

[Mantis]

Re: Australia vs South Africa

It's interesting that we have had two major big bag of wicket performances by Krejza in the last test against India and Johnson on the last test against SA and yet still could not win either game.

You just know that it was McGrath or Warne grabbing those bags of wickets we would have won both of those games easily but there currently isn't the supporting players to take advantage when one of the team is on a roll.

In context when your spinner takes 8 for 200+ it's a fair chance the opposition have scored pretty heavily.

Do agree that when your opener takes 8 for 60 odd and you have a first innings lead of 100 on a good track you should never lose.

[GVGjr]

Re: Australia vs South Africa

In context when your spinner takes 8 for 200+ it's a fair chance the opposition have scored pretty heavily.

Do agree that when your opener takes 8 for 60 odd and you have a first innings lead of 100 on a good track you should never lose.

The '8 for' was outstanding but going for 200 was way too lose. Still an '8 for' would normally mean that we would win a test and just shows the the support team is not performing.

Agreed that Johnsons 8 for and then the subsequent lead should have resulted in a comfortable win but them times are a changing and with our current set-up, grabbing 20 wickets in most conditions will be very difficult against good teams.