Are You Sick Of The Afl Changing Rules Every Year

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Re: Are You Sick Of The Afl Changing Rules Every Year

Happy to have a counter view but can I ask why?

Before we change fundamentals of the game (such as with zones), we should look at ways to eliminate needless delays in the game that promote congestion - IMO boundary throw-ins are one such delay that could be removed to speed up the game and promote open play.

I've been wanting the boundary throw-in gone for 3-4 years now. But not on last touch. Because spoils in defensive 50 will lead to shots at goal for the other team. Too harsh a penalty IMO. So i'd probably look at last touch from a kick or handball.

[Sedat]

Re: Are You Sick Of The Afl Changing Rules Every Year

I'm against radical changes to the game as time often helps sort issues out but this isn't a major change. The only issue I would be concerned about is if a coach brings all 14 non-square players to the edge of the square whenever the ball is bounced.

So am I because I think there are options available that are not nuclear. But I am open-minded enough to consider the nuclear options if the game cannot unstrangle itself through other means - however I'm very confident it can if interpretations of existing rules and natural evolution of existing rules are modified as already suggested.

[Sedat]

Re: Are You Sick Of The Afl Changing Rules Every Year

I've been wanting the boundary throw-in gone for 3-4 years now. But not on last touch. Because spoils in defensive 50 will lead to shots at goal for the other team. Too harsh a penalty IMO. So i'd probably look at last touch from a kick or handball.

Not against that at all - last kick or handball is a fair compromise. Maybe instead of throwing it in after a spoil it can be thrown up 10m from the boundary from where the ball crossed the line?

[Mofra]

Re: Are You Sick Of The Afl Changing Rules Every Year

there are just a lot of low skilled footballers in the game and the coaches have so much pressure on them to win that they cannot do anything to coach for the future.

That may not be the players fault - mentioned on another thread that Paul Roos still thinks players are part-time, and the amount of time players spend with ball in had is much less than even a few years ago (it's all running/fitness work).

We started a revolution with "handball club" and North Melbourne are doing well with a crap lost by removing some restrictions on skill work and all restrictions on goal kicking practice.

The first coaches that allow players to spend as much time with ball in hand as possible will probably get a jump on the rest of the competition just as we did over pre-season 2016.

[Bornadog]

Re: Are You Sick Of The Afl Changing Rules Every Year

Couldn't agree with Buckley more - This is the only thing we need to do and see what happens. This is taking the rules back to pre 1996 when congestion wasn't an issue.

REMOVE PRIOR OPPORTUNITY TO LIMIT CONGESTION: BUCKLEY


Collingwood coach Nathan Buckley says umpires must reward the tacklers more often, which in turn would help reduce the amount of congestion in the game.


As debate rages about what can be done to free up the game, Buckley said radical rule changes such as zones aren’t the answer. Instead, making a simple tweak to the tackler/ball handler situation will help be the panacea.


“I like the fact the game can evolve on its own but there is one rule that I’ve been keen on for quite a while and that is to eliminate prior opportunity,” Buckley told SEN’s Whateley.


“If teams want to handball in a short space, they get numbers into that congestion and they want to handball and take the tacklers on.

“If you possess the ball, but you do not kick or handball it, then it’s a free kick against. I think that is something that will change it all together.


“If you put two or three quick handballs together inside or you have a handball to a player that was hot, and he was tackled, regardless of prior opportunity or anything, if he had the ball, was tackled and didn’t handball or kick it, that’s a free kick.”


Buckley also added the evolution of tactics always happens and he is frustrated by the constant discussion surrounding the state of the game.

[jeemak]

Re: Are You Sick Of The Afl Changing Rules Every Year

The issue with that is it doesn't account for the evolution of tackling ability across the competition, nor the fact that handballing is used to find an option that can use the ball properly so as not to kick the ball to opposition players sitting one kick outside of the play.

I'm actually surprised that a senior coach thinks so narrowly on the topic.

I get that on my second point the issue wouldn't exist to the extent it does if teams didn't crowd their opposition's forward 50m, but at the same time if a team didn't do that they'd immediately hand control of numbers to the attacking team and be highly exposed to being scored against.

The natural evolution away from positional play can't be stopped. Incentives to encourage a more attacking style of territorial play should be looked at. For instance, a team that scores over 100 points in a game, win or lose, could be awarded an additional half or single premiership point, a team that scores over 115 points in a game could be awarded a full premiership point or more. No rules have to change to achieve this type of outcome, though the reward for playing a more offensive style might be worth it - especially during the middle two quarters of a season as teams are grinding through.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Re: Are You Sick Of The Afl Changing Rules Every Year

The issue with that is it doesn't account for the evolution of tackling ability across the competition, nor the fact that handballing is used to find an option that can use the ball properly so as not to kick the ball to opposition players sitting one kick outside of the play.

I'm actually surprised that a senior coach thinks so narrowly on the topic.

I get that on my second point the issue wouldn't exist to the extent it does if teams didn't crowd their opposition's forward 50m, but at the same time if a team didn't do that they'd immediately hand control of numbers to the attacking team and be highly exposed to being scored against.

The natural evolution away from positional play can't be stopped. Incentives to encourage a more attacking style of territorial play should be looked at. For instance, a team that scores over 100 points in a game, win or lose, could be awarded an additional half or single premiership point, a team that scores over 115 points in a game could be awarded a full premiership point or more. No rules have to change to achieve this type of outcome, though the reward for playing a more offensive style might be worth it - especially during the middle two quarters of a season as teams are grinding through.

This would be a bit unfair to teams playing a game in the wet though wouldn't it?

Getting rid of prior opportunity won't solve the problem. I agree it's surprising Buckley thinks this would solve the problem. It would lead to lots of tunnel ball and soccer to get the ball out of congestion as players avoid taking possession. This latter point is not something we want to see in our game. Tackling is one of the best aspects of our game and removing prior opportunity would lead to players avoiding taking possession. I can't see it alleviating congestion.

I'm more for speeding up play with less stoppages and less interchanges to encourage more play through the corridor.

For mine, i don't need high scoring. Strong, tough and fierce play with minimal stoppages is what i like to see. Just look at our grand final. Yes there is bias, but there are plenty of neutral supporters who were saying it was one of the best games of all time. And the score was 89-67.

[Bornadog]

Re: Are You Sick Of The Afl Changing Rules Every Year

The issue with that is it doesn't account for the evolution of tackling ability across the competition, nor the fact that handballing is used to find an option that can use the ball properly so as not to kick the ball to opposition players sitting one kick outside of the play.

I'm actually surprised that a senior coach thinks so narrowly on the topic.

I get that on my second point the issue wouldn't exist to the extent it does if teams didn't crowd their opposition's forward 50m, but at the same time if a team didn't do that they'd immediately hand control of numbers to the attacking team and be highly exposed to being scored against.

The natural evolution away from positional play can't be stopped. Incentives to encourage a more attacking style of territorial play should be looked at. For instance, a team that scores over 100 points in a game, win or lose, could be awarded an additional half or single premiership point, a team that scores over 115 points in a game could be awarded a full premiership point or more. No rules have to change to achieve this type of outcome, though the reward for playing a more offensive style might be worth it - especially during the middle two quarters of a season as teams are grinding through.

This would be a bit unfair to teams playing a game in the wet though wouldn't it?

Getting rid of prior opportunity won't solve the problem. I agree it's surprising Buckley thinks this would solve the problem. It would lead to lots of tunnel ball and soccer to get the ball out of congestion as players avoid taking possession. This latter point is not something we want to see in our game. Tackling is one of the best aspects of our game and removing prior opportunity would lead to players avoiding taking possession. I can't see it alleviating congestion.

I'm more for speeding up play with less stoppages and less interchanges to encourage more play through the corridor.

For mine, i don't need high scoring. Strong, tough and fierce play with minimal stoppages is what i like to see. Just look at our grand final. Yes there is bias, but there are plenty of neutral supporters who were saying it was one of the best games of all time. And the score was 89-67.

2. Get rid of prior opp - the single most exploited rule in the comp. Good players will get rid of it legally instead of deliberately hatching it in a tackle and waiting for a secondary stoppage. People are missing the point about prior opp and rewarding the ball winner - if the ball winner is doing nothing to try and dispose of it legally and simply waiting for another stoppage, they don't deserve any protection whatsoever. Reward proactive players who win the ball and want to do something with it, and also incentivise players to chase and tackle legally to win it back.

I agree with Buckley and Sedat. How many times do you see a player taking possession of the ball, but knows he will be tackled, holds the ball against his chest because he wants to create a stoppage and claims no prior. It happens too regularly and has created the situation where packs are formed. If the No prior was removed, the players would try and dispose the ball correctly and kick or handball outside the pack, or if they know they are about to be tackled, they will merely punch the ball away and not grab it in the first place. Players will still try and get hold of the ball, but only if they know they won't be tackled.

Go back to games before prior opportunity was introduced (pre 1996) and see how the players behaved when it was time to grab the ball. It doesn't mean we have to reward the tackler everytime, but if you commit to grab the ball, you have to make sure you are not going to be tackled.

[soupman]

Re: Are You Sick Of The Afl Changing Rules Every Year

If you remove prior there are going to be a lot of players in tight that will just whack the ball to a teammate or a designated area (forward/the wing etc.).

My preference has always been for them to reward the tackler by penalising incorrect disposal. Atm if you are tackled and the ball comes out unless the player clearly drops it or throws it it's play on, I would prefer that unless the player legally handballs or kicks it then it's play on.

The other idea I am ok with is prior is tightened by making it team prior. ie. At the moment prior resets everytime a new player receives the ball, I'd be happy if just the first player to take possession of the ball was awarded more time but every teammate in the chain he handballs/kicks to has forfeited their prior opportunity.

[Bornadog]

Re: Are You Sick Of The Afl Changing Rules Every Year

If you remove prior there are going to be a lot of players in tight that will just whack the ball to a teammate or a designated area (forward/the wing etc.).

My preference has always been for them to reward the tackler by penalising incorrect disposal. Atm if you are tackled and the ball comes out unless the player clearly drops it or throws it it's play on, I would prefer that unless the player legally handballs or kicks it then it's play on.

The other idea I am ok with is prior is tightened by making it team prior. ie. At the moment prior resets everytime a new player receives the ball, I'd be happy if just the first player to take possession of the ball was awarded more time but every teammate in the chain he handballs/kicks to has forfeited their prior opportunity.

I don't mind the way you are thinking. One thing we have to make sure is we don't complicate the rules for the umpires. I don't know how umpires remember all the rules.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Re: Are You Sick Of The Afl Changing Rules Every Year

If you remove prior there are going to be a lot of players in tight that will just whack the ball to a teammate or a designated area (forward/the wing etc.).

My preference has always been for them to reward the tackler by penalising incorrect disposal. Atm if you are tackled and the ball comes out unless the player clearly drops it or throws it it's play on, I would prefer that unless the player legally handballs or kicks it then it's play on.

The other idea I am ok with is prior is tightened by making it team prior. ie. At the moment prior resets everytime a new player receives the ball, I'd be happy if just the first player to take possession of the ball was awarded more time but every teammate in the chain he handballs/kicks to has forfeited their prior opportunity.

Yeah i'm ok with this and think it would work. Getting rid of the "hospital handpass" essentially. It's not right for the game or even player safety that you can handball it to another player when you know they are about to get tackled. That is certainly team prior.

[Twodogs]

Re: Are You Sick Of The Afl Changing Rules Every Year

I don't mind the way you are thinking. One thing we have to make sure is we don't complicate the rules for the umpires. I don't know how umpires remember all the rules.

Because they love rules and applying them to others. You couldn't invent enough rules for the average umpire to forget, they love them.

[soupman]

Re: Are You Sick Of The Afl Changing Rules Every Year

Yeah i'm ok with this and think it would work. Getting rid of the "hospital handpass" essentially. It's not right for the game or even player safety that you can handball it to them when you know they are about to get tackled.

The worst bit is the player who receives the hospital handpass not only gets crunched but penalised with a free against. Can see teammates cringing when Dahlhaus or Jong get the ball near them.

[Sedat]

Re: Are You Sick Of The Afl Changing Rules Every Year

There is a skill in decision-making that prior opportunity has completely diluted. It gives players an out to just sit there and take the tackle, knowing there is a neutral stoppage as a result. If players cannot execute a skill such as decision-making, they do not deserve to be able to dictate a neutral stop-play by their inaction.

[Bornadog]

Re: Are You Sick Of The Afl Changing Rules Every Year

There is a skill in decision-making that prior opportunity has completely diluted. It gives players an out to just sit there and take the tackle, knowing there is a neutral stoppage as a result. If players cannot execute a skill such as decision-making, they do not deserve to be able to dictate a neutral stop-play by their inaction.

I think they are coached to create a stoppage. Many teams are very good at winning the ball from a stoppage, as we were in 2016.