Sharp Axes

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Re: Sharp Axes

All valid points. Appreciate the point of view. Don't agree with all of all of it but lots is hard to dispute.

In regards to the list. Hindsight is a wonderful thing. Would have an outsider rated the list at the end of 2014? Nope. Let's look at one player. Easton Wood. No one rated him. He was AA in 2015. Why? 100% Bevo. Bevo made him AA. If you listen to Easton speak about the period and the confidence that Bevo gave him and others was inspiring to listen too.

So you may say in hindsight. The list was great. But how much of that was due to Bevo getting the most out of players.

Fully agree Bevo played a role. A major role. But these guys clearly have talent.

You could argue the same right now - Richards, Williams, Dale, Smith etc. Should they be achieving another level?

[JanLorMill]

Re: Sharp Axes

I guess these are the important questions.

Is the list that good? Do you believe another coach would be getting more out of the list than Bevo?

My answer is no. I don't think so. It is a obviously a hypothetical question. I think the list is mid table. I think that no other coach would have this list entrenched in the top four.

So its the lists fault. A list which the coach has had a major part in building.
Probably 4 players out there last night that most other coaches wouldn't play.

King and Cornes have actually talked up the list.

[Bornadog]

Re: Sharp Axes

I brought this up in another thread where MJP talks about issues in the midfield and the whole team. (If you haven't read his post you should - see here post #416)

Is one of our issues Brendon Lade. He is the midfield coach and we have changed things up in the centre, where Smith and Macrae are no longer rotating through there. Last year we were the number one team for centre clearances. This year we have dropped to 14th? We are still number one for stoppage clearances?

Has Brendon tweaked the mids too much?

[Boots]

Re: Sharp Axes

I think the interesting feature of the two videos I posted is that collectively they point to something we've also noticed as fans: for whatever reason, the Bulldogs are less than the sum of their parts.

That's super weird, when Bevo's entire reputation - as Angelo pointed out above - is to make teams play like more than the sum of their parts. I always remember the friend of Bevo's who said of 2016 "I think Luke convinced a few of those boys they were quite a bit better than they were" (I think that's from 'A Wink from the Universe', maybe).

In the strangest of ways, it's harsh to judge Bevo by the standards he's set for himself. I think his standards - and ours - might actually be impossibly high. It's possible that no other coach could get our 2016 result out of our list in 2016, or get even this list to a GF in 2021.

Also, our new game plan is really quite conservative, and Bevo doesn't seem to be a conservative coach. He seems to do best when he's really up against the wall, list-wise. He built a premiership forward line out of Tory Dickson and loose change from the midfield. He's made a hell of a defensive back six out of rejects, pocket lint, and Liam Jones. It's possible he's no longer the coach for this list, because paradoxically this list is too good, and he doesn't quite know how to coach it.

Maybe that's too long a bow to draw.

What if the problem is, we're judging him by the standards of 2016, when actually those standards were never fair to begin with. And what if, at the same time, we're judging him too harshly because even if he were a 'normal' coach, any other coach with this list would still struggle to make top four, not because of the list, but because making top four is hard.

[angelopetraglia]

Re: Sharp Axes

So its the lists fault. A list which the coach has had a major part in building.
Probably 4 players out there last night that most other coaches wouldn't play.

Agree with that too. But how many lists are in perfect condition in the AFL? The majority have serious gaps. We have now been in a finals window for a long period of time. Not too many clubs have been able to stay competitive enough to consistently make and win finals. A few unicorns. Yes.

[JanLorMill]

Re: Sharp Axes

So now Brendan Lades fault for no selection integrity (eg continually playing JOD), 3/4 tall forward system, a backline that can't defend, no tall interceptors, etc

[azabob]

Re: Sharp Axes

He won 15 games in 2016 with a ridiculous injury profile. The comment is bullshit.

I've asked twice now, where did Cornes say that comment? I can't find it.

[GVGjr]

Re: Sharp Axes

He won 15 games in 2016 with a ridiculous injury profile. The comment is bullshit.

We played sensational football in 2015 and if you believe Bevo we could have also made some progress in the finals had some information not been leaked. That said, the list was coming together and based on something Bevo shared with a group of supporters watching a training session the side he inherited was very sound defensively. His job was to get the backline moving forward and I think he achieved that very quickly.

He inherited a good list and he quickly got it it playing some exciting football.

[angelopetraglia]

Re: Sharp Axes

I brought this up in another thread where MJP talks about issues in the midfield and the whole team. (If you haven't read his post you should - see here post #416)

Is one of our issues Brendon Lade. He is the midfield coach and we have changed things up in the centre, where Smith and Macrae are no longer rotating through there. Last year we were the number one team for centre clearances. This year we have dropped to 14th? We are still number one for stoppage clearances?

Has Brendon tweaked the mids too much?

It is a valid point. Potentially yes. We also have lost Dunkley. Our inside beast and B&F.

[Bornadog]

Re: Sharp Axes

So now Brendan Lades fault for no selection integrity (eg continually playing JOD), 3/4 tall forward system, a backline that can't defend, no tall interceptors, etc

Oh come on, who said that ? Please read what I wrote. I was talking about the midfield and the changes made there

[Bornadog]

Re: Sharp Axes

We played sensational football in 2015 and if you believe Bevo we could have also made some progress in the finals had some information not been leaked. That said, the list was coming together and based on something Bevo shared with a group of supporters watching a training session the side he inherited was very sound defensively. His job was to get the backline moving forward and I think he achieved that very quickly.

He inherited a good list and he quickly got it it playing some exciting football.

I remember in the Summer of 2014/15 before the season started, a mate went to a BBQ where Bevo also attended. He told my mate he can see us playing finals after three years as the list was inexperienced. His expectations were low when he first came in.

[EasternWest]

Re: Sharp Axes

Is he wrong though? It's shit snarky language, but is he wrong?

I know because I'm asking you this question you'll obfuscate or deny, but we both know what the truth is.

He won 15 games in 2016 with a ridiculous injury profile. The comment is bullshit.

Dunno why you replied to me - I deliberately omitted that part from the quote I took and made it clear I don't agree with him on that.

I've asked twice now, where did Cornes say that comment? I can't find it.

I didn't watch/listen I just copy/pasted the main points that someone else quoted.

[angelopetraglia]

Re: Sharp Axes

The other crucial question for me.

Has the club put the right team around Bevo? These things are difficult to judge. But on face value it feels like some of the bigger clubs have got more senior figures, better talent and more support for their football departments.

Has Bevo resisted brining in other people? Has the club not been stronger enough? Have we not invested enough or in the right places?

[JanLorMill]

Re: Sharp Axes

Oh come on, who said that ? Please read what I wrote. I was talking about the midfield and the changes made there

The problems haven't just appeared this season since Lade got here.

[JanLorMill]

Re: Sharp Axes

The other crucial question for me.

Has the club put the right team around Bevo? These things are difficult to judge. But on face value it feels like some of the bigger clubs have got more senior figures, better talent and more support for their football departments.

Has Bevo resisted brining in other people? Has the club not been stronger enough? Have we not invested enough or in the right places?

This is blame shifting, Bevo is the man.