Sharp Axes

[GVGjr]

Re: Sharp Axes

Agreed GVGjr. I was on the 'sack Bevo' train after Rounds 1 and 2, but I'm not anymore. Take those two games out and, while not a great season or even a good one, it's not sack the coach territory.

Even when we miss finals (we are not beating Geelong at home and it's now necessary to make finals), I won't be on the sack Bevo train. It takes a lot to reinvent the game from a handball-heavy high press to a more balanced approach with more emphasis on kicking and a properly constructed forward line. Get a few other things right - like the club appears to be trying to do - and we'll be OK.

I'd like this awful season to end though. Our losses are sapping my interest in footy, and our wins are not all that inspiring. We've beaten only Brisbane and Carlton in the 8, and lost games to teams currently ranked 16, 15, 13, 11 and 9. Most of our wins came against teams we played twice and split the wins with (Richmond, Giants, Hawks), Freo (who we beat twice), North, and a couple of good games against Brisbane and Carlton. We're a desperately middle-of-the-road team and we can't even put away those teams lower on the ladder than us with any consistency.

Well I've previously said that if we don't make the eight or win a final then the season is a fail and we could be forced into a deeper look at things like the list, recruiting and the coach and I still believe that to be the benchmark and the catalyst.

[Bullies]

Re: Sharp Axes

I agree with this in principle and I'm not scared to try an untested senior coach either but if we look deeper than the heartbreaking losses is it really just all on Bevo?

My trepidation to land it all on Bevo stems from the points I made on this thread on post #98

https://www.woof.net.au/forum/showthread.php?23657-Western-Bulldogs-accused-of-wasting-golden-era/page7

There were a lot of diversions on the thread that attacked the journo and questioned his integrity rather than being willing to look a bit deeper to the reasons why we aren't performing like we should. I think this is bigger than just Bevo but enjoy a good discussion on why removing him solves our issues. It might fix some peoples frustrations more than fixing the challenges of the club.

We will forever be indebted to Bevo for what he has done however for whatever reason the message is stale and not getting through. We need new ideas and the players need a new voice. Kingsley at GWS, McRae at Collingwood. Our list is to good to waste. We need change and we can't keep doing the same and expect different results.

[SonofScray]

Re: Sharp Axes

Between Baines, Watson Wheeler, Grant and Bevo we have turned ourselves into a bland, uninteresting, joyless and unreliable footy club.

That's even before I start on the players who just seem to take the piss quarter by quarter, week by week and refuse to be accountable for their performances.

Another weekend turned sour, well done you lot.

Baines seems to be doing all the non footy, non fans stuff right. But he won?t be far off my hit list if things keep going. Don?t like him, but respect he has been good for the balance sheet.

Grant can go.

KWW I have no clue about. Who is she? Where is she? Non factor.

[Vred]

Re: Sharp Axes

Baines seems to be doing all the non footy, non fans stuff right. But he won?t be far off my hit list if things keep going. Don?t like him, but respect he has been good for the balance sheet.

Grant can go.

KWW I have no clue about. Who is she? Where is she? Non factor.

Word on the street is Baines is being chased *hard* by the Hawks, one insider I speak to is positive he'll be there next season.

[Hotdog60]

Re: Sharp Axes

I keep hearing our list is good enough and we need to move Bevo on for a fresh voice but I'd ask the question is our list good enough?
Treloar although talented is he hard at it.
JUH is still learning the ropes
Weightman see JUH
The Bont is a star but he needs more support.
B.Smith he's head could be a problem and for player that could show promise is giving very little.
Lobb is he doing enough but is that our fault or that all you get.
Macrae has skills but is off the boil is this a change in role.
Baker handy but on the fringe.
West smart footballer but lacks pace for the role he is playing.
Duryea time has caught up.
Mclean cooked
Bruce cooked
O'Donnell shows something but still learning
L. Jones won't be there forever and next year may fall of a cliff
Richards good honest footballer
Liber busts a gut but lacks pace if he doesn't win it
O'Brien is backup
Vandermeer has pace but lacks skill
Poulter see Baker
Scott is fringe
Hannan cooked
McNeil could a smart footballer but his skills don't show it
Dale is good outside runner but not great defensively
A. Jones unknown but shouldn't be there at the moment
Naughton is a class act but let down by his disposal in front of the sticks
Williams see Baker but a little better
Daniel is a class player but he needs time and space.
Johannisen great footballer but for a pacey player has suss hamstrings
Keath can look good but do you want the ball in his hands
Gardner fills a hole but see Keath
English would be better placed as the relieving ruck rather than the main man but from what I read doesn't see it that way.

All the other players are either young and learning or won't make the grade although Sweet could have been a good combo with English but that ship has bolted.

How many star players do you see on this list?

[ledge]

Re: Sharp Axes

We just got called the perennial under achievers by bombers fans .. can you believe that ! We might be but I think the bombers top us in that department . Kettle / black

[bulldogtragic]

Re: Sharp Axes

We just got called the perennial under achievers by bombers fans .. can you believe that ! We might be but I think the bombers top us in that department . Kettle / black

I guess their logic is they’re shit and shouldn’t be playing in or winning finals. And with our talent, we should be playing and winning finals. In that sense we are under achievers. We left six wins on the table this year after leading. I guess that’s under achieving.

[GVGjr]

Re: Sharp Axes

I keep hearing our list is good enough and we need to move Bevo on for a fresh voice but I'd ask the question is our list good enough?

How many star players do you see on this list?

Well here is the thing, the list is of the club's making and it's neither clearly rebuilding like say a Hawthorn or continually topping up following the Geelong model.
In fairness most clubs do what we have been doing but I'd say we've been far more patient with players with marginal talent levels by maintaining them on the playing list for longer than is ideal. As a result of that we are now at the stage with a couple of players like Bailey Smith and Rhylee West who are stalling a bit where we don't have a lot younger talent coming through.
And again in fairness we have invested heavily in Ugle-Hagan and Darcy which has eaten into our early picks currency in recent years which is why we've tried to balance things by endeavoring to strike it rich with slightly more mature state league players which is no guarantee to success and certainly is part of our lack of star players. Losing Dunkley in his prime also weakens our star player levels.

BT suggests we need to do a hard reset for a year and I think there is merit in that approach, whether the club takes on that challenge remains to be seen.

[SonofScray]

Re: Sharp Axes

He should be gone by the end of the day.

Anything less is a failure of the leadership. They are letting us all down.

[1eyedog]

Re: Sharp Axes

Agreed GVGjr. I was on the 'sack Bevo' train after Rounds 1 and 2, but I'm not anymore. Take those two games out and, while not a great season or even a good one, it's not sack the coach territory.

Even when we miss finals (we are not beating Geelong at home and it's now necessary to make finals), I won't be on the sack Bevo train. It takes a lot to reinvent the game from a handball-heavy high press to a more balanced approach with more emphasis on kicking and a properly constructed forward line. Get a few other things right - like the club appears to be trying to do - and we'll be OK.

I'd like this awful season to end though. Our losses are sapping my interest in footy, and our wins are not all that inspiring. We've beaten only Brisbane and Carlton in the 8, and lost games to teams currently ranked 16, 15, 13, 11 and 9. Most of our wins came against teams we played twice and split the wins with (Richmond, Giants, Hawks), Freo (who we beat twice), North, and a couple of good games against Brisbane and Carlton. We're a desperately middle-of-the-road team and we can't even put away those teams lower on the ladder than us with any consistency.

Your post convinced me we need to sack Bevo. Terrible, terrible loses, no top 8 wins and a supporter base that is close to checking out.

[1eyedog]

Re: Sharp Axes

Well here is the thing, the list is of the club's making and it's neither clearly rebuilding like say a Hawthorn or continually topping up following the Geelong model.
In fairness most clubs do what we have been doing but I'd say we've been far more patient with players with marginal talent levels by maintaining them on the playing list for longer than is ideal. As a result of that we are now at the stage with a couple of players like Bailey Smith and Rhylee West who are stalling a bit where we don't have a lot younger talent coming through.
And again in fairness we have invested heavily in Ugle-Hagan and Darcy which has eaten into our early picks currency in recent years which is why we've tried to balance things by endeavoring to strike it rich with slightly more mature state league players which is no guarantee to success and certainly is part of our lack of star players. Losing Dunkley in his prime also weakens our star player levels.

BT suggests we need to do a hard reset for a year and I think there is merit in that approach, whether the club takes on that challenge remains to be seen.

Bevo gets way too close emotionally to the players makes the hard calls harder.

Roarke Smith should have been delisted 2 years ago. Khamis and Sweet have been on the list for FIVE years for a combined total of 20 games.

[ledge]

Re: Sharp Axes

Your post convinced me we need to sack Bevo. Terrible, terrible loses, no top 8 wins and a supporter base that is close to checking out.

Not sure about the supporter base checking out we have record members.

[1eyedog]

Re: Sharp Axes

Not sure about the supporter base checking out we have record members.

Read the room Ledge.

[GVGjr]

Re: Sharp Axes

Bevo gets way too close emotionally to the players makes the hard calls harder.

That's quite true and you can see after making the hard call on Rohan Smith how hard it actually hit him. Multiply that across a tightly knit playing group and it would difficult for him to let go of players who are giving their all.

This is why I believe we need a strong GM of Footy and perhaps he needs to be making the calls more than a very invested coach.

[Mofra]

Re: Sharp Axes

Roarke Smith should have been delisted 2 years ago. Khamis and Sweet have been on the list for FIVE years for a combined total of 20 games.

You'd delist a guy immediately after being one of our best players in a Grand Final? Really?