England v Australia, Fourth Ashes Test, Nottingham

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  • GVGjr
    Moderator
    • Nov 2006
    • 44694

    #91
    Re: England v Australia, Fourth Ashes Test, Nottingham

    Originally posted by lemmon
    Have to start examining Smith's spot at 3 with the way he's been nicking off. It will only ever be exposed when the ball is swinging but that big walk across the crease has got his mind scrambled and lost his off stump. No doubt he'll plunder runs on flat wickets but I don't think anyone is content with thrashing sides at home.

    He's not a natural number 3 but when Clarke goes and he takes the captaincy I think it sends a great message if he bats at first drop. He'll be undoubtedly our best batsman, the only really proven player and captain of what could be a very young side...we're lumping the most pressure on a captain since probably AB and the lad is only 26, at least if he comes in early it gives the opportunity to dictate play before momentum is lost.
    I said at the start of the series that I didn't like Smith at 3 and I believe he is better suited to batting at the number 4 or 5 spot.
    I'm not sure why we were confident that having our most dominate batsman batting at 3 was going to work. Perhaps it was an acknowledgment that we just didn't have a better or more suitable number 3.

    Some of the positives in what has been a poor tour are:
    - Losing Harris at the start of the series hurt us but in the longer term the experience both Starc and Hazlewood gained will be a benefit.
    - We've made the hard call on Watson and I think we have done the same of the grand old warriors in Haddin and Siddle.
    - S.Marsh should now have his card marked and Voges will need a minor miracle to still be in contention for a spot this summer.
    - I think Clarke is now very aware that his time as one of the world best batsman is behind him and he might decide to make this summer in Australia his last.

    We need to look at freshening up this team particularly with batsman who have good techniques and character. We might suffer some additional pain along the way but it needs to happen. It's over to the likes of Burns, Khawaja, Bancroft, Head and Handscomb to prove they have test match quality grit and consistency with their batting.
    It's also time for our selectors to look at the England approach and see what we can follow. How we approach this summer will be a huge statement of if the selectors play it safe or bite the bullet and promote some of our talented youngsters.
    Western Bulldogs Football Club "Where it's cool to drool"

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    • GVGjr
      Moderator
      • Nov 2006
      • 44694

      #92
      Re: England v Australia, Fourth Ashes Test, Nottingham

      Originally posted by ledge
      Maybe it was Hogg or someone in radio giving their view, can't remember.
      I think you would have remembered more clearly if it was said with any conviction. The hosts would have also challenged it if they thought it was a serious comment. Lets chalk this one up to being highly speculative.
      Western Bulldogs Football Club "Where it's cool to drool"

      Comment

      • GVGjr
        Moderator
        • Nov 2006
        • 44694

        #93
        Re: England v Australia, Fourth Ashes Test, Nottingham

        How bad was Smiths shot that cost him his wicket? All he had to do was get through to tea but handed the momentum back to England.
        Western Bulldogs Football Club "Where it's cool to drool"

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        • LostDoggy
          WOOF Member
          • Jan 2007
          • 8307

          #94
          Re: England v Australia, Fourth Ashes Test, Nottingham

          Everyone in the cricket world has Smith a certainty to be our next captain, but some of his displays this series must surely put some doubt over this. Flat track bullies don't make good captains. I like Smith but he still has some developing to do.

          Between England and the summer, Australia have a 2 Test series in Bangladesh, who have improved a lot in recent times and have unearthed a gun teenage quick. Selections for that tour will be very interesting.

          Comment

          • Twodogs
            Moderator
            • Nov 2006
            • 27656

            #95
            Re: England v Australia, Fourth Ashes Test, Nottingham

            Originally posted by GVGjr
            I said at the start of the series that I didn't like Smith at 3 and I believe he is better suited to batting at the number 4 or 5 spot.
            I'm not sure why we were confident that having our most dominate batsman batting at 3 was going to work. Perhaps it was an acknowledgment that we just didn't have a better or more suitable number 3
            Greg Chappell nearly destroyed his career and his place as one of the greats trying to prove he could bat at 3 when he made that long run of ducks. Alan Border rarely batted at 3 but was a great batsmen and a good captain. Mark Taylor was a very good opening batsmen and is the best Australian captain in my life time. Steve Waugh batted in the middle order and was another outstanding captain.

            The whole 'captain must bat at 3' thing went out with Collingwood captains having to wear the #1 jumper.
            They say Burt Lancaster has one, but I don't believe them.

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            • hujsh
              Hall of Fame
              • Nov 2007
              • 11848

              #96
              Re: England v Australia, Fourth Ashes Test, Nottingham

              Originally posted by hujsh
              England were horrible in Australia and we looked a million bucks. Now we're away and playing awful. Clearly if 20/20 is the issue it's affecting both teams who can manage in home conditions but fall apart outside their comfort zones.
              Originally posted by ledge
              Most teams are better at home so I'm not sure how t20has any relevance to that.
              I don't have an opinion either way. Just rebuting that idea that if 20/20 was the issue it's had no impact on England.
              [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

              Comment

              • LostDoggy
                WOOF Member
                • Jan 2007
                • 8307

                #97
                Re: England v Australia, Fourth Ashes Test, Nottingham

                I think T20 has had a big impact on Test cricket of all nations. 20-30 years ago it was really hard work to get a team out inside of 4 or 5 sessions. Now a team surviving 120 overs is the exception rather than the rule. Way more Tests are finished inside of 3 days than ever before.

                England are winning this series because their batting has been mediocre by Test standards whereas Australia's has been abysmal. The only 2 batsmen who have consistently performed have been Joe Root and Chris Rogers.

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                • Bornadog
                  WOOF Clubhouse Leader
                  • Jan 2007
                  • 66809

                  #98
                  Re: England v Australia, Fourth Ashes Test, Nottingham

                  I blame the whole selection process and basically jobs for the boys. Development seems zero and no opportunities given to young players.
                  FFC: Established 1883

                  Premierships: AFL 1954, 2016 VFA - 1898,99,1900, 1908, 1913, 1919-20, 1923-24, VFL: 2014, 2016 . Champions of Victoria 1924. AFLW - 2018.

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                  • FrediKanoute
                    Coaching Staff
                    • Aug 2007
                    • 3834

                    #99
                    Re: England v Australia, Fourth Ashes Test, Nottingham

                    Originally posted by PeanutsPeanuts
                    Everyone in the cricket world has Smith a certainty to be our next captain, but some of his displays this series must surely put some doubt over this. Flat track bullies don't make good captains. I like Smith but he still has some developing to do.

                    Between England and the summer, Australia have a 2 Test series in Bangladesh, who have improved a lot in recent times and have unearthed a gun teenage quick. Selections for that tour will be very interesting.
                    I like Smith. I think he will be a good captain.

                    I think much like Starc, Hazelworth etc, he will learn from this tour. His shot yesterday wasn't that bad, it was a fair catch. Like Steve Waugh, he will go away and work on his technique and the deficiencies that the tour has exposed. If he doesn't it will be a short career.

                    Comment

                    • GVGjr
                      Moderator
                      • Nov 2006
                      • 44694

                      Re: England v Australia, Fourth Ashes Test, Nottingham

                      The Hun is reporting that Clarke will retire and the end of the series. Big news
                      Western Bulldogs Football Club "Where it's cool to drool"

                      Comment

                      • azabob
                        Hall of Fame
                        • Sep 2008
                        • 15328

                        Re: England v Australia, Fourth Ashes Test, Nottingham

                        Originally posted by GVGjr
                        The Hun is reporting that Clarke will retire and the end of the series. Big news
                        Mixed reports coming through.

                        Some outlets saying he is quitting, other outlets are saying he has been pushed.

                        As you say, big news either way.
                        More of an In Bruges guy?

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                        • Remi Moses
                          WOOF Member
                          • Jan 2009
                          • 14785

                          Re: England v Australia, Fourth Ashes Test, Nottingham

                          Originally posted by ledge
                          All countries play t20 so how come it hasn't affected them?
                          They're all woeful .
                          Bar South Africa and the Aussies at home, there are some ordinary teams .

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                          • ledge
                            Hall of Fame
                            • Dec 2007
                            • 14337

                            Re: England v Australia, Fourth Ashes Test, Nottingham

                            Game over
                            Bring back the biff

                            Comment

                            • bulldogtragic
                              The List Manager
                              • Jan 2007
                              • 34289

                              Re: England v Australia, Fourth Ashes Test, Nottingham

                              Originally posted by ledge
                              Game over
                              Surprised it lasted this long.
                              Rocket Science: the epitaph for the Beveridge era - whenever it ends - reading 'Here lies a team that could beat anyone on its day, but seldom did when it mattered most'. 15/7/2023

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                              • Twodogs
                                Moderator
                                • Nov 2006
                                • 27656

                                Re: England v Australia, Fourth Ashes Test, Nottingham

                                Woeful. Let's never talk of it again..
                                They say Burt Lancaster has one, but I don't believe them.

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