Well Ruck Me.

[azabob]

Re: Well Ruck Me.

Did you see my posts on GF night? I wasn't of sound mind.

We were 19 up... I don't know mate it was Jackson that turned it, I just don't know who is out there that makes that difference?

I did see your posts and am glad your back. But gee whiz a decent ruck option who could physically impact the contest would've helped throughout the entire season

[josie]

Re: Well Ruck Me.

Jackson got hold of us and a solid second ruck would have helped but our mids went into cruise mode being 19 points up. I dunno what happend. Arrogance? Assume Bevo sent out a message to hold the lines and slow things up, retain possession etc. but we couldn't even get near it to implement anything. Our best accumulator and clearance player went awol.

It's hard to accept that we were simply 'cooked'. It seemed to be a mental lapse.

And Bont was off ground when they overcame that 3 goal difference!!

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Re: Well Ruck Me.

Max Lynch has requested a trade to hawks.

This is what’s bizarre. Either everyone is rejecting us, we’re strangely not sounding out ruckmen like Max because we don’t rate them or we don’t even want a ruckman. Strange.

[josie]

Re: Well Ruck Me.

Wouldn’t it be just great to nab Goldstein….I’m not sure Martin’s body will hold up any better next year than this but to have two really good rucks only one of whom would play vs teams with excellent rucks like Pies, Dees, whilst other not playing seniors (resting or recovering from injury) with Sweet playing quite a few games & if good enough pushing those two out - this would be ideal.

Then Tim could focus on being a forward with relief ruck later in quarters.

[bulldogtragic]

Re: Well Ruck Me.

Max Lynch has requested a trade to hawks.

This is what’s bizarre. Either everyone is rejecting us, we’re strangely not sounding out ruckmen like Max because we don’t rate them or we don’t even want a ruckman. Strange.

As soon as that gets done, Ceglar gets to Geelong. Fort to Brisbane. Ladhams to Sydney. CCJ & Chol to new homes. Xerri gets to Saints. While Lobb goes back to Freo on huge money for little output. Then the ruck circus is over for 2021. We get to hope no action doesn’t hurt us next year.

[GVGjr]

Re: Well Ruck Me.

Max Lynch has requested a trade to hawks.

This is what’s bizarre. Either everyone is rejecting us, we’re strangely not sounding out ruckmen like Max because we don’t rate them or we don’t even want a ruckman. Strange.

I think we have specific tastes in what we want with our ruck man. We probably should be a bit more flexible but it's no good getting someone in who won't be played or who we regard as a break glass only in an emergency type.

[Scraggers]

Re: Well Ruck Me.

I know the game is changing (getting faster) and the neanderthal ruck (aka Madden) will be a thing of the past, but is the ilk of Max Gawn the way of the future? Like, I wonder if the hybrid ruck is the way forward. I look at how good Tim English is below his knees and his clunking mark ability and wonder if he is the true hybrid ... the Lobb hybrid (as I shall now call it). Is Jackson more the hybrid ruck than the true (gawn) tap ruck. therefor, when Bevo says our ruck will look a lot different in 2022, are we going full hybrid? Bevo has always been strong on players being able to play multiple positions around the ground, does a full hybrid ruck posse lead us this way? I can's see Martin getting much game time next year; I honestly think he now morphs into a ruck coach/player more than a fulltime player.

Just my musings

[azabob]

Re: Well Ruck Me.

I know the game is changing (getting faster) and the neanderthal ruck (aka Madden) will be a thing of the past, but is the ilk of Max Gawn the way of the future? Like, I wonder if the hybrid ruck is the way forward. I look at how good Tim English is below his knees and his clunking mark ability and wonder if he is the true hybrid ... the Lobb hybrid (as I shall now call it). Is Jackson more the hybrid ruck than the true (gawn) tap ruck. therefor, when Bevo says our ruck will look a lot different in 2022, are we going full hybrid? Bevo has always been strong on players being able to play multiple positions around the ground, does a full hybrid ruck posse lead us this way? I can's see Martin getting much game time next year; I honestly think he now morphs into a ruck coach/player more than a fulltime player.

Just my musings

So your suggesting English will lead our ruck next year? If so, I’m not really sure how that is any different to the cluster we’ve seen the last few years.
IMO Lobb is not even at English level.

[Sedat]

Re: Well Ruck Me.

Did you see my posts on GF night? I wasn't of sound mind.

We were 19 up... I don't know mate it was Jackson that turned it, I just don't know who is out there that makes that difference?

Jackson is clearly the best 2nd ruck in the comp. He gives them a significant point of difference to the rest of the competition - unfortunately we found that out the hard way after being able to very effectively nullify their no 1 ruck for 2 and a half qtrs.

[josie]

Re: Well Ruck Me.

Jackson is clearly the best 2nd ruck in the comp. He gives them a significant point of difference to the rest of the competition - unfortunately we found that out the hard way after being able to very effectively nullify their no 1 ruck for 2 and a half qtrs.

How much if this was our mids not being able to close down theirs after they kicked a few goals to catch up with us vs ruck superiority?

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Re: Well Ruck Me.

So assuming we go into 2022 with Sweet, English and Martin, what do we think the rationale behind it would be from those in charge?

From the outside looking in, the ruck situation has been diabolical for 4-5 years. English plays maybe 3-4 decent games in the ruck, but has proven consistently he is what he is - a second ruck. At some point if a player keeps showing you who he is, well... Believe him. In any case, Martin is a year older and it's hard to understand how or why we'd rely on him at all. I actually like Sweet and think he has ability but didn't we offer him a 1 year rookie deal prior to the one we just gave him a few days ago? If so, it says to me we were unsure and certainly did not rate him that highly.

Does the club really believe English is ready and that Sweet and Martin are adequate support at different ends of the experience spectrum?

I'm not sure what to think with this one. The other part of me says that we didn't lose the GF because of the rucks, it was our mids. We also were largely top or second for the whole year... So maybe the club is putting more emphasis on that rather than who's actually rucking? I can see the point and agree to an extent, but I'm not sure how we could possibly have faith in Martin and Sweet given one's age/injury history in recent years and the other's lack of experience.

I know some have raised points about us only liking a certain type of ruck, but when you're going into finals with Lewis Young as your first ruck and then trade him anyway, that seems pretty desperate and worth picking up SOMEBODY - Ceglar, Lynch, Ladhams, ANYBODY.

Hopefully the club is quizzed on this in a few days time, it'll be interesting listening and even more so if/when we have games where the opposition rucks dominate us again next year.

[WBFC4FFC]

Re: Well Ruck Me.

Maybe I read it here on this thread. I don't have the inclination to go back and find it given we are on the 75th page but is it correct that the Club has spoken to English and told him to bulk-up for 2022, as he will be the main Ruckman?

[soupman]

Re: Well Ruck Me.

Just to be clear the arguments "we cannot secure a good enough ruckman to stop that 5 minute patch in the Grand Final that was on our mids anyway" and "we finished top 2 (well 5th but we were basically top 2) without one so why should we go all out to get one" are no where near as strong as they are being made out to be.

The fact we were so good despite no ruck is not an argument for saying we don't need one. We have desperately needed a competent ruck since Tom Boyd opted out and the moment we decided Trengove was only to be allocated a Footscray jumper.

It is our biggest weakness by a mile, which is incredible considering our key defender brigade is 75% Ryan Gardner, Zaine Cordy and Tim O'Brien.

I am all for being optimistic and stuff (and still am for the most part) but going into next year with somehow a worse ruck division is not something that should be spun into an "aw shucks I'm sure we tried".

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Re: Well Ruck Me.

Just to be clear the arguments "we cannot secure a good enough ruckman to stop that 5 minute patch in the Grand Final that was on our mids anyway" and "we finished top 2 (well 5th but we were basically top 2) without one so why should we go all out to get one" are no where near as strong as they are being made out to be.

The fact we were so good despite no ruck is not an argument for saying we don't need one. We have desperately needed a competent ruck since Tom Boyd opted out and the moment we decided Trengove was only to be allocated a Footscray jumper.

It is our biggest weakness by a mile, which is incredible considering our key defender brigade is 75% Ryan Gardner, Zaine Cordy and Tim O'Brien.

I am all for being optimistic and stuff (and still am for the most part) but going into next year with somehow a worse ruck division is not something that should be spun into an "aw shucks I'm sure we tried".

For the record soup, I totally agree and I have been questioning our strategy around this since around 2018ish.

I'm just trying to understand what our club must be thinking.

[bulldogtragic]

Re: Well Ruck Me.

Feels like going on a tour to India

Test 1: Beaten with a junior spinner
Test 2: Same
Test 3: Competitive, but lost in the final session when their spinners cut us up
Gap: Do we fly out a new and experienced spinner or stay with the young spinners and guy who can’t stay fit. No we don’t need one. Send the part timer back to Carlton.
Test 4: Since there’s no other spinner we like, that spins it to our specific satisfaction, go into the test hoping our quicks cover for our sub standard spinner and hope our batsmen aren’t put to the sword by their spinner/s

If we can’t have Shane Warne or Nathan Lyon, what’s the point right. Maybe we can drop the spinner for an All Rounder that averages 15 with the bat and 42 with the ball with gentle medium pacers.

No Border-Gavaskar Trophy.