Honest reflection and the path forward

[jeemak]

Re: Honest reflection and the path forward

I'm not sure that we all agree though because typically during the trade period there is a strong push back when it's pointed out we should be linked to KPP or ruckman. Even suggesting we needed a short term replacement for the Bruce injury wasn't regarded as a priority.
Once the season starts and gaps in the depth of those key positions starts to appear the conversation moves towards that the list is lacking.

Bevo the coach is not the problem and while Clarkson say's he's not tactically great Clarko did what he could to undermine the way we used the 3rd man up tactic early in Bevo's coaching career that caught many clubs by surprise.

We are under performing to the quality of our list and that is on the club not just Bevo to sort out what we need to do to right the ship.

I don't think anyone would disagree that we lack a better key defender than Gardner, at least one quality mid-sized forward and a second ruck who Bevo would actually play. But I don't read as many posts as you do so maybe I'm off the mark.

Who said who isn't tactically great?

[jeemak]

Re: Honest reflection and the path forward

What are our tactics?

+1, get it in, keep it in, turnover or kick point and get scored against.

I rate Bevo too but he needs some experienced outside voices.
In my job my work is constantly reviewed by peers and it makes me better. If I insulate I make the same mistakes over and over.
I'd love an experienced senior assistant to come in from another system. Boyd would be perfect.

We definitely need to bolster our assistant stocks.

[Grantysghost]

Re: Honest reflection and the path forward

I'm not sure that we all agree though because typically during the trade period there is a strong push back when it's pointed out we should be linked to KPP or ruckman. Even suggesting we needed a short term replacement for the Bruce injury wasn't regarded as a priority.
Once the season starts and gaps in the depth of those key positions starts to appear the conversation moves towards that the list is lacking.

Bevo the coach is not the problem and while Clarkson say's he's not tactically great Clarko did what he could to undermine the way we used the 3rd man up tactic early in Bevo's coaching career that caught many clubs by surprise.

We are under performing to the quality of our list and that is on the club not just Bevo to sort out what we need to do to right the ship.

Damn you GVG - you've almost swayed me to Levi.

He would've been useful structurally last night.

[GVGjr]

Re: Honest reflection and the path forward

I don't think anyone would disagree that we lack a better key defender than Gardner, at least one quality mid-sized forward and a second ruck who Bevo would actually play. But I don't read as many posts as you do so maybe I'm off the mark.

Who said who isn't tactically great?

Clarko doesn't believe Bevo is great tactically.

[jeemak]

Re: Honest reflection and the path forward

Clarko doesn't believe Bevo is great tactically.

When did he say that? Odd that he would target him specifically to pull him back into the AFL.

[GVGjr]

Re: Honest reflection and the path forward

When did he say that? Odd that he would target him specifically to pull him back into the AFL.

My mistake, I have misread something else. Please ignore.

[jeemak]

Re: Honest reflection and the path forward

My mistake, I have misread something else. Please ignore.

Bloody hell. Get your act together.

Now I want to know what you misread!!!

[Bulldog4life]

Re: Honest reflection and the path forward

Bit of a throw away line, but I'd love Clarkson.

I really don't rate Bevo tactically. Amazing motivator, poor tactically. The amount of times our supposed contending list gets outplayed / outcoached is ridiculous.

Clarko was on a million plus at the Hawks. Could we afford him in our soft cap?

[Bornadog]

Re: Honest reflection and the path forward

Clarko was on a million plus at the Hawks. Could we afford him in our soft cap?

From some insiders at Hawks, Clarko was dubbed as stubborn and would not change many things.

I think alot of his success was having guys like Bevo, Simpson, Fagan as assistants, having some great players in Buddy, Roughead, plus a top midfield with Lewis, Mitchell and many other great players like Hodge. He no doubt brought all these guys together through good management.

However, the idea of changing coach who has been so successful to date is just not on.

[jeemak]

Re: Honest reflection and the path forward

Just for shits and giggles, I thought I'd post the Hawthorn 2014 premiership side to show what Clarko was working with vs. what we have been (2014 purely chosen on the back of it being the middle year of three premiership years):

B: 6 Josh Gibson 17 Brian Lake 14 Grant Birchall
HB: 27 Matthew Spangher 24 Ben Stratton 15 Luke Hodge (c)
C: 3 Jordan Lewis 5 Sam Mitchell 16 Isaac Smith
HF: 22 Luke Breust 19 Jack Gunston 33 Cyril Rioli
F: 7 Ben McEvoy 2 Jarryd Roughead 28 Paul Puopolo
Foll: 20 David Hale 26 Liam Shiels 9 Shaun Burgoyne
Int: 4 Matt Suckling 10 Bradley Hill 29 Will Langford
8 Taylor Duryea (sub)

The battlers in Lanford and Duryea were both ordinary at that stage of their careers, whilst the former didn't really do much. But just take a look at the quality across the ground and the balance across the ground.

Yes, it took winning a flag to make some of these players better than battler level, like Spangher but he was better then as depth than what we have right now.

Either way, it's chalk and cheese compared to what we took to the last game of the season in 2021, and the lack of respect Bevo gets is alarming in this context.

I mean, how's the back three? How's the forward six? If Bevo has too much say in who we put on the list and it's all his fault then absolutely, we need to do something about it. But for the cattle we had it was an extraordinary effort to get a game together that could compete:

B: 10 Easton Wood 42 Alex Keath 34 Bailey Williams
HB: 35 Caleb Daniel 12 Zaine Cordy 31 Bailey Dale
C: 6 Bailey Smith 21 Tom Liberatore 7 Lachie Hunter
HF: 19 Cody Weightman 33 Aaron Naughton 1 Adam Treloar
F: 13 Josh Schache 44 Tim English 29 Mitch Hannan
Foll: 8 Stefan Martin 11 Jack Macrae 4 Marcus Bontempelli
Int: 39 Jason Johannisen 5 Josh Dunkley 15 Taylor Duryea
37 Roarke Smith 23 Laitham Vandermeer (medi-sub)

True, you can only play against what's in front of you, but Jesus, the difference is stark. I'm not in the mood to post what we put on the park last night, given the improvements are really peripheral.

[jeemak]

Re: Honest reflection and the path forward

And by posting that I'm not saying Clarko isn't a gun. Just showing the difference between a balanced side and what our side was/ is.

[G-Mo77]

Re: Honest reflection and the path forward

Spangher, so close enough. Don't think he'd coached before? Was in an operations role at Collingwood.

Don't worry GG, I know exactly who our forward line coach is, I'd rather have the work experience kid to be honest.

No coaching experience at all and is one of our senior assistants? Good lord!!! It's no surprise that our forward half just has no direction.

[Hotdog60]

Re: Honest reflection and the path forward

I wonder how Rocket would go as senior assistant. Bevo would be safe on the boundary and never go in the box.
In seriousness if Rocket was happy playing second fiddle and Bevo was coaching from the bench to keep the players on the ball I reckon it would be a good coaching combo.

[Grantysghost]

Re: Honest reflection and the path forward

Don't worry GG, I know exactly who our forward line coach is, I'd rather have the work experience kid to be honest.

No coaching experience at all and is one of our senior assistants? Good lord!!! It's no surprise that our forward half just has no direction.

Ah I missed the sarcasm!

It does reek of jobs for the boys doesn't it. I guess people have to start somewhere but id hope he's at least got his accreditation.

Edit: Doesn't appear to have his levels, it's mainly business training and sports operations.

[Grantysghost]

Re: Honest reflection and the path forward

I wonder how Rocket would go as senior assistant. Bevo would be safe on the boundary and never go in the box.
In seriousness if Rocket was happy playing second fiddle and Bevo was coaching from the bench to keep the players on the ball I reckon it would be a good coaching combo.

You get the sense that unless Grant employs one it won't happen.