WB Game Day V Sydney Swans R18 2023 Thu 13/7, 7:20PM - SCG

[Bigdog]

Re: WB Game Day V Sydney Swans R18 2023 Thu 13/7, 7:20PM - SCG

VDM is 5 games into a new role and doing quite well. JODs only played around 10 games of footy since he was 15, he looks a gun at vfl level. I think both loco down best 22 spots for a long time.

Garcia shows a lot and has been picked when fit this year. I think he can have a career (not sure about 200 games).

jury is still out on West and Poulter. However west has equipped himself better than I expected the last couple of weeks, we also forget he had an interrupted pre season. I just haven’t seen enough of Poulter

I don’t think McNeil will get to 200 games as he just isn’t a 1 touch clean footy player. I think he can have cameos though.

[Grantysghost]

Re: WB Game Day V Sydney Swans R18 2023 Thu 13/7, 7:20PM - SCG

Can you imagine if we didn't have Bont?

I noticed he threw his mouth guard to the ground in anger at the siren.

This one hurt.

[lemmon]

Re: WB Game Day V Sydney Swans R18 2023 Thu 13/7, 7:20PM - SCG

Maybe I'm harsh but Dale's output has dropped significantly since 2021.
His numbers maybe the same but gut feel is his kicking is now suspect and his decision making and dare isn't what it was.
Symbolic of our team bare a few really.

Absolutely agree. I think there's a level of 'I am the designated kicker, I must make this hurt' when he gets the footy and has the ground in front of him. There's some paralysis to his decision making and he'll either try to make the impossible work, or miss a target he should hit 100% of the time. He was far more direct in 2021.

If we're being honest, the game should've been done when Dale lost himself from the kick-out and ran too fat. Not sure how Hayward didn't make us pay.

[angelopetraglia]

Re: WB Game Day V Sydney Swans R18 2023 Thu 13/7, 7:20PM - SCG

Absolutely agree. I think there's a level of 'I am the designated kicker, I must make this hurt' when he gets the footy and has the ground in front of him. There's some paralysis to his decision making and he'll either try to make the impossible work, or miss a target he should hit 100% of the time. He was far more direct in 2021.

If we're being honest, the game should've been done when Dale lost himself from the kick-out and ran too fat. Not sure how Hayward didn't make us pay.

Do you think Caleb going into the middle has impacted his form as well? All the opposition attention is on him.

[lemmon]

Re: WB Game Day V Sydney Swans R18 2023 Thu 13/7, 7:20PM - SCG

Do you think Caleb going into the middle has impacted his form as well? All the opposition attention is on him.

Potentially, but I do think it's the decisions he's making more than anything else. Losing Caleb from the back 6 has been offset with Richards and JJ playing back there when fit, and we've tried Laith back to offer some extra running support as well. On paper, we had some pretty good half back/running defenders on the field last night.

Dale's still finding the footy and getting himself in a decent amount of space - it all just seems a bit complicated when he's trying to pick a target (which may very well be because of what's happening ahead of him too).

[ledge]

Re: WB Game Day V Sydney Swans R18 2023 Thu 13/7, 7:20PM - SCG

I thought the last 3 weeks we have finally got our forward line functioning , none of the forwards are going for the same ball and are spreading to different parts of the ground.
This is allowing different forwards to kick multiple goals in different games . Sharing the load.

Our now see our problems are
1. We stop running and attacking our forward line from half back and go into some sort of defensive mode half way into the second qtr . No idea why this happens.
2 When we do go forward and don’t hit a target the opposition just cruise through and kick goals, perfect example last night was a Papley goal .. and it happens every game . Why do we not have a backman staying between opposition goal and the last forward ?
It is renowned for happening when wr kick points too .
Liam Jones is a huge loss, he reads the ball and intercepts, have we got no one else with even half that ability ?
I want to see Busslinger in and see how he goes about it with Jones missing.
We did miss Darcy and O’Donnell more than we think though. I would say they would have come over the top and stopped Buddy competing.

[Bullies]

Re: WB Game Day V Sydney Swans R18 2023 Thu 13/7, 7:20PM - SCG

I thought the last 3 weeks we have finally got our forward line functioning , none of the forwards are going for the same ball and are spreading to different parts of the ground.
This is allowing different forwards to kick multiple goals in different games . Sharing the load.

Our now see our problems are
1. We stop running and attacking our forward line from half back and go into some sort of defensive mode half way into the second qtr . No idea why this happens.
2 When we do go forward and don’t hit a target the opposition just cruise through and kick goals, perfect example last night was a Papley goal .. and it happens every game . Why do we not have a backman staying between opposition goal and the last forward ?
It is renowned for happening when wr kick points too .
Liam Jones is a huge loss, he reads the ball and intercepts, have we got no one else with even half that ability ?
I want to see Busslinger in and see how he goes about it with Jones missing.
We did miss Darcy and O’Donnell more than we think though. I would say they would have come over the top and stopped Buddy competing.

I think we missed Lobbe. It resulted in Marra getting McCartin one of the closest checking backmen in the game. Due to his height McCartin more than likely would have gone to Lobb. Marra has been used to getting the third best defender each week.

[Boots]

Re: WB Game Day V Sydney Swans R18 2023 Thu 13/7, 7:20PM - SCG

I think at this point, my take on this game, and the position of the team, and our season, is this:

Good teams don't lose as many close games as we do.

It's the only way to articulate the tension between the apparently contradictory positions of "but our list is amazing" and "we're a middle of the table team at best".

We DO have insane talent, a good list, players for every position. We have a good coach. We have every ingredient EXCEPT that missing X factor that teams like Sydney, Geelong, Collingwood, Brisbane, and Melbourne have in droves: the almost fanatical drive to keep playing hard regardless of the stakes or the potential outcome, in every game.

I have zero idea how you get that mindset into a team's collective head, and god it's annoying to watch a team without it.

[angelopetraglia]

Re: WB Game Day V Sydney Swans R18 2023 Thu 13/7, 7:20PM - SCG

I think at this point, my take on this game, and the position of the team, and our season, is this:

Good teams don't lose as many close games as we do.

It's the only way to articulate the tension between the apparently contradictory positions of "but our list is amazing" and "we're a middle of the table team at best".

We DO have insane talent, a good list, players for every position. We have a good coach. We have every ingredient EXCEPT that missing X factor that teams like Sydney, Geelong, Collingwood, Brisbane, and Melbourne have in droves: the almost fanatical drive to keep playing hard regardless of the stakes or the potential outcome, in every game.

I have zero idea how you get that mindset into a team's collective head, and god it's annoying to watch a team without it.

We beat the Lions in a close game in Round #3 (blew out to 14 late)

We beat the Tigers by 5 points in Round #4

We beat the Blues by 20 points when they hit the lead late in the game in Round #9

So this season. Games decided by 20 points or less.

We are 4-5. However, we have lost the last three games decided by two goals or less. That is what is really hurting us now. But over the season you can't say we lose the close games. We are basically 50/50.

[angelopetraglia]

Re: WB Game Day V Sydney Swans R18 2023 Thu 13/7, 7:20PM - SCG

Further on close games. Games decided by 12 points or less.

In 2022. We were 2-2.

In 2021. We were 2-2.

In 2020. We were 2-2.

In 2019. We were 2-2.

So on the stats available I would say we are neither good or bad at close games. We are AVERAGE!!!!!!

[Boots]

Re: WB Game Day V Sydney Swans R18 2023 Thu 13/7, 7:20PM - SCG

So on the stats available I would say we are neither good or bad at close games. We are AVERAGE!!!!!!

Angelo I think we are in furious agreement - I didn't say we were bad or good at close games, just that good teams win more of them than we do.

Thank you though for adding stats to my hunch.

[angelopetraglia]

Re: WB Game Day V Sydney Swans R18 2023 Thu 13/7, 7:20PM - SCG

Angelo I think we are in furious agreement - I didn't say we were bad or good at close games, just that good teams win more of them than we do.

Thank you though for adding stats to my hunch.

Thanks. For the record last year the Cats were 4 wins and 3 losses in games decided by 12 points or less. In 2017 Richmond were 1 win 4 and losses in games decided by 12 points or less.

Outside of the Pies recent miraculous run, it normally averages out. There is a lot of luck involved in close games. Sometimes the footy gods are with you. Sometimes they dessert you.

[angelopetraglia]

Re: WB Game Day V Sydney Swans R18 2023 Thu 13/7, 7:20PM - SCG

Also for the record.

In the Bevo era. There has been 50 games decided by 12 points or less. So one in four games finishes that way.

We are 27 wins and 23 losses over the journey for what it is worth.

Averaging losing margin is 29 points. Average winning margin is 31 points.

[JanLorMill]

Re: WB Game Day V Sydney Swans R18 2023 Thu 13/7, 7:20PM - SCG

I think we missed Lobbe. It resulted in Marra getting McCartin one of the closest checking backmen in the game. Due to his height McCartin more than likely would have gone to Lobb. Marra has been used to getting the third best defender each week.

We were too tall already for the scg. Darcy going off was a blessing in disguise.

[Bornadog]

Re: WB Game Day V Sydney Swans R18 2023 Thu 13/7, 7:20PM - SCG

We were too tall already for the scg. Darcy going off was a blessing in disguise.

But that meant Tim had to ruck with no rest and was stuffed. He couldn't float back into defense and take marks.