Liam Jones's Improvement

[ledge]

Re: Liam Jones's Improvement

Grant was a great kick in the begining but if i remember rightly he went to the backline (because we needed him everywhere) and after he came back he was a shocking kick.

[GVGjr]

Re: Liam Jones's Improvement

Back to Liam jones, watching the replay I was very impressed not just by his marking, which is a strength of his, but did anyone notice the quick hands. I think 3 times lovely handballs from him were part of a chain that led to goals, including the great passage which led to Cooney's gem.

I can't wait to see him next year, he is really blossoming.

[LostDoggy]

Re: Liam Jones's Improvement

The biggest plus for Jones is his ability to read the ball in the air and time his jump so he can get both hands cleanly to the ball and still have good body positioning so he lands on two feet , and that once he has marked he still keeps his field vision to see if he can keep the momentum of the play with a quick handpass , and if thats not on he doesn,t take too long to pick a target to cleanly pass to , I,m not sure on the stats of how many times he has kicked or handpassed backwards but I,m sure it would be very low , against Carlton he didn,t make a tackle but his zone pressure and harassment was very good , he may have a few flaws ( goalkicking ) but there is a future for the lad , I do like the cut of his jib

.

[ledge]

Re: Liam Jones's Improvement

I watched him at Willy the other week and he was giving instructions during the game, looks to have a good mature football brain as well as talent.

[westbulldog]

Re: Liam Jones's Improvement

I think he is improving with every game. I don't underestimate his huge potential irrespective of who else plays in the forward line.

[1eyedog]

Re: Liam Jones's Improvement

Grant was a very good 1 on 1 mark, but he didn't take a lot of pack marks... Well I don't remember him doing so.

Fair enough. My recollection of him, particularly between the period 92-97 was a young bull who used to charge out of the forward line at 100 mph and jump high into packs taking big contested chest marks. He took a number of these so to me that would make him a fairly handy pack mark. I haven't seen Liam doing anything like Grant used to do, not yet anyway but the signs are promising...

[Raw Toast]

Re: Liam Jones's Improvement

Thanks for the thread CD, Jones has really impressed me the last couple of weeks.

I think the trial of him as a second ruck has really helped him, as he's started touching the ball a bit more and is going for his marks with much more confidence - most of us had heard stories from training that were testament to his contested marking potential, but maybe he needed to get his positioning (and associated skills) better for this level. He's also been able to outmark opposing ruckman which can be easier than outmarking defenders (many current rucks tend to struggle to defend well in one-on-one marking contests).

What do others think about Jones as a semi-longterm 2nd ruck/forward option? I'm hopeful but have only seen the last two games on TV. He's been pretty good when the ball hits the ground which is promising.

My quick perspective on a couple of other point:

Chris Grant was an excellent field kick pretty much all of his career, but did get the yips in front of goal for significant periods. Jones is often a very good field kick - he has made some beautiful passes along with some shockers this year.

Grant took some amazing pack marks, but tended to get most of his touches (as a forward) from leading and reading the play - death by a thousands cuts was more his style as opposed to Carey's aerial dominance.

Back to Liam jones, watching the replay I was very impressed not just by his marking, which is a strength of his, but did anyone notice the quick hands. I think 3 times lovely handballs from him were part of a chain that led to goals, including the great passage which led to Cooney's gem.

I can't wait to see him next year, he is really blossoming.

Completely agree r54. Jones' has shown excellent hands and has been valuable when the ball has hit the deck which certainly surprised me - it's part of why I think he might be able to help us out as the makeshift 2nd ruck for at least awhile.

[stefoid]

Re: Liam Jones's Improvement

He looks better and better as each week passes. As for the comment about Grant, has anyone seriously suggested he has the build to be our major tall forward? He's a third tall with an edge in pace and should be developed as such.

Grant = FF for mine.

[jeemak]

Re: Liam Jones's Improvement

Grant = FF for mine.

Agree, Grant will be a leading FF and will take the odd hanger when we manage to get the jump on any pressing over defenders who attempt to block his leading space. Over time I think his real asset will be in confusing defenders through an ability to lead towards it or jump all over them. But FF is his go.

We were extremely Hall conscious last year, for a couple of reasons. Firstly, he was a presence we hadn't had since all of the players kicking the ball forward had been at the club. He wasn't a risky option. Secondly, our forward structure suffered badly when Johnson, Hahn and Akermanis weren't playing consistently, let alone consistently well and were replace by very innexperienced players.

There's a spot for all of Jones, Hall and Grant in the one forward line, as each has attributes that require solid defence to quell meaning they will stretch any defence. With Hall coming in to some form, it would be disappointing if we over rely on him for the rest of the year and ignore Jones and Grant. They should have, to this point, had enough strategy training put in to them to ensure they present at different times and in different positions, and our midfield should be capable of understanding this rather than take the easy option of kicking to Hall.

With continuity gained through playing together, these three should present a lot of headaches for opposition over the coming weeks. And with some quick pressure players at their feet, in Dahlhaus and Hooper, complemented by the class of Gia we have an unpredictable, pressuring and dangerous forward line all of a sudden.

[Remi Moses]

Re: Liam Jones's Improvement

Coming along nicely. His efforts and his good hands are a feature, his kicking needs work.
With his field kicking he tends to lean back and off one step spray them.

[chef]

Re: Liam Jones's Improvement

Fair enough. My recollection of him, particularly between the period 92-97 was a young bull who used to charge out of the forward line at 100 mph and jump high into packs taking big contested chest marks. He took a number of these so to me that would make him a fairly handy pack mark. I haven't seen Liam doing anything like Grant used to do, not yet anyway but the signs are promising...

That's what I remember too. I used to be amazed by how he would still take the ball on his chest while smashing through or going over a pack.

Liam is a more arms outstretched kind of mark.

[1eyedog]

Re: Liam Jones's Improvement

Thanks for the thread CD, Jones has really impressed me the last couple of weeks.

I think the trial of him as a second ruck has really helped him, as he's started touching the ball a bit more and is going for his marks with much more confidence - most of us had heard stories from training that were testament to his contested marking potential, but maybe he needed to get his positioning (and associated skills) better for this level. He's also been able to outmark opposing ruckman which can be easier than outmarking defenders (many current rucks tend to struggle to defend well in one-on-one marking contests).

What do others think about Jones as a semi-longterm 2nd ruck/forward option? I'm hopeful but have only seen the last two games on TV. He's been pretty good when the ball hits the ground which is promising.

My quick perspective on a couple of other point:

Chris Grant was an excellent field kick pretty much all of his career, but did get the yips in front of goal for significant periods. Jones is often a very good field kick - he has made some beautiful passes along with some shockers this year.

Grant took some amazing pack marks, but tended to get most of his touches (as a forward) from leading and reading the play - death by a thousands cuts was more his style as opposed to Carey's aerial dominance.



Completely agree r54. Jones' has shown excellent hands and has been valuable when the ball has hit the deck which certainly surprised me - it's part of why I think he might be able to help us out as the makeshift 2nd ruck for at least awhile.

I don't want to break him too early. I would hope that we could afford to play someone like a Minson/Roughhead or a Roughhead/Cordy combination post-Hudson because Roughead is versatile and mobile enough to go forward. If this is possible there is no need for Jones to ruck. I don't think he gives us a lot in the ruck-he's simply not a ruckman-it's more through necessity that he's been doing it.

[1eyedog]

Re: Liam Jones's Improvement

Agree, Grant will be a leading FF and will take the odd hanger when we manage to get the jump on any pressing over defenders who attempt to block his leading space. Over time I think his real asset will be in confusing defenders through an ability to lead towards it or jump all over them. But FF is his go.

We were extremely Hall conscious last year, for a couple of reasons. Firstly, he was a presence we hadn't had since all of the players kicking the ball forward had been at the club. He wasn't a risky option. Secondly, our forward structure suffered badly when Johnson, Hahn and Akermanis weren't playing consistently, let alone consistently well and were replace by very innexperienced players.

There's a spot for all of Jones, Hall and Grant in the one forward line, as each has attributes that require solid defence to quell meaning they will stretch any defence. With Hall coming in to some form, it would be disappointing if we over rely on him for the rest of the year and ignore Jones and Grant. They should have, to this point, had enough strategy training put in to them to ensure they present at different times and in different positions, and our midfield should be capable of understanding this rather than take the easy option of kicking to Hall.

With continuity gained through playing together, these three should present a lot of headaches for opposition over the coming weeks. And with some quick pressure players at their feet, in Dahlhaus and Hooper, complemented by the class of Gia we have an unpredictable, pressuring and dangerous forward line all of a sudden.

How good is that and a very promising forward set up come finals!

[LostDoggy]

Re: Liam Jones's Improvement

It's been great to see this young man growing in confidence and I agree with those that have suggested that continuing to play him and not drop him back to Williamstown can only help. I look forward to watching him for many years to come!

[GVGjr]

Re: Liam Jones's Improvement

The 'great man' himself (Chris Grant) has compared Jones to an Earl Spalding type. Not to ever disagree with the great one, but wasn't Spalding a workhorse toiler type? There is something more naturally gifted about Liam, I think. As for marking, he doesn't perhaps do brute attacks on the footy a la Brown or Carey but has lovely touch and feel for the footy. Martin Flanagan once described Chris Grant beautifully as 'the boy with the solemn hands.' Liam has a bit of that about him too. Will enjoy watching his progress.