Forward line 2012

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  • Greystache
    Bulldog Team of the Century
    • Dec 2009
    • 9775

    #61
    Re: Forward line 2012

    Originally posted by HKB
    I think you underrate Libbers kicking. Tom has a neat left foot thats better than average. IIRC, Libber won the Nathan Buckley kicking test at the draft camp.

    I agree Wallis is an accumulater but I think his kicking is better than Cross. He should be targetting a Watson or Mitchell type level. Neither of whom are great kicks but not seen as a weakness (only recently in Jobes case). I very much like the Watson comparison actually. Came as a highly touted Father-Son, did not meet initial expectations due to kicking and speed, now ripping it up as captain and their key mid. Hope Wallis follows the same path.
    I'm not underating Libba's kicking. I'm actually using him as an example of how a player who's not a penetrating kick can still be a damaging player by foot. His hitting up of leading forwards last year was excellent
    [COLOR="#FF0000"][B]Western Bulldogs:[/B][/COLOR] [COLOR="#0000CD"][B]We exist to win premierships[/B][/COLOR]

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    • jeemak
      Bulldog Legend
      • Oct 2010
      • 21843

      #62
      Re: Forward line 2012

      Originally posted by HKB
      I think you underrate Libbers kicking. Tom has a neat left foot thats better than average. IIRC, Libber won the Nathan Buckley kicking test at the draft camp.

      I agree Wallis is an accumulater but I think his kicking is better than Cross. He should be targetting a Watson or Mitchell type level. Neither of whom are great kicks but not seen as a weakness (only recently in Jobes case). I very much like the Watson comparison actually. Came as a highly touted Father-Son, did not meet initial expectations due to kicking and speed, now ripping it up as captain and their key mid. Hope Wallis follows the same path.
      If Wallis could get to a Mitchell standard on both sides then we'd have to be pretty happy with that.

      I don't think we have too much to worry about with Wallis though. Some players, as other posters have stated, don't have clear attributes that assist them adjusting to AFL level immediately. Wallis will just have to work his bum off, kind of like Matthew Boyd who ended up going ok throughout his career.
      TF is this?.........Obviously you're not a golfer.

      Comment

      • LostDoggy
        WOOF Member
        • Jan 2007
        • 8307

        #63
        Re: Forward line 2012

        Originally posted by jeemak
        If Wallis could get to a Mitchell standard on both sides then we'd have to be pretty happy with that.

        I don't think we have too much to worry about with Wallis though. Some players, as other posters have stated, don't have clear attributes that assist them adjusting to AFL level immediately. Wallis will just have to work his bum off, kind of like Matthew Boyd who ended up going ok throughout his career.
        Boydy cost us a rookie pick. Him turning out to be elite was a bonus. Wallis was a first-rounder. If he doesn't turn out to be elite (or close to it) it would be a disappointment. Having said that, I'm with you in being pretty confident that he'll make it: attitude seemed to be the main deterrent to his development in his first year, but he should settle down and start learning better this year. He already has a fantastic footy brain, which is his stand-out attribute, once he gets used to the game at senior level he'll start becoming pretty influential. He's been compared to Jobe Watson on this thread, but I think Libba is more Watson, and Wallis actually has more of a James Hird vibe about him (another player who didn't have any stand-out physical attributes other than a natural understanding of the game), once he builds his tank and starts taking responsibility for the outcome of games.

        Re: Murph, he's a defender who will be swung forward at times for the rest of his career. He has 3-5 years left playing that role (at an elite level, mind you), he'll be retired with bung knees by the end of next year playing exclusively as a forward.

        Comment

        • Missing Dog
          WOOF Member
          • Jan 2007
          • 8501

          #64
          Re: Forward line 2012

          I haven't heard about any attitude issues with Wallis previously Lantern, if anything I was led to believe he had a good attitude as was shown with the way he attacked his 1st preseason by pushing many more senior players.

          What was wrong with his attitude?

          Comment

          • Desipura
            WOOF Member
            • Mar 2008
            • 4344

            #65
            Re: Forward line 2012

            Originally posted by Swoop
            I haven't heard about any attitude issues with Wallis previously Lantern, if anything I was led to believe he had a good attitude as was shown with the way he attacked his 1st preseason by pushing many more senior players.

            What was wrong with his attitude?
            Im hearing he has a great attitude.

            Comment

            • LostDoggy
              WOOF Member
              • Jan 2007
              • 8307

              #66
              Re: Forward line 2012

              Oh im just going off stuff said here on woof that he did have a bit of a big head upon joining, did find the step up a big one and probably expected to be given games or some such. Apologies if this is all wrong... like i said, it just sounded like first year blues that was never going to be a huge problem long term.

              Comment

              • The Bulldogs Bite
                Hall of Fame
                • Dec 2006
                • 11270

                #67
                Re: Forward line 2012

                Originally posted by Lantern
                Oh im just going off stuff said here on woof that he did have a bit of a big head upon joining, did find the step up a big one and probably expected to be given games or some such. Apologies if this is all wrong... like i said, it just sounded like first year blues that was never going to be a huge problem long term.
                I recall hearing that too.

                My issue with Wallis is that he doesn't use the ball well at all -- even under no pressure he misses targets -- and I've seen him fumble too much for my liking.

                Not writing him off, but I am far from convinced.
                W00F!

                Comment

                • Bornadog
                  WOOF Clubhouse Leader
                  • Jan 2007
                  • 66840

                  #68
                  Re: Forward line 2012

                  Originally posted by The Bulldogs Bite
                  I recall hearing that too.

                  My issue with Wallis is that he doesn't use the ball well at all -- even under no pressure he misses targets -- and I've seen him fumble too much for my liking.

                  Not writing him off, but I am far from convinced.
                  19 years old, plenty of time to come to terms with the pace of the game.
                  FFC: Established 1883

                  Premierships: AFL 1954, 2016 VFA - 1898,99,1900, 1908, 1913, 1919-20, 1923-24, VFL: 2014, 2016 . Champions of Victoria 1924. AFLW - 2018.

                  Comment

                  • KT31
                    Bulldog Team of the Century
                    • Jul 2008
                    • 5454

                    #69
                    Re: Forward line 2012

                    Originally posted by The Bulldogs Bite
                    I recall hearing that too.

                    My issue with Wallis is that he doesn't use the ball well at all -- even under no pressure he misses targets -- and I've seen him fumble too much for my liking.

                    Not writing him off, but I am far from convinced.
                    Wallis seems keen to improve from all reports and like mentioned previously, hopefully a case of first year expectations.(his and ours)
                    If we have a game plan that protects the ball carrier, giving them more time and confidence then Wallis and all players will have to improve with disposal.
                    It's better to die on our feet than live on our knees.

                    Comment

                    • F'scary
                      WOOF Member
                      • Dec 2011
                      • 4089

                      #70
                      Re: Forward line 2012

                      Good thread! Tried a reply once, not sure what happened so here I am rewriting my original.

                      Re Libba Jnr’s kicking: I agree with HKB, he’s a good penetrating kick. Greystache’s point about how he showed ability in hitting up targets is also correct imo. Actually, one of the things I liked best about him is that he appears to like to kick the ball which I think is good as we have a few players who look to handball first as it is.

                      Re Wallis Jnr: I think he looked pretty good for a first year player. Should be well worth the draft pick.
                      Re Panos, like a few others, e.g, Big Fish, the banker & Sockeye, I think he needs to show continued form in the VFL for 2012 before he cracks a game. Not really a first choice pick for a key forward role at the moment.

                      Re needing midfielders to provide goals (HairyMidget et al) – spot on. This was one of the hallmarks of our recent good years. I hope it continues, we have the players to supply goals from the midfield - Coon Dog, Griff, the Professor, The King (that’s right The King has come to Footscray, King Tutt that is), the Captain, etc.

                      My forward line for round 1:

                      HF: Dalhaus, Jones, Murphy
                      FF: Giansiracusa, Lake, Roughead

                      My reasoning: Dalhaus, Jones & Gia pick themselves. Murphy (agree with GVGjr, etc) – while he was AA off the half back flank in 2011, I reckon he is needed more up forward because that’s where we’re a bit thin. There are a few others who can cover on the half back line. Roughead – it seems to me that the Sub rule means that rucks need to be switched on the ground. Either you go with just one or swap in the forward pocket (just like the old days!) I think we need to play two rucks, partly to give us more physical presence on field. Lake – I read this suggestion from one of the 2011 assistant coaches and I like it. Lake is a big, mobile unit, rough and tumble with a good pair of hands. He adds the X factor a forward line needs. And we all know he likes a goal! Markovic has shown he can play full back.

                      Omissions: J Grant (per Dancin’ Dougy) – play him off half back flank, effectively a swap with Murphy. Grant seemed to be down on confidence last year, a swap to the back line would be just the tonic. King Tutt – I see him more as a rover / wingman.

                      In the mix: Big Ed Barlow – more X factor with this bloke but can someone tell me if he is back on the rookie list or is he a senior list player? Other small forwards: Hooper, Moles, Djerrkura, Vespremi could all press for regular games as forwards. The first three need to work on kicking for goal though. Hargrave (no s) – proven tough nut, gut busting, all round marking and running player who could be used as a half forward in a side that wants to be known as tough and unrelenting.
                      Officially on the Bus-wagon

                      Comment

                      • The Coon Dog
                        Bulldog Team of the Century
                        • Jan 2007
                        • 7579

                        #71
                        Re: Forward line 2012

                        Originally posted by F'scary
                        In the mix: Big Ed Barlow – more X factor with this bloke but can someone tell me if he is back on the rookie list or is he a senior list player?
                        Neither, he was delisted.
                        [COLOR="Red"][B][U][COLOR="Blue"]85, 92, 97, 98, 08, 09, 10... Break the curse![/COLOR][/U][/B][/COLOR]

                        Comment

                        • F'scary
                          WOOF Member
                          • Dec 2011
                          • 4089

                          #72
                          Re: Forward line 2012

                          Originally posted by The Coon Dog
                          Neither, he was delisted.
                          NNNnnnnnoooooooooooooooooooooo!!!
                          Officially on the Bus-wagon

                          Comment

                          • SlimPickens
                            Coaching Staff
                            • Aug 2010
                            • 2929

                            #73
                            Re: Forward line 2012

                            Originally posted by F'scary
                            NNNnnnnnoooooooooooooooooooooo!!!
                            Any relation to Ed?
                            "Loves a scrap....oh yeah & he's a pretty handy footballer as well"

                            Comment

                            • F'scary
                              WOOF Member
                              • Dec 2011
                              • 4089

                              #74
                              Re: Forward line 2012

                              Originally posted by SlimPickens
                              Any relation to Ed?
                              HOW CAN YOU SAY THAT! He is a footballer of rare ability. I am completely shattered. How could they get it so wrong. I WANT TO KNOW: WHO'S RESPONSIBLE?!?
                              Officially on the Bus-wagon

                              Comment

                              • Remi Moses
                                WOOF Member
                                • Jan 2009
                                • 14785

                                #75
                                Re: Forward line 2012

                                The problem with Barlow was he didn't fit a need.
                                What was he? KP? Midfield?He's a great size but just didn't fulfil any role.

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