Game Day 2012 - R17 Western Bulldogs vs Carlton

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Re: Game Day 2012 - R17 Western Bulldogs vs Carlton

I think the match committee erred in leaving out Shaggy tonight, how Pearce was seen as somehow a better option in a match we really should've been going out to win, given it was in all probability our last shot to get a win for the remainder of the year.

I'm not willing to knock the kid at such an early stage in his development but he doesn't look close to being ready for AFL level at the moment.

ACtually good to hear McCartney acknowledge in the post game interview on TV that our young midfielders need to learn how to read the outside play better from ruck contests - in response to the question as to why we were not able to leverage the total dominance from Minson's ruckwork.
I was dreading that he might instead talk about ' the need for them to win the contested ball and crack in. Hopefully this means that he is aware of the need to instruct our midfielders in how to play outside of the contest.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Re: Game Day 2012 - R17 Western Bulldogs vs Carlton

Don't get me wrong but I thought he was much better than the last couple of weeks.i thought he started on the wing and that was better or him. He seems to get lost in the bak line and become to worried about finding body contact and he ends up getting pushed aside.

If he is going to make it, it is definitely going to have to be in a role other than defense that is for sure. However when he was forward tonight he still looked unable to size up the right option and looked dreadfully unaware and slow to react to pressure in one particular contest where he was run down with ball in hand.

As an aside how many times tonight did we handball to the stationary man, repeatedly in the same passage of play. Invariably this would lead to each successive player receiving the ball being under slightly more pressure than the last, culminating in a turnover.

[Desipura]

Re: Game Day 2012 - R17 Western Bulldogs vs Carlton

The trouble is we have to many players not up to it.

Vev DJ Gilbee should never be in this side again. Gia is gone, Cordy's role needs to be reassessed at Willi.

This is plainly obvious to see yet the MC continues to play them. What is Cordy learning standing stationary in the forward line?
I hate watching us play, we are so boring. Dahl can turn it on and Griff after that the cupboard is bare.

Our lack of pace means all our midfielders want to do is handball out of congestion, only to place a teammate under pressure.
No one is willing to break a tackle and take the game on, that's way you need A graders in your side.
They have that ability to make something out of nothing.
Our skills are deplorable, experienced players like Murphy and Minson turning it over with no real pressure is not good enough.

[GVGjr]

Re: Game Day 2012 - R17 Western Bulldogs vs Carlton

The trouble is we have to many players not up to it.

Vev DJ Gilbee should never be in this side again. Gia is gone, Cordy's role needs to be reassessed at Willi.

McCartney is falling into the same trap at the selection as Eade did over his last two seasons. I believe we had the cattle to win tonight but we aren't selecting the right players.
Hargrave was an absolute requirement tonight as was Jones.

The positives for me tonight were:
- Williams as a forward is working
- Minson is having a great season
- Wallis has emerged
- Howard rebounded from a poor game and was much better this week

[azabob]

Re: Game Day 2012 - R17 Western Bulldogs vs Carlton

This is plainly obvious to see yet the MC continues to play them. What is Cordy learning standing stationary in the forward line?
I hate watching us play, we are so boring. Dahl can turn it on and Griff after that the cupboard is bare.

Our lack of pace means all our midfielders want to do is handball out of congestion, only to place a teammate under pressure.
No one is willing to break a tackle and take the game on, that's way you need A graders in your side.
They have that ability to make something out of nothing.
Our skills are deplorable, experienced players like Murphy and Minson turning it over with no real pressure is not good enough.

Agree with most of what you have said, Griffen's lack of goal kicking is really frustrating the one he missed from 50 in the third was very poor.

Murphy's disposal this season had been woeful.

[Bornadog]

Re: Game Day 2012 - R17 Western Bulldogs vs Carlton

This is plainly obvious to see yet the MC continues to play them. What is Cordy learning standing stationary in the forward line?
I hate watching us play, we are so boring. Dahl can turn it on and Griff after that the cupboard is bare.

Our lack of pace means all our midfielders want to do is handball out of congestion, only to place a teammate under pressure.
No one is willing to break a tackle and take the game on, that's way you need A graders in your side.
They have that ability to make something out of nothing.
Our skills are deplorable, experienced players like Murphy and Minson turning it over with no real pressure is not good enough.

I do agree with you but guys like DJ, Vez are not up to this standard at all. In the third quarter two goals in two minutes were due to Vez poor turnovers. DJ tries his guts out and we all wish he would succeed as we need his pace and endeavour, but he is plainly punching out of his league.
Gilbee has played one good game in three years and he was a forward that day. Gia well, I have been a big supporter, but maybe father time has caught up.

As for the rest, they are mainly kids and yes they are learning. I thought Howard was good tonight, but haven't read any praise for him.

Edit - GVGjr has given Howard some positive remarks

[The Pie Man]

Re: Game Day 2012 - R17 Western Bulldogs vs Carlton

Tis a weird dark place to be happier we got run over in a game we had in our keeping. Weird, dark place

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Re: Game Day 2012 - R17 Western Bulldogs vs Carlton

McCartney is falling into the same trap at the selection as Eade did over his last two seasons. I believe we had the cattle to win tonight but we aren't selecting the right players.
Hargrave was an absolute requirement tonight as was Jones.

The positives for me tonight were:
- Williams as a forward is working
- Minson is having a great season
- Wallis has emerged
- Howard rebounded from a poor game and was much better this week

Mostly agree Gary. Having Hargrave tonight would've provided much needed cover, which would've allowed Murphy to be more attacking, and it would've forced Carlton to think a bit more about how defensively accountable guys like Garlett or Betts needed to be, as Shaggy would've also provided another rebounding option if not attended to.

Williams in back to back weeks has shown he can play a role for us in the forward half.
Whilst I'm pleased at how much ball Wallis can find, I think he is still some way from 'emerging'. He needs to learn - and hopefully it will come with more experience- how to use the ball to our advantage. At the moment he takes the easiest option rather than the best option when distributing the ball. I think Libba is ahead of him in this regard.

Howard, whilst better than last week - it was an extremely low base he was coming off - was still subpar. He just doesn't seem to have any one stand out skill, and indeed when asked to play behind the ball he looks totally lost, and it only seems to highlight his deficiencies. I think he would be better suited forward of the play.

[Eastdog]

Re: Game Day 2012 - R17 Western Bulldogs vs Carlton

Very disappointing we let that one get away tonight. Considering the team Carlton had in tonight and with us leading for most of the match we really should of won. We will most likely not win another match for the season. Our list: we have some exciting young players coming up but they will take time to become good, but we have a lot of older players who are coming towards the end of their careers. We don't have those 23/24 years olds firing players in that side if you know what I mean.

[Desipura]

Re: Game Day 2012 - R17 Western Bulldogs vs Carlton

I do agree with you but guys like DJ, Vez are not up to this standard at all. In the third quarter two goals in two minutes were due to Vez poor turnovers. DJ tries his guts out and we all wish he would succeed as we need his pace and endeavour, but he is plainly punching out of his league.
Gilbee has played one good game in three years and he was a forward that day. Gia well, I have been a big supporter, but maybe father time has caught up.

As for the rest, they are mainly kids and yes they are learning. I thought Howard was good tonight, but haven't read any praise for him.

Edit - GVGjr has given Howard some positive remarks

I'm agreeing with you about the above not being up to AFL standard, as well as Gia and Gilbee being finished (Gilbee time was up a few seasons back)

[jazzadogs]

Re: Game Day 2012 - R17 Western Bulldogs vs Carlton

ACtually good to hear McCartney acknowledge in the post game interview on TV that our young midfielders need to learn how to read the outside play better from ruck contests - in response to the question as to why we were not able to leverage the total dominance from Minson's ruckwork.
I was dreading that he might instead talk about ' the need for them to win the contested ball and crack in. Hopefully this means that he is aware of the need to instruct our midfielders in how to play outside of the contest.

Of course he would be aware that we need to develop our outside game as well. I'm a bit over the criticism of Macca's coaching. People talk about him like as though he has absolutely no idea...of course he has an idea. There is no instant fix for our football club. He's trying to develop our side, and at the moment our side just isn't up to it. This is where our list is at. We were able to compete with the Blues while they weren't playing great football. Once they turned it up a bit, they got on top of us.

We are currently a developing football side, which is going to lead to depressing losses such as tonight. As much as our team is developing, so too is our coaching staff and I feel we need to give them a bit of allowance for their inexperience. In much the same way as Sockeye's 20-game-rule for players, Macca (and the assistants) are going to take time to settle into their roles. We took this risk when we appointed a first year coach. I would hope that the club continues to back him in, as it has so far.

I understand that this was a disappointing loss, for me it was the most disappointing loss of the year, but I don't think the blame can be laid solely at Macca's feet. He doesn't have much to work with just yet. (I understand you're not blaming Macca YHF, just the general feel I'm getting).

[Maddog37]

Re: Game Day 2012 - R17 Western Bulldogs vs Carlton

Tis a weird dark place to be happier we got run over in a game we had in our keeping. Weird, dark place

I agree. More than ever before I am questioning the relevance of the game I once loved.

Tanking for sure. Beautifully disguised but tanking no doubt.

[KT31]

Re: Game Day 2012 - R17 Western Bulldogs vs Carlton

I agree. More than ever before I am questioning the relevance of the game I once loved.

Tanking for sure. Beautifully disguised but tanking no doubt.

Not tanking, just a poor team.

[Eastdog]

Re: Game Day 2012 - R17 Western Bulldogs vs Carlton

Of course he would be aware that we need to develop our outside game as well. I'm a bit over the criticism of Macca's coaching. People talk about him like as though he has absolutely no idea...of course he has an idea. There is no instant fix for our football club. He's trying to develop our side, and at the moment our side just isn't up to it. This is where our list is at. We were able to compete with the Blues while they weren't playing great football. Once they turned it up a bit, they got on top of us.

We are currently a developing football side, which is going to lead to depressing losses such as tonight. As much as our team is developing, so too is our coaching staff and I feel we need to give them a bit of allowance for their inexperience. In much the same way as Sockeye's 20-game-rule for players, Macca (and the assistants) are going to take time to settle into their roles. We took this risk when we appointed a first year coach. I would hope that the club continues to back him in, as it has so far.

I understand that this was a disappointing loss, for me it was the most disappointing loss of the year, but I don't think the blame can be laid solely at Macca's feet. He doesn't have much to work with just yet. (I understand you're not blaming Macca YHF, just the general feel I'm getting).

Very good post. We can't judge Macca in his first year as coach as he has to get used to the new role as he hasn't coached an AFL side before and the fact he doesn't have that much to work with right now.

[Maddog37]

Re: Game Day 2012 - R17 Western Bulldogs vs Carlton

Not tanking, just a poor team.

You say potato.........